Seeking advice

NewbieFromNJ said:

This is why besides financial issues I need 2 more years of research. I will look into the zero speed stabilizers. Thanks B

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Most are going away from them to gyros on larger boats. One other stabilizer I recommend giving consideration. That is Side-Power's Vector Fins. They're in essence zero speed but a few twists to them. We had them on a Sunseeker and loved them anchored, at slow speed, or underway. They even call them the "Permanent Seasickness Cure."

https://slides.sleipner.no/stabiliz...sc=203514447.1.1543347740715&__hsfp=188824577

The boat we had them on came either with them or Gyro. We got them because they would perform far better than Gyro at higher speeds. Our experience is they perform as advertised. Many faster boats that get Gyros also get fins.

I can just see some engineer in Norway bored and deciding to play around with different shapes and methods. Oh, what if we curved it. Maybe like this. Then probably to his shock he hit upon one that worked. Said, well, it might work sitting but what about at speed. Shocking, still works. Maybe just on this boat, we'll have to try others. Oh my, it still works. But why? We can't just say it was an accident. We must figure out why, then we can claim a theory for what led us to this.

NewbieFromNJ said:

Simi 60, did you ever install flopper stoppers on your boat..

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Not yet

Had someone lined up to do the welding and fabrication for me when we came out of the water for two weeks recently and they totally let me down.

The prices for getting them done on short notice by anyone else would have required selling a kidney or resorting to male prostitution neither of which held any appeal.
I have built aluminium vessels before and if I had access to the gear would be an easy make.
The arms have a couple of hundred in material and several hours labour at most in them.

Why is there a picture of a PBY on this thread?

I would give the Mainship 40 a look. I don't know if they make a 43?
I have a 34T and I love it. I don't worry about guests. If they want to stay over night, there's a pull out couch (not very comfortable). I have twins with a bow thruster. Can anyone say YEAH!

BandB said:

Most are going away from them to gyros on larger boats. One other stabilizer I recommend giving consideration. That is Side-Power's Vector Fins. They're in essence zero speed but a few twists to them. We had them on a Sunseeker and loved them anchored, at slow speed, or underway. They even call them the "Permanent Seasickness Cure."

https://slides.sleipner.no/stabiliz...sc=203514447.1.1543347740715&__hsfp=188824577

The boat we had them on came either with them or Gyro. We got them because they would perform far better than Gyro at higher speeds. Our experience is they perform as advertised. Many faster boats that get Gyros also get fins.

I can just see some engineer in Norway bored and deciding to play around with different shapes and methods. Oh, what if we curved it. Maybe like this. Then probably to his shock he hit upon one that worked. Said, well, it might work sitting but what about at speed. Shocking, still works. Maybe just on this boat, we'll have to try others. Oh my, it still works. But why? We can't just say it was an accident. We must figure out why, then we can claim a theory for what led us to this.

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If I was in the market for stabilizers for a slow boat, I'd serious look at a Magnus effect stabilizer. Not many installations that I know of, but I sure like the theory.


https://rotorswing.com/

dhays said:

If I was in the market for stabilizers for a slow boat, I'd serious look at a Magnus effect stabilizer. Not many installations that I know of, but I sure like the theory.


https://rotorswing.com/

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It seems to have potential but does seem to still be in the experimental, testing, and revising mode. Perhaps in the future. I was hesitant about the Vector fins at first, but after finding out how many boats had them and how they were performing I gained courage.

There is a late model low engine hour GB42 with stabilizers for sale here, with a recon genset which has about 1000 hours on it. Is one issue with stabilizers you have to run the genset for them to work? I know the genset could have been worn out and replaced for other reasons, but I suspect long hours driving the stabilizers is more likely. I don`t have,and know SFA about, stabilizers.

BruceK said:

There is a late model low engine hour GB42 with stabilizers for sale here, with a recon genset which has about 1000 hours on it. Is one issue with stabilizers you have to run the genset for them to work? I know the genset could have been worn out and replaced for other reasons, but I suspect long hours driving the stabilizers is more likely. I don`t have,and know SFA about, stabilizers.

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There are electric designs, and pneumatic designs, but most are hydraulic. They don't need a lot of flow, and many larger motors can power them just fine with an optional pump. In my case, there is a pump driven off the front drive pulley via a u joint.

Gyros do require a genset power to keep spinning, which is one of the disadvantages of them, IMO.

I guess its possible this vessel has an electric driven hydraulic pump, which could require a genset, although that seems unlikely.

There's a definite variance on gen sets based on size and complexity of boat and location. Most larger boats run them 24/7 as they have A/C or Heat to run, hot water needed, dishwashers, washers and dryers, refrigerators and freezers all requiring them.

Boats, not as large as above, in warmer areas run them more simply because of their need for air conditioning.

Now, sailboaters will saw off their right arm to avoid running a gen. A lot of trawler owners came from that mindset. Trawler owners in the PNW don't have the need for A/C. Smaller boats don't have the complex needs as much plus may find the generator more annoying. Then some are just more comfortable in warm, non conditioned air than others of us have.

FF said:

"This will be my second new boat. After all the issues I had on my previous new boat I will definitely get it surveyed and give the list to the maker and I'm sure there will be a list. __________________"

If the dealer will accept the contract , its best to hold back 10% of the purchase price till AFTER a new boat is surveyed and repaired.

As 10% of sales price is about half of a boat dealers profit , your boat gets priority in the repair dept.

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A very good idea and thanks for it. So the premise would be to bring an independent surveyor to your sea trials (acceptance trials). Generally the 10% or other amount is held against that final deliverable.

I have an OA 456 with both flopper stoppers and Trac ABT hydraulic stabilizers. We come from the sailboat world and put thousands miles on or boat to include extended Bluewater sailing.

We went to the trawler in 2016. My wife now says, no stabilizers, no go. It is nearly unbelievable what a difference they make. We now are in the Bahamas after going down the ICW from Hampton Virginia. We have a hydraulic pump on each engine, and can choose which engine provides pressure.

I have never deployed the flopperstoppers. I think it has more to do where we cruise than on their utility. I know that we would have used them extensively in the Caribbean. Not so much of a need going up and down the iCW or in the Bahamas.

Gordon

FF said:

"My research has led me to believe that at the minimum, an engineering space inspection should be preformed at least once an hour while underway."

Boats are more reliable than autos (after the first 500 hours) do you stop hourly to inspect the car engine? Of course not!

A lifting hatch will allow your EYEBALLS access ,to inspect as often as desired, although rugs or floor sound damping can make it a chore.

WE have found that once after shutdown is sufficient to inspect the engine room.

That way we know all is well for an AM departure or a midnight anchor drill .

With the low cost a camera and lamp could be mounted below ,

but to actually monitor an engine Murphy Alarm Gauges do a far better job.

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Yep I think the once an hour thing is a fallacy, at least when sailing for multiple days straight. No way or need for that unless you have no faith in your engine(s). I usually checked 2 to 4 times daily at most.

Same thing for shutting down the engine for oil level checks. Nonsense. Just learn to judge your oil level when it's running, even with spatter on the dip stick. Maybe it was just my Jimmies, but it was accurate I found. Other engines might not be so.

However the camera idea is great.

Delfin said:

Not sure if this will be helpful, but roll at anchor is something you get pretty well habituated to, within limits, of course... But by comparison to the open ocean, it felt completely stable when on board. Flopper stoppers do help, though.

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Like NewbieFromNJ was saying, my wife also is a big "customer" of the seasickness bug, and therefore not so hot about boats. Boat roll can be really bad at anchor even on my past 65' MY. One shipyard I spoke to swears they achieve about 30% roll reduction with large rolling chocks on their fishing boats. I don't entirely believe him and am more interested in a flume tank for controlling roll underway and at anchor.

makobuilders said:

A very good and thanks for it. So the premise would be to bring an independent surveyor to your sea trials (acceptance trials). Generally the 10% or other amount is held against that final deliverable.

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At least that as even that doesn't fully protect you, but also by refusing to take final delivery based on a surveyor's findings you enhance your legal standing. We've done this several times. On new semi-custom, we had no issues as surveyor was regularly onsite during the build. On one production boat, no negative findings. On the other production boat and a semi-production boat minor items. One item on the production, four or five on the semi-production. However, the kinds of things that often drag on. Their initial comments were "Just bring it back anytime and we'll fix it. Won't take long." Our comments were "Just fix it now and then we'll take delivery and make final payment. As you said, it won't take long." Both times the work was started immediately and completed that same day.

Now, making subject to survey isn't a perfect solution. You've already paid a substantial amount and if they refuse to fix everything before delivery you have a standoff. At that point, you either have to give in and accept a boat with problems, knowing they'll never likely fix them or you have to go to court while leaving the boat in their possession, knowing they're likely not to take good care of it and even try billing you for storage. So, it still doesn't solve the unreputable or crooked dealer or builder. It just works with a smoother closing with a good dealer or builder. In fact, it benefits the good dealer or builder as an independent third party has signed off and if later problems are found at least you can both agree they weren't initially obvious.