Oil change w/ XChangeR

The friendliest place on the web for anyone who enjoys boating.
If you have answers, please help by responding to the unanswered posts.
See posts with no answers
Olebird

Olebird

Senior Member
Joined
Aug 23, 2019
Messages
413
Location
USA
Vessel Name
StarLite
Vessel Make
Mainship 30 Pilot II - 2003
Xchanger plumbed to engine and genny. No problem pulling oil out.


How many of you who have some thing similar use it to put fresh oil back into the engine and genny??.


PO said he did not use it to put fresh oil back in.:blush:
 
It is designed to do just that using the reverse pump direction. I have done it, but really prefer the old fashioned way of getting the oil back in the engine. My boat has the valving at the XchangeR to suck the oil out of the tranny, but there was no hose installed to any possible drain plug on the tranny; so I just connected a piece of hose to the correct barb on the XChangeR and stuck it right into the wide dipstick hole - does a pretty good job.

When I had the fuel tanks low and wanted all the fuel in one tank for a project I was working on, I closed the tank valves and stuck vinyl hose into the two tank fills and used the XChangeR's tranny oil suction to get the fuel out and the outlet hose connection to send the fuel to the other tank.

Last hint (I promise!) When done with the petroleum product pumping, I stick the tranny suction hose end into a bucket of water and dishwashing soap solution and pump it through to clean the impeller. Seems those darned things do not like sitting for months on end in oil and tend to fall apart at next use. I had the issue on my trawler, no matter what fancy "oil-resistant" impeller I used.
 
Last edited:
Thanks Rich, I think the PO was concerned with flushing residual (dirty) oil back into the engine along with the new oil. I suspect compared what oil remains in the engine normally, the "tare" oil in the pump and hoses is pretty small. Thanks for the tips keep them coming.
 
Olebird said:
Thanks Rich, I think the PO was concerned with flushing residual (dirty) oil back into the engine along with the new oil. I suspect compared what oil remains in the engine normally, the "tare" oil in the pump and hoses is pretty small. Thanks for the tips keep them coming.
Click to expand...

Yeah, it’s not a big deal. I have worked for companies where we never changed the oil. We change the filters, top off the oil, and send a sample to the lab who advises us back to what additives need to be added, but typically the top up oil was enough to keep the additives in check.
 
Larry
My practice is as the PO described. I know a few mechanic types that do the same.
I / we realize the volume is small but just doesnt feel right to put even a small amount of dirty oil back in if there is a fairly easy way to avoid it.
I have a stubby funnel that fits snugly in the fill hole and I have room to just pour from Gal jugs.
 
Suck the old out, pour the new in.

Ted
 
My engines took over 6 gallons a side. I'd pump a 5 gallon pail in with the reversing gear pump, then top off by pouring in the rest. We were doing three or four oil changes a year, I was going to make them as easy as possible. And anyway, the only contaminated oil was whatever residual was left in the hose... just a trace. I had oil analysis done every change and they came back great.
 
Olebird said:
Xchanger plumbed to engine and genny. No problem pulling oil out.

How many of you who have some thing similar use it to put fresh oil back into the engine and genny??.
Click to expand...


I did. Not enough clearance over the main engines to fill from the top (without lifting the saloon floor hatches) and not enough benefit to bother with all that.

I reckoned fresh oil was easily able to dilute anything remaining of the old oil in the lines. Also, the X-Chang-R probably always left a drop or two (or five or whatever) in the pans... and dilution of that seemed likely too.

My technique drew old oil out of the gears last... and since that was usually clean anyway, I reckoned that nicely cleaned up the pump itself and the drain hose from pump to bucket.

-Chris
 
Always going to be some old oil in the sump and all the internal parts so i am not concerned about a little dirty oil mixing with 5 gallons of new.

I always pumped it back in . also added a valve so I could use a plastic tube to suck out tranny oil as well.
 
Having about 10% old oil in the engine is not to be considered a problem. IMO

There is a mindset on TF to achieve 100% of everything. Anchors dragging? not an inch. Many remember Marin Fare. When he bought the Rocna he was totally convinced it would never drag. It probably did. The seafloor in a liquid of varying degrees of liquidity. I’m saying everybody has dragged their anchors. And few know about it. But does it matter? Certainly not.
And likewise does it matter if there’s a bit of old oil in the engine after a change. Certainly not. Many people go 100,000mi. In their cars w/o changing the oil at all. We all fully accept many things that are not ideal from marriage to how green our lawns are.

Residual oil in our engines is fly stuff. Is it ideal .. no. Is it to be avoided? Not unless you like beating your head on the wall.
The downside is that you’ll have impurities like acids, fuel, carbon and other undesirables in the oil. The way to minimize the downside is not to fret around about the contamination but to do what you can to minimize it. It’s obvious you’ll never get all the oil out. Never. So to minimize it just change oil more often. Warm the engine up by an hour’s run at cruise speed or more, drop the oil out as immediately as is practical and perhaps let it drain more by leaving the engine sit overnight and extract what has drained overnight. I usually do that.

Then replenish w oil that minimizes contamination and the things that cause contamination like running a 160 degree thermostat, running at low load and hence low temps, and anything else that would promote oil contamination. And if you do change more often or even much more often. Oil changes are not expensive.

Then change often.
When you leave a bit of old oil in the engine at oil change time remember your only leaving a small fraction compared to what you put in. And like many things in life 100% is unobtainium and you’d be wasting your time thinking about it. Go cruising with or without 100% fresh oil. You don’t need it.

Pump it back in? Whatever for? And you’ll have residual oil in the thing you use if it’s the same as you use to pump it out. Sounds to me like more work and complications that pouring the new oil in through the fuller hole in the valve cover.
 
Last edited:
Interesting responses - thanks.

CAP, I think we worked for the same company for a while - "never change oil, just filters and keep an eye on the chemistry". Would never say that out loud cause they make the stuff!

FWIW - My plan - use the pump out and in for bulk, major changes - to/from 5 gallon buckets. Minor additions thru the top via 1 quart containers.

Access to the gen set is restricted, the main engine less so, but cumbersome with large containers.



Cleaning the bilge if you spill it, is a PITA.


Have a great August,

Larry :)
 
Nomad Willy said:
Having about 10% old oil in the engine is not to be considered a problem. IMO

There is a mindset on TF to achieve 100% of everything. Anchors dragging? not an inch. Many remember Marin Fare. When he bought the Rocna he was totally convinced it would never drag. It probably did. The seafloor in a liquid of varying degrees of liquidity. I’m saying everybody has dragged their anchors. And few know about it. But does it matter? Certainly not.
And likewise does it matter if there’s a bit of old oil in the engine after a change. Certainly not. Many people go 100,000mi. In their cars w/o changing the oil at all. We all fully accept many things that are not ideal from marriage to how green our lawns are.

Residual oil in our engines is fly stuff. Is it ideal .. no. Is it to be avoided? Not unless you like beating your head on the wall.
The downside is that you’ll have impurities like acids, fuel, carbon and other undesirables in the oil. The way to minimize the downside is not to fret around about the contamination but to do what you can to minimize it. It’s obvious you’ll never get all the oil out. Never. So to minimize it just change oil more often. Warm the engine up by an hour’s run at cruise speed or more, drop the oil out as immediately as is practical and perhaps let it drain more by leaving the engine sit overnight and extract what has drained overnight. I usually do that.

Then replenish w oil that minimizes contamination and the things that cause contamination like running a 160 degree thermostat, running at low load and hence low temps, and anything else that would promote oil contamination. And if you do change more often or even much more often. Oil changes are not expensive.

Then change often.
When you leave a bit of old oil in the engine at oil change time remember your only leaving a small fraction compared to what you put in. And like many things in life 100% is unobtainium and you’d be wasting your time thinking about it. Go cruising with or without 100% fresh oil. You don’t need it.

Pump it back in? Whatever for? And you’ll have residual oil in the thing you use if it’s the same as you use to pump it out. Sounds to me like more work and complications that pouring the new oil in through the fuller hole in the valve cover.
Click to expand...

There are probably some things that aren't worth the extra effort. I never viewed pouring oil through a funnel as a big effort.

BTW, I view moving 5 gallon pails of oil into an engine room, about the same as an 8D battery. I'll leave that to the go fast crowd.

Ted
 
Keeping fuel in a tank while replacing hoses or fittings

If you stick the suction hose from a shop vac in the fuel fill and turn on the vac you can change or add fuel hoses, fittings, or sight-glasses with out emptying the tank. Just make sure the vent hose is closed or pinched tight and no one turns off the ship vac. You will hear a lot of gurgling, but not a drop will be spilled out.
 
Mike Negley said:
If you stick the suction hose from a shop vac in the fuel fill and turn on the vac you can change or add fuel hoses, fittings, or sight-glasses with out emptying the tank. Just make sure the vent hose is closed or pinched tight and no one turns off the ship vac. You will hear a lot of gurgling, but not a drop will be spilled out.
Click to expand...

Probably not the thing you want to try on a gasoline powered boat.

Ted
 
Using a shop vac to suspend duel in thd tank

I would like to think no one is foolish enough to do this with gas, but I know one who might try it. Many years ago when I was the service manage of a boat yard we had a customer and three guests bring his boat in to refuel with gas. It was a 32' Chris Craft steel Roamer. While the attendant was refueling the boat the owner lifted the engine hatches on the aft deck and took this opportunity to remove and clean the sediment filters on the engines, but the attendant did not see this.

The explosion occurred after they left the dock, fortunately, but I felt the shock wave and saw the smoke. The owner was blown clear off the boat and the other three jumped overboard. Naturally no one was weraring a life jacket. We took the paramedics out to the boat which was an inferno, but were able to collect the victums and were brought back to the fuel dock where ambulance were waiting. It was a horrible sight, but amazingly none were killed. The boat burned to the waterline, the gaskets had not been put back in the filters. All received serious burns. We made a new rule that all people had to get off the boat until it was fully vacant of any fumes.
 
BTW, I view moving 5 gallon pails of oil into an engine room, about the same as an 8D battery. I'll leave that to the go fast crowd.
Click to expand...

Depends on the engine room. Ours were full height walk-ins. A 5 gallon pail weighs less than a third of an 8D. Those I hired some muscle to move.

I remember buying four buckets of oil at Ocean Marine in Brunswick GA. The dock guy came down from the store room up by the office with two in each hand, like they were a kid's little beach pails. Made note to self: " NEVER piss this guy off."

One benefit of using buckets is they are an excellent repository for the used oil, rather then messing with little gallon bottles.
 
Last edited:
I use it to drain and fill. So does my buddy and several other people. No problems so far.
 
I use a Reverso pump to change the oil in my mains and a hand pump vacuum pump for the two generators. I buy the oil in 5 gallon pails and pump the dirty oil into empty pails. The new oil is taken by pump directly from the pail and into the oil pan via a quick disconnect fitting at the front of the engine. There is also a fitting for the gearbox there. I don’t worry about any residual oil in the hoses since I am pumping about a pail and a half back into the engine. Between oil changes I service the oil with a hand pump that screws onto the plastic nozzle of the pail. That way I can service the oil without any spilling, without a funnel or any mess to clean up. I use the same pail and pump method in the generator room except I use a suction pump through the dipstick to change it. I buy the 15/40 generator oil in pails from NAPA like the special 40wt Detroit oil in the mains.

Since all the diesels onboard have 100hr oil change intervals I have had plenty of opportunity to perfect my technique and having an oil change pump is absolutely a necessity. As is having a pump to dispense the oil too.
 
An 8D battery weighs in at 127 lbs, a 5 gallon pail of SAE 10W40 weighs 37.5 lbs.



The Pilot 30 II is "tight" below deck, and while the oil filler is on top of the engine, it's at the far end of a 7 ft hinged hatch - cumbersome at best to get to. No way to walk around the open hatch without climbing on seating on each side of the cockpit.


The X-ChangeR is just below the stern end of the engine hatch - very handi and makes changing the oil a snap, if your willing to pump it back into the engine. (why I asked the question)



Also, I use a lot of engine oil in other diesels so buying in bulk only makes cents!



I just roll my dock cart with a fresh bucket and an empty up next to the boat. Snap an 6 ft extension on the end of the pump feed/exit and turn the pump on.
 
Olebird said:
An 8D battery weighs in at 127 lbs, a 5 gallon pail of SAE 10W40 weighs 37.5 lbs.



The Pilot 30 II is "tight" below deck, and while the oil filler is on top of the engine, it's at the far end of a 7 ft hinged hatch - cumbersome at best to get to. No way to walk around the open hatch without climbing on seating on each side of the cockpit.


The X-ChangeR is just below the stern end of the engine hatch - very handi and makes changing the oil a snap, if your willing to pump it back into the engine. (why I asked the question)



Also, I use a lot of engine oil in other diesels so buying in bulk only makes cents!



I just roll my dock cart with a fresh bucket and an empty up next to the boat. Snap an 6 ft extension on the end of the pump feed/exit and turn the pump on.
Click to expand...

I am happy with gallon jugs poured into the oil fill with a funnel. Does not seem to be an issue for me. I have had so many impellers go out on oil changing pumps that I would be afraid of one quitting in the middle of the re-fill process and be stuck with a container impossible to get to the oil fill with.
 
Proper rubber for oil pumps

You need to use Nitrile rubber vanes in the oil pump or switch to a gear pump.
 
Mike Negley said:
You need to use Nitrile rubber vanes in the oil pump or switch to a gear pump.
Click to expand...

Yep, I used the best nitrile impellers they sell over the twenty plus years I have been using these Reverso pumps. I dunno why the darned things broke up so often, but the recently initiated soapy water flush when done seems to be effective. It was recommended by a marine tech who now runs the local marine parts supply house. A gear pump conversion into this compact installation is not likely for something I do every year or two.
 
rgano said:
I am happy with gallon jugs poured into the oil fill with a funnel. Does not seem to be an issue for me. I have had so many impellers go out on oil changing pumps that I would be afraid of one quitting in the middle of the re-fill process and be stuck with a container impossible to get to the oil fill with.
Click to expand...

I installed an Oberdorfer reversible gear pump to avoid that issue. Worked great in tandem with a DIY manifold. As mentioned I was doing three or four changes a year there for awhile. Like WoodlandHills, I can't imagine not using a pump system and 5 gallon pails for those big Detroits. I still have the NAPA part number for the CF2 oil memorized years later. 75118. Eventually, when we settled down from full time cruising, I got the local Detroit dealer to give me a commercial account and could get the Mobil Detroit labeled stuff for the same price. The NAPA was rebranded Valvoline and had great specs well within Detroit's requirements.
 
caltexflanc said:
I installed an Oberdorfer reversible gear pump to avoid that issue. Worked great in tandem with a DIY manifold. As mentioned I was doing three or four changes a year there for awhile. Like WoodlandHills, I can't imagine not using a pump system and 5 gallon pails for those big Detroits. I still have the NAPA part number for the CF2 oil memorized years later. 75118. Eventually, when we settled down from full time cruising, I got the local Detroit dealer to give me a commercial account and could get the Mobil Detroit labeled stuff for the same price. The NAPA was rebranded Valvoline and had great specs well within Detroit's requirements.
Click to expand...

No question it worked for you, but look at the smallish size of my boat and access to single engine. An expensive pump like yours makes no sense for me doing an oil change once every 18 months to two years.
 

Attachments

  • DSC01826.jpg
    DSC01826.jpg
    117.1 KB · Views: 27
rgano said:
No question it worked for you, but look at the smallish size of my boat and access to single engine. An expensive pump like yours makes no sense for me doing an oil change once every 18 months to two years.
Click to expand...
Gotta love the single engine. Especially around maintenance time.
:)
 
FWIW, I have a Reverso pump and have done it both ways. I normally by the oil in 2 1/2 gallon containers and have found it easier and less prone to mess if I just pour the new oil into the engine. The Genset would be easier with the pump, but I the volume is so low that I'd rather not have the tiny bit of extra dirty oil.
 
rgano said:
No question it worked for you, but look at the smallish size of my boat and access to single engine. An expensive pump like yours makes no sense for me doing an oil change once every 18 months to two years.
Click to expand...

Did that boat come an owner horn?
Think shoehorn to fit something in an otherwise unattainable space. Up to about age 50, I could worm my way into pretty tight spaces. I have a new appreciation for why an acquaintance my age, opted for outboards on his Sabre.

Ted
 
Yeah that big ol' Yanmar certainly fills the space available in an impressive fashion. I can access batteries and a/c pump and other stuff at front of the engine through a small access door under the steps down into the cabin, and I can step down in behind the engine to access coolers, generator, fuel valves, etc. I use two old throwable seat cushions on top of the engine to I can lie down on it if necessary to mess about with stuff like the raw water pump (lower left and forward). I can (and must) remove and install it one-handed; luckily I am left handed. I am way older than 50 and it takes a day to recover from such silly activities.
 
I use mine in both directions - out with the dirty oil, in with the clean. SOOOOO much easier than the alternative, especially when you buy oil in 5 gallon buckets.
 
My MS Pilot did not come with shoe horn ... at least I haven't found it yet. Probably should have. I have a requirement that service people can not be taller than 5'4" and weight more than 150 lbs in order to fit in the ER.


Thanks again guys for the input on using the XChangeR - will have to keep an eye on the impeller.


22101-albums915-picture5756.jpg
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

JDCAVE
Oil Pressure Sender: To Dope or not to Dope? That is the question!
2
Replies
31
Views
2K
C lectric
C lectric
boomerang
Questionable survey?
2 3
Replies
60
Views
5K
mvweebles
mvweebles
Sharpseadog
Oil change
2
Replies
55
Views
4K
rslifkin
R
D
Water in the Engine Oil
2
Replies
30
Views
3K
ronobrien
R
B
High Oil Pressure- Yanmar 6LYA-STP
Replies
9
Views
2K
STB
S

Latest posts

Back
Top Bottom