TruFuel for Dinghy Outboard

Ethanol-Free 4-Cycle Fuel | Gas for 4-Cycle Engines | TruFuel

I am thinking of using this in a small 4 stroke outboard. Has anyone tried this? It's pricey, but I'm tired of cleaning carbs and my dinghy spends most of it's life making quick trips to the beach or hanging in the davits for months on end.

Pay the piper and be a slave to buying the stuff or just run your outboard dry or drain the carb after uses that will result in more than a couple days of inactivity.

Neither really takes that long once you get in the habit.

Do the marinas in your area not sell non-Ethanol gas?

You could do what I did, buy a propane powered outboard.

pukeanddie said:

Ethanol-Free 4-Cycle Fuel | Gas for 4-Cycle Engines | TruFuel

I am thinking of using this in a small 4 stroke outboard. Has anyone tried this? It's pricey, but I'm tired of cleaning carbs and my dinghy spends most of it's life making quick trips to the beach or hanging in the davits for months on end.

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Buy av gas at the local small airport.. about $6/7 gal, 100 octane, no ethanol
Way cheaper and the outboard will love it.
HOLLYWOOD

I'm still confused. Almost all the marinas I've been to sell ethanol free gas in the $3.60 to $4 range. Typically about a dollar more than it would cost with ethanol. That's the only way most marinas sell gas.

BandB said:

Do the marinas in your area not sell non-Ethanol gas?

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Dunno about Boston, but they don't around here.

-Chris

ranger42c said:

Dunno about Boston, but they don't around here.

-Chris

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That's one of those strange MD laws. On the Eastern shore (Delmarva) we have ethanol free fuel most everywhere. Apparently, they can't sell it on the Western shore. Go to Ocean City and 92 octane ethol free is sold at the dock.

Ted

You've probably heard all the stuff about miracle additives yada yada yada....
I've always been a skeptic.....Until I tried this stuff. I've let engines sit a year without draining and they often start on the first or second pull... Buy the big bottle and treat your dinghy fuel can with an ounce or two. You'll end up using it in everything...

http://www.amazon.com/Mechanic-in-a-Bottle-24oz/dp/B00CHS25OW/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1435328320&sr=8-1&keywords=mechanic+in+a+bottle

Apparently these are the counties where reformulated gas is mandated. Certain counties in CA, CT, DE, DC, IL, IN, MD, NJ, NY, PA, TX, VA, and WI.

RFG Areas | Fuels and Fuels Addtives | US EPA

I had no idea as we don't have the issue in FL, nor anywhere on the east coast south of VA. And yesterday we fueled out Ribs twice but in Ocean City MD where it's not a problem.

A huge suggestion to Active Captain and Waterway Guide. Specify Ethanol vs. Ethanol Free. You mention ethanol free in some cases but it needs to be as much separated as Diesel is from Gas.

Here is a site of ethanol free stations.

Ethanol-free gas stations in the U.S. and Canada

Obviously the aviation fuel suggestion works if you can get it.

Then there are the various treatments that I know nothing about having not realized this was such an issue until last night.

hollywood8118 said:

Buy av gas at the local small airport.. about $6/7 gal, 100 octane, no ethanol
Way cheaper and the outboard will love it.
HOLLYWOOD

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With all due respect to Hwood, I would avoid Avgas. With regular use you will have a buildup of lead oxides in your cylinder head and likely foul spark plugs prematurely. The "100 Octane" sound good emotionally but high octane fuel is an advantage only in high compression engines. You are going to have less efficiency in a lower compression engine. You should run the lowest octane fuel that will run without detonation (pinging/knocking). The extra money spent on Avgas is wasted...other than the fact that it will be ethanol free. In the swamplands around my neck of the woods there are many small service stations that carry non-ethanol motor fuels. There is a website that locates such stations across the US...cannot recall the name but a google search for non-ethanol fuel will likely pull up a few search apps.

edit- pm me for the website...unless administators clear me to post the name/link for the pure gas locator site.

Uhhh...did not read B's post completely as his link is the site I used to find fuel for my outboard boats.

BandB said:

I'm still confused. Almost all the marinas I've been to sell ethanol free gas in the $3.60 to $4 range. Typically about a dollar more than it would cost with ethanol. That's the only way most marinas sell gas.

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Not in MA. Impossible to buy Ethanol from a pump. A few places sell pails of high octane racing fuel.

"A few places sell pails of high octane racing fuel."

Many racing fuel formulations employ ethanol as an oxygenating agent. I would add a fuel stabilizer designed for ethanol blends to your local pump gas and call it a day. I try to use ethanol free fuel in my outboard but sometimes it is not practical and just add stabilizer. No fuel related issues in 900 hr.s on a pair of Merc 225 optimax and 925 hr on a Yamadog 250.

pukeanddie said:

Not in MA. Impossible to buy Ethanol from a pump. A few places sell pails of high octane racing fuel.

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Brewer doesn't even have non ethanol?

We're fortunate in that our Weber engines in our RIB's are ok with ethanol up to 15%. Now we still prefer non-ethanol and we get 91 octane or higher when available. The only outboards we own never leave Florida.

rardoin is absolutely correct. AvGas is blended for large-bore, long-stroke, low RPM engines which run at high altitude. Its sale is also supposed to be limited to airplanes. Research the octane that your outboard manufacturer recommends for your motor (generally 87-90) and that's all you need. More octane only slows down the flame front and prevents early, compression ignition (detonation.) We had a saying in racing: "Enough octane is enough octane."

And my stock answer. What does your outboard motor manufacturer say to do? I'd go to their pages and do what they say. Here's what Yamaha says:

Yamaha Offers Help with Ethanol Fuels | Yamaha Outboards

Yup Av gas is not good. Some guys tried that on ultralights. Lots and lots of soot. Very dirty running.

If you want small bottles of good gas mix up a few gallons of reg gas w Stabil in the mix.

What I'd like for my little Yamadog 2hp is a bottle (bottles) that works like those things the mechs use on batteries to top off electrolyte. The fluid stops draining down when the fluid level in what you're filling reaches the end of the nozzle of your dispenser. It's hard for me to pour fuel into the top of the little 2hp w/o spilling and in this case it goes directly into the water.

manyboats said:

What I'd like for my little Yamadog 2hp is a bottle (bottles) that works like those things the mechs use on batteries to top off electrolyte. The fluid stops draining down when the fluid level in what you're filling reaches the end of the nozzle of your dispenser. It's hard for me to pour fuel into the top of the little 2hp w/o spilling and in this case it goes directly into the water.

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Try this...
Haven't spilled a drop since I bought it!

Amazon.com: No-Spill 1405 2-1/2-Gallon Poly Gas Can (CARB Compliant): Patio, Lawn & Garden

Steve,
That's great but may be too big for what I described above. Of course I could just put a gallon or so in it. It's a long reach in the big canoe back to the aft end of the little two horse where the filler is. We should get one just for all the lawnmowers and related stuff at home. I most often pour the gas for Chris. But she likes to do things herself.

BandB said:

Brewer doesn't even have non ethanol?

We're fortunate in that our Weber engines in our RIB's are ok with ethanol up to 15%. Now we still prefer non-ethanol and we get 91 octane or higher when available. The only outboards we own never leave Florida.

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The website that shows non-ethanol suppliers used to list several near here, but they were outdated listing. One "gas station" had been turned into a fast food, for example. (There's probably a pun in there somewhere, just waiting to get out!)

My experience with ethanol -- FWIW -- is that as long as the engine is rated for it, it's only a problem if I don't use the engine often enough. And of course our dinghy only gets sporadic use. Hence the parts about running the carbs dry after each use, etc. as mitigating approach. Usually, I'd let gas (with ethanol) sit no longer than 3 weeks, and after that it's likely toast. Works in cars, not in small one-cylinder 2-strokes, so it gets recycled.

Additives never seemed to do any good. Tried many, no change in results; the ethanol gas is suspect after 2 weeks non-use, likely toast after 3.

OTOH, on longer vacations, lots o' gallons go through fine. Letting it sit unused seemed to be the culprit, in our case.


All of that is especially true with small lawn things, like leaf blowers and so forth. (A 32V battery-powered blower is working better than a small gas blower ever did.)

Last year we got a new 15-hp 4-stroke 2-cylinder fuel injected outboard, and so far haven't had as much of a problem... possibly due to the closed system. OTOH, I don't have enough time with it yet to fully evaluate... so I can only say "It's promising. Maybe."

-Chris

manyboats said:

Steve,
That's great but may be too big for what I described above. Of course I could just put a gallon or so in it. It's a long reach in the big canoe back to the aft end of the little two horse where the filler is. We should get one just for all the lawnmowers and related stuff at home. I most often pour the gas for Chris. But she likes to do things herself.

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Try the 1.25 gallon size:
http://www.amazon.com/No-Spill-1415..._sim_86_3?ie=UTF8&refRID=1RN6BK3D95FHCNMXXNCQ

ranger42c said:

The website that shows non-ethanol suppliers used to list several near here, but they were outdated listing. One "gas station" had been turned into a fast food, for example. (There's probably a pun in there somewhere, just waiting to get out!)

My experience with ethanol -- FWIW -- is that as long as the engine is rated for it, it's only a problem if I don't use the engine often enough. And of course our dinghy only gets sporadic use. Hence the parts about running the carbs dry after each use, etc. as mitigating approach. Usually, I'd let gas (with ethanol) sit no longer than 3 weeks, and after that it's likely toast. Works in cars, not in small one-cylinder 2-strokes, so it gets recycled.

Additives never seemed to do any good. Tried many, no change in results; the ethanol gas is suspect after 2 weeks non-use, likely toast after 3.

OTOH, on longer vacations, lots o' gallons go through fine. Letting it sit unused seemed to be the culprit, in our case.


All of that is especially true with small lawn things, like leaf blowers and so forth. (A 32V battery-powered blower is working better than a small gas blower ever did.)

Last year we got a new 15-hp 4-stroke 2-cylinder fuel injected outboard, and so far haven't had as much of a problem... possibly due to the closed system. OTOH, I don't have enough time with it yet to fully evaluate... so I can only say "It's promising. Maybe."

-Chris

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Each outboard manufacturer is well aware of the ethanol issues and they have made recommendations of how to maintain and run with E10. I really feel if one follows those recommendations they will have minimal issues. I simply say listen to the engine manufacturer and what they say for your engine model and age. Most of them today see little issue with 91 octane or higher E10. They also do have guidelines for gas sitting any period of time. They also recommend the additives to use if needed. There's no need beyond that to panic or chase around searching for other solutions if a non-ethanol provider isn't handy.

Well, we're lucky at home that there is virtually no ethanol on the water. We were also lucky to have just been in Ocean City which has no ethanol. But our RIB's have Weber engines and if we need to fuel with E10, we'll just make sure per the manufacturer to use 91 octane or higher and recognize we may get slightly poorer "mileage".

To the original question. Here in NJ only ethanol gas is sold. After gumming up the injectors a few times I tried the cans you found. Works great, but the price wasn't worth it. Easier to pull the fuel line and run the engine dry.

BandB said:

Each outboard manufacturer is well aware of the ethanol issues and they have made recommendations of how to maintain and run with E10. I really feel if one follows those recommendations they will have minimal issues. I simply say listen to the engine manufacturer and what they say for your engine model and age. Most of them today see little issue with 91 octane or higher E10. They also do have guidelines for gas sitting any period of time. They also recommend the additives to use if needed.

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Yep, got all that. The motor was certified for E-10. Memorized the 5-hp/2-stroke manual, followed meticulously. No joy.

Didn't seem to be a problem with the engine; just the fuel breaks down too quickly when it sits unused in our environment. And I think low HP 1-cylinder motors can't really power through any water build-up. And BTW, the straight ethanol layer will really race an engine!

Faster "recycling" worked easily enough, though. And an external fuel-water separator would likely help, too... although in the meantime, faster "recycling" was, in effect, a manual fuel-water separation.

That's high on my list of installs, though, once I improve the way the battery and the fuel tank (for this new 4-stroke) sits in the dinghy.

-Chris

Down south here we have a lot of ValveTech fuel. Most everyone thinks it's none ethanol fuel. It does not say on the pump anywhere what it is. If you go to their website and dig deep enough you will find its E10 with lots of additives.

If it does not say Non-Ethanol on the pump or the marina does not post a sign that says their fuels are Ethanol free it's got Ethanol in it.