Opinions; Astoria, Columbia River, Portland OR

We're currently near the San Juans but considering this trek down to OR in 2018 but we know nothing about OR waters.
Obviously Astoria is much closer but perhaps not as many marinas available? And I expect Portland has quicker access to the major airport?
What about transiting the Columbia River, I've heard one can experience currents and high winds, and is there enough to do and see in the area to spend a year there...?
Thanks in advance for all comments!

There are plenty of places near but outside the Columbia Bar as well. More coastal cruising south as far as you want to go.

Some boat a lifetime on the Columbia river. Your boat has adequate power to deal with any currents. I don't know if you have thrusters or not. I could see spending a year with Portland as a home port but going west on the Columbia river for long cruises and going east to Astoria and then south along the Oregon coast.

Love Astoria. Good restaurants, quaint town. Do not miss the maritime museum.

Many of the riverfront towns down the coast are quite attractive. Each is guarded by a river bar which can be problematic, but if you have time towait for the proper weather/tide combination, all are manageable.

BandB said:

There are plenty of places near but outside the Columbia Bar as well. More coastal cruising south as far as you want to go.

Some boat a lifetime on the Columbia river. Your boat has adequate power to deal with any currents. I don't know if you have thrusters or not. I could see spending a year with Portland as a home port but going west on the Columbia river for long cruises and going east to Astoria and then south along the Oregon coast.

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Thanks BandB and yes we have a 500hp Cummins and both bow and stern thrusters... though i'm spending some effort learning to use them as little as necessary

We are going up the Columbia this coming summer. We keep the boat at a very nice marina on Hayden Island. The one drawback to Astoria is the tide effects at the Marina’s. Astoria is a nice little town with much to offer and the Museum is a must see. The Airport in Portland is 20 mins from our marina.
PM me if you are interested in Moorage on Hayden.
Cheers

I've been down the coast as far as San Francisco and it's a beautiful trip as long as you don't try to push it by running in bad weather. We did a Seattle to SF trip and planned in taking 5 days. Weather delays extended that to 8 days but we were not trying to set any speed records.


We crossed the Columbia bar twice (in and out) and both times it was a piece of cake, much calmer than what we found on the open water. It's all a matter of timing.


We stayed at Ilwaco instead of Astoria. Nice marina but the fuel dock is more set up for the commercial fishing boats. If you use it, learn what fender boards are and how to use them.

Mike,
When we get closer to departure from Portland in April/May, Ill PM you for that Beer and Klondike Bar, look forward to hooking up.

The Columbia Bar is fine in good weather. Fishermen cross every day it isn't closed. Slack water/high tide is the best time on any bar. The Columbia bar isn't as bad as it's made out to be except in a storm. Then it's worse. Ilwaco (less expensive) caters to fishermen, but yachts are welcome. Astoria (more expensive - at least to yachts) has 2 main marinas owned by the port. The East marina is plagued by sea lions and the port does little to discourage them. They inhabit the docks and will try to haul out on your swim platform unless you have some barrier. Last I heard about 2500 were in the area whenever salmon are running.
Best way up river is to leave Astoria at low tide and catch the flood all the way to Portland. Adds a couple knots to your speed. Or do it wrong and fight the 2 or more knots.
Both Astoria and Ilwaco have a Englund gear store. Astoria is the big one. Interesting, lots of stuff.
https://www.portofilwaco.com/
Port of Astoria
Check out their web sites. Not a bad idea to tell them ahead you're coming. Depending on fishing they can fill up. Lots of places on the river to anchor.

Columbia River

We took our tug and went from our boathouse in Portland all the way to Clarkston, WA. on the Snake river this July while the dams were still dumping a lot of water. We also went down to Astoria twice this year. Last year we went as far north as Princess Louisa inlet in British Columba. If you are comfortable running passes in current up in the Sound, you can handle the Columbia.

I moved from Seattle to Hayden Island, Portland, last summer. Came up when the river was at flood. Tide no help with that and it was a long slow slog east from Astoria. In fact the last eight hours of the run from Barkley Sound into the Columbia was a slog as so much water was pouring out into the Pacific we saw 2 plus knots. The river east of Portland is beautiful. Astoria to Portland not so much. I find Hayden Island to be a bit isolated, but I mostly get around on a bicycle. Giant mall and a whole lot of gated neighborhoods. Limited options for quality food. Connected to Portland by an interstate. Moorage is a lot less than Seattle. PDX is a great and easy airport but less flights and higher fares than Seattle.

I have a winter dock on the lower Columbia. The run from Neah Bay to Astoria is roughly 190 miles. Timing is everything if you plan to run the Columbia. There are only 2 places to stop on the way down, La Push and Grey's harbor.


Crossing the bar is no big deal so long as you follow this rule: Never ever never never cross the bar on an ebb, EVER! I learned the hard way.


You can cruise up river clear to Lewiston ID. Several locks are involved. Wind can be a factor in the summer and can make the Columbia River Gorge almost impassable. i.e. 5 footers a 3 seconds or less. GFC is up in Tri-Cities and Crusty is in Portland. I am 40 miles down river from Portland.


If you plan to continue down the Oregon Coast it is beautiful. You can harbor hop with most stops 10 hours apart. Beware that all the stops on the upper west coast (S.F. to Neah Bay) are influenced by a river. This means you have to cross a river bar. The only marina that does not fall into this category is Crescent City CA.


Good luck and keep TF in the loop. Lots of experience here.

Hamrow, when you get to OR you owe it to yourselves to take a trip up the Columbia. After passing the Portland area you'll be in the Columbia Gorge Scenic area and with some beautiful forested hills. We've made the trip to Portland a few times (and will be doing it again in March) and can give you some info if you need it.


Keep going upriver and you will pass through 4 locks on the way to the junction with the Snake River. We're at milepost 235 on the Columbia, just upstream from the confluence of the Snake and Columbia. If you're in this area, get in touch with me and I'll make arrangements for moorage for you. Our club is known as the friendliest club in the PNW and we work hard to maintain that reputation.


I've also made the run to Lewiston (4 more dams, ~160 miles) and can help out with info about that trip.


Mike

One of our regrets on our PNW travel was that we didn't take the Columbia as far as possible. We only went a short distance past Portland. As we want to explore every possible river that flows to the ocean or is accessible from the Mississippi, the Columbia remains on our "to do" list.

We're thinking about going to Idaho next summer! Tony Fleming did that trip a couple years ago, and made one of his wonderful videos:

https://youtu.be/f0PGkDY2EXc

He also wrote a story about it in Passagemaker:

https://www.passagemaker.com/destinations/lewis-clark-fleming

I learned to sail on the Columbia at Portland, and have always wanted to do the entire length plus the Snake River. It would certainly be a departure from Salish Sea and Alaska cruising!

Daveo said:

I moved from Seattle to Hayden Island, Portland, last summer. Came up when the river was at flood. Tide no help with that and it was a long slow slog east from Astoria. In fact the last eight hours of the run from Barkley Sound into the Columbia was a slog as so much water was pouring out into the Pacific we saw 2 plus knots. The river east of Portland is beautiful. Astoria to Portland not so much. I find Hayden Island to be a bit isolated, but I mostly get around on a bicycle. Giant mall and a whole lot of gated neighborhoods. Limited options for quality food. Connected to Portland by an interstate. Moorage is a lot less than Seattle. PDX is a great and easy airport but less flights and higher fares than Seattle.

Click to expand...

Ok sorry for the dumb questions but looks like I have a lot to learn: i've no experience with an estuary, obviously i'll have the tides data, but is there a resource available to warn us about how the river is flowing...?

Alaskan Sea-Duction said:

I have a winter dock on the lower Columbia. The run from Neah Bay to Astoria is roughly 190 miles. Timing is everything if you plan to run the Columbia. There are only 2 places to stop on the way down, La Push and Grey's harbor.


Crossing the bar is no big deal so long as you follow this rule: Never ever never never cross the bar on an ebb, EVER! I learned the hard way.


You can cruise up river clear to Lewiston ID. Several locks are involved. Wind can be a factor in the summer and can make the Columbia River Gorge almost impassable. i.e. 5 footers a 3 seconds or less. GFC is up in Tri-Cities and Crusty is in Portland. I am 40 miles down river from Portland.


If you plan to continue down the Oregon Coast it is beautiful. You can harbor hop with most stops 10 hours apart. Beware that all the stops on the upper west coast (S.F. to Neah Bay) are influenced by a river. This means you have to cross a river bar. The only marina that does not fall into this category is Crescent City CA.


Good luck and keep TF in the loop. Lots of experience here.

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Thanks so much and similar question about the gorge: whats a good resource to know the conditions in the gorge are favorable or not or do you just use something like the Windy app?, i promise we'd pay attention to crossing the bar at the right time and yes I'll keep TF in the loop on our plan.

GFC said:

Hamrow, when you get to OR you owe it to yourselves to take a trip up the Columbia. After passing the Portland area you'll be in the Columbia Gorge Scenic area and with some beautiful forested hills. We've made the trip to Portland a few times (and will be doing it again in March) and can give you some info if you need it.


Keep going upriver and you will pass through 4 locks on the way to the junction with the Snake River. We're at milepost 235 on the Columbia, just upstream from the confluence of the Snake and Columbia. If you're in this area, get in touch with me and I'll make arrangements for moorage for you. Our club is known as the friendliest club in the PNW and we work hard to maintain that reputation.


I've also made the run to Lewiston (4 more dams, ~160 miles) and can help out with info about that trip.


Mike

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Thanks again to all of you, this certainly sounds like a worthwhile journey while on the west coast! We spent 3 months based on the Swinomish channel in La Conner dealing with their shifting currents so hopefully that experience will help us a bit...

-David

The fact you aren't full displacement and have that extra power will help you deal with the current easier.

Astoria is a great town to visit, as you head up the river stop at Cathlamet, and St Helens, then up the Multnomah channel for several overnight docks. Go up to Portland and stay at River Place and explore the city.
If you can the trip all the way up to Clarkston/Lewiston is really great. We did the down river trip from Clarkston to Astoria after we finished the Great Loop and I would say we enjoyed it as much as any segment of the loop.

Tony Fleming has a nice you tube video of the trip from Astoria to Lewiston on youtube -
Cheers
Eric

One issue with the coast is crap pots. The buoys are every where out to deep water. It's a good idea to miss the buoys by a wide margin. Because pot buoy line floats and the pots have enough line for any fishing depth, there's a lot of floating line near the buoy. Too close and it will be in your screw.
I have crossed the Columbia bar early ebb and it was rolly but not impossible or even dangerous for a 40'+ boat. But it wasn't breaking yet.

"Ok sorry for the dumb questions but looks like I have a lot to learn: i've no experience with an estuary, obviously i'll have the tides data, but is there a resource available to warn us about how the river is flowing...?"


It's not the river current that can be a problem, it's the winds. They can vary from zero to "HOLY CRAP" but they don't change quickly from one extreme to another. The changes you encounter will most likely be when you move from one stretch of the river to another.


A good example of this are four short videos (~40 to 60 seconds each) I took as we were headed downriver in the summer of 2016. Go to YouTube and search for "Umatilla Days 1", then do #2, #3 and #4. They're taken within an hour time span and within 20 miles of river. As you watch them, keep in mind I'm on a 60' boat that weighs about 60,000 pounds loaded.
Windy.com is a good app to use and gives you the ability to see what's coming.

GFC said:

It's not the river current that can be a problem, it's the winds. They can vary from zero to "HOLY CRAP" but they don't change quickly from one extreme to another. The changes you encounter will most likely be when you move from one stretch of the river to another.

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It's sort of typical for a very winding river without a lot of stuff blocking the wind in many places. Not only does the wind shift, but you're going in a different direction every 10 minutes. You can find yourself headed east into a wind out of the east, then suddenly you're headed south and it's still out of the east, then you're headed east and suddenly the wind is out of the south.

Thanks i'll check out the GFC videos. I had already read the Fleming article when it came out, Fleming's video is pretty cool... though if I show it to the admiral, she might not like the dramatic beginning of the video where they call the columbia bar the "graveyard of the pacific" and how the museum in Astoria shows over 2000 ships that sank there over a couple centuries.... yikes!

Not sure if you have ever done any locks, but here is a nice paper from the Corps. I am still a lock virgin.......


http://www.nwp.usace.army.mil/Portals/24/docs/navigation/HowToLockThru.pdf

Alaskan Sea-Duction said:

Not sure if you have ever done any locks, but here is a nice paper from the Corps. I am still a lock virgin.......


http://www.nwp.usace.army.mil/Portals/24/docs/navigation/HowToLockThru.pdf

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Wifey B: Does that mean I'm a lock not saying it but I've done over 70 unique locks and some of them as many as 6 times.

I'm done as many as 5 in a day.

BandB said:

Wifey B: Does that mean I'm a lock not saying it but I've done over 70 unique locks and some of them as many as 6 times.

I'm done as many as 5 in a day.

Click to expand...

LOL Maybe someday I will make the plunge

Alaskan Sea-Duction said:

Not sure if you have ever done any locks, but here is a nice paper from the Corps. I am still a lock virgin.......


http://www.nwp.usace.army.mil/Portals/24/docs/navigation/HowToLockThru.pdf

Click to expand...

Thanks for the link Tom.

some locks are cake; small locks in Ballard. Some are more exciting; those on the snake river where you go up/down darn near 100 feet. In a small boat, the water churns enough you feel like you're being flushed down the toilet.

Another issue is the quality/friendliness of the lock tenders. I recall years ago when going up the snake, you pulled up to a pull rope, pulled to sound a horn, and watched the lock guy ride his bike over to the controls and let you up or down. Pretty much any time you wanted and the guys were pleasant. 9/11 changed all that.

Now, if you're in the big locks at ballard and get to fumbling around, you'll get a tongue lashing from the lock guys, some of whom are very knowledgeable and some of whom are dumb as a stump. YMMV.

The one absolute, never forget thing is to be sure about the tie off bollards. Some float with the rising water, but a some don't. I'll leave the rest of that to your imagination.

toni

The Columbia River Locks operate much like the TN River. The Erie is rather old in techniques. Okeechobee has so little movement. Yes, on a busy day, Ballard is a zoo. I've seen reports that in season the locks on the Ohio get very crowded with long lines of boats waiting. Then there's the Welland Canal and the St. Lawrence where pleasure boats are the exception, not the rule. Last the Panama Canal which introduces tires, line handlers, pilots, and mules.

Alaskan Sea-Duction said:

Not sure if you have ever done any locks, but here is a nice paper from the Corps. I am still a lock virgin.......


http://www.nwp.usace.army.mil/Portals/24/docs/navigation/HowToLockThru.pdf

Click to expand...

Tom, I've seen that paper before and there's one item on there that I take issue with. They say to use a bow line and stern line. Nope, we do it with a single mid-ship line and it's much easier.

I also discovered the secret to being bounced around when you're being raised in one of our locks. I want to put a graphic together first so I'll get back to you on that one.

I'm back, and here's my secret.....


When you're being lowered in a lock there's almost no water movement inside the lock that would move your boat around. Going down is a piece of cake.

When you're going up and the water enters the lock it comes in through "tainter valves" (google it) and is fed through a series of baffles in the bottom of the lock. The baffles don't extend all the way to the upstream and downstream ends of the lock so as the water is rising the water flows toward each end of the lock. Here's a photo of the baffles...



So, if you are tied toward the upstream end of the lock (as shown below in "A") the water hits the stern of the boat (lots of surface area) and tries to push it forward. You're tied to the bollard that's about the midship point on your boat so that is the pivot point whether you're using one line at your mid-ship cleat or a bow and stern line. Since the boat can't be pushed forward, the push from the water will make the bow of the boat move toward the lock wall. Not fun.


If you are at the downstream end of the lock as the water moves toward the boat it is pushing against the bow. Since there's less surface area for it to push against it doesn't have much force and what force there is gets divided by the bow so the push is almost equal on both sides of the bow. With less force trying to move the bow the boat sits basically stable.

Most boats in the 26'-36' range get by with using one fender aft of the bollard and one or two forward of the bollard. We use two fenders aft and three forward just to be on the safe side. Dealer's choice on how many to use and where to put them.

Here's a photo of what the bollard looks like. FYI, I grade my wife based on how quickly she gets us secured to the bollard. How pretty, or not, her knots are is not a factor. Some of them look like a Gordian Knot but if she is quick about it I don't really care.


So, Tom, there's my big secret for you on how to easily transition a lock. The first round is on you, my friend!

Good job my friend. Ever have a Bullard stick on you requiring you to untie like yesterday?

I also saw someone (here on TF or CSR) use some old fenders and attach them to two 2x4s. Reason being the walls of the lock can get really nasty, so why mess up your good fenders.