Active Captain Interface

WesK said:

Why are so many people in favor of "getting rid of flash"? It has never caused me any problems that I know of. To me it's something that's not broken and doesn't need fixing.

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If you wanted to access AC with an Android or iOS device (i.e. phone or tablet), you probably wouldn't have asked this. We find planning is most often done spur of the moment when a PC is not available, so having AC on a phone or tablet is necessary to how we cruise. We do not often cruise with a PC, but always have at least one tablet and our phones on board, so even when on the boat, rely on the tablet for planning purposes.

BandB said:

But don't you find marinas for an area by entering a location?

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I never even thought of doing it that way -- when looking for a marina, I start on the live map and zoom in on the area I am interested in.

Now I am going to look into how you are doing it so I have that as an option!

WesK said:

Why are so many people in favor of "getting rid of flash"? It has never caused me any problems that I know of. To me it's something that's not broken and doesn't need fixing.

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Waywego said:

If you wanted to access AC with an Android or iOS device (i.e. phone or tablet), you probably wouldn't have asked this. We find planning is most often done spur of the moment when a PC is not available, so having AC on a phone or tablet is necessary to how we cruise. We do not often cruise with a PC, but always have at least one tablet and our phones on board, so even when on the boat, rely on the tablet for planning purposes.

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What does that have to do with Flash?

Are you meaning all that in relation to the AC website? Or various Android and/or iThing apps that integrate AC data?

Or...?

-Chris

Waywego said:

Now I am going to look into how you are doing it so I have that as an option!

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At least I would have if the flash version would run on my PC. It must be offline for now as I can't get it to load using any of my browsers.

I see your issue with only a search by marina name, you can't really use the search feature to find a marina in a particular area if you don't know its name already. Hopefully that will be at the top of the bug list.

I still remember the days when products went through engineering test, alpha test and beta test before the public ever saw them. Nowadays, I wonder if even alpha testing is getting done.

OK, yesterday I reviewed a marina and it came up with Jeffery Siegel's name, not mine. Today I wrote a review and it ignored it. Kind of crappy that I took the trouble to review and anchorage and the site just threw it away.

I hope they get this crap fixed before my next cruise.

Waywego said:

At least I would have if the flash version would run on my PC. It must be offline for now as I can't get it to load using any of my browsers...................

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I had an issue with AC on my laptop a year or two ago but it turned out our puppy (yes, the dog) who likes to lay on the table had turned it off. She once posted on Facebook.

Seems to work faster and smoother for me but I'm really going to miss the marinas filter. It sure was nice to be able to quickly eliminate those that didn't have diesel or pump out. What a pain it is going to be to click through all the choices now.

I downloaded the iPad app named Locations and am look forward to updates in the future. It's obviously still a work in progress at this point. In the help menu under the "Coming Next" tab the are announcing that they will be adding the following items: Anchor Watch (better than Drag Queen), Community Anchoring, Follow Location, Active Captain offline data and much more. I think it looks very promising.

ranger42c said:

What does that have to do with Flash?

Are you meaning all that in relation to the AC website? Or various Android and/or iThing apps that integrate AC data?

Or...?

-Chris

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Up until the latest release of the website, AC used Adobe Flash to render the maps and some other features. So, if you have a device without Flash capability (i.e. Android or iOS phones and tablets) you could not use the web browser to get the live map and all the crowd sourced data. The old AC app was marginally OK, but without decent base maps and very slow. Then it was discontinued, so without a browser with Flash support, you had to use one of the few charting apps to get AC data. The charting apps do not require Flash for the AC data, but there were only a few. Even Garmin does not currently have an Andriod version of BlueChart.

AC was not the only website that had content based on Flash, but the only one I particularly cared about...

WesK said:

Why are so many people in favor of "getting rid of flash"? It has never caused me any problems that I know of. To me it's something that's not broken and doesn't need fixing.

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I think I misread your post before...

Part of the reason people are moving away from Flash is that Adobe is trying to stop supporting it. Another reason is that it has been used by hackers to get access to peoples computers and is seen as a security risk.

Waywego said:

Up until the latest release of the website, AC used Adobe Flash to render the maps and some other features. So, if you have a device without Flash capability (i.e. Android or iOS phones and tablets) you could not use the web browser to get the live map and all the crowd sourced data. The old AC app was marginally OK, but without decent base maps and very slow. Then it was discontinued, so without a browser with Flash support, you had to use one of the few charting apps to get AC data. The charting apps do not require Flash for the AC data, but there were only a few. Even Garmin does not currently have an Andriod version of BlueChart.

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Ah. I've only used their website interface from the home computer, and not all that often, so didn't realize it wouldn't work on the tablets.

OTOH, there are several charting apps for tablets/smartphones that integrate AC data. The ones I've used on Android devices have been much better -- for related chart data -- than the website, at least for our purposes.

Waywego said:

I think I misread your post before...

Part of the reason people are moving away from Flash is that Adobe is trying to stop supporting it. Another reason is that it has been used by hackers to get access to peoples computers and is seen as a security risk.

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Ah. Helps to have that background... Haven't been paying much attention to technical computer stuff these last several years...

-Chris

WesK said:

OK, yesterday I reviewed a marina and it came up with Jeffery Siegel's name, not mine. Today I wrote a review and it ignored it. Kind of crappy that I took the trouble to review and anchorage and the site just threw it away.

I hope they get this crap fixed before my next cruise.

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Last night I got an email from Jeffery Siegel saying he removed my review and that I could post reviews using the new interface. I cannot.

Waywego said:

I think I misread your post before...

Part of the reason people are moving away from Flash is that Adobe is trying to stop supporting it. Another reason is that it has been used by hackers to get access to peoples computers and is seen as a security risk.

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Thanks. Since I retired, I haven't been following the industry so I didn't know that.

BandB said:

Wifey B: I left this out. I also do not like that he tells you not to send individual complaints or problems, to post them on face book. Well, some of us choose not to be on facebook or not to be in his facebook group.

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IF I joined facebook, my sister would wonder why I didn't "friend" her.

I suspect there are other alternatives to AC.

One of the final messages from the original 'owners' said, they did have a way to return to the old system if the transition did not go well.

WesK said:

Last night I got an email from Jeffery Siegel saying he removed my review and that I could post reviews using the new interface. I cannot.

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Just tell Jeff that. With description of symptoms, etc.

You will likely know not all software roll-overs go perfectly every time <snort!>... and often the developers can't (or haven't figured out how to) make the same kinds of problems happen that creative users can cause... so usually the "rollers" are happy to get feedback on stuff they need to fix.

-Chris

ranger42c said:

Just tell Jeff that. With description of symptoms, etc.

You will likely know not all software roll-overs go perfectly every time <snort!>... and often the developers can't (or haven't figured out how to) make the same kinds of problems happen that creative users can cause... so usually the "rollers" are happy to get feedback on stuff they need to fix.

-Chris

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That's the excuse you hear from all sloppy developers. There is no excuse, ever, for bringing a system live that is functioning as poorly as AC appears to be right now. It's done all the time, but it's the wrong way. I've been over IT departments that did a lot of developing and never tolerated it. Never had to. I had the right people and the right systems.

In my working days, I developed two pretty big database programs that were used by dozens of people to track and report important business information.

Once I thought I had it right, I logged on as a regular used and tried every function before I let it go public. That's just common sense because many people are looking for you to fail. Don't let it happen because they will never have confidence in you or your programs again.

Did he (I guess it is THEY now)ever put it out as a beta?

WesK said:

In my working days, I developed two pretty big database programs that were used by dozens of people to track and report important business information.

Once I thought I had it right, I logged on as a regular used and tried every function before I let it go public. That's just common sense because many people are looking for you to fail. Don't let it happen because they will never have confidence in you or your programs again.

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We'd have "rainy day testing" and "break the system parties." There was always a compilation of test data to enter so that every transaction and entry was done. It got more complex online with all the different browsers to test.

A system is going to be tested either before you release it or after. Just seems to make a lot more sense to do it before.

BandB said:

That's the excuse you hear from all sloppy developers. There is no excuse, ever, for bringing a system live that is functioning as poorly as AC appears to be right now. It's done all the time, but it's the wrong way. I've been over IT departments that did a lot of developing and never tolerated it. Never had to. I had the right people and the right systems.

Click to expand...

WesK said:

In my working days, I developed two pretty big database programs that were used by dozens of people to track and report important business information.

Once I thought I had it right, I logged on as a regular used and tried every function before I let it go public. That's just common sense because many people are looking for you to fail. Don't let it happen because they will never have confidence in you or your programs again.

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Both of those are correct, but then there's real world.

I managed some mega-$$$ projects (approaching a quarter-billion $$ budget on one of the systems), and our teams mostly got things right the first time. And then we tested the systems to death... and found boo boos. Not sloppy developers at all, but we were inventing stuff that had never been done before, for users who were "envisioning" system they needed for mission. Fixed those boo boos, tested to death again, found more boo boos.

Fixed those, released the beta version with a few power users, and they did "stupid stuff"... outside design parameters... because they needed the system to do that stuff and hadn't quite expressed the requirement perfectly in the first place...

So we fixed that... and the system worked pretty well... except for those pesky new requirements that kept pouring in because mission demanded it.

Lots of moving parts, mobile teams, world-wide users, evolving mission... the dart board moved... and the budget is often the budget.

So yeah, errors should never occur.

But they do.

We also found some of the users didn't like some of the interface implementations. At the same time, other users loved those same bits and pieces. Well, we couldn't please everyone, nor did we care to try. As long as the product met the goal (got the user the answers, historical detail, and predicted way forward he needed... all as quickly and efficiently as he needed it) that at least was measurable. The "I like it" factor was often too subjective to waste much time (and $$$) with.

I haven't looked at the new AC interface, but that's partly 'cause I seldom used the original website interface anyway... but even if it sucks, feedback to the developers is appropriate, and they'll eventually get it mostly right. Good developers, bad developers, great work ethic, slop, whatever... No sense wasting any emotion over it.

-Chris

ranger42c said:

I haven't looked at the new AC interface, but that's partly 'cause I seldom used the original website interface anyway... but even if it sucks, feedback to the developers is appropriate, and they'll eventually get it mostly right. Good developers, bad developers, great work ethic, slop, whatever... No sense wasting any emotion over it.

-Chris

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You forget that it's a developer who will tell you why he's right and you're wrong and if he doesn't like the feedback will ban you from using the site.

I think eventually it will be ok and we'll take it or leave it.

There was criticism by some of Garmin and we have Garmin products and have been very pleased with them. I'm also a huge fan of Active Captain and regularly use it, although not linked to any chart system.

BandB said:

You forget that it's a developer who will tell you why he's right and you're wrong and if he doesn't like the feedback will ban you from using the site.

I think eventually it will be ok and we'll take it or leave it.

There was criticism by some of Garmin and we have Garmin products and have been very pleased with them. I'm also a huge fan of Active Captain and regularly use it, although not linked to any chart system.

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That's pretty well put and it's the reason it won't be me reporting bugs to "the developer". Someone else can man the front lines and take the shots.

Hey speaking of AC, it's seems to me that I only see older reviews and comments on marinas, anchorages, etc. Seems like they are all a year or older. Is that just me? Do I need to update something?

I use AC on my iPad if that matters.

cardude01 said:

Hey speaking of AC, it's seems to me that I only see older reviews and comments on marinas, anchorages, etc. Seems like they are all a year or older. Is that just me? Do I need to update something?

I use AC on my iPad if that matters.

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I see newer reviews. Are you connecting to the internet? Go look at Bahia Mar in Fort Lauderdale and you should see one from August 8. Riviera Beach is 10/2. Ft. Pierce is 9/2.

Newest review I see is 12-30-2015.

Wait. I see I didn't have "auto update" turned on. Duh !

Thanks. I think it's updating now.

cardude01 said:

Newest review I see is 12-30-2015.

Wait. I see I didn't have "auto update" turned on. Duh !

Thanks. I think it's updating now.

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That should help.

BandB said:

You forget that it's a developer who will tell you why he's right and you're wrong and if he doesn't like the feedback will ban you from using the site.

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Hmmm.... yeah, well, that's certainly a point relevant to this particular product.

I remember I'm meant to believe social interaction -- made easier via eboatcards and Facebook -- is the world's salvation....

Not.

WesK said:

That's pretty well put and it's the reason it won't be me reporting bugs to "the developer". Someone else can man the front lines and take the shots.

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Several times in the past Jeff has accepted factoids about how the system worked -- or didn't. He certainly has his own opinions (and is entitled), but when I reported factoid-based things like "clicking on X didn't open X" (or some such) he got right on it, and graciously, I thought. I would imagine that "I entered a review but the system didn't accept it" -- with whatever details might be required to identify the attempted transaction and the method you attempted -- would be welcome enough.

But mostly my point is only that often things don't get fixed if the developer doesn't know it needs fixing.

-Chris

cardude01 said:

Hey speaking of AC, it's seems to me that I only see older reviews and comments on marinas, anchorages, etc. Seems like they are all a year or older. Is that just me? Do I need to update something?

I use AC on my iPad if that matters.

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You're seeing AC data through a Nav app of some sort? iNavX or iSailor or whatever?

Should be an update command.

Edit: Ah, see you found it.

-Chris

ranger42c said:

But mostly my point is only that often things don't get fixed if the developer doesn't know it needs fixing.

-Chris

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And my point is that if the developer doesn't know, then he's not done a very good job of testing.