Is this set up OK?

Just looking at a boat with head set up attached Is this OK ?

Notice:

There is no vented loop -- there is a vent that goes from the top of the tank to the side of the hull.

There is no Y valve -- but I can close the seacock and prevent discharge. It would be possible to add a way to lock that shut (although currently it is not locked).

I don't think it would siphon because of the vent to the top -- but this is my main concern.

I am guessing that if I locked the thru hull down the coast guard would be ok

Other thing would be will be laying down in the pipe between the tank and the thru hull ? would a pump out still suck it all out?

any advice appreciated thanks

Welcome aboard. I believe you cannot post images until you've made a minimum of 10 posts. But I'm not certain. There is a welcome thread here that might help:

http://www.trawlerforum.com/forums/s22/

ok thanks

ok thanks. guess I will have to figure it out or make a bunch of posts!!

Is there a pump out top side on the deck? If not then a I would say that is the reason there is no Y valve. You would not be compliant with the regulations as there is no way to pup out at the dock.

trawlerdrake said:

ok thanks. guess I will have to figure it out or make a bunch of posts!!

Click to expand...

You can upload a pic to postimage.org, then link it here.

yes

there is a pump out up to the deck. but no y valve. just a T on the discharge side of the holding tank. Also no vented loop ..... but there us a vent from top of tank to side of hull near deck level about 14" above tank

head, inlet and discharge are below waterline. holding tank is above

i will try again to attach drawing

I suppose that would work as long as the sea cock was closed when using the dock pump out. There needs to be a pump if you are going to discharge overboard.
I would talk to the owner and ask how this system works.

Check out this link: http://www.westmarine.com/WestAdvisor/Selecting-a-Sanitation-System

Looks like a simple effective system. That set up may be one that has a gravity discharge when offshore where you just open the valve while underway and the tank empties.


I have also been hearing about the need for having a macerator in a system before the holding tank if it is to be pumped out, but i dont know if that is a requirement as I haven't tried to become an expert - i have enough poop to deal with in life as it is....

System looks good to me. It should gravity drain if the base of the tank is above the WL. My last boat was set up this way. No macerator pump no fuss.

I don’t believe you need a Y valve since the toilet(s) go straight to the holding tank. If anything, you may need a lock on the through hull that gravity drains the holding tank.

There needs to be a pump between the holding tank and the T intersection. Without a proper trash pump you will fill your holding tank with sea water when the sea cock is open.

trawlerdrake said:

ok thanks. guess I will have to figure it out or make a bunch of posts!!

Click to expand...

No need to get too involved, just write welcome aboard whenever someone joins and that will give your posts # a tick up .....


fb

trawlerdrake said:

ok thanks. guess I will have to figure it out or make a bunch of posts!!

Click to expand...

Send me a PM and I'll reply with my email address so you can send it to me and I'll post it...prob'ly with a comment and/or question or two.


--Peggie

I should have scrolled down before posting....

If the toilet is a sea water toilet, there must be a vented loop in the inlet. On toilets that have a line from the thru-hull to the pump and another line from the pump to the bowl, the loop belongs in the line from the pump to the bowl. It may be necessary on some electric toilets that don't have two inlet sections to install an electric solenoid valve in the loop.

If the tank is entirely above the water line there would be no need for a vented loop or pump in the TANK discharge line because the tank is plumbed to drain via gravity. That would put the discharge fitting IN the bottom of the tank instead of on the end or a side.


If you want the ability to flush the toilet directly overboard you'll need a y-valve in the line from the toilet to the tank. You'll also need a vented loop in the line from the y-valve to the thru-hull. Better yet, you can send everything to the tank, leaving the thru-hull open when at sea outside the "3 mile limit"...closed when inshore.

I'd recommend going with TWO separate discharge fittings in the tank--one in the bottom to dump at sea and the second one to the deck pumpout fitting. And I'd put the second one (to the pumpout fitting) in the top of the tank with a tube inside to the bottom.

I think we'll prob'ly need to talk after you've had time to digest all this, so send me that PM anyway.

--Peggie

The only real problem I see is the lack of a vented loop in the intake. If possible the vented loop should be between the intake pump and the bowl, not between the seacock and the pump. If it’s between the seacock and intake pump, you’ll have a hard time sucking water as the vent will let air into the intake line.

That setup is very similar to what I had except my tank was below the waterline so I couldn’t gravity drain the tank. I had a macerator Pump between the tank and the discharge seacock.

A shut off valve at the tank discharge would be nice but I never had one.

Thank goodness there is someone on the forum that can’t draw any better than I can.

You may wish to read applicable regs and touch base Peggy Hall the head mistress before any mods or changes.

thank you

Most real sea cocks have an operating handle that can be easily removed.

Remove the handle inshore with the sea cock closed and keep it in a drawer.

trawlerdrake,

You are onto it! For some reason all of us boaters love nothing more than to over engineer everything- especially head systems.

If you keep the holding tank above the water line that eliminates all kinds of stuff; vented loop, discharge pump, ect. If you can "lock" the discharge sea cock (or remove the handle as a poster suggested) that removes the need for a switch or "Y" valve. Attached set-up allows the tank to be pumped out, or discharged where permitted. (I know some folks read the regs as any over board discharge needs to be "macerated" but thats a loose term and I have yet to find a passage that defines it).

For this set up between the hand pumping and head chemicals flushed into the tank, a fairly liquid result is obtained.

Granted, this is an old school set up; hand pumper with sea water flush. Electric, fresh water flush systems definitely have their advantages, but their weak points as well. Only two things can ruin a beautiful day on the water; engine trouble and a mal-functioning head!

Cheers all - got only 33 days till my launch date!

I would be concerened there would be a smell with no Y Valve there is raw sewage sitting in the line from the T to the closed through hull

When we have had this system deployed we never experienced any more smell than you might anticipate with any salt water set up. Theres not a whole lot of difference between the hose used in that run and the actual holding tank; and whats in the hose line has been subjected to the same liberal doses of chemicals as whats in the tank.

There is always give and take when dumbing things down and seeking simplicity; you give up some features. The Y valve is a good thing to have no doubt, unless it gets jammed because someone flushed a feminine hygiene product down the head and you can't turn the selector to what you want want at the worst possible time.

No question a fresh water system will have less odor than a salt water one, and a salt water one with more controls and features would probably have less odor than this set up. I'm certainly not advocating this approach as superior in any way, but rather bringing it forth as a low cost, easy installation, low maintenance and generally trouble free one.

On tanks that have a discharge port AT the bottom of 'em, there's always raw waste sitting in the line between the tank and a y-valve, or between the tank and the macerator pump on boats that only have a wye, so it's unlikely a hose from a discharge port IN the bottom of a tank directly to the thru-hull would be any more likely to to stink. The quality/permeation resistance of the hose definitely matters though.

And Sean, you should have a vented loop in your toilet intake...it belongs between the pump and the bowl and should be at least 6-8" above waterline.
Australia is the only country I've ever heard of that requires all waste leaving the boat to be macerated.




--Peggie

You asked about pipe? I usually lay out sewage systems in schedule 80 plastic pipe. It lasts forever, unlike hoses. Schedule 80 has a thicker wall, less likely to break or crack when under stress. Sewage hoses are usually ribbed and cause some restriction whereas pipe is smooth and pumps better.