Oil filter equivalent

Larry M said:

Baldwin B2 or NAPPA 1515 = happy SP135

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Thats what the previous owner used on my Lehman 120....Napa 1515 and Wix 51515.

I have used Wix, Napa, Purolator and Motorcraft for 3100 hours...oil analysis for oil changes every 100 to 150 hours all the same, the oil filters are not changing anything that fast...maybe long term, but for a 100 to 200 hour interval, I wouldnt sweat it if using a reasonable quality filter.

But my point was.... all these fit the remote adapter seen on many Lehmans.

I searched "Oil Filter Comparison", and found lots of videos of men dissecting a range of filters and comparing the contents. This one included FRAM, so I selected it,but check some others,the one with a cat co-demonstrating looked helpful.

BruceK said:

I searched "Oil Filter Comparison", and found lots of videos of men dissecting a range of filters and comparing the contents. This one included FRAM, so I selected it,but check some others,the one with a cat co-demonstrating looked helpful.

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While the video is helpful, the unanswered question is, "what is the quality of the filter media"?

I have 440,000 miles on the B Cummins in my Dodge pickup. Oil analysis confirms what I already know, the WIX filter is doing a good job.

Ted

"Oops, not so fast. One last question. I have seen some filters that come in a "2 quart" version. I assume they are longer and have more filter media? Any REAL benefit to these?"

Good question, many boat engine converters stress the physical size of the engine so it can be easily fitted, or retrofitted.

Way back the tiny Volvo lube filters were rally expensive (surprise!) and a check in the Fram cross book showed the PH8A to be identical , just bigger.

This might apply to any common boat engine , the truck or industrial filter will be the same , just larger.

With more filter to collect gunk, and more surface area a larger filter would be worth exploring.

No downside to more lube oil either.

Way back Consumer Reports did an on engine test real world oil filter test of NYC taxicabs ,

Fram had the best results, but that as decades ago.

The filter media is not the only important thing about oil filters. Mechanical construction is important as well. If internal parts fail or the case fails, this could mean a quick death for an engine.

I know someone in the lubricant business. He showed me photos of different brands of filters that he had personally cut open. It's been a while but as I recall, Fram could easily be seen to be inferior. WIX was good. He said Donaldson was the best but they don't have a filter for my engine so I'm sticking with WIX.

O C Diver said:

NAPA filters are made by WIX. WIX also builds for OEM. A Deere and a WiX filter are identical down to the internal stamp marks, just different exterior paint. You will also find WIX makes all kinds of fuel filters like the ones on my Deere, the Kabota engine in my Onan generator, and the final fuel filters on my B And C series Cummins engines.

Fleetfilters.com is a good source for them. They and WIX have online converts to cross most other brands to WiX filters.

Ted

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Only certain ISO rated WIX plants have the QA QC approval from Napa. As best I understand they are located only in the US. WIX has non US plants, several in China, for those markets.

My Napa Golds come from the US plants. But, they are a few bucks more than OEM when purchased in Canada. It can get confusing.

aboatman said:

The filter media is not the only important thing about oil filters. Mechanical construction is important as well. If internal parts fail or the case fails, this could mean a quick death for an engine.

I know someone in the lubricant business. He showed me photos of different brands of filters that he had personally cut open. It's been a while but as I recall, Fram could easily be seen to be inferior. WIX was good. He said Donaldson was the best but they don't have a filter for my engine so I'm sticking with WIX.

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Despite my best attempts to keep from turning yet another Firstbase-Mission-From-God I have now turned it into a Firstbase-Mission-From-God. Have watched 100 videos over the last 36 hours. Wife went shopping yesterday because she was "tired of listening to YouTube oil filter crap". somewhere around Came to the conclusion that the brands bashed on the internet i.e. Fram, WIX, etc. also make good quality filters as well as lesser. All depends on the specs they are built to. Synthetic filter material better than cellulose, coil sping better than leaf spring, thicker cartridge better than thinner, silicon antiflow back better than rubber...on and on. don't even get me started about everyone's take on "99% effective on microns >20". I've decided to use one that has the attributes I see as important. I will throw it away in 100 hours. Seems to me the process and dedication to changing the oil and filter every 100 hours is much more important than the filter I put back on. Plus that 100 hours take a little less than a year. The difference between the low of $3.00+= and the high of $17.00+- once or even twice a year doesn't seem worth discussing as compared to everything else on the boat.

The same maker will have more than one quality level. NAPA Gold is # 1515. Silver is 21515. Both made by Wix.

Daniel

I still use Fram filters. I also get great oil sample reports.

Our SP 135 oil filter base is different then some. Originally came with NAPA 1843. Now use Baldwin BT 126.

I have over 40 years in and around the auto service business. Have seen every brand of oil filter that you can imagine. HAVE NEVER seen an oil filter in itself ruin an engine. Filters that were not tightened.....yes. Old Oil filter gasket not removed. Yes. Loose drain plugs. Yes. No oil put back in. Yep......cost me a $30,000 Mercedes engine.
If you are really concerned use a different brand at every change which is probably once or twice a year. You will run out of road before you find a bad brand and ruin your engine. Are some better than others? Maybe. Pay attention to human error and your chances are pretty good.

Thanks Easting. Although I am a newb trawler/diesel owner I have been big boat sailing and smaller boat powering since I was 15. Learned a long time ago that there are more things to obsess about on or near a boat than you can shake an..oil filter at. Still sort of fun though!

firstbase said:

Oops, not so fast. One last question. I have seen some filters that come in a "2 quart" version. I assume they are longer and have more filter media? Any REAL benefit to these?

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The benefits of a larger filter may or may not be beneficial. You have greater filter area so you have the potential to trap more than a smaller filter. Also oil filter differential psi will be lower with the larger size. One thing to consider is the oil change intervals and how the engine is loaded. High loads and long duration will break down the oil faster than an engine running at moderate loads and shorter duration. Oil samples are good for long term trending. But won't tell you much if you only do it once.

Possibly diesel oil filtration is a bit different than a gasoline engine filtration. The nature of the fuel, compression ratio, fuel burn rate all conspire into the differences.

But as has been said so often, for low hour under used recreational engines it seems they tend to rust out and just plain wither away long before the effects of poor oil filtration are felt.

Ended up buying a couple of Mobile 1 extended performance filters, regular capacity. My 30 year old engines are in remarkable shape and the last thing they need is me trying to "help" them with some odd change. Mobile 1 filter is slightly demonstrably better than the Fram so satisfies my most likely unnecessary need for "the best". Why.... I think I can feel the boat going faster already. Yes indeedy!

Easting said:

I have over 40 years in and around the auto service business. Have seen every brand of oil filter that you can imagine. HAVE NEVER seen an oil filter in itself ruin an engine. Filters that were not tightened.....yes. Old Oil filter gasket not removed. Yes. Loose drain plugs. Yes. No oil put back in. Yep......cost me a $30,000 Mercedes engine.
If you are really concerned use a different brand at every change which is probably once or twice a year. You will run out of road before you find a bad brand and ruin your engine. Are some better than others? Maybe. Pay attention to human error and your chances are pretty good.

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I remember seeing a photo and claim of a filter where the case rusted through and all the oil leaked out. This would probably ruin an engine if it wasn't noticed.

Being on the Internet, the whole thing could have been made up, we'll never know.

I can't imagine how long a filter would have to be on the engine to completely rust through. I don't know much but I would think that would take a pretty long time. User error not filter problem.

firstbase said:

I can't imagine how long a filter would have to be on the engine to completely rust through. I don't know much but I would think that would take a pretty long time. User error not filter problem.

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Agree....

Sad part is that the guy posts pictures and threads about how he will never ever buy a XXX brand filter because they suck and rust through. Sadder part is others will read it and believe him.

firstbase said:

Sad part is that the guy posts pictures and threads about how he will never ever buy a XXX brand filter because they suck and rust through. Sadder part is others will read it and believe him.

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thats why these forums will always need those that will ask for some kind of confirmation or provable facts...and call BS if appropriate.

Like you just politely did...

And you are pretty, pretty, PRETTY, good at it yourself!!

not very good at polite though.....

I will keep trying ...

firstbase said:

Sad part is that the guy posts pictures and threads about how he will never ever buy a XXX brand filter because they suck and rust through. Sadder part is others will read it and believe him.

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I solved the problem, my filters are disposable paper cartridge in thick cast iron housing
In the climate where I live, with our highly salted roads and air where everything is rusting even my tools, I never saw any trace of rust on any oil filters I changed on my cars used everyday. I cannot imagine how a filter housing can rust to the point oil goes through.

L

firstbase said:

I can't imagine how long a filter would have to be on the engine to completely rust through. I don't know much but I would think that would take a pretty long time. User error not filter problem.

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I had it happen to me on my Phoenix. The stbd eng blew the exhaust riser on the delivery run ultimately trashing the engine. Pulled the boat and new long block later, boat back in the water to get the stbd engine running again. Time for a test ride with the mechanic so I fire up the port engine for the first time in a month. The mechanic says" the port motors lifters sound awlful. When we get back we'll adjust them too." Im thinking, they didnt sound like that before.... just as I noticed a stream of oil jetting out the bottom of the filter! Saltwater drips from the cockpit hatch above had run down the outside of the can and rusted through it at the very bottom center.
So now I give any filter a feel at the low spot on my cold engine room checks.

...and if you are buying a boat with a name like MENTAL D FISH & SEA, run away!

High Wire said:

I had it happen to me on my Phoenix. The stbd eng blew the exhaust riser on the delivery run ultimately trashing the engine. Pulled the boat and new long block later, boat back in the water to get the stbd engine running again. Time for a test ride with the mechanic so I fire up the port engine for the first time in a month. The mechanic says" the port motors lifters sound awlful. When we get back we'll adjust them too." Im thinking, they didnt sound like that before.... just as I noticed a stream of oil jetting out the bottom of the filter! Saltwater drips from the cockpit hatch above had run down the outside of the can and rusted through it at the very bottom center.
So now I give any filter a feel at the low spot on my cold engine room checks.

...and if you are buying a boat with a name like MENTAL D FISH & SEA, run away!

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Yes, things do happen. Hard for some to believe but they do happen.

Under normal conditions, the case of an oil filter should not rust out before it is replaced during normal maintenance. But, things are not always normal. Water dripping or spraying on a steel filter can cause it to rust. Remember, it's a boat and boats operate in water.

An Internet search on the subject reveals many complaints of rusting oil filters leaking oil.

FWIW the only oil filters I have ever seen with an "issue" were the basic orange PH series Fram's. Over the years I have seen half a dozen horizontally mounted PH filters (not installed by me) come off with no oil in them due to the anti-drain back valve failing.

When I contacted Fram about this they recommended going to the TG series or better and fully admitted the anti-drainback valve in the PH series is not what it is in their better grade filters. Retailers demand cheap filters so the manufacturers make what they want...

There are a lot of good filters out there, including Fram's, if you avoid the bottom feeder price range. If you want to pay $1.99 for a filter, to install on a 30k engine, I suspect you may well get what you pay for.

I use factory filters or Fleetguard, Baldwin, Wix and sometimes Donaldson. Never had an issue with any of them.

I don't think it makes a big difference as other's have stated. I am comfortable with Wix, which sells through OEM and Napa. I think Carquest used to use Wix, but swapped to another mfr (not 100% on that). Donaldson is another reputable mfr. I don't use Baldwin, but that's only because my fav vendors do not stock. Lots of commercial guys use Baldwin exclusively with no issue that I have heard.

I don't use Fram, but I have heard of no engine failures from those that do. The insides do look pretty cheap when you cut one apart. But it is a cheap filter, so no surprise there.

On Cummins I use OEM fleetguard. Cats get Cat filters. Prices are not outrageous. Everything else gets Wix if available.

Wix also has a nice cross reference app on their website. Gives some engineering data and pore sizing details.

Doesnt matter what you use except rock bottom. quality if general maintenance is ignored...especially if it sorta did its job till you let it rust through.

On my last Ford Powerstroke the oil pan rusted through before any oil filters.

You do have to monitor everything in life to a small degree, especially after something out of the ordinary occurs.

Parts rusting tbrough is as much maintenance as product failure.... as it is conditions that may change interval maintenance more than product.

Oil filters are sold to be used.

Of you purchase in bulk , you may find them rusted , just sitting in a locker a year later.

Vacuum bag filters for best results.

Got the admiral to agree she needs a vacuum sealer for the kitchen. Need to bag up stuff on the boat. PO was very proud of his MANY 4 year old spares in the engine room. Impellers, belts, filters. Not sure I trust them as they have been down there in the heat for that long. I have quickly learned that having enough spares is a fine line of sorts.