Leaving dirt home for good

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woodscrew

woodscrew

Senior Member
Joined
Feb 14, 2016
Messages
100
Location
USA
Vessel Name
Northern Star
Vessel Make
Bristol 42 1970
So, after almost two years of living aboard full time we have listed our house for sale. We are residents of New Jersey, and are trying to figure out how we can remain so without a dry land address. First issue is driver licenses, then voting, and some issues with insurances- notably an umbrella policy that is part of our soon to be gone homeowners policy. We spend winters aboard in Florida and may eventually establish residency there. In the mean time if anyone has experience with all or any of this some advice will be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance, Woodscrew
 
Not sure what NJ laws are, but a UPS or Postal Annex store will give you a physical address. We used a service in Texas that caters to the RV and liveaboard market, Escapees, which allowed us to maintain our various licenses, registrations, tax status and so on. They had various levels of mail forwarding as well. Beware of jury duty though when you are a thousand or two miles away.
 
woodscrew said:
So, after almost two years of living aboard full time we have listed our house for sale. We are residents of New Jersey, and are trying to figure out how we can remain so without a dry land address. First issue is driver licenses, then voting, and some issues with insurances- notably an umbrella policy that is part of our soon to be gone homeowners policy. We spend winters aboard in Florida and may eventually establish residency there. In the mean time if anyone has experience with all or any of this some advice will be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance, Woodscrew
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Will you not be subject to the draconian NJ taxes?

Have a look at St Brendan's Isle, based out of Green Cove Springs, FL. For your residence, and voting.

https://www.sbimailservice.com/become-a-florida-resident/
 
St. Brendand’s Isle looks interesting. We are seeing our accountant next week and will have to eventually deal with the NJ ‘’exit’’ tax. Don’t think we can escape NJ without paying that. Florida residency is a real possibility. We’ll have to weigh it all out. Right now up to our necks getting out of the house and especially my shop of 37 years.
 
I don't live on the boat but have no mail delivery at my house.

I have a private mail box from a mailing store similar to an UPS store. I pay for a small box for mail but the business receives UPS, Fed Ex and freight services in addition to US Mail. I've received large items like water tanks, tires, dock flotation tubs etc. there. They will also save my mail when gone for several months. They will even forward my mail if I wanted it.

My address there is a regular street address with my box number, 3110 Main St #118. I have my drivers license and everything else linked to that address. As for voting, I use my residence address but have mail come to the mail box store. I have not received mail at a residence for over 30 years.

A Post Office can receive US Mail only and your address will be PO Box XXX which a lot of businesses will not ship to.
 
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syjos said:
I don't live on the boat but have no mail delivery at my house.

I have a private mail box from a mailing store similar to an UPS store. I pay for a box for small mail but the business receives UPS, Fed Ex and freight services in addition to US Mail. I've received large items like water tanks, tires, dock flotation tubs etc. there. They will also save my mail when gone for several months. They will even forward my mail if I wanted it.

My address there is a regular street address with my box number, 3110 Main St #118. I have my drivers license and everything else linked to that address. As for voting, I use my residence address but have mail come to the mail box store. I have not received mail at a residence for over 30 years.

A Post Office can receive US Mail only and your address will be PO Box XXX which a lot of businesses will not ship to.
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Which state?

And do you still register to vote and pay taxes in that state because you still have a dirt home - which the OP is giving up (so has some flexibility)?
 
menzies said:
Which state?

And do you still register to vote and pay taxes in that state because you still have a dirt home - which the OP is giving up (so has some flexibility)?
Click to expand...

Washington State. No income tax.

I pay Property tax and vote using my residence address.

We lived on our boat for a year and a half and used the mail box address for everything, including drivers license and voting.

When you use a real address, which a private mail box provides, on licenses and other things there is no way that they can determine that the address is a private mail box.

For a while in the early 2000's, the Post Office or some Federal Agency required the user of a private mail box to use "PMB" in front of the box number - 3110 Main Street PMB118. That requirement was dropped after a short time. You can use Suite, Unit, # in front of the box number or just the number.
 
I'm curious. What's the upside to maintaining NJ residency? I left California 15 years ago for Florida and did everything possible to sever ties completely. My understanding is NJ is a higher tax jurisdiction than CA. Thoughts?
 
menzies said:
Will you not be subject to the draconian NJ taxes?

Have a look at St Brendan's Isle, based out of Green Cove Springs, FL. For your residence, and voting.

https://www.sbimailservice.com/become-a-florida-resident/
Click to expand...

You cannot register to vote with only a St Brendan’s Isle address. It is a commercial address and is well known to the Clay County voter registration people. You need either utility bills, rent receipts or an affidavit swearing you are resident in a Florida address by the actual resident. The information on the SBI website is out of date ever since Clay County changed the rules.
The same now applies to Florida drivers licenses ever since Real ID rules took effect. You need to prove a residential address, not just a mail service.
 
Actually, I switched to St Brenda s Isle (SBI) last February and everything worked as their web site states. The marina/rv address on Bulkhead Rd worked for voting....and the main address is a mailing address. SBI has done well staying on top of it based on my readings and experienced.

The big deal is using a permanent address for a driver's license and some banks where people are having issues. But I found the same in NJ as it is federal regulations on what addresses work or not. Turns out a rental receipt from a marina will qualify you, afterwards I have heard changing the license address is less of a big deal.

Banks now are coming up with some strange rules. For 3 weeks I have gone round and round with Capital one over a credit card.I don't have a piece of paper that satisfied all their requirements.. My 50 year old Social Security card didn't meet their standard even after 2 supervisor level reviews. My tax returns didn't work because I dont use a paid preparer. My 1099s dont work because they no longer print my whole SSN on them. I dont have W2s because I dont have an employer and my 1099R from the USCG no longer used the whole SSN but my military number designed to PROTECT my SSN.

So even though Capital One really wanted me to have one of their cards...the banking and ID requirements the government wants is getting strange unless you are a homeowner with mail going there....and even then not always enough.
 
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Larry M said:
I’ll second St. Brendan’s Isle. SBI has being doing it for years and handles ~7K active clients. Florida is a no income tax state, about 7% sales tax rate, and they want you here. SBI will help you make the move
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This is why you can no longer use SBI as an address to register to vote in Clay County: they did not want 7000 non-residents absentee voting in local elections possibly turning the county from Republican to Democratic. They looked at the mail-in ballots from the district where SBI is located and were horrified that the returns “did not reflect the actual and historic make-up of the electorate”. This was a couple of years ago and we learned of this when we tried to register to vote using our SBI address about 18mo ago.
 
psneeld said:
Actually, I switched to SBI last February and everything worked as their web site states. The marina/rv address on Bulkhead Rd worked for voting....and the main address is a mailing address.

The big deal is using a permanent address for a driver's license and some banks where people are having issues. But I found the same in NJ as it is federal regulations on what addresses work or not. Turns out a rental receipt from a marina will qualify you, afterwards I have heard changing the license address is less of a big deal.
Click to expand...

That’s because you used a physical address to register, the marina/RV park, not SBI. In our case we were not in a marina in Clay County. We since registered to vote and got driver’s licenses in Naples at my Brother-in-laws residence. All we needed was his utility bill and a sworn statement that we lived there.
 
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Woodland Hills said:
You cannot register to vote with only a St Brendan’s Isle address. It is a commercial address and is well known to the Clay County voter registration people. You need either utility bills, rent receipts or an affidavit swearing you are resident in a Florida address by the actual resident. The information on the SBI website is out of date ever since Clay County changed the rules.
The same now applies to Florida drivers licenses ever since Real ID rules took effect. You need to prove a residential address, not just a mail service.
Click to expand...

I believe SBI worked with the state and resolved those issues. I have an explanitory email from them back home which I will find when I get back.
 
woodscrew said:
St. Brendand’s Isle looks interesting. We are seeing our accountant next week and will have to eventually deal with the NJ ‘’exit’’ tax. Don’t think we can escape NJ without paying that. Florida residency is a real possibility. We’ll have to weigh it all out. Right now up to our necks getting out of the house and especially my shop of 37 years.
Click to expand...

Good looking Bristol!
 
psneeld said:
Actually, I switched to St Brenda s Isle (SBI) last February and everything worked as their web site states. The marina/rv address on Bulkhead Rd worked for voting....and the main address is a mailing address. SBI has done well staying on top of it based on my readings and experienced.

The big deal is using a permanent address for a driver's license and some banks where people are having issues. But I found the same in NJ as it is federal regulations on what addresses work or not. Turns out a rental receipt from a marina will qualify you, afterwards I have heard changing the license address is less of a big deal.

Banks now are coming up with some strange rules. For 3 weeks I have gone round and round with Capital one over a credit card.I don't have a piece of paper that satisfied all their requirements.. My 50 year old Social Security card didn't meet their standard even after 2 supervisor level reviews. My tax returns didn't work because I dont use a paid preparer. My 1099s dont work because they no longer print my whole SSN on them. I dont have W2s because I dont have an employer and my 1099R from the USCG no longer used the whole SSN but my military number designed to PROTECT my SSN.

So even though Capital One really wanted me to have one of their cards...the banking and ID requirements the government wants is getting strange unless you are a homeowner with mail going there....and even then not always enough.
Click to expand...

We did all of this in FL early 2019. Yes, SBI has another physical address that is used for voter registration. It worked without a hitch.

The current process in FL for live aboard driver's licenses is to use the boat registration or USCG documentation number as your street address, then Green Cove Springs for city/state, etc. Makes sense, as that is where you "live". Our driver's licenses say "DO 177xxxx" for the street address. Lots of strange looks from people checking......

For banks/credit cards, we just kept calling and applying until we found one that accepted whatever addresses, etc. we had. They got our business.
 
+1 on SBI. We have not had any issues with banking, licenses, insurance, voting, etc.
It is possible to operate almost totally electronically, so we do not get much mail. But what we get is handled very well by SBI.
 
I just sold my condo in Florida in December, and had to switch over to St. Brendan's Isle in Green Cove Springs for everything. I went there in person as we had a bunch of boat parts to be picked up at the mail warehouse for me to schlep back over here to Turkey. I have a new entry for my resume: boat parts mule.

Anyway, the lady at the Clay County voter's registration office could not have been nicer. SBI has a special address you use to register to vote. It is 1063 Bulkhead Rd. and your mailbox number. It doesn't get flagged as a commercial mail address like the Walnut St. address does. However, Clay County will allow you to have a residence address AND a mailing address, so the mail still goes where it is supposed to go. I've already received my voter's registration card and my mail-in ballot.

My understanding for the banking issue is that you can use a family member's address. I haven't tried yet.
 
mvweebles said:
I'm curious. What's the upside to maintaining NJ residency? I left California 15 years ago for Florida and did everything possible to sever ties completely. My understanding is NJ is a higher tax jurisdiction than CA. Thoughts?
Click to expand...



I left New Jersey last July to be a livaboard in Florida and never looked back. Best decision I ever made. I also use a mailbox but my marina in Saint Petersburg actually has mail here for us. Escape NJ! Never look back! You will be glad you did!
 
Congratulations with your decision. In my opinion Florida is better in many ways. We've decided to put our real estate for sale in Limassol too, we just don't fly there very often anymore so no point in keeping it and I don't want to rent it out and deal with people in general.
 
Reminds me
I need to go back and do something about the dirt house
Or not.
 
Simi 60 said:
Reminds me
I need to go back and do something about the dirt house
Or not.
Click to expand...

Good thing about a dirt home is it's appreciation. I know of a few people here in the US that sold their houses to live on a boat. Many years later when they wanted to move back ashore, they were unable to buy another home because the prices had gotten out of reach.
 
syjos said:
Good thing about a dirt home is it's appreciation. I know of a few people here in the US that sold their houses to live on a boat. Many years later when they wanted to move back ashore, they were unable to buy another home because the prices had gotten out of reach.
Click to expand...



Poor planning and/or unrealistic expectations. That stuff needs to be planned into the decision.?
 
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We are full-time live aboards and do not own a dirt house. In January, we drove our truck, previously registered in Maryland using our daughter's address, to Green Cove Springs to register it in Florida. We already had Florida driving licenses using a St. Brendan's commercial address. This can no longer be done, using the commercial street address, for licenses, voter registration, and vehicle registration. Instead, Clay County will issue a driving license and register a vehicle using a boat's Coast Guard documentation number in place of a street address. Sounds hokey but it is the practice. Having our new driving license, we then drove about 1/4 mile down the street to the Voter's Registar's office which happily updated our voter registration and offered us the opportunity to fill out a request form for an absentee ballot for the November election. The address for voting is NOT the documentation number address that is used on vehicle registrations and driving licenses. Used is a local address that has been approved by the Registrar of Voters. Again, hokey but legal and fully approved. You don't even need to know the address when you walk in. The counter agents will provide it. They are VERY helpful. By the way, the motor vehicle office is very efficient, a welcome surprise.

To the original poster, you just need to drive to Green Cove Springs. Start at St. Brendan's, then the motor vehicle office, then register to vote. If you wish to register a vehicle you will have to have your insurance policy reissued to comply with Florida's requirement of having an insurer licensed in Florida. We use Liberty Mutual. Got it done on the phone in less than an hour. Call SBI. They will gladly answer your questions and get you started. NO INCOME TAX!
Woodland Hills said:
You cannot register to vote with only a St Brendan’s Isle address. It is a commercial address and is well known to the Clay County voter registration people. You need either utility bills, rent receipts or an affidavit swearing you are resident in a Florida address by the actual resident. The information on the SBI website is out of date ever since Clay County changed the rules.
The same now applies to Florida drivers licenses ever since Real ID rules took effect. You need to prove a residential address, not just a mail service.
Click to expand...
 
Woodland Hills. This is old news. All changed. See my earlier post.
Woodland Hills said:
This is why you can no longer use SBI as an address to register to vote in Clay County: they did not want 7000 non-residents absentee voting in local elections possibly turning the county from Republican to Democratic. They looked at the mail-in ballots from the district where SBI is located and were horrified that the returns “did not reflect the actual and historic make-up of the electorate”. This was a couple of years ago and we learned of this when we tried to register to vote using our SBI address about 18mo ago.
Click to expand...
 
syjos said:
Good thing about a dirt home is it's appreciation. I know of a few people here in the US that sold their houses to live on a boat. Many years later when they wanted to move back ashore, they were unable to buy another home because the prices had gotten out of reach.
Click to expand...

Having lived in San Francisco - a market that is indeed difficult to re-enter once you exit, I fully understand what Sylos is saying. However, in my opinion, home ownership is over-rated as an investment. Home ownership works because you must live somewhere which offsets the high transaction costs and holding costs with added kicker of having an asset that is difficult to liquidate in the best of times (unless the market is crazy hot, still takes time and work to put a house in shape to sell). Living on a boat removes that benefit of needing a place to live.

There are risks to both sides. Much as I like and enjoy my house, I wish I had remained living on a boat. I have accumulated way too much stuff.

Peter
 
woodscrew said:
St. Brendand’s Isle looks interesting. We are seeing our accountant next week and will have to eventually deal with the NJ ‘’exit’’ tax. Don’t think we can escape NJ without paying that. Florida residency is a real possibility. We’ll have to weigh it all out. Right now up to our necks getting out of the house and especially my shop of 37 years.
Click to expand...

New Jersey has an exit tax? You have to pay to leave? Wow! :eek:
 
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