OTDE - Has... err, Had its place!

FF wrote:
Many "old salts" will simply say Bye, Bye! Me included!!


And the next stop is??

On a similar forum years ago I was dunned to appoligise " for stating that I avoid JABSCO products !!

Once the censorship starts the slope gets pretty slippery.

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Fred - I understand.**

Forums are just a game of communication to/from/with others of whom without internet we'd probably*never met.* I use forums as respite from my incessant*business doings/obligations/addiction*and numerous contract writings as well as my IP product developments.* I just completed one contract at 4:30 - 6 AM this morn and am now playing with this relaxing forum banter. **

I really could care less if any forum stays open or pleasing to me.* Plenty of others things to do and forums to chose from, if I feel so inclined.* That said, this forum has afforded me boat-worthy communication with mariners as well as opportunity to interact/debate on pertinent, timely issues via OTDE, with some pretty darn intelligent folks... others not so much so, IMHO lmao!!*

Without OTDE and therefore OPEN availability to converse with some of the crusty souls who frequented that forum section I will probably seldom visit.* Noooo Big Deal!!* I only began this thread to see what might occur and in process to learn what the new owners have planned... as well as to give the owners a bit o good ol insight as to how this forums contributors truly feel about OTDE.* Pole results speak for themselves.* Change is the only constant!

If any of you early adopters remember, JB started this forum after excessive moderation over on T&T. That, and the ability to post pictures brought it to it's current state. The length and participation of this thread proves that OTDE will always be here. If you don't put it in it's own spot, it will just spill over into the other areas. I think OTDE was one of the strengths of this forum. But like any free market item, the new owners are free to change it any way they want, and the users are free to go anywhere they like.

Keith wrote:
If any of you early adopters remember, JB started this forum after excessive moderation over on T&T. That, and the ability to post pictures brought it to it's current state. The length and participation of this thread proves that OTDE will always be here. If you don't put it in it's own spot, it will just spill over into the other areas. I think OTDE was one of the strengths of this forum. But like any free market item, the new owners are free to change it any way they want, and the users are free to go anywhere they like.

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Keith, Well Put!*

1,060 visits so far...

2bucks wrote:
* NO SPAM! Our user base is not a resource to be "mined" by individuals, groups, or businesses, for profit or not for profit. Participants may not post affiliate links or links to direct others to any pages at their own commercial website or website in which they have a commercial interest. Exception to this may be found in Signature Standards, Marine-Related Commercial Posting, Sponsoring Vendors and Commercial Members (see below).


I'm pretty sure many of us on here found this site by this exact item that it looks like is being banned. I saw Bakers ad about starting a new site on Trawlers and Trawlering site. In fact I saw it a number of times. And now he's sold the site which means it is commercial. How times change...

Ken

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*You're skating on thin ice amigo! *

*

PS...I posted on T&T about this site exactly once. *There may have been many other discussions about it but I had nothing to do with that. *I have been back to that list just that one time.

*


-- Edited by Baker on Sunday 18th of March 2012 09:17:24 PM

I believe that T&T mailing list was sold to an advertisement "magazine" that was promotion for only one brand of TT.

Similar to the trashing/advertising that went on with Passagemaker the book after it was sold.

Circumnavigator , or something like that was the name , and the prohibition against calling stuff that is totally unsuitable for cruising was needed to not hack off the advertising base.

Today with the market so taken over by only a few brands Tethford and Dometic come to mind,my guess is Practical Sailor will be under attack. next.

Interesting stats re this thread, to date; 7:55 AM PST, 3/19/12
*
Of 1,192 visits - - > Only 57 votes!*
*
36 total replies (posts)
*
1.***** Either those that voted are visiting some 20 times each... maybe, but doubtful??
2.***** Many visiting forum participants are simply not interested enough to vote...*could be.
3.***** Most visitors simply not clear what OTDE actually represents from its history...*could be.
4.***** Visitors not sure how they think OTDE should be handled, by moderators etc...*maybe.
5.***** Many visitors are not forum participants at all... fairly likely.
*
I imagine owners and moderators have access to stat answers re this thread.
*
Poll stats speak for themselves!



-- Edited by Art on Monday 19th of March 2012 08:55:50 AM


-- Edited by Art on Monday 19th of March 2012 08:57:58 AM

I would imagine that visitors that have not registered are unable to vote....that is likely the bulk of your "views". PS, I haven't voted. My personal opinion is to have OTDE like it always was. I never went in there unless somebody dragged me in there to clean something up....which was VERY rare.

Art wrote:1.***** Either those that voted are visiting some 20 times each... maybe, but doubtful??

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*I voted and have been here every time there is a new post to read. It could have easily been 20 times by now. I suspect #1 is the most likely reason for the high views and low votes.

TY for input John...* below is quote from you with my inserts in CAPS
*
I would imagine that visitors that have not registered are unable to vote....that is likely the bulk of your "views". MY FEELING ALSO - - - > BUT, TOMS RECENT INPUT ON VISITS HOLDS WEIGHT TOO
*

*PS, I haven't voted. My personal opinion is to have OTDE like it always was. GREAT TO HEAR! I never went in there unless somebody dragged me in there to clean something up....which was VERY rare. ALSO GREAT TO HEAR!!

Art wrote:*PS, *I never went in there unless somebody dragged me in there to clean something up....which was VERY rare. ALSO GREAT TO HEAR!!

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*Hmmm. *That's a good point, Art. *I guess I was dragged into OTDE, it would have to be kicking and screaming. *Once I was there, I'd probably kick and scream a bit. *Never thought of that.

Never clicked on OTDE but I liked a more active board

Baker wrote:

PS...I posted on T&T about this site exactly once. *There may have been many other discussions about it but I had nothing to do with that. *I have been back to that list just that one time.

*

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*John created TF back when I was fairly active on T&T.* But my attention was drawn to TF not by John's announcement of the forum on T&T but by Carey's bringing it to my intention.* He was one of the first participants on TF--- I have no idea how he found it because he didn't use T&T--- and after a few weeks I took a look at TF, too.* I believe--- I don't recall for sure-- that I posted at least one comment on T&T about the new forum and how cool it was, and I believe--- but don't recall for sure--- that John responded to me either on T&T or in an e-mail.* But I don't recall John ever promoting TF on T&T other than his first announcement, which I did see but didn't do anything about until Carey mentioned how impressed he was with it.

GonzoF1 wrote:*

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*I voted and have been here every time there is a new post to read. It could have easily been 20 times by now. I suspect #1 is the most likely reason for the high views and low votes.

I did not vote, because of*#2.* But like you I visit most every new post just to see if there is anything worth seeing.**So I probably have been here 20 times also!!

2.***** Many visiting forum participants are simply not interested enough to vote...*could be.

Marin wrote:Baker wrote:

PS...I posted on T&T about this site exactly once. *There may have been many other discussions about it but I had nothing to do with that. *I have been back to that list just that one time.

*

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*John created TF back when I was fairly active on T&T.* But my attention was drawn to TF not by John's announcement of the forum on T&T but by Carey's bringing it to my intention.* He was one of the first participants on TF--- I have no idea how he found it because he didn't use T&T--- and after a few weeks I took a look at TF, too.* I believe--- I don't recall for sure-- that I posted at least one comment on T&T about the new forum and how cool it was, and I believe--- but don't recall for sure--- that John responded to me either on T&T or in an e-mail.* But I don't recall John ever promoting TF on T&T other than his first announcement, which I did see but didn't do anything about until Carey mentioned how impressed he was with it.

*Thanks Marin!!!

First off, thanks for all the input and view points on this topic. Even though the numbers of voters is

I just want to state AGAIN that OTDE is just closed temporarily. Once we are converted to vBulletin we will be splitting up OTDE into two sections 1) Off Topic and 2) Hot Topics. The Off Topic forum will be a regular forum but the Hot Topics forum will be an opt-in section. This setup ensures that those who enjoy participating in the hot topic debates can continue to do so while at the same time not mixing them with other threads like jokes, sports, cars, weather, wine and other off topic discussions.

Andy R wrote:
First off, thanks for all the input and view points on this topic. Even though the numbers of voters is

I just want to state AGAIN that OTDE is just closed temporarily. Once we are converted to vBulletin we will be splitting up OTDE into two sections 1) Off Topic and 2) Hot Topics. The Off Topic forum will be a regular forum but the Hot Topics forum will be an opt-in section. This setup ensures that those who enjoy participating in the hot topic debates can continue to do so while at the same time not mixing them with other threads like jokes, sports, cars, weather, wine and other off topic discussions.

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Sounds good, Andy R.* Hope this thread helped show the general camber of forum contributors.* Any prediction as to date when vBulletin will be installed and OTDE can reopen?* Cheers! Art

Art, a thread was just posted regarding your question....it is coming soon!

Baker wrote:
Art, a thread was just posted regarding your question....it is coming soon!

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Thanks, John!*

I read*Andy R's thread...*And The Beat Goes ON - - - - >>>> !!!!!!!

If you go to this Trawler Forum thread you can read Bakers ONE ANY ONLY message about TF on the T&T list.

Mike
Palm Coast FL

Greetings,
While the poll results ARE interesting, it would be even MORE interesting to try to figure out how many potential members have either left prematurely or declined to enroll as a result of the shenanigans on OTDE. I suppose we'll never know unless someone expressed their dissatisfaction with the format before departing. Just sayin'

RT Firefly wrote:
Greetings,
While the poll results ARE interesting, it would be even MORE interesting to try to figure out how many potential members have either left prematurely or declined to enroll as a result of the shenanigans on OTDE. I suppose we'll never know unless someone expressed their dissatisfaction with the format before departing. Just sayin'

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Well... RTF... You surely do have a valid point there (although you will see below that Im not exactly sure what your point is); your point is one I hope that could have the new owners take into deep consideration regarding their time schedule for re opening OTDE... in order to still TF waters back into a semblance of contributor harmony!* And, for new members joining.* **
*
Previous to abrupt banishment of OTDE (with no warning I was aware of) most if not all TF waters appeared pretty calm with daily currents flowing regularly and smoothly between their threads and posts throughout TF sections.* Forum contributors wanting only to discuss boating topics did so and would happily ignore OTDE (not a bad way to proceed... cant say as I blame them, at all!).* Contributors who wanted to solely delve into the morass that some of the heated OTDE threads evolved into, so they were able to THROW their insults, barbs, or short-quips, did so with seeming joy and virtual impunity (their inputs are not my cup of tea... but, different strokes for different folks... live and let live is how I see it!).* Others who wanted to get points across and simultaneously read others points regarding non-boating items in OTDE, as well as to enjoy and calmly participate in many of the more boat-like TF sections, were also able satiate their needs (that includes me and numerous other TF members).
*
So... as, a fantasy, I wistfully believe you may somewhat allude (subconsciously), that previous and potential TF contributor volume may have simply gone elsewhere due to this current OTDE disruption.* Be real hard to put a count on that, as there appears no way to track those numbers.* However, in reality, by your words it appears that you may feel it was the existence of OTDE (at all) that was the driving force to expel any number of potential members.* Clear my confusion up for me would you RT.* Thanks!
*
To Date; By the Recorded Numbers:
*
-******** 1840 visitors to this thread so far / only 49 replies
*
When asked: Should OTDE be Allowed (only 69 votes)
*
-******** 52.2% vote: YES Unmonitored
-******** 23.2% vote: YES Monitored
-******** 24.6% vote: Not At All
*
Time will tell the outcome... it always does, in everything!* Good ol Time.* Gotta Luv It!

*

RT Firefly wrote:
... it would be even MORE interesting to try to figure out how many potential members have either left prematurely or declined to enroll as a result of the shenanigans on OTDE.

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*Well, of the fairly active members who I know or havevcorresponded with who have left as a direct result of OTDE there is Walt and so far as I know, Carey.* Eric Henning left for a long time based, as I recall, on political discussions on OTDE.* I know you left for a long time although I don't know the reason.

But I suspect that most people who stop participating in the forum do so for reasons other than OTDE.* All forums on any subject tend to get very repetitive, with the same questions asked and answered over and over.* I can't speak for anyone else, but while I find TF an interesting place to converse with people who have had experiences different than mine, have common interests (not necessarily to do with boating) or who live and boat in an area I'm interested in (like Dave and Peter), I certainly don't need the forum for any aspect of our actual boating.* There are many good diesel, electrical, electronics, prop, etc. shops in our area, we have a good boatyard in Bellingham and there are others nearby in Anacortes.* I know several current or retired shipwrights.*

So for us, information and assistance with reagards to our boat is easy to get locally and in person.* And I know or at least am familiar with the reputation of all these folks, where the people giving advice on a forum are for the most part a total unknown.* If TF went away tomorrow, it would not make any difference to our boating, and I suspect it wouldn't to most of the other members' boating either.

So my guess is that members drift in, find out what they want to find out, and might stay if they like the dialogue, but also might drift away again once they've gotten whatever they want from TF, or they find another forum they like, or their own interests move them on to other things.


-- Edited by Marin on Thursday 22nd of March 2012 12:04:46 PM

RT Firefly wrote:
Greetings,
While the poll results ARE interesting, it would be even MORE interesting to try to figure out how many potential members have either left prematurely or declined to enroll as a result of the shenanigans on OTDE. I suppose we'll never know unless someone expressed their dissatisfaction with the format before departing. Just sayin'

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*I've been here a very short time compared to many. I recall at least one instance in particular of a new member who after a dozen or so posts complained about the shenanigans of OTDE. I recall one seasoned member calling the junior member out, "Great, another newbie trying to tell us how to run our forum" I believe was part his response.

As one who stays away form OTDE for the most part, I like the idea of seperating hot topics from the jokes etc. It works well on many other forums. It will work great here too.

Of course the flip side are those members who use the forum only to participate in OTDE. Ancora comes to mind here. To my knowledge these folks rarely or never post anything about boating, but use the forum as another venue to express their hatred of this, that, or the other.

While it's not my forum and I have no say whatsoever on how the owners choose to run it, I've always found it annoying that it is used simply as an avenue of opinion by people who have no connection with boating at all, or who do but aren't interested in the purpose of fhe forum, only the opportunity it presents to broadcast their own political or social views.

I don't miss the absence of these folks at all with the closing of OTDE.* It's one thing if Art, RTF, etc. like to discuss off-topic ideas and viewpoints in OTDE.* They're also active boaters who contribute greatly to the rest of the forum as well.* I think it's quite another thing if a person only uses the forum to vent their political or social frustrations.* There are other places on the internet that cater to that sort of thing.* To that end, I don't miss OTDE at all.

Greetings,
Mr. Art. No real point to my question other than idle musing. If I saw a survey that found 75% of a group enjoyed a cold beer on a hot day I would think what about the other 25%? Lemonade? WARM beer? They don't like hot days? Don't mean to influence the owners, they'll be done when they're done. The answer is probably close to what Mr. Marin suggests-the ebb and flow of listees. Hopefully with the new "hot topic" format, I will be able to call out the shills and trolls. I think Mr. Marin alluded to one in particular whom I have absolutely no use for.

RT Firefly wrote:
Greetings,
Mr. Art. No real point to my question other than idle musing. If I saw a survey that found 75% of a group enjoyed a cold beer on a hot day I would think what about the other 25%? Lemonade? WARM beer? They don't like hot days? Don't mean to influence the owners, they'll be done when they're done. The answer is probably close to what Mr. Marin suggests-the ebb and flow of listees. Hopefully with the new "hot topic" format, I will be able to call out the shills and trolls. I think Mr. Marin alluded to one in particular whom I have absolutely no use for.

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Cool - TY, RT... I can hardly wait to see your mellow, pointed ways in action.* Shills and trolls should be banned to their caves!* At least thats my opinion.
*

*

Some here have asked why the new owner would change things when things were just fine. Well, I have a very simple theory and maybe even too simple. I believe that when a website becomes for-profit, which I have no problem with, from being a member run operation, the new ownership has to attract sponsors/advertisers for its income.

This is where I believe the OTDE section becomes a problem. If I were a potential advertiser and I came across OTDE, I don't think I would be too eager to have my company associated with such a site. But on the other hand, if all I saw was Trawler Forum minus OTDE then heck ya, I would advertise.

I'm just trying to understand, and again this is just a theory. I don't think that the new owner closed OTDE just to*mess with Art and the rest.

From what I've read the new owner is a seasoned forum owner/operator. So he knows what he's doing.*I wish him all the success.

*

*


-- Edited by mahal on Thursday 22nd of March 2012 05:37:24 PM

mahal wrote:
Some here have asked why the new owner would change things when things were just fine. Well, I have a very simple theory and maybe even too simple. I believe that when a website becomes for-profit, which I have no problem with, from being a member run operation, the new ownership has to attract sponsors/advertisers for its income.

This is where I believe the OTDE section becomes a problem. If I were a potential advertiser and I came across OTDE, I don't think I would be too eager to have my company associated with such a site. But on the other hand, if all I saw was Trawler Forum minus OTDE then heck ya, I would advertise.

I'm just trying to understand, and again this is just a theory. I don't think that the new owner closed OTDE just to*mess with Art and the rest.

From what I've read the new owner is a seasoned forum owner/operator. So he knows what he's doing.*I wish him all the success.

-- Edited by mahal on Thursday 22nd of March 2012 05:37:24 PM

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So true - Too true... If OTDE is*abolished, that is just another example to*the Dummying of America!* We get much more Politically Correct... I'm gonna PUKE! lmao*