Navigator 42 w/Volvos

Greetings Everyone!

Well, time passes as time does and it looks like Bess and I **MAY** get back into the boating lifestyle. We had no idea we would miss it so much. We decided that we wanted something a bit bigger and faster to suit our still-working situation. Yes, we know we won't technically be trawler owners anymore, buy hey... Whatever.

We have our eye on a Navigator 42 and have a few (okay, maybe more than a few) questions about it. Skinny Dippin' was the technical equivalent of a '65 Mustang. This Navigator is going to be way more modern with way more systems, wires, and fiddly-bits that could fail and I am feeling a bit paranoid about it. I guess the best thing is to bullet-point the questions so y'all can cut-n-paste answers as needed. Here goes:

1. What is your opinion of these boats?
2. The company is out of business (China-owned now and not shipping to US). I had hoped, when we started looking at this, that buying a boat that still has a factory would be a huge plus. I can't really find a Navigator-specific forum and worry about that. I had hoped to talk to the builders, get wiring diagrams, service manuals, etc. but that seems to be out. However, I wondered with the large number of member we have in the PNW or left coast in general and that being the haven for these boats, if someone could direct us to a FORMER Navigator dealer that might have this stuff (and opinions) we could get?
3. It has two Volvo TAM D63 motors. 318 h.p. each. Any info from the group about these motors? I have read mixed reviews. I know Volvo parts are expensive, but if they are solid and reliable, who needs parts
4. How do they handle in rougher seas? Specifically like the chop of shallower waters like Pamlico Sound and also the long and steep waves offshore.
5. We have not had twin engines before. on a 42', should we consider adding a bow thruster? I guess I could wait to find that out, but hey... while I am asking

We think this is a really good fit for us, but want to do a little due diligence before we step into liquid. Thanks for reading... Hope y'all can help.


Tom-

P.S. *NOTE TO MODS* I know this should be in the manufacturer's sub-forum, but I wanted to get the west coast request out to a lager audience. Give it a few days or a week to soak here and I will put in a request to have it moved to it's proper place. Thanks!

Tom.B said:

The company is out of business (China-owned now and not shipping to US). I had hoped, when we started looking at this, that buying a boat that still has a factory would be a huge plus. I can't really find a Navigator-specific forum and worry about that. I had hoped to talk to the builders, get wiring diagrams, service manuals, etc. but that seems to be out. However, I wondered with the large number of member we have in the PNW or left coast in general and that being the haven for these boats, if someone could direct us to a FORMER Navigator dealer that might have this stuff (and opinions) we could get?

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Are you sure about that?

Private equity group acquires Navigator Yachts | Trade Only Today

Yep... Already changed hands again. That article is over a year old. It didn't last.

Well, funny how they closed up shop with no press releases or anything showing up in trade publications. The 2013 press release sounded kind of positive but I guess a press release and $10 bucks will buy you a cup of coffee at Starbuck's.

They may not be totally "out of business" but they have moved all operations to China. And the previous Navigator forum appears to be shut down.

Be advised, VOLVO does not support "legacy" engines, (engines that are no longer bein' manufactured. Parts, at any price could be hard to find.

ancora said:

Be advised, VOLVO does not support "legacy" engines, (engines that are no longer bein' manufactured. Parts, at any price could be hard to find.

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Well... Now THERE is something to consider and ask about. Thanks.

Greetings,
Mr T. I didn't want to say anything to pee in your cornflakes but I would NEVER buy a Volvo engine in spite of their stellar reputation. Parts may be atrociously expensive or as alluded to, UNAVAILABLE at any price. You say you will ask about that but can the person giving you the verbal guarantee of "You'll always be able to get those parts" refund the purchase price of your boat 10 years down the road when you CAN'T get "those" parts or pay for a re-power? If so, and you get in in writing with cash in an escrow account, by all means proceed.

I don't know that specific model, but there are quite a few of the 48' to 52' models in my club and the scuttlebutt is that the hulls are very lightly constructed. Attractive and open interior design but not well built.

The engineering info is exactly the kind of thing where corners were cut.

They are pretty boats. There is a larger one at our dock. Very nice layout and nice looking boats.

I have heard they are lightly constructed as well but I don't put allot of confidence in that. I've heard lots of things about Bayliners as well.

I would look and see if there have been any hull failures, or other major issues. That will be much more telling than internet lore which is suspect at best.

Don't know much about Volvo engines though, but the boats sure look nice.

I presume you are not referring to this Navigator 42 Tom…

Navigator Boats

On the other hand, seeing you said…

We decided that we wanted something a bit bigger and faster to suit our still-working situation. Yes, we know we won't technically be trawler owners anymore, buy hey... Whatever.

Maybe you should consider this…

So, I have done a little due diligence over the past couple of days and found out a few things.

Firstly, I asked a surveyor whom we have worked with several times to do a walk-thru. He spent an hour on the boat yesterday and was looking for any "red flag" items we should know before entering into a contract to buy. He came away pretty happy with the way the boat had been maintained. The biggest bullet point was that he said it didn't look like it was "rode hard and put away wet". No leaky spot, no rusty motors, solid hull and stringers... etc.

Secondly, I called an ex dealer of these boats in Seattle and talked to a guy that has been in the biz for 35 years. He had a lot of good things to say about the build quality and the overall engineering. I was looking to see if there were manuals or service books I could get from them. He was a wealth of information and he said he would be happy to talk to me again about it if I had any questions.

Finally, I spent some calling diesel mechanics in the area to get professional opinions about the Volvo motors. Of course the biggest thing was the price of parts, but Cat parts are very expensive too... but hey... all boat crap is expensive, so that doesn't bother me all that much. However, they all said the motors are very solid and it is the bolt-on stuff that marinized the motor that needs attention. I have a list of things to look at and questions to ask the owner about the routine maintenance he has done. I plan to hire one of them to do an engine survey if we get that far.

We are going down to take it for a ride with the current owner tomorrow to help us decide if she is a good fit. The boat really does "check all the boxes" of what we are looking for (well... it missed one or two), but we aren't sold yet.

More to come. Maybe.

Tom, a few suggestions:

• Check boatdiesel archives on specific engine and query the experts with a post as to specific engine issues.
• Cold call a Volvo dealer and ask him availability, price and delivery on a few key marinization items such as after cooler, HXers, high pressure fuel pump
• Many Volvos smoke, watch this one on a cold start and look and finger test at transom for soot
• The Navigator hull to deck joint at the transom drops way down to near the water line. Look inside the lazarette for leaks.
• Ask the owner to do a full throttle underway test to see if max rated RPM plus about 25 can be achieved
• Last but not least, ask owner the date of last after cooler servicing.

(Forgot to mention that I did renew my Boatdiesel.com membership.)

I'm assuming then that the Californian/Navigator website is completely outdated and was the former owner? Is that true?

As to the OP's questions. If it's surveyed and comes out ok, I wouldn't worry about the quality of the boat. As to the Volvo's, same emphasis on survey, but also I'd expect the price to be significantly reduced by Volvo engines. If so, I wouldn't summarily reject them.

I'm guessing Crow's Nest or Pier One is who you spoke to?

I think it's a good boat probably, even if not a great boat. When I think Pamlico sound and the waves offshore there, I immediately think Hatteras, but I'm guessing that's a higher price range. A 42' Navigator can handle more than you and guests can, but there will be many days in your area that getting out and especially going outside are just not recommended. A little more boat in size or capability reduces those days. On the other hand I see many here with the bigger or more capable boats and they don't get out on the slightly worse days either. I just thing of a Navigator as a west coast boat and not a Pamlico, Ocracoke, Hatteras boat.

Correct... The official website and even the "owners group" sites and forum are dead. You are also correct in that I talked to Vick Parcells at Crow's nest. Nice guy.

Tom.B said:

Correct... The official website and even the "owners group" sites and forum are dead. You are also correct in that I talked to Vick Parcells at Crow's nest. Nice guy.

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Actually the website is still alive. Navigator Yachts ? Premium luxury yachts manufacturer

It even still lists Crow's nest as a dealer.

Not the first time there's been a sale and the website got lost in the process with the new owners not taking it over.

Yes, but when you speak to Crows Nest, they say they are no longer dealers and all operations have been moved to mainland China. But Crows Nest people were very helpful!

That's neither here nor there really. It does check all of the boxes. And should make for fun coastal cruising. We are going to see it tomorrow, so wish us luck!

A couple we met last year in JAX have a Navigator. We've been on the boat several times and like the lay out/build. They're based in CT where they spend the summers and winter in JAX. They do mostly the outside when they do the seasonal change. We'll keep our fingers crossed for you that things go well.

BandB said:

Actually the website is still alive. Navigator Yachts ? Premium luxury yachts manufacturer

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When I say "dead" I kinda meant that it no longer had any current information on it. Tried the phone numbers and they are disconnected. Email gets no reply either. But like you mentioned, the website probably fell between the cracks during the couple of times it changed hands in the past few years.

We'll post some pics of the test run we make tomorrow.

Tom.B said:

When I say "dead" I kinda meant that it no longer had any current information on it. Tried the phone numbers and they are disconnected. Email gets no reply either. But like you mentioned, the website probably fell between the cracks during the couple of times it changed hands in the past few years.

We'll post some pics of the test run we make tomorrow.

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Lot's of those type websites floating around. Northern Marine hasn't changed theirs. Christensen hasn't been updated.

Tom and Bess,
You all have talked yourselves into that boat. Pretty much you better decide what you can negotiate.

When I was looking and yapping with diesel mechanics, I consistently heard that Volvos were "high-winders" that their RPMs at cruise were higher than other engines, and may have a "shorter" life cycle. Basic mechanics doesn't scare you, Tom (like it does me) so I shouldn't think that the normal exterior stuff like heat exchangers, piping, and injectors should be a labor cost as much as it is a parts cost. Not sure the hours on the engines (?) or the make and hours on the generator (?). Generators can also be costly, so inspect it closely.

90% of the problems a boat can have, I've seen you guys fix, so you should be fine. This next boat will be way more thirstier ($) than Skinny Dippin'. Be ready ($). Fuel is down from a few years ago, however .

Enjoy!

Hey Ben!

We actually haven't yet talked ourselves into it. We need to do some more shopping!!

Take a look at the Hatteras 42 Motor Yachts, with and without cockpit. If I was shopping for a boat in that range that's the first thing I would look at. Engines and boats still extremely well supported by the manufacturers, great owner's forum and parts source. We've known three couples with these boats that have cruised them extensively and it's a nice layout and very sea worthy. I happen to like Navigators from my west coast days, but with the change in ownership and the paucity of them here in the southeast, would steer clear.

Besslb said:

Hey Ben!

We actually haven't yet talked ourselves into it. We need to do some more shopping!!

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Tom will start pining. And I know you are loving that big beam and power. It takes a few days, but we'll be seeing you out there by Memorial Day!

Please don't wake me with those 25 knots!