2005 34 Rum Runner mid bilge leaking

Hello...

I am brand new to this and any forum. I am trying to get advice on my 2005 34 Mainship Run Runner...500 hrs on boat w twin engines...hardtop...etc. Details i suppose that arent relevant because the issue is my mid bilge has sprung a leak. Approx 1/2 gal or less a minute when the boat is moving. I keep the boat on a lift and I'm sitting aboard in the lift right now lowered in the water...and it's not leaking? At anchor the other day it was leaking? The other bilge areas are relatively dry. Mid issue only. Definitely sea water...not fresh. Do I have to rip up the entire cabin floor to remove the water tank to access the bilge to inspect? Please tell me that I don't?!

Where is your drive shaft?

They are back in the rear bilge area with engines. They are both dry. There is some type of intake in the keel of these boats...i was hoping someone had experienced something similar and there was an extremely simple fix (wishful thinking)...or at least some guidance?

Fresh or salt water?

Chesapeake Bay...salt water is getting in bilge

So you have checked to be sure that it is salt as opposed to fresh? I it is coming from the outside not the inside of the boat.

Without a history of grounding, you can expect a leak from a thruhull. If is isn't the shafts, then look to other raw water sources. Hose connections, thruhull, etc. Not terribly likely to have a hole in the hull.

it seems odd that it leaks at anchor, but not in your lift. Do the straps of your lift cover one of your intake thruhulls ? Perhaps that's why you're not leaking now ? When you were leaking, were you using something like AC or Generator that you're not using now ?

Definitely not a.c. or generator. Was not running either at anchor. I put the boat high in the lift yesterday to get a good look at the hull and keel...the intake recess on the keel has the engine and a.c. through hulls. I thought they were further forward but they are not. Those through hulls would/should leak into the rear engine bilge and that bilge is fairly dry. There should not be any hoses or through hulls in the mid bilge section of the boat according to the manuals and from what I could see with an endoscope camera. I also checked the bilge pump and hose to make sure it was not leaking back in while underway....and it was not. I feel like the keel board on the lift may have something to do with stopping it?

Trying to get boat pulled to see if I hit something. I do not recall anything? Definitely did not run aground (In this boat...but others YES). My keel has me concerned.

A suggestion made in another thread is to put down a layer of paper towels and check it frequently. Put some around each thru hull, along the keel, etc.
You may be able to get some help from the pattern of "wetness" on the paper towels. Might at least narrow it down a little.

Good info and idea. Unfortunately there is zero access under the floor and under a full length water tank. And there is no through hull in this bilge compartment? Truly the weirdest and hardest to access issue I have ever seen. The water is coming from aft to forward...so I know the leak is not in the bow and is behind the small bilge panel and behind the bilge pump.

If no thru hulls in the wet compartment it must be coming thru a limber hole in a stringer from another compartment.
Stuff some paper towels in those as well to find the source.
Is the head seawater?
Maybe leak in the hose someplace and it's traveling?
Just guessing?

Will give it a shot. Engine/ rear bilge stringer hole is visible. Thank you.

Eric,
My P-34 is the same model and engine set up as yours so I would think everything is relatively the same. However, there is something about your post that is confusing me so I cant really picture your issue. My forward bilge is the area under the water tank, mid is between the engines, and rear is by the rudder posts. The mid and rear are connected by the trough under the generator but I am not sure if the forward and mid are connected. Do you have a bow thruster? I know that on mine there are seacocks behind the refrigerator but they are above the waterline. Hope we will be able to help you out. Kevin

You are correct. it would be considered the forward bilge area. The boat pictured in your profile is my exact boat. I am pretty certain the mid (engine bilge) and forward bilges are connected by a small opening. I do have a bow thruster and that area is 100% dry and sealed off to the other bilges. I did not know there were through hulls behind the fridge? Will pull fridge and check those to be certain its not leaking from there. It is definitely leaking from aft to forward...I witnessed that. I was hoping someone with my same boat could tell me that there was definitely no reason to rip up the cabin floor. Consensus seems to be a leaking through hull someplace and the fridge area could possibly fit the profile because the port lift board covers a good portion of that area on the boat. I am praying that it will be that easy to access...and have a reason to drink a cold beer. GOOD INFO THANK YOU!

Eric,
Were you running the a.c. at the time? My a.c. pump is mounted just under the fuel tank in front of the starboard engine and the raw water line runs forward from there into the main cabin. On the other side in front of the port engine runs the raw water line to the head. Where is the transducer mounted? Just tossing ideas out. In the past I have stumbled across the real issue by checking other possible sources.
Kevin.

No...not running a.c...i think I am overlooking something simple. Probably through hull...hoping to check closer tonight. Truly appreciate help!!!

Might be worth checking shaft seals. I'm not able to accurately picture what you're describing as fore/mid/aft bilges and whether there are separations or limber holes...

But if you engine compartment (mid?) is at all connected to the area where shaft seals live (via limber holes?) then leaking "driftless" shaft seals could be a culprit.

-Chris

Eric,
I would like to say I truly doubt that the water tank would have to come out but anything is possible, especially when it comes to boats. Correction on the seacocks, they are not actually behind the frig they are under the bathroom sink. 2 small and 1 large, drains from the bathroom sink, kitchen sink and forward bilge pump. The thru hull is the oval port just above the waterline almost directly below the midship cleat. Sometimes I get confused because I bang my head a little to much trying to peek in all the nooks and crannies on the boat.
Kevin

I have found leaks with cardboard strips. Once it gets wet, it darkens and is easy to spot what is wet and what is not... chop up a box and lay them around the suspected area.

I'm betting your leak is forward of the mid bilge and drains to the middle when you are underway and on plane.

Eric...I know the answer. Do you have bilge pump in said compartment??? That is a rhetorical question because I know you do. Water is actually backflowing from the thru hull down the tubing back out thru the bilge pump and into the bilge.

How do I know? Because I had this exact problem in my Pilot 30. I wish I could remember the exact chain of events and how I solved the problem. But we were embarking on a long trip and we were only a few hours into it when the high water alarm went off. There was no pump back there and the "Jesus pump" pick up was significantly higher than the float switch for the alarm. Basically the water was back flowing from a bilge pump forward and the water was finding its way to that rear quarter compartment where there was no pump(except that Jesus pump).

My solution???.. check valves for all the bilge pumps. I know surveyors or ABYC would probably not like that. But it did solve the problem. Like I said, I do not remember the logic in how I solved the problem...I think I might have simply observed it coming in while underway or maybe it was just the process of elimination in that there was no other place it could be coming from.

I do remember observing the bilge pump thru hulls from the outside and notice they were partially submerged while underway. I guess enough pressure was pushing up in there causing water to flow back into the boat.. thru the bilge pump(s). In a static situation, it would have filled that compartment and the pump would have pumped it back out causing a continuous Loop. But since we were underway and the attitude of the boat was nose up, all the water ended up in the back of the boat on that back compartment. Maybe this is happening underway but not enough to set off your alarm. And then when you slow down or stop, the water flows back thru the limber holes forward.

would it be possible to plug all your limber holes so you have isolated the 3 bilges ? I'm thinking some kids "Silly Putty" or something like that. Then pour a gallon or two of colored water into each bilge to check.....that way you'd know for sure where to start looking deeper into the issue. Just a thought

Thanks all. I am digging into this further this weekend. The water is definitely not coming from any of the bilge pump lines...I already went through that little disaster a while ago with check valves failing at the same time on the aft and mid pump lines. That would be an easy one. This water is coming from another source. Thanks again and stay tuned...if I cannot figure it out I have a slot with a mechanic late next week? Hopefully.

check valves for all the bilge pumps.

Click to expand...

I would be careful of this and if you do it make sure checking the check valve is on your regular maintenance list.

I had to get some water out of forward bilge and float switch tripped, bilge pump running, water gurgling in clear tubing BUT...nothing coming out. A check valve in a difficult to see location was frozen.

ktdtx said:

I would be careful of this and if you do it make sure checking the check valve is on your regular maintenance list.

I had to get some water out of forward bilge and float switch tripped, bilge pump running, water gurgling in clear tubing BUT...nothing coming out. A check valve in a difficult to see location was frozen.

Click to expand...

I would never advocate for check valves on a bilge pump outlet....except on my own boat.... IOW, I would keep a close eye on them. I have since sold the boat and either the surveyor missed it or nothing was said to me about it.

Run water into all sink drains and flush head,work any system that uses salt water . Plug up any lmber holes with paper towels to locate water .

Eric,
Have you found the source or made any progress? Inquiring minds want to know.
Cheers,
Kevin

I inspected a MS34 like yours. The forward bilge had a little water in it which was coming from a tiny leak in the exit hose. I could not see the leak except with great patience. the water would travel along the hose and then over the check valve and in the bilge. The pressure in the hose was caused by the back check valve doing it's job. The hoses were about 10 years old and should all be replaced.

Periodically the pump would empty that bilge in an endless loop of pump-leak-drain- repeat, unless she went up on plane in which case I saw where the water ran elsewhere before it could get high enough to trigger the fwd pump.