Anchoring in a creek

sdowney717 · Sep 5, 2017

Using the OPENCPN ENC chart, i drew a line acroos the creek, it is from shore to shore 0.11 nm, or 660 foot wide.
On my side of the shore, i was about 40 foot away and had plenty of depth.
If you subtract off the other side of the shore, even 200 foot for depth, that leaves
660 - 40(boat from shore) - 25 (boat sticking into creek)- 200 A(extreme amount)
395 foot of navigable water in front of my bow.

On the other shore at the shoreline are covered docks and big slips for big boats.

Unless I figured it wrong should have been plenty of room.

rwidman · Sep 5, 2017

From the description of the way the tow boat operator approached, I would not have thought he was there to offer friendly advice. And if he was there to offer friendly advice, he certainly would have gone ahead and explained why he thought the OP was in a bad place.

Remember, none of the other boats that passed the OP while he was anchored came up on him to offer friendly advice.

SoCal · Sep 5, 2017

Never mind, I've got a lot to learn.

hfoster · Sep 5, 2017

WesK said:
As we boat, we should keep in mind that we don't own the water we boat in. Sometimes other boaters inconvenience us with their actions but what they are doing is perfectly legal and normal.

Sometimes I'll pull into an anchorage and find that I'm inconvenienced by one or more boaters who are already there. Well, that's legal, normal and to be expected. I have to anchor further away. I might even have to select an alternate anchorage. That's life and that's boating.

On my last cruise, I got behind two tugs towing dredging equipment and pipes in a narrow cut. I had to slow to about three knots for a half hour. Again, that's life and that's boating.

So this tow boat operator had no cause for acting as he did and his employer needs to know about this incident. It's likely this isn't the only time he has acted in this manner. Having the skills to do his job is important of course, but representing his employer to the public in a positive way is also important.

As for asking him why he thought the OP shouldn't be anchored where he was, the tow boat operator already blew any chance of a reasonable conversation when he approached the OP's boat as he did and yelled at him.

I agree Mate on your reply. However as for me, if a fella is yelling at me I would like to know why. If he/she is having a bad day that will become clear by a little chat with them.

In this case the Tow boat Fella went out of his way to make a point for some reason. If he was just being a Nutter, as I said I would have told he to bugger off. However we will not know what point he was trying to make or if he was having a bad day. In any case, I would asked him why he felt the need to come up as he did and why he was yelling that it was a bad shot to drop the hook, but that is just me.

Cheers.

H.

markpierce · Sep 5, 2017

Anchoring at the extreme edge of the natural channel at a wide part with too shallow water further away seems prudent to me. Wonder if showing an anchor day shape would have helped.

Often encounter reckless AHs on the highway. My tactic is to ignore them but will likely swear under my breath.

rwidman · Sep 5, 2017

markpierce said:
Anchoring at the extreme edge of the natural channel at a wide part with too shallow water further away seems prudent to me. Wonder if showing an anchor day shape would have helped.

Often encounter reckless AHs on the highway. My tactic is to ignore them but will likely swear under my breath.

Yes, this incident is pretty much "road rage" except on the water, not the road. Ignoring the jerk was probably the best plan. Anything else could have escalated the situation.

As far as an anchor day shape, I have never, repeat never seen a recreational boat showing an anchor day shape.

psneeld · Sep 5, 2017

WesK said:
You and I read the same post and came away with entirely different takes on it. The OP felt this guy's actions were inappropriate and threatening or he wouldn't have bothered to post about it.

I would hope we would come away with 2 takes on it.

Me, I can see both sides because I have been on both sides. Plus we only heard one side.

You however, have already figured it all out.

Most people who are told they are doing wrong and being glared at usually do feel it is inappropriate till the other side is heard.

While there is no "wrong" in this situation unless someone can without a doubt show the anchored boat was in the channel.....maybe uoon reflection and understanding, there may be a better solution next time. So posting is appropriate, not just feeling being right without more input.

Unless one loves jumping to conclusions.

markpierce · Sep 5, 2017

WesK said:
As far as an anchor day shape, I have never, repeat never seen a recreational boat showing an anchor day shape.

Since professional sailors display the shape, perhaps the harrasser would be intimidated and not be confrontational.

rwidman · Sep 5, 2017

markpierce said:
Since professional sailors display the shape, perhaps the harrasser would be intimidated and not be confrontational.

We still don't know why he acted the way he did. Unless the OP left out some serious information, I personally find his actions totally inappropriate. He doesn't own the waterway and has no enforcement authority. The OP did not cut in front of him or restrict his movement.

To me, the guy is a jerk and should be reported. If I had employees acting like that when driving a vehicle or boat with my business name on it, I would not tolerate this behavior and I would want to know about it.

And I have never seen a "professional sailor" display an anchor ball either. I have seen them on cargo ships.

markpierce · Sep 5, 2017

WesK said:
...
And I have never seen a "professional sailor" display an anchor ball either. I have seen them on cargo ships.

Some time ago I posted a couple of photos in TF displaying the day shape on recreational vessels, including mine. Can't display them now because Photobucket photos are prohibited.

psneeld · Sep 5, 2017

I and other cruisers I know fly an anchor ball when anchored up for awhile.

I spray painted an old ball fender flat black and hoist it on tbe mast. It is a little small at 13 inches so I am making a larger one for this winters trip.

You dont see them as often as one should, but they are out there amongst serious, experienced cruisers. If for nothing else, one last thing protecting your liability in a collision.

Insequent · Sep 5, 2017

Seems to me that more info is needed. Is the creek some kind of reserve? Protected habitat? No anchoring after a certain time? Everyone waving, being friendly - or were they indicating you 'are in a bad spot'?

Asking the towboatUS guy 'what's the problem?' might have revealed the information we might just be missing here.

markpierce · Sep 5, 2017

If the fellow was sincere, he would have explained in a reasonable voice the reason anchoring was wrong.

Simi 60 · Sep 6, 2017

WesK said:
If A guy comes at your boat at high speed and stops just short of your boat and yells at you, it's not to give you friendly advice.

Under the wrong circumstances, this guy could have been shot.

Only in America, or maybe Somalia.

BandB · Sep 6, 2017

markpierce said:
If the fellow was sincere, he would have explained in a reasonable voice the reason anchoring was wrong.

I'll give you an alternative explanation too. Perhaps he yelled because he knew with engines running, he might not be heard. He could even be in the habit of speaking loudly when doing his normal tow work. Perhaps he didn't explain further because he didn't know he was ever heard since there was no recognition or response. He then saw the OP safely off and just let it go at that point.

I have no idea. Neither does anyone else other than the man doing it and to my knowledge he is not currently present. It appeared strange but many things do on the surface and later are found not to be.

Art · Sep 6, 2017

Although I've only read first page of this thread... think I understand enough to comment.

If it had been a tow boat, a police boat, a CG boat or any other boat commercial or private who had approached my anchored boat that way... I'd want intelligent what/why conversation to start right on the spot... immediately! And, to reach a conclusion before I up anchored.

If no conversation was available from the captain on other boat I'd tell him to beg-off and get away from my boat's anchoring space. If no result - I might call the police.

Of course if the other captain would like to yell at me... I'd ask him aboard for a friendly short discussion! - LOL

I know H will appreciate the last portion of the last paragraph!!! :rofl:

Benthic2 · Sep 6, 2017

OP....did you have your radio on ? No need to get too close or yell with a VHF.

I'd say, spend a few minutes of self examination, see if, in hindsight, you could have done anything to be a better boating citizen, and then just let it go.

“You can please some of the people all of the time, you can please all of the people some of the time, but you can’t please all of the people all of the time”.” -J Lydgate

rwidman · Sep 6, 2017

Even if the OP was perceived by the tow boat operator to be in or too close to the channel, it is not his place to run up on him and yell at him. He has no law enforcement authority, in this case he is nothing more than a private citizen with a company logo on his boat.

He is entitled to believe that the OP is anchored in a bad spot but he has no right to do anything about it and no right to act and speak in a threatening way. He was being a bully, possibly because he saw a woman on the bow, not a man.

This is road rage on the water, plain and simple. It could have ended badly if the OP had said or done anything about it.

psneeld · Sep 6, 2017

And the supositions keep rolling on.

This is America where you can burn the flag.

Yelling above ambient noise because he perceived someone to be anchored in a marked (sorta) channel, which is against COREGS and possibly the law, is certainly his right.

If that is bullying, well, I would have to take that to OTDE.

jleonard · Sep 6, 2017

Sounds like much ado about nothing from what I read.
Time to move on.

rwidman · Sep 6, 2017

You realize, I hope, that no one is forcing you to follow this thread!

psneeld · Sep 6, 2017

Unsolicited advice.....hmmmm.....isnt that what this thread is about now? :rofl:

sdowney717 · Sep 6, 2017

Gee, I hope none of you smart boaters drop anchor in a creek ever again, or maybe your conscience should smite you who are critical.

Marked channel??
Sort of marked, there are buoys far apart, and I was far away from the red one, and I was anchored close to shore. If this is a marked channel most certainly not the center of the channel, and wow must be very very wide. And if I was in a channel, then that channel is coming right close to the creek shore. There is a NO WAKE sign prominently displayed close to shore, and that sign was about 20 foot off my stern. We were drifting close to it and I was thinking we were getting too close to the shore, but the boat drifted back.

I still think that guy has a GPS track he follows all the time, he came by us, went out, came back, must be based there or something and I was in or close to his usual boating path, and he did not like that.

No one else was yelling or waving madly at us, pulled up to complain like they thought we were doing something illegal. I see a poster is now suggesting illegal anchoring...

sunchaser · Sep 6, 2017

SD

Seems a good opportunity was lost to have had a conversation with the fellow to hear his point of view. When it comes to anchoring local knowledge can be quite helpful.

rwidman · Sep 6, 2017

I see people anchored in the channel all the time. Sometimes in the middle of a channel, fishing. I've even had to stop for people swimming in the channel. It's something we have to learn to deal with as boaters.

What is odd in this situation is, the tow boat operator didn't say why he thought you were anchored in a bad place. We are left to wonder what was on his mind.

Even if he thought you were anchored in the channel, it's not his place to tell you that, especially the way he did it. If this was something that really bothered him, he could have reported you to the Coast Guard or local authorities. Of course he could have called you on the radio from a safe distance and advised you that in his opinion, you were too close to the channel.

Recreational boating is supposed to be fun and it's a shame when some A-hole ruins your day.

rwidman · Sep 6, 2017

sunchaser said:
SD

Seems a good opportunity was lost to have had a conversation with the fellow to hear his point of view. When it comes to anchoring local knowledge can be quite helpful.

The tow boat guy killed that opportunity by the way he approached and the way he spoke.

And of course the OP had already been anchored there all day without a problem.

psneeld · Sep 6, 2017

It is a marked channel by definition. If a towboat guy had a trackline in his plotter, so much more so it shows that it is considered the channel there.

No one is being critical, just suggesting the other guy may have had a point even if brusk.

Whether the guy was a jerk or not...certainly subject to interpretation .....and the more one protests, etc....isnt that the saying?

Sorry you are taking it so badly, this stuff seems to happen all the time on the water everywhere I have ever been. Just take it for what you feel it is worth. Just like going by a guy on a paddleboard in the middle of the busy ICW and complaining about your 6 inch wake.

The real problem is the guy who is inventing the problem, claining stuff that either didnt happen or would be interpreted differently by others with maybe more experience on the water including non towboat guys.

As far as a dangerous and bullying manner as interpreted ...all I have to say to that is.... :rofl:

:

Yeah, call the CG because someone glared at you...

BandB · Sep 6, 2017

psneeld said:
It is a marked channel by definition. If a towboat guy had a trackline in his plotter, so much more so it shows that it is considered the channel there.

No one is being critical, just suggesting the other guy may have had a point even if brusk.

Whether the guy was a jerk or not...certainly subject to interpretation .....and the more one protests, etc....isnt that the saying?

Sorry you are taking it so badly, this stuff seems to happen all the time on the water everywhere I have ever been. Just take it for what you feel it is worth. Just like going by a guy on a paddleboard in the middle of the busy ICW and complaining about your 6 inch wake.

The real problem is the guy who is inventing the problem, claining stuff that either didnt happen or would be interpreted differently by others with maybe more experience on the water including non towboat guys.

As far as a dangerous and bullying manner as interpreted ...all I have to say to that is....:

Yeah, call the CG because someone glared at you...

Wifey B: I'll bet you've yelled at people.

I'll bet you've gone to do some tows and people about to do something stupid and you have to tell them not to. It's hard to hear over engines. Sometimes people yell instructions to their mate on their own boat if they don't have walkie talkies. :ermm:

All we know is he approached at high speed of 10-12 knots. Oh shame. And he yelled. Then the audacity to glare when he got no response to yelling. Clearly he didn't yell loud enough.

Maybe you and I tend to give him the benefit of the doubt because he's a tow captain. I do it because they generally know the area they're in better than anyone else.

I just don't get all the jumping on the dude when we have no idea what his reasoning was. Wish the OP would give him a telephone call and ask him. :hide:

psneeld · Sep 6, 2017

I give the tow boat guy the reason of doubt because there wasnt any mention of anything bad other than a loud voice and some glaring....despite one individual who made a rash, incorrect assumption and continues to defend an indefensible position....not the OP. The high speed thing? Nope.....

I spent 23 years around turbine helicopters and another 16 operating loud boats.

While I do tend to get loud, a huge part of that beyond hearing loss is I got tired of repeating myself when outside near operating machinery.

Yelling to me usually incorporates anger, being loud is a function of ambient noise to include wind in the listeners ears that can mask a lot. So yes, me conversing with another boat is usually loud, but then again, I rarely have to repeat myself.

The fun thing is years later, I have towed people and they have thanked me for giving them a bit of nautical knowledge they might not have had years before.

BandB · Sep 6, 2017

psneeld said:
Yelling to me usually incorporates anger, being loud is a function of ambient noise to include wind in the listeners ears that can mask a lot. So yes, me conversing with another boat is usually loud, but then again, I rarely have to repeat myself.

Wifey B: I couldn't hear you. What did you say? You weren't loud enough. :rofl:

Anchoring in a creek

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