Binoculars

Seevee said:

Thought I'd bring this thread up again....

Question re stabilized binoculars:

I'm seeing the 8x25 and 8x30 Cannon in the $300 to $500 range NEW, and the 10x42 new in the $1000 plus range or occasionally $600 used.

Is the 10x42 worth more than double than the 8x30?

There's a FUJIFILM Fujinon Techno-Stabi TS 1440 for $700 locally. A lot of $ but worth it?

Use is just for seeing markers primarily.

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The prices didn't seem right to me so I went on Amazon to check. They advertise the 10x42 as waterproof but not the 8x25. That may account for the big jump in price. The bigger 42mm lens will account for some of that as well. Gives you better light gathering.

It looks like you can get a 10x30 for about a hundred more than the 8x25.
If you're going to get a stabilized binocular you might as well get some magnification. You can hand hold a 7X without stabilization pretty well. I think the 12X Canon stabilized is kind of the sweet spot.

My opinion:

Anything under 10x power doesn't really need image stabilization. Save money and go with the bigger 2nd number (objective lens size), so 7x50s over 8x35s. Exit pupil also matters, bigger the better, which is generally the "hidden" difference between a $30 pair and a $300 pair.

10x power and above, you do need image stabilization. And at this point, in my opinion, more power is better. I love my Canon 12x36s at ~$600.

We have Cannon 10*30. Had them for about 3 years and 15,000 miles. while the standards 7*50 bincs might pull in more light, the stabilization makes the Cannons our first choice day or night. For east coast cruising we find the cannon 21*30 to be excellent.

Keep an eye on eBay: I got my Steiners and my IS Canon as used items from pawn shops in other parts of the country. I saved a bunch of money and they work and look like new.

Anything under 10x power doesn't really need image stabilization.

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I agree with this.

I have the Fujinon 14x and while they work well they are large.

I briefly used some Canon 12x and they were much more compact.

I've not used the FUJIs but I'm sure they are excellent. If they are marinized, that would be a plus over the Canons. You could also wait a couple months and see what's new at the boat shows. I don't think you can go wrong with either pair.

Back in Post #52 I tried to describe my impressions and comparisons of the Canon and Fuji. Since I have had a Canon for years and really liked it until the stabilization failed, I decided to try the Fuji even though it is much more expensive.

I have been very happy with my decision. I keep two pair in the PH. A smaller non-stabilized pair and the Fuji. I use both. When I need the mag and/or the stabilization, the Fuji is fantastic.

Coast Guard around these parts use Nikon 12x or 16x image stabilizers. If you're going to spend the extra $$ for image stabilizers, go for big power. We've sold these in the past re-ordering for spring. As previous posters have said, lower power binoculars do not amplify hand shake, so not much point in spending extra $$ getting a low power image stabilizer

We ordered a pair of the Fujinon 12x image stabilized for only about $500 from B&H photo, we've had them for 4 months and so far they're fantastic.
I've got a close friend in the professional video business and he orders most of his equipment from B&H.

Seevee said:

There's a FUJIFILM Fujinon Techno-Stabi TS 1440 for $700 locally. A lot of $ but worth it?

Use is just for seeing markers primarily.

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For seeing markers, we've found good unstablized 7x50s work fine. For reading markers... stabilized would like be the way to go... so we've been leisurely shopping. For us, it has to be hands-on shopping; gotta try 'em (especially for sufficient eye relief, since we both wear eyeglasses), feel the weight, etc.

Somewhere recently (a different forum?) I saw a thread about stabilized binocs. One note was about the degree of stabilization offered, and Fuji seemed to outscore Cannon on that. Another note said Fuji made the Nikon binocs, now discontinued.

A third pointed out there are two different lines of Fujinon, one being the less expensive 14x and two in the more expensive 12x/16x sizes. The latter two were said to be aimed to military/commercial customers, are more expensive, and seem to weigh about a pound more than the 14x. Info on the Fujinon website...

When comparing specs, we usually start at eye relief, and then go from there. We DID try out the Fuji 14x model somewhere (a year or more ago, now) and it was pretty heavy, bulky. They didn't have Cannon or Nikon to compare against, at the time...

-Chris

ranger42c said:

Somewhere recently (a different forum?) I saw a thread about stabilized binocs. One note was about the degree of stabilization offered, and Fuji seemed to outscore Cannon on that. Another note said Fuji made the Nikon binocs, now discontinued.

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The Fuji and Cannon use different stabilization technologies. Both are great at doing what they do but they are doing different things. The Cannon does a great job of getting rid of hand shake. However, it doesn’t handle boat motion. The Fuji will handle boat motion in addition to the hand shake.

If I was going to be using binocs exclusively on land, I would definitely go with the Cannon. However, after using the Cannon for almost a couple decades on boat I am finding the Fuji to be much better for handling boat motion.

dhays said:

The Fuji and Cannon use different stabilization technologies. Both are great at doing what they do but they are doing different things. The Cannon does a great job of getting rid of hand shake. However, it doesn’t handle boat motion. The Fuji will handle boat motion in addition to the hand shake.

If I was going to be using binocs exclusively on land, I would definitely go with the Cannon. However, after using the Cannon for almost a couple decades on boat I am finding the Fuji to be much better for handling boat motion.

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Useful info, thanks for posting. One of these days I'm gonna get off the dime...

-Chris

All great responses....

I'm going to decide between three options:

The Fujinon 12x image stabilized indicated about at $500 B&H

Canon IS Image Stabilized Binocular - 8x25 $350 Defender

Fujinon Techno-Stabi TS 14x40 locally used at $700.

If the 14x40 guy matches the 12x at $500 I'll buy his, otherwise I'm leaning on the 12x from B&H.

I just feel the 8x25 isn't powerful enough, even the cheap price.

Sound good?

We like our Steiner 7X50 Marine Navigators

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/co...XWZ9mjXAoMaAuTSEALw_wcB&is=USA&m=Y&sku=244846

Seevee said:

All great responses....

I'm going to decide between three options:

The Fujinon 12x image stabilized indicated about at $500 B&H

Canon IS Image Stabilized Binocular - 8x25 $350 Defender

Fujinon Techno-Stabi TS 14x40 locally used at $700.

If the 14x40 guy matches the 12x at $500 I'll buy his, otherwise I'm leaning on the 12x from B&H.

I just feel the 8x25 isn't powerful enough, even the cheap price.

Sound good?

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Why do you feel 8 power isnt enough?

Sure 100 power would be enough....maybe?

Fot decades 7x50s were good enough for navigation uses, stabilization made them better...

At some point all the goodiesvwe buy for boats reach a tipping point to where we get great use out of an item 90 percent of the time. Do we really need to keep throwing money at the other 10 percent if there is no direct return on it?

Its not like addind another alarm on the engine that might prevent seripus damage...this is seing somwthing clearer o.oor bigger or whatever way past the real need to know. Nice but not critical.

Seevee said:

All great responses....

I'm going to decide between three options:

The Fujinon 12x image stabilized indicated about at $500 B&H

Canon IS Image Stabilized Binocular - 8x25 $350 Defender

Fujinon Techno-Stabi TS 14x40 locally used at $700.

If the 14x40 guy matches the 12x at $500 I'll buy his, otherwise I'm leaning on the 12x from B&H.

I just feel the 8x25 isn't powerful enough, even the cheap price.

Sound good?

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If you wear eyeglasses, you'd probably benefit by putting eyes on each unit before deciding. I've found eye relief is much more important than magnification...

In our case, weight is also a possible issue, Our intention is that these would be used by our normal spotter (Admiral), and she mentioned the two units we looked at one day were REALLY heavy (for her).

I hadn't known much about stabilization, and we couldn't get a real feel for how each brand might work while we were in the store... no bouncing around in there -- so Dave's latest comment seems to me to be especially useful.

-Chris

psneeld said:

Why do you feel 8 power isnt enough?

Sure 100 power would be enough....maybe?

Fot decades 7x50s were good enough for navigation uses, stabilization made them better...

At some point all the goodiesvwe buy for boats reach a tipping point to where we get great use out of an item 90 percent of the time. Do we really need to keep throwing money at the other 10 percent if there is no direct return on it?

Its not like addind another alarm on the engine that might prevent seripus damage...this is seing somwthing clearer o.oor bigger or whatever way past the real need to know. Nice but not critical.

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Psneeld,

I don't know, that's why I'm here. I've got a 10x50 Bushnell and it's fair at best. I can't imagine much less magnification, but if it were stable it would be very useful. And a lot of comments on other forums indicate that 8 power can be a bit marginal.

But I've never tried 8 power with stabilization, so I don't know.

And, yes, there's a direct return on knowing what's up there, verifying a marker or a clearance board from a distance. Not often, but enough to justify some binocs.

Cant say for sure, but for simple bridge navigation, 7x50 have been the staple binocs of professional bridge crews for many decades. Stabilization was just getting started in the early 80s.

I find them the most useful in low light conditions where the human eye doesnt cut it....and 7x50 is it unless you start getting into monsters to get the light gathering for the increased power.

Unless searching for something, the only time I wish I had more power is looking at tide gauges on bridges when they have the tiny ones and I am tring to decide to call for an opening.

And if course sightseeing...

psneeld said:

Cant say for sure, but for simple bridge navigation, 7x50 have been the staple binocs of professional bridge crews for many decades. Stabilization was just getting started in the early 80s.

I find them the most useful in low light conditions where the human eye doesnt cut it....and 7x50 is it unless you start getting into monsters to get the light gathering for the increased power.

Unless searching for something, the only time I wish I had more power is looking at tide gauges on bridges when they have the tiny ones and I am tring to decide to call for an opening.

And if course sightseeing...

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Good points, and I'm really on the fence. I could be talked into or out of one. At times I see their value and at times I feel it's an expensive luxury.

It's pretty simple, 7X helps you find the marker, stabilized 12X lets you read the number on the marker.

But weren't 7x50 the staple simply because that was the maximum magnification you could hold by hand ? If stabilization was available decades ago, I imagine the "staple" would have been higher powered.

One more option for the OP if you decide you don't need stabilized, and i think i got this website from another TF post a long time ago. theres a site called "Steep and Cheap" that seems to have significant discounts on actual brands that appear to be legit, for example they have some Steinar deals right now that seem cheap, just a thought...

HopCar said:

It's pretty simple, 7X helps you find the marker, stabilized 12X lets you read the number on the marker.

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One can argue that real navigators dont find out where they are, they confirm where they are and the number becomes less important when it is the right color in the right location.

The 7x light gathering lets me see in the dark better to see unlit things better than 12x...again unless they are giants or special, costly design.

Benthic2 said:

But weren't 7x50 the staple simply because that was the maximum magnification you could hold by hand ? If stabilization was available decades ago, I imagine the "staple" would have been higher powered.

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Not really, on larger warships they had much larger mounted binocs.

The bridge crews wound up with the best general purpose binoc.

Sure more magnification is better for some things, but magnification also decreases field of view as well as light gathering.

Tradeoffs.....steady hands and how steady the deck is is always a variable.

As I said, one is good enough, yet 8X is almost 12 percent better than 7X and stabilized.

What do you give up by going higher?

I use a pair of 6x something backpack size. That way I can quickly one hand them. Wife uses a the 7x50s (plus zoom) if we need better magnification.

HopCar said:

It's pretty simple, 7X helps you find the marker, stabilized 12X lets you read the number on the marker.

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This is a great description.

I had great experience with my Canon stabilization. I really liked it and it performed and survived for a couple decades being used on my sailboats. Most of the time it was all I could ever want.

However there are times, usually coming into an unfamiliar marina, when I want to be able to read the markers or signs. The 14x40 Fuji does that great. For a quick grab and look, the Canon is more convenient and lightweight.

The issues mentioned above about eye relief is very important for those wearing glasses.

Is the 8x42 a good compromise between mag & light gathering?

psneeld said:

Why do you feel 8 power isnt enough?

Sure 100 power would be enough....maybe?

Fot decades 7x50s were good enough for navigation uses, stabilization made them better...

At some point all the goodiesvwe buy for boats reach a tipping point to where we get great use out of an item 90 percent of the time. Do we really need to keep throwing money at the other 10 percent if there is no direct return on it?

Its not like addind another alarm on the engine that might prevent seripus damage...this is seing somwthing clearer o.oor bigger or whatever way past the real need to know. Nice but not critical.

Click to expand...

The answer is yes if that's how one chooses to spend his money for that extra bit of utility. Value is in the eye of the beholder. We have a pair of Fujinon 7 x 50's and a pair of Fuji Tecnho Stabi 14x. We like them both depending on the situation. Sure, one could get along just fine with 7 x 50's but why do so if one sees value in having both and is willing to pay the price?

My real point is you can keep going up that list from a great pair of binocs that most yachtsmen would have killed for pretty much my whole life for around $300.... or just keep thinking you are getting a bit more utility right up every rung of the ladder till you spend over $5000.

Sure pay whatever you want, but like many navigation systems on a boat, way iverkill for what the boat owner is getting out of them.

I am just suggesting critical thinking of what you are really gonna get out of them for the money.

psneeld said:

My real point is you can keep going up that list from a great pair of binocs that most yachtsmen would have killed for pretty much my whole life for around $300.... or just keep thinking you are getting a bit more utility right up every rung of the ladder till you spend over $5000.

Sure pay whatever you want, but like many navigation systems on a boat, way iverkill for what the boat owner is getting out of them.

I am just suggesting critical thinking of what you are really gonna get out of them for the money.

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Fair enough!