Untied Again?

How is that the same Airline seems to be the culprit for the most insane events?

Dog dies on United flight after flight attendant forced passenger to put carrier in overhead bin http://www.foxnews.com/travel/2018/03/13/dog-dies-on-united-flight-after-flight-attendant-forced-passenger-to-put-carrier-in-overhead-bin.html

I know all airlines receive complaints. The FAA has a db which tracks this data annually. But “Untied” (sp incorrect intentionally) seem to garner the most horrific kinds of customer service.

I flew United once and never again.

It was a flight from Sydney to LA. As soon as we took off the stewardess announced that for our safety there were six armed air marshals on the flight. That went down like a lead balloon.

Midway through the flight we hit some turbulence. Over the PA address system a crew member literally screamed 'get down on the floor...now!" Our feathers by now were thoroughly ruffled.

Shortly after this a crew member walked past our seats about four times looking at a young man playing a game on his I phone, opposite us. She then came back with presumably one of the sky marshalls, they confiscated his phone and marched him off to the rear of the aircraft, with his protesting family politely but firmly told to be quiet. He returned to his family about 40 minutes later with his phone.

There was a lot of comment from fellow passengers as we got off the plane in LA, none of it complimentary.

After that experience I have avoided United.

I fly several times a year, often enough that over the years I've learned that I hate to fly.


I wouldn't give any of the airlines a passing score on customer service. But I can see their side of it. Flight attendants are harassed by passengers too ignorant to understand how to put bags in the overhead compartments, too lazy to move their butts and take their seats, etc.


Any more I get in and take my seat ASAP, put on my headphones to listen to music then read a book on my Kindle. Makes the time go by more quickly.

I fly weekly on an airline I will not name (not the one this thread mentions). I am surprised how often I am shocked by what I witness. From attire to luggage to food, there is never a limit to what some "people" consider to be appropriate to bring on board. Noise cancelling headphones, a window seat and a book attempt to make the journey palatable.

The concerns I feel are not associated with the civility of those who purchase tickets, it's about what to me is a recurring news item regarding employee behavior. I am unwilling to give that a pass. Training is certainly at the root of many an issue. However I will continue to hope that the recruiting efforts attract above the mean regarding IQ. Putting a dog in the overhead bin? Perhaps in some overseas carriers but in one of our (US) primary service providers?

Untied? I call it Uniturd.
Domestic NYC>San Francisco, once was enough, began with rude check in staff, went on from there. On a late evening departure LA>Sydney we were threatened with abuse if anyone ordering a meal went to sleep.
I take an Asia based airline anytime I can.

Yep, I agree, Singapore Airlines is my first choice. Air New Zealand are also good.

I used to fly United almost exclusively for probably 20 years. The equipment was in good shape, and customer service was outstanding. They were head and shoulders better than most. Then everything turned upside down.

It all happened around some bitter labor disputes, first with the pilots, then with the non-pilots unions. I have no idea what went on, but seemingly ever since they have been horrible. Any interaction with their staff makes you feel like you are the greatest annoyance and imposition ever foisted on someone in all of time. All ooze disdain for you, their customers, and their jobs. It's completely toxic. I do all I can to avoid them.

My son works as a financial analyst for American Airlines. He gets a certain evil satisfaction when United and Delta face bad press. However, he also is quick to point out that the true story is likely different than is portrayed in the press reports.

The problem is when things start to go 'south' for an organisation this tends to be self perpetuating. Look at the comments posted here on 'United'. Perhaps they are no worse than other airlines, but their name has become synonymous with bad news aviation stories, and that is a real issue for the company and their staff.

I put on over 20,000 miles a year on various carriers, they’re all the same.
Flying with a single airline has no merit anymore, as points are worthless and expire before you’ll get to use them anyway.
Flying is a necessary evil in my life, and has given me great understanding of how the sardines must feel in that little can.
Earplugs, a good book, a little Colorado Candy, and hopefully a skinny seatmate are the best one can hope for!
Travel light, dress comfortably, mind your own business, and don’t stress, odds are good you’ll get where you’re going eventually!

I fly a few times per month for work. In the US, there are no good airlines, just less bad ones. Nowadays most flying has the same level of ambiance and appeal as taking a long distance bus in the '80s. The level of service and amenities are the same.

On the other hand a lot of people on airplanes expect to behave as if they were lounging at home and do what they please. There was a recent story of some woman who thought the tray table on a plane was a good place for her feet. This is just a continuation of the disregard some people have for others. You also see it movie theaters, restaurants, while driving, etc. The attitude is "I going to do what I feel like and the rest of you can shove it if you don't like it. Just get out of my way!"

"The level of service and amenities are the same."

Way back when the carriers were regulated , the setup was that companies could survive and make a profit at about the 60% Load factor.

Flying was expensive then , the folks dressed for the occasion ,there was lots of room, and seats were easy to get.

Today the load factor most flights is close to FULL! , but the travel price has dropped by at least half in constant dollars.

Folks seem to like cheap seats in a Roach Coach , the folks with bucks travel in business or first.

The passengers and style of travel in the Roach Coach will never return to the coach travel style of 40 years ago.

As someone said , "you get what you pay for".

Sad, isn’t it? As mentioned, the decline we witness of the travel experience (civility, attire, respect ad Infinitum) only mirrors what is going on elsewhere in society. I often wonder how this occurred? Where once (50 or 100 years ago?) people sought to achieve a higher plane (no pun intended) of what was considered top tier in their dress, behavior (manners) and so forth we seem to have flipped and now so many seek to achieve the moral low ground.

Can you imagine what we experience on the highways with cutting and weaving and so forth was experienced while in line at the supermarket? (I just had my morning commute thus this experience is still very fresh!)

So along with wondering “how” this got to be this way (because it wasn’t how I was raised) I also think about what is going to be the bottom of this current societal demise.

Wifey B: Don't overlook the dog bound for Kansas they just shipped to Japan. Poor doggy didn't even speak the language.

BandB said:

Wifey B: Don't overlook the dog bound for Kansas they just shipped to Japan. Poor doggy didn't even speak the language.

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?

Didn’t hear about that one!

Does Japan practice similar cuisine attitudes about canines as the NPRK?

While I can't argue with a lot of the other factors pointed out above, United HAS gone out of their way to earn this reputation.

I won't bore you with the long story of my last - and final - United flight, but there were a number of issues, none of which can be explained away that simply. It's a systemic problem, from the top down. I don't even fault the employees, one of whom I actually felt sorry for. Even the pilot apologized and, speaking with him briefly as we left the plane, he was visibly upset about the way his bosses had handled things. The crew just want to get to their destination, too.

Telling the story to a shuttle bus driver on the way out of the airport, he said he knew a lot of people who worked at the airport. When they hear stories like that, everyone knows "it's always about United."

I hate flying. Did way too much on business. And all the discount fares, forget them as when you're my height you can't take advantage of any of them unless you're really a masochist and want to punish the people in front of you and behind you as well.

The airline industry has been built on price, not service, since the days of Frank Borman. The customers suffer but so do the employees. The job standards for flight attendants, what they're supposed to do before and during a flight, no longer have an allowance for being kind to passengers or asking if they need anything or even something as simple as asking if someone would like another soft drink. The jobs are engineered to only allow for the necessities.

Now, I think it's also become popular to pile on the airlines, especially United at the moment, but I've seen it vary over the years. Alaska Airlines is repeatedly having issues also. It's amazing and sad sometimes that one issue can spiral so in social media that it casts an entire airline negatively. I have seen some ridiculous moves by Southwest including playing hemline or cleavage police by some. They've all seemed to get quicker in removing passengers and liking to show their ability to do so, so much so that you get scared to question them and I can easily see that in the dog owner. No way I would have put my dog up there and that probably means the carrier wouldn't have fit under the seat and I would have been removed from the plane. I don't think the flight attendant realized it was a dog carrier with a dog.

The stories like those shared in this thread have always been there. Just couldn't always go viral. However, the flight attendants definitely have different attitudes than they once did and if I had their jobs, I would as well. I remember when they had time for pleasantries and to be cordial and friendly.

CaptTom said:

Telling the story to a shuttle bus driver on the way out of the airport, he said he knew a lot of people who worked at the airport. When they hear stories like that, everyone knows "it's always about United."

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Well, pet deaths is always United although not like this one. They have more pet deaths than all other airlines combined.

"I remember when they had time for pleasantries and to be cordial and friendly."

There was Lots of extra time with half full aircraft to please.

"They have more pet deaths than all other airlines combined"

Perhaps because United flies the most pets of any airline?

Gotta love the latest United pet story. Flight 3996 was on it's way from Newark to St. Louis. However, they realized a pet was on the flight in error, one that was supposed to go to Akron Ohio. Well, clearly they couldn't afford another pet incident so they diverted the plane of 33 passengers to Akron and let the pet off there. They said the pet was "safely delivered to it's owner."

We shop hard for best deal, right timetable, good connections,newish planes, like 787/A350,comfortable fitouts, good service, etc,and don`t fuss too much about which airline,except for a few.
I really don`t think anyone expects people flying dressed up these days. Comfortable casual is just fine,drawing the line at the shorts,sleeveless shirts,sandals,etc,you might see on some pax between Oz and Bali.
I respect that onboard staff work hard,courtesy is a 2 way street.

"I respect that onboard staff work hard,courtesy is a 2 way street.'

The horror for the stews was any flight to or from NYC.

There would always be someone (usually a female) that thought the stews were there to be personal maid servants !

When the industry was deregulated ('78?) it was supposed to be good for the flying public. About the same time travel in the air became akin to travel by bus.

I am not advocating for more government oversight than already exists. But travel sure is not enjoyable on American carriers any longer. Pity the animals!

"When the industry was deregulated ('78?) it was supposed to be good for the flying public. About the same time travel in the air became akin to travel by bus. "

To the gov. "good" meant cheap , so available to far more folks.

"But travel sure is not enjoyable on American carriers any longer. Pity the animals! "

Would you be willing to pay more 2x or 3x the current roach coach prices?

Investigate business ,or even 1st class, it might be worth it to you.

Looks like the fairy's have been here ?

FF said:

1.Would you be willing to pay more 2x or 3x the current roach coach prices?

2.Investigate business ,or even 1st class, it might be worth it to you.

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1.Yes.
2. Indeed.

Whenever I can I upgrade or outright purchase first class tickets. (Not always available believe it or not. Others must also despise steerage!)

What I find interesting from a historical perspective is this. My first “adult” purchase of an airline ticket was back in 1978 (after deregulation). From MIA to ANC. Round trip “excursion” fair. It was just under $700 as I recall.

If you look up an advance purchase discount ticket for that same route today it is about the same price.

How in the world, with inflation on every aspect of operating costs (let alone profit) can an air carrier afford to operate now a days?

My frustration is that the majors, feeling a need to compete for tourist $$$, have allowed themselves to migrate to the lowest common demographic (People’s Express-level to date myself).

When I travel for pleasure it is only by 1st class now. I don’t consider myself to be a prejudiced person but as I just experienced last week the need for an immediate shower after deplaning due to who I had as an adjoining seat mate, I guess my tolerance for traveling with individuals who smell worse than the livestock I am around that there is definitely a limit and tolerance level. Some may call it biased. I think of it as recognizing I don’t wear a loincloth any more.

It’s acutely sad to see the general level of behavior deteriorating. I know we all experience it while boating as well.

I guess as in much of life, there are those who are responsible and those who are not. The wrong side seems to be growing IMO.

No need to have a neighbour, fitouts seen in 787s, A350, and revamped 777s in business premier are a 1-2-1 configuration.

BruceK said:

No need to have a neighbour, fitouts seen in 787s, A350, and revamped 777s in business premier are a 1-2-1 configuration.

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Agreed.

If only all flights were triple sevens or a Dreamliner, etc.

Most often my weekly route of flight is on a 737-800 or 321.

FF said:

Would you be willing to pay more 2x or 3x the current roach coach prices?

Investigate business ,or even 1st class, it might be worth it to you.

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Well, for all practical purposes I have no choice unless I want a flight of total misery. Not only am I very tall but it's mostly legs.