Boat sinks after hitting tug rope

The news item is brief, and I'm not sure of the boat brand and size. But it seems likely it was a twin engined boat on the plane. I don't see how else the props and struts would be ripped off after hitting a rope. Maybe there will be more detailed reports once the guys get off the P&O cruise ship in Brisbane tomorrow.

Seems to make a case for a single engined boat with skeg-protected prop!

https://www.smh.com.au/world/oceani...e-raft-off-new-caledonia-20190926-p52vco.html

Insequent said:

Seems to make a case for a single engined boat with skeg-protected prop!

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Not trying to scoot between a tug and it's tow would also be a good idea

Sure, but we don't know yet whether there was a tug and tow present!

I suspect that there wasn't, or else the tug would have rescued the guys.

Yup...more information needed.

looking for some enlightenment here from the old salts as i'm a stickler for grammatical accuracy. Do tugs tow using a "rope" (a tow rope) or is the link between tug and barge technically called something else? I actually don't know....

On a tug the steel cable used for towing is called a "string or line".
Wire ropes is the proper terminology for the tug line.

thank you "fgarriso"
appreciate the technical

I have never heard of a tug rope. I have heard of a tow line. Tow lines are made of wire rope which doesn’t float. Is “tug rope” Aussie speak for something else?

Chains typically connect tugs and barges here.

The term 'tug rope' in this case is a quote from the news report. Journalism being what it is these days, who knows what it was they hit, whether or not there was a tug in the vicinity at the time, etc. Another report I saw said there was a 'thick rope floating in the water'.

I would be curious to know if they were anywhere near longline fishing activity. Those guys have floats on their line, but I don't know whether there is wire in it. To tear off running gear and leave a hole in a boat would take both a fair amount of boat speed and a substantial line of some kind. I hope there is a follow-up report.

My personal experience with the media is that they get it half right and only half the story.

I looked at available reports, which are sketchy. There is mention of a rope, no mention of a tug,a barge, or anything like that. The crew have been taken to Brisbane,there will likely be interviews to come. My impression, and it`s no more than that, is that they simply came into contact with a large heavy line.

Tow wire. Chain bridle connects barge to wire.

could have been a trailing line for emergency pickup. They crossed too close behind.

Insequent said:

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Seems to make a case for a single engined boat with skeg-protected prop!

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And or cat with protected prop and rudder.
I have taken single engine and a couple of cats across to New Cal and Vanuatu, exposed anything would freak me out and the water there is clean compared to many places.

Insequent said:

The news item is brief, and I'm not sure of the boat brand and size. But it seems likely it was a twin engined boat on the plane. I don't see how else the props and struts would be ripped off after hitting a rope. Maybe there will be more detailed reports once the guys get off the P&O cruise ship in Brisbane tomorrow.

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The video included some pictures, once of which showed a sport fisher style boat in the background. So likely twin-engine with props on shafts, not outboards or stern drives. Thus the 'skeg bearings' mention in the article are likely what we'd call shaft struts here in the States.

More details would be of interest, but what was written doesn't seem terribly incorrect, at least not compared to some news articles.

“Tug rope” could be anything!
I frequently find floating rope debris and nets all matted up, sometimes into quite a large mat that floats just below the surface.
Some of the ropes they use to pull these nets are easily 3” diameter.
I can see where running over such at speed could do significant damage.
The open ocean barge tows around here use very long cable with a “catenary”
( usually a length of VERY heavy chain) in the middle to keep the line deep and to allow the water to act as a shock absorber as the towline moves up and down in the water. The rougher the water, the longer the towline. Cable cannot be allowed to snap up tight, it will wreck the tow boat.
Running over a towline like that will defiantly sink most small boats, and probably large ones too.
The best prevention is sharp eyes at all times, and following the rules of the road.
A tug with a tow is plainly marked as such, as well as is the tow, even though they’re often barely within sight of each other.
All accidents are not preventable, but many can be. The insurance industry banks on this fact.

If a tug was towing the rope when they hit it, the tug would have been on scene of the sinking already. I'm sure the tug operator on watch would have seen the SF hit it. So me thinks its was just a piece of free floating heavy line.
If it was an actual tow cable connected to a barge, they would have been run over by the barge.

Soo-Valley said:

could have been a trailing line for emergency pickup. They crossed too close behind.

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what, you mean that a barge has a floating line behind the barge or other tow that could be caught in the propellers by a boat going behind too close. who would have thunk it.
You mean they drag a line in case the main line breaks so they can hook up a new line in rough weather without having to come alongside?

kapnd said:

The best prevention is sharp eyes at all time..

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If I see a tugboat I automatically assume there's a barge or something else somewhere nearby, and prepare to alter my course to not be anywhere near the tug's path.

Soo-Valley said:

You mean they drag a line in case the main line breaks so they can hook up a new line in rough weather without having to come alongside?

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Really? Where is that a common practice?

wkearney99 said:

If I see a tugboat I automatically assume there's a barge or something else somewhere nearby, and prepare to alter my course to not be anywhere near the tug's path.



Really? Where is that a common practice?

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I have no idea,
can only state what I have seen more than a few times, a float being dragged behind a barge.

You mean they drag a line in case the main line breaks so they can hook up a new line in rough weather without having to come alongside?
_______________________________________________________________
YES,
I have seen the after lines being dragged behind barges here, also log tows. Have not paid attention in the last few years as there are FAR fewer than when I first started boating. Regardless , when I cross after a tow I stay well clear.
The ones I remember also had a good sized fender or float marking the end so it was more easily located but sometimes the float is gone, then what. I live in B.C. and I've seen them used here. The guideline used to be stay back at least 100 yards and keep your eyes peeled.

As far as the watch seeing a boat flipped, don't bet on it. Bunch of years ago a boat was flipped when they crossed the tow line. It was at night. The tug crew did not see it but according to the report they did feel a jerk so dropped power and used the searchlight before they realized what happened.
THere was a small speed boat who had tried to warn the unfortunate boat and did also help save some people. But the watch did NOT SEE and were it not for the jerk they could have carried on without being aware. Report below which I have read.

Marine Investigation Report M99W0133 - Transportation Safety Board of Canada


We have berthing tugs and they do not use wire lines for this purpose, rather synthetics, often Dyneema or Spectra. Some of those lines can float and if a piece broke away it could cause the trouble.

Even some [many] of the deep sea ships use synthetics for mooring lines rather than wire.

Now I'm going to have to go looking more since i have left Vancouver Harbour so don't see as much on a weekly or so basis.

THe line in question could indeed have been lost fishing gear depending upon the fishing rig. Some of those larger boats such as seiners use some pretty good size lines.

Soo-Valley said:

what, you mean that a barge has a floating line behind the barge or other tow that could be caught in the propellers by a boat going behind too close. who would have thunk it.
You mean they drag a line in case the main line breaks so they can hook up a new line in rough weather without having to come alongside?

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There are times when a line is towed behind the barge if a transfer from one tug to another is called for at some point.. This line has a buoy ball attached so that another tug boat can pick it up and attach to the barge and transfer the barge from one tug to the other. These lines are not usually long enough that a passing boat can run over them, unless they wanted to get rediculously close to the back of the towed barge when passing. Probably not the case here. Just a boat running over some floating, heavy, discarded rope.

This is a report of the TV story after the guys arrived in Brisbane today.

https://www.news.com.au/national/qu...c/news-story/210958bd99e9697df7bd09d1ca42fd4b

A lot of boats the struts are simply bolted to hull skin without much reinforcement. We see that when one grounds hard at high speed, the strut just punches though the relatively thin hull.

Tangling a line on a twin can do the same thing. Props and shafts literally winch themselves together. Strut pad weak and hull breaks.

After investigating a few of these, when building my shaft line, the hull over the strut is seriously reinforced.

Ski in NC said:

A lot of boats the struts are simply bolted to hull skin without much reinforcement. We see that when one grounds hard at high speed, the strut just punches though the relatively thin hull.

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Just got off the phone with the yard. They happen to be replacing my shaft seal, cutlass bearing and repacking the rudder post. They mentioned that the struts bolts are leaking, slightly rusted and the washers are way too small. They also mentioned that it looks like someone tried to reef down on the bolts to stop the leak, which as a result of the small washers now look like they're compressing a bit. The entire strut is getting removed, dried out, new bolts, a a backing plate installed. They were basically saying the same thing to me.

As to the accident I see a lot of barges being towed in my area. It's easy to see how it can happen. I hear calls on the radio of people almost crossing a tow line all the time. To my knowledge they all use a chain bridle attached to wire rope. (Wire rope has significantly less weight for the same tensile strength as comparable chain, takes up less space and can be more easily spooled).

There are incredible distances between the tug and the barge. A novice could easily (and apparently do) mistake a barge for a small container ship (hint.....no wheelhouse ) I hear at least one tug operator a year hailing boats warning them they're about to cross his tow line.

I once heard a tug hailing the offending vessel by name. The guy was broadcasting his AIS info. but apparently not listening to channel 16. I'm always amazed at how many people don't listen on 16.

But then I'm always amazed how many people think that 16 is for hailing the harbor master or various marinas and docks.

Most fishermen (not commercial) only put their radio on their local working channel.

Its not the first sinking in deep water for one of these guys.

"“Initially we thought we might have hit a reef but that wasn’t the case,” Chris Doran told reporters in Brisbane after the cruise ship that rescued them docked on Saturday morning.
“We found quite a large ship’s rope, there was about 50 metres of it and it wrapped around both propellers causing a breach in the hull, the boat started filling with water.”

This speaks to one of my greatest fears while underway, at sea or on inshore waters - barely submerged debris that damages the boat below the waterline. I've seen heavy logs and containers at sea. A section of heavy dock line can be equally destructive.

It can happen anywhere. Recently here in Jacksonville, the Jean Ribault (the St. Johns River ferry) fouled one of its two propellors on a piece of partially submerged rope that happened to be drifting past the ferry landing as they were getting underway. It damaged the shaft sufficiently that the ferry had to go into the yard, shutting down operations for three weeks.

Thinking about the amount of crap that we turn loose in the ocean is dispiriting.