Single parents?

Hello everyone!

Here’s a little introduction as well as looking for recommendations.

I am from New England and I hate snow. I am a single mother to a 7 year old boy. I got a taste of the liveaboard lifestyle a few years ago when I dated a guy with a 37 foot sailboat and we spent most of a summer on the sailboat. I am not confident enough to try to single hand a sailboat. I have been around boats my entire life, and in the past year I have decided I want to liveaboard with my son.

My goal is to get an older trawler in the next few years. I want one that is structurally and mechanically sound that I can rehab the interior to make my own. I am saving money, hoping to be able to find one that I wouldn’t need to finance. Yes, I’m aware that anything I find cheaper will need a lot of work. I would do all the major work up here where I can take advantage of family and tools to assist when needed. I would hopefully learn more about the mechanical aspects of running a boat and get familiar with what I buy. When the major stuff is done and I’m comfortable running the boat alone, my son and I would start south. Our end location is TBD. I would go until I find someplace I want to stay. Ideally, somewhere I could dive year round without a drysuit.

I don’t seem to see a lot of single people doing the liveaboard lifestyle, never mind single parents. Any blogs I can find are usually couples or couples with their kids. I already know my dad will be overprotective and be the hardest one to get onboard with my plans. He will worry about our safety.

Are there any other single parents that liveaboard? Are there areas where this is more common? Tips? I don’t have to contend with limitations due to custody/visitation. I have sole legal/physical custody and there is no visitation.

Realistically, What size trawler would I want to be looking at? I know I want us both to have our own space, as well as space for family to visit (pull out couch?). I know I don’t want to go too big because of slip fees. I want to live on it full time. Somewhere I can send my son to school and I can work, but on weekends/vacations we can just go cruising.

You go girl! Just be careful.

I'd recommend a 32 to 38' boat for you. Dual or tri cabin layouts make for comfort and "room to breath" on bad weather days.

There are soooo many good boat builders and good designs to chose from in the used boat market. But be cautious... there are an equally great number of not too good builders and designs.

I strongly recommend you search Yachtworld and look closely at boat types and live aboard layouts available. Prices are all over the map!

https://www.yachtworld.com/core/lis...pid=&rid=&cint=&pbsint=&boatsAddedSelected=-1

I knew a liveaboard at a marina I was at for a year, who was a single parent of two. They seemed to be doing very well. Her's was a houseboat which never left the dock. Sounds like you want to do more "real" boating, but the point is, it can be done.

With a 7 year old, you're getting into that age group where friends are important. I'm not a huge fan of moving kids around a lot, but you know your son better than I, and I'm sure you'll make the right call.

Good luck!

When you say you would do all the major work up there, do you mean living on it while there? I'm asking because from prior single mom's who came here with big plans, one winter in Boston on their boat drove her to sell it. She's now switched to a motor home.

5 Kids and a Boat

Now, I see no reason a single mom can't live aboard, but there's a tendency to underestimate the work that needs to be done on the boat purchased, the learning curve for maintaining a boat and for operating one, and the ongoing level of work. Plus, in New England, the impact of winter.

I would suggest outlining a plan of learning and taking relevant courses in the meantime with the goal of being better prepared to operate a boat when you buy one. Also, you might try chartering for a short vacation to get a feel for what it's like.

School for your son becomes an important consideration as does building friends in his age group.

Upon opening the link I provided in my post #2.... I realized that many of those listed may not fit your budget.

Boats on this link might be closer to what you see as affordable.

You can always go into Yachtworld Advanced Search and bring up boats close to your desires.

Good Luck! - Art

https://www.yachtworld.com/core/lis...pid=&rid=&cint=&pbsint=&boatsAddedSelected=-1

And, these boats should be in your $$ range as well as geographic region!

https://www.yachtworld.com/core/lis...id=100&cint=100&pbsint=&boatsAddedSelected=-1

Welcome! A couple plane tickets would be cheaper, more expedient, and less hassle. If you get to a warmer clime and still have the itch, then finding a suitable boat and living aboard would both be easier. Best of luck whichever path you choose.

Have known a few families that have lived aboard and cruised a lot too.

The kids actually seem better adjusted than many dirt dwelling friends and were a mix of home schooling, public schools.

I was a divorced dad with 2 young boys (around 7-14 yeasr) who did not live with me but came to visit every other weekend, holidays and vacations. They loved the boat and cruising..... they had friends at every location I moved the boat srmi-permsnently....etc

Ultimately kids are resilient and adapt better than adilts for many things. But my 37 foot sportfish could have never acvomodated even one for a liveaboard situation. I don't think even a second adult would have worked unlesx both retired and living in the near tropics.

Parenting and many principles remain the same whether ashore or afloat.

Kids need their own space. Kids need a quiet place to spread out to do homework. Needs often have to be accomodated or at least negotiated to kerp things from not goint the way you want them too.

Many areas of the country and then particular locations lend themselves better to living aboard in general let alone having kids aboard. You just have to figure what you can afford and what will entertain your son and friends....pool, boardwalk, fishing, water activities, etc....

My first cut...I would NOT do it in New England in the winter unless you can afford a pretty large boat and have the money to keep it in a marina that doesnt become a frozen wasteland. Dark, cold, windy, desolate.....it does nothing for the average disposition.

I would also NOT get a fixer upper while trying to liveaboard, especially with my son onboard. I just tried it with this liveaboard and it is painful in working around the space issues as well as health issues depending on the rehab. In warmer climes it works better, but still not ideal.

Thanks guys!

A little clarification, I definitely have no interest in living in a boat in winter in New England. I would do work up here because I would have family and lots of tools close by. My cousin takes apart engines for fun and has a degree to go with it. Then between my brothers; dad, and closest friends, I have a plumber, master electrician, and carpenters. I would wait to live on it until after any work was done. I could move back to my parents while we did work to save money. I know that buying a cheaper boat needing work isn’t really going to save me any money over buying one that’s ready to go.

Once I go, I would make the journey south during summer vacation months. My son won’t still be 7 when we go.. I am guessing closer to 10. (He turns 8 in February). I will be somewhere that he can go to school Monday-Friday and I can work.

I dive already, he is counting down til he is old enough to dive as well. We are both avid kayakers as well. He also fishes a lot. He doesn’t know that I want to live on a boat yet, but he still talks a lot about the summer on the sailboat. He actually says we should live on a boat. He doesn’t know how much I want to.

MamaShark said:

Realistically, What size trawler would I want to be looking at? I know I want us both to have our own space, as well as space for family to visit (pull out couch?). I know I don’t want to go too big because of slip fees. I want to live on it full time. Somewhere I can send my son to school and I can work, but on weekends/vacations we can just go cruising.

Click to expand...

Hard to say what size would suit; lots of personal decision-making that goes into it.

Pull-out couches can make for spartan/crammed living. My first guess would be private space (a stateroom) for each of you, plus maybe (at least) one more stateroom -- and maybe the pull-out/jackknife thing -- depending on on how many guests you might anticipate, and for how long.

You could rummage around on yachtworld.com to see boats and the various features they might offer. PSN is likely correct in that a sportfish of affordable size probably isn't the correct cup of tea for living aboard... but I wouldn't rule out motor yachts, cockpit motor yachts, etc., given they often offer decent interior accommodations... and given you can often save fuel in those by just cruising at slow speeds when weather and sea states permit.

Slip fees can be managed, somewhat. Monthly rates, for example, can be much easier on your wallet compared to transient or even weekly rates. You might have to manage the way you design your cruising plans to deal with that, though...

Be aware, land electricians and boat electricians can be whole different breeds. Do some research on ABYC electrical standards etc. for examples...

If you haven't seen it, there's also a liveaboard section at cruisersforum.com (sister site).

-Chris

Just remember to tell all your family and friends in the building/repair trades tthat there are differences in boats and houses.....(thanks Chris, see you just beat me to it)...

If you want a safe, resellable, insurance covered boat....before they do a lot of work on it....they may want to read up on the "suggestions" by ABYC and others. As much as I hate to say it...it needs to be said.

OK then, my suggestion is to still not tell your son about moving aboard and start visiting a lot of boats for sale, of ALL kinds.... sail, power, cat, mono, houseboat, etc...etc....

Kids when they get aboard often zoom to p,aces they feel comfortable in and say what that space would fit into their life....take real or mental notes as most boats wont fit everything you need...but you will start to see which ones do the best and then you have to make that tough decision on just how big you can go to accomodate yet afford.

Factor in, if you are talking to someone who has never lived aboard, your maintenance costs can run much higher than other boaters. Many boat systems and parts just dont last as long as you want them to because of the constant use. Stupid things like throw rugs wear o
fast because of the constant back and forth compared to even an apartment. Its due to layout and size. And some pieces and oarts get pretty pricey to be replacing frequently.

MamaShark said:

My goal is to get an older trawler in the next few years. I want one that is structurally and mechanically sound that I can rehab the interior to make my own. I am saving money, hoping to be able to find one that I wouldn’t need to finance. Yes, I’m aware that anything I find cheaper will need a lot of work. I would do all the major work up here where I can take advantage of family and tools to assist when needed. I would hopefully learn more about the mechanical aspects of running a boat and get familiar with what I buy. When the major stuff is done and I’m comfortable running the boat alone, my son and I would start south. Our end location is TBD. I would go until I find someplace I want to stay. Ideally, somewhere I could dive year round without a drysuit.

Click to expand...

A few more thoughts...

1) Cheaper isn't necessarily gooder. With that in mind...

"Turnkey" boats are the ones with some non-functional systems... that just haven't been identified yet... and with some systems that will need replacement tomorrow/next week/next month/next year... IOW, most all boats come with built-in fix-it requirements.

I'm thinking about stuff like fresh water pumps; ACs; batteries, chargers, inverters, etc.; fridges, stoves, ovens, microwaves, etc.; thru-hulls and sea strainers... various engine bits and pieces... and all those pesky electronics...

Starting out with a boat that has known issues... means you have all those known issues to fix immediately... and then you also have all those "turnkey" systems that will also start to need your attention anyway.

So my approach would be to get the best "turnkey" boat you can afford, to start out with. That way you'll at least have a semi-functional boat from the git-go, and you can fix/replace/upgrade individual systems as the need arises. You'll almost certainly have enough work to do taking that approach, without beating yourself up refitting a boat from day one. (I'm assuming you'd not be interested in GG's over-the-top remake, as in the 5 kids/boat thread.)

And if by "rehab the interior" you mean largely cosmetic improvements (carpets, wood work, countertops, etc.) at least some of that can be done without completely losing all habitability during the process. And it can be done in warm weather, which might mean south.

2) Once you've made up your own mind for sure, no kidding... You've probably already thought all this through, but involve your son in the process right away. In the "decision to do it" upfront, and then in the whole shopping thing. He's a stakeholder, so his input should be part of the journey. He'll probably enjoy the shopping, too. And probably whatever you end up with will be much more copacetic for the pair of you, given some of his input is likely to be something you wouldn't have dreamed of in a million years..

3) Getting a boat from Maine to "south" can be an expense. Buying the boat in "the south" could save you that expense. Might or might not be a big deal, and taking the trip would likely be fun too. Just evaluate things like that.

4) You can import family help even when the boat is "south." Call it a chance for them to take a working vacation, they'll probably be there for ya.

5) Enjoy.

-Chris

MamaShark said:

Thanks guys!

A little clarification, I definitely have no interest in living in a boat in winter in New England. I would do work up here because I would have family and lots of tools close by. My cousin takes apart engines for fun and has a degree to go with it. Then between my brothers; dad, and closest friends, I have a plumber, master electrician, and carpenters. I would wait to live on it until after any work was done. I could move back to my parents while we did work to save money. I know that buying a cheaper boat needing work isn’t really going to save me any money over buying one that’s ready to go.

Once I go, I would make the journey south during summer vacation months. My son won’t still be 7 when we go.. I am guessing closer to 10. (He turns 8 in February). I will be somewhere that he can go to school Monday-Friday and I can work.

I dive already, he is counting down til he is old enough to dive as well. We are both avid kayakers as well. He also fishes a lot. He doesn’t know that I want to live on a boat yet, but he still talks a lot about the summer on the sailboat. He actually says we should live on a boat. He doesn’t know how much I want to.

Click to expand...

Time Keeps on Slipping Into the Future -
MS - Your intent seems noble and your plan is actually doable... to an extent; regarding progressive sum culminations in years and expenses and income and health, and, and and...... Please see bold sentences in your post-quoted above.

Regarding levels of circumstances you describe for you and your son. I herein want to state a great time saver, potential large $$ expense limiter, and most likely an enormous effort reducer:

Do not settle on a boat whose layout fairly well suits you and son's needs but it actually needs much work to make it correct for the purposes you envision accomplishing.

But rather embark on a speed search to locate a truly good condition boat that has similar to your size and layout needs but that is also in a "distress" sale situation that has greatly reduced its asking price and which can also give you some wiggle room for further price reduction and/or boat improvements done by the seller. I must say... in situations such as these, usually only an immediate CA$H offer talks.

What I mention for "speed search" to find correct boat can be done. However, a speed search takes consistent [every day possible] searching throughout all available sales channels to find the "magic" boat. These good condition distressed sale boats usually do not last on the market but one to a few days before someone puts cash on the table; and, the good, affordable boat is gone off the market.

If you do a speed search [actually any type of boat search for buying purposes] you need to either be VERY knowledgeable yourself about boat condition circumstances and/or you need to have persons who will come to review the boat that are VERY knowledgeable about boat condition circumstances.

Much more can be added to the above. Hope you get the picture. I'd be pleased to chat on phone with you regarding this. Just PM me your phone and best time of day to call. Please have pen and paper ready for notes. I'll give you a "speed review" on properties and requirements entailed in a "speed search" through the used boat for-sale world.

My Boston marina has a number of liveaboards. Mixture of divorced men, older couples who apparently prefer the lifestyle, and a bunch of young adventurers. Several babies were born in the past few years. Hardy types for sure. They eventually head south.

The boat part is easy. You need 2 master cabins and that puts you in the 38' range or larger. Note that marinas charge by the foot. There are a lot of project boats out there. Every marina has one in the back lot that hasn't been used in the last few years. The engines are probably seized, all the windows leak, FB stress cracks everywhere, and the electronics are long gone. Restoration is probably a 2 or 3 year expensive process. I wouldn't touch a boat that needs a new interior. That would stretch it to a 3 or 4 year process.

Your son's needs are a little more difficult. It might be an adventure for a year but a pre-teen needs a lot of socialization. Cruising with mom every weekend isn't on the list. He will soon be at the age where he needs to start the separation process and it's a lot easier if he is in a location where he is within walking distance to a lot of kids his own age.

You might want to spend your vacations in FL scoping out potential locations. A marina within walking distance to a school, walking distance to a residential area, walking distance to commercial area, opportunities for your employment. You might have a car but you work. What is he going to do after school?

Finding and restoring a boat is the easy part. And don't wait. The sooner you go the better.

As you spend lots of time internet boat shopping, it might also be worth researching where you might live, is there work there in your field, and if living aboard is permitted, how expensive is it in that area. Some areas do everything they can to discourage living aboard while others openly embrace it. Also of consideration is are the marinas in that area that permit living aboard, located in safe neighborhoods. Finally, where you call home, may impact the boat you choose. Living in New England should have you focused on how you plan to heat the boat. Living in the Carolinas and South, will have you more focused on air conditioning. Some areas will be great for enjoying the outside of your boat (aft sun deck or enclosure). Other regions or live aboard marinas will only provide outside enjoyment when you leave it on the weekend.

Lots to consider.

Lots of good diving on the East coast. Some places are much better than others.

Ted

We have a neighbor that lives on a Present 42 Sundeck in our marina. She works full time for a local school system. The social aspects and it being a safe environment are a big plus she says. My observation is she appears to get a little overwhelmed with the upkeep at times but she seems to be sticking with it. She’s going on her 4th year.

ranger42c said:

A few more thoughts...

1)

So my approach would be to get the best "turnkey" boat you can afford, to start out with. That way you'll at least have a semi-functional boat from the git-go, and you can fix/replace/upgrade individual systems as the need arises. You'll almost certainly have enough work to do taking that approach, without beating yourself up refitting a boat from day one. (I'm assuming you'd not be interested in GG's over-the-top remake, as in the 5 kids/boat thread.)

And if by "rehab the interior" you mean largely cosmetic improvements (carpets, wood work, countertops, etc.) at least some of that can be done without completely losing all habitability during the process. And it can be done in warm weather, which might mean south.

3) Getting a boat from Maine to "south" can be an expense. Buying the boat in "the south" could save you that expense. Might or might not be a big deal, and taking the trip would likely be fun too. Just evaluate things like that.

-Chris

Click to expand...

Rangers comments make a lot of sense and a couple I'd like to comment further on.

I'd want a boat that I could use for boating and could live on within 30 days after purchase. Doesn't mean it will be pristine or what it will become in the future, but the entire concept of owning a boat I can't use is so negative, especially since the time frame you anticipate doubles and triples and more.

As to all those helpers, don't bet money on them. They'll show only a percentage of the time they promise, through no fault of theirs other than over-committing because they want to help.

Equally as important as the boat is figuring out the location, based on schools, community, marinas, and work. I don't know the type work you do, but finding yourself on a boat which continues to cost money and struggling to find good work while your son is wanting to "do something fun" is depressing. Florida is great, but not to an out of work single mom searching for a job.

I applaud your desire to purchase without financing. Again, I don't know your current living expenses, but don't think the paid for boat solves it all. With no boat payment, your living costs will still be as much or more than they would be in an apartment or small house. You're going to have to think of transportation and pay for dockage plus maintenance on the boat. Electricity and water at a marina will cost you more than on land. Air conditioning a boat isn't cheap.

Mama:
I live on a 41' President DC year round in Essex, Ct and would not turn back. For one adult it might be overwhelming but resources are good and knowledge is readily available. Where are you thinking ? We have a diesel fireplace for awesome heat and there is nothing like a snow storm on the water
And yes, every weekend in the summer I leave the dock !
Are you local ?

I'm 70 and been on the water all my life. Something I consistently see in new boaters buying older boats are wrong priorities. Redoing the interior is dead last. First is hull maintenance, new zincs and clean and lube seacocks. Next, fix any deck or cabin top leaks (so you don't ruin your new paneling). Then all the systems needed for comfortable liveaboard life. After all of that you can redecorate.
I've seen new people, especially women, installing exotic wood panels, new seat covers, lots of wall papering while the boat is sinking around them and electrolysis is eating away their props and rudder. Don't buy a wood boat. You don't have the experience needed to maintain.
Most people buy a boat too small. It's more uncomfortable in the ocean, maybe even dangerous. If you're going to dive, figure out how you'll get on and off the boat. Also enough room is needed for you and your son to have separate space. You need laundry on board, especially with a kid. If you're going to cruise, you need lots of storage. If you're going to dive you need a way to fill your tanks.

Don't forget the machinery. The engines need to be started and warmed to operating temps on a regular basis, even if you just sit at the dock.
Living aboard in New England requires a good plan for heating, lot of old posts on this.
For repairs, don't hire someone that knows less than you. Stay away from house carpenters. You use screws and bolts on boats not nails. House carpenters only know straight lines and level. Only rarely are there straight lines on a boat and nothing is level unless the boat is blocked on land. And then only the keel may be level.

I am not a single parent, but have a 6 year old daughter who spent the first year of her life living on a sailboat and we just recently moved back aboard. On our current boat she has her own room and her own bathroom. In her room she has a desk for schoolwork but is free to arrange and decorate as she wants to make it her space. This year we decided to stay at the dock for the school year, but we have looked at home school options for the future if we decide to travel more.
All this is to say that none of it is a big deal to our kid, or to the kids of others we know in similar situations. The best thing you can do for your children is to make choices that make you a happier person.

Stripper said:

I am not a single parent, but have a 6 year old daughter who spent the first year of her life living on a sailboat and we just recently moved back aboard. On our current boat she has her own room and her own bathroom. In her room she has a desk for schoolwork but is free to arrange and decorate as she wants to make it her space. This year we decided to stay at the dock for the school year, but we have looked at home school options for the future if we decide to travel more.
All this is to say that none of it is a big deal to our kid, or to the kids of others we know in similar situations. The best thing you can do for your children is to make choices that make you a happier person.

Click to expand...

Stripper, I do like your observations and recommendations. The part that worries me is the decorating. She needs your approval before she starts nailing stuff to the woodwork.
I am not a parent but, based upon my living aboard with my 'then wife', mid 40s in length, minimum, two full heads. Per the pull out berth in the salon, not a viable option for the long term. It will inconvenient for you and the occupants. Save that space for those you might rescue from an unnamed island. I say this because I have occupied the slide out, not a fun place to sleep.
Your daughter will need a place to entertain so put a TV in your stateroom so you have a place to hangout while she entertains in the salon. LOL

OldDan1943 said:

Stripper, I do like your observations and recommendations. The part that worries me is the decorating. She needs your approval before she starts nailing stuff to the woodwork.

Your daughter will need a place to entertain so put a TV in your stateroom so you have a place to hangout while she entertains in the salon. LOL

Click to expand...

Luckily I have a very well behaved kid that would know to ask before firing up the power tools.
Right now we have a big TV up in the wheelhouse. It was left over from our dirt house, is too big for the boat, but for now allows me to watch movies at the dock. I tried convincing my wife it was for the navigation software but she aint buying it.

MamaShark, there is a lot of good advice in the posts above, especially in the need for private areas, and to look at a possible boat as a place to do your usual life activities.
Will there be enough room to cook, shower, do laundry, read, study, etc. And will you have enough time to do the necessary maintenence to keep the boat safely seaworthy?
We have recently bought a 40ft double cabin slow trawler, designed to carry 3-4 people, and which allows us to have both the space and stuff we need to live aboard in reasonable comfort.
Read and take classes when you can on boat maintenence and repair, and charter a boat in an area that interests you to look at both the boat make and type and the area.
Make contacts in a pre-job-search in areas that have good diving, and contact home-school associations in those areas.
Even if you do not home school, you may be able to find a community of kids available to meet for a summer or a vacation.
My advice would be that when you have done the research and work necessary to make the best informed decision that you can make, just do it.
Even if you fail to reach all of your goals, you will have made your best effort to reach for them.
Welcome, and good luck in your future.
John

I cant imagine living on a boat with my 10 year old. Too much cooking, laundry, legos, bicycling, etc. Why not just get a boat and use it on weekends and vacations. Living aboard a boat in a marina is hardly a glamorous lifestyle.

I would not see any problems with living aboard with a child. They will have to learn to put stuff away and you will both need your own spaces. We have a 41’ double cabin that I would consider the minimum size for my wife and me to live aboard. The child will learn to like different things than dirt home children. It isn’t better or worse, just different. Don’t let people rain on your dreams until you try it and find out for yourself if it works or not.

"I want one that is structurally and mechanically sound that I can rehab the interior to make my own."

That is a dream in itself.

When folks get lazy or tired of the boat , its not just the cosmetics that get skimped , its everything.

Its true "paint sells the boat" but even on great looking boats the many many items that need PM may not have been taken care of .

A "stuck" engine can easily double the vessels cost , even with factory trained mechanics in the family.

An all glass hull, deck and PH, , simply outfitted will be least hassle to rehab &operate.

Use the marina laundry , and avoid things you can not fix. SIMPLE , SIMPLE ,SIMPLE!