Frustrated with yacht brokers

GalaxyGirl said:

It wouldn't matter about Mike. Mike can set up the showing and I get to view the boat. I highly doubt that the owner will refuse cash because the buyer isn't Mike.

You don't take me serious, as, you don't really think that I am going to buy a boat. I would expect that from others, but it surprises me coming from you, Phil.

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I meant to say I would not take you seriously EITHER. I do not mean to say I don't think you are serious that you want to buy a boat. 17 years ago we where having the same difficulties and situation. So I can relate. It took us 2+ years and it was bind luck my wife saw the Eagle.

GG
any boat in the size you are looking at will be documented with the USCG. These documentations are public record. Why not contact the owner of the boat directly and tell them you have tried to call their broker repeatedly and they won't return your call. I bet they return your call then!!
John

Blue Heron said:

Wish I could recommend a buyer broker with integrity. But I cannot.

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Really?

I'm calling red hearing. Snipe hunt anyone?

Phil Fill said:

I meant to say I would not take you seriously EITHER. I do not mean to say I don't think you are serious that you want to buy a boat. 17 years ago we where having the same difficulties and situation. So I can relate. It took us 2+ years and it was bind luck my wife saw the Eagle.

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Sorry Phil, I knew that I had to have misunderstood that comment. You have always been very supportive and I appreciate it.

johnma said:

GG
any boat in the size you are looking at will be documented with the USCG. These documentations are public record. Why not contact the owner of the boat directly and tell them you have tried to call their broker repeatedly and they won't return your call. I bet they return your call then!!
John

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John, that's a great suggestion. Thanks.

Daddyo said:

Really?

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Really. I had a less than satisfactory experience with my buyer broker. Therefore I cannot make a recommendation.

Daddyo said:

I'm calling red hearing. Snipe hunt anyone?

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Sure, why not?

So what is recommended for new boat buyers then?

How far out should I contact insurance companies?

My spouse and I will pay cash for a boat in 7 years. I have no issue with coordinating with an insurance company prior, but see no benefit in pre-financing with a bank as we will not be financing anything. We have a running list of want we want, but recognize we have to get on some boats to refine it. We are going to Kema, TX next month to look at boats. Our plan had been to call a broker/dealer and go look at some listings, from reading this thread it seems we may run into issues. We will also walk some docks and politely look at boats from a respectful distance.

I will not misrepresent my intentions when speaking to a broker/dealer. We are quite landlocked, the “plan” is to visit a marina once a year. When we get closer to the target date, we will do some “teach me” charters.

Oh and *hello* to all!

syfer said:

So what is recommended for new boat buyers then?

How far out should I contact insurance companies?

My spouse and I will pay cash for a boat in 7 years. I have no issue with coordinating with an insurance company prior, but see no benefit in pre-financing with a bank as we will not be financing anything. We have a running list of want we want, but recognize we have to get on some boats to refine it. We are going to Kema, TX next month to look at boats. Our plan had been to call a broker/dealer and go look at some listings, from reading this thread it seems we may run into issues. We will also walk some docks and politely look at boats from a respectful distance.

I will not misrepresent my intentions when speaking to a broker/dealer. We are quite landlocked, the “plan” is to visit a marina once a year. When we get closer to the target date, we will do some “teach me” charters.

Oh and *hello* to all!

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I said it before and I will say it again. Weather you plan on paying cash or not, it is best to have a financing/bank and even finance some of it as the bank has pre approved surveyors list, they will give you an idea of the value they will finance, and they will make sure the deal goes through smoothly and correctly. Also the changes are that you will want to change/up grade and then there are surprises, so you do not want to use all your funds buying a boat. You can finance boats, but you can not finance up grades/repairs and surprises. So there are a plus for using a bank/finance. You do not need to talk to an insurance compnay until you are ready to buy the boat.

You might be surprised what you end of buying. When you say we does that mean the wife/SO is 100% in agreement? There is nothing wrong with walking the docks, and talking to other boaters. Also make sure you walk through the yards so you know what boats look like below the water line. I let people in gates and show them the Eagle all the time. Boaters like to talk about their boats! 90% of the theft is from the water not the dock.

You probably will miss represent yourselves at times, if you do not have the courses, knowledge and experience, especially if its a large and expensive boat. So take boating courses, maybe even buy a smaller boat for experience.

Thank you for the response. “We” does mean we are in agreement, we are fortunate that when there are differing opinions, we have always been good at compromising. Part of our plan includes having funds set aside for upgrades, repairs and any other unanticipated costs. I’ll add visiting yards to our trip next month. We did have a very small boat, though we sold it recently as we are whittling down possessions now so it is not overwhelming later.

I am %100 on board we will need more experience before we buy. Our youngest graduates in a few years, so we will have more leeway on gaining some hands on experience and/or courses then.

Leave a message asking to call back because you have "great news!"

We did our boat search 7 years ago. Prior to buying "Auriga" our 47ft Selene trawler, I had owned 3 boats: a 16ft Glastron ski boat; a 23ft Bayliner;; and a 21 trailer fishing boat. It was a big step up!! I had crewed extensively on large sailboats and even had a stint on a minesweeper courtesy of the RN. Despite the fact that the economy was good in 2006, I had no problem lining up about 30 boats to see in a 5 day trip to Florida. We worked with one "buyer's broker" in Fort Lauderdale who arranged for us to see a good selection of boats, some that I had previously identified on Yachtworld, some that he contributed to the mix. We also traveled to other parts of the Florida East Coast and West Coast to meet with other brokers showing individual vessels that we had spec'd on YW. In all we saw some 30 boats and ended up buying the Selene that we had seen in Lauderdale on our first day.
My point is simple. I do not understand the problem you are experiencing. The economy is much worse now than in 2006. There are lots of boats for sale. Brokers must be interested to sell boats. It is hard to understand why somebody would blow you off without reason.
I would identify a local (Boston area) broker to use as a buyer's broker. Go sit down with him/her and explain what you want and tell them how much cash you want spend. Identify a few boats you want to see on YW and let the buyers broker set up the viewings.
I do not think you will get far with an insurance company until you have a specific vessel to insure. But be prepared for another big problem. Insurance companies want owners who have experience. I was able to put together a credible resume with my sailing, prior boats, and the USPS boating course.
You appear to lack any credible experience. this will make it next to impossible in my opinion for you obtain insurance on a 70-80ft vessel that does not have a full-time qualified captain.

syfer said:

So what is recommended for new boat buyers then?

How far out should I contact insurance companies?

My spouse and I will pay cash for a boat in 7 years. I have no issue with coordinating with an insurance company prior, but see no benefit in pre-financing with a bank as we will not be financing anything. We have a running list of want we want, but recognize we have to get on some boats to refine it. We are going to Kema, TX next month to look at boats. Our plan had been to call a broker/dealer and go look at some listings, from reading this thread it seems we may run into issues. We will also walk some docks and politely look at boats from a respectful distance.

I will not misrepresent my intentions when speaking to a broker/dealer. We are quite landlocked, the “plan” is to visit a marina once a year. When we get closer to the target date, we will do some “teach me” charters.

Oh and *hello* to all!

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You are not going to have a problem.

Call a broker and talk about the boat your interested in. Go look at the boat. Sometimes (often times) the broker is local to the boat. Show up at his office if your local and discuss the boat.

GG is having a problem for several reasons. I for one believe she is ready, willing, and able, but I'm probably in the minority here. I know its gender bias but shes a single parent, and a girl. Few brokers will be taking her seriously. My opinion is that they will be losing out on a good sale, but thats just my opinion.

ksanders said:

I know its gender bias .

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It is unfair to GG to say it is gender bias. A PM or phone call or two on her part could open all sorts of doors. I'm willing to help, but only if she can demonstrate:

• competency,
• dedication,
• earnestness,
• financial wherewithal,
• and wisdom to be in the big boat buying game.

You signed on to Trawler Forum and Cruisers Forum in September, 2012. That's getting close to a year. You have made close to 500 posts and still don't appear to be any closer to your goal. Step back and take a look. As many have said you will not find your boat on the forums. From memory, your actually haven't actually looked at many boats if any.

Lot's of good advise here, get on the docks and find boats to look at. While I know it can take some time to find the "right" boat, you should have by now narrowed the choices down considerably to the point brokers can help you. If you haven't, that is not the brokers fault.

Given what appears to be your reluctance to actually get on board boats of the type you may be interested in, I am:

<----- that far -----> from calling this whole thing nonsense.

Take that any way you want, but it is meant in the best spirit.

I suspect a big factor here is in the size of vessel she is interested in. How many TF members know of anybody who has ever purchased a 70-80ft vessel as their first boat??? It must be a big credibility gap with brokers.

Chrisjs said:

I suspect a big factor here is in the size of vessel she is interested in. How many TF members know of anybody who has ever purchased a 70-80ft vessel as their first boat??? It must be a big credibility gap with brokers.

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Lots of them, most bought even larger boats. What does any of that have to do with it anything?

If someone has the desire and the cash they can buy boats of all sizes all day long without banks or brokers. I would advise against a first-timer not using a broker on their side of the deal but most of the warnings and advice so far seem a bit hysterical and I don't mean funny hysterical.

What does it have to do with it??
Kind of like showing up at the Maserati dealership in a Lada!!
I suspect that very few people with no boating experience just show up and buy a 80ft boat , no matter what you think.

Trawler people are notoriously slow to buy. They are very deliberate and detailed in their requirements as opposed to the typical impulse buyer. They can take years to make a decision. There are good brokers right here on TF that understand that, and realize that lime today may pay off in the future. There are also other good brokers out there. Some will keep you in their follow up for years.

I am also a real estate developer of condos, townhomes, planned mixed use developments, and light commercial projects. When I was doing my own marketing, I would usually hold an open house on Sunday afternoons. It didn't take long to figure out that I was the entertainment for many people. Their hobby was touring open houses and asking questions. I knew many by name. Others were looking for ideas for their homes or ones they were building. They were not shy about asking where did you get this, what is the number of this paint color, or could you give us the plans to this home. Of course I had to be pleasant to everyone, but soon learned to identify those that were serious. Some would even try to impress me with we have money. We can buy what we want. I don't remember selling anything to any of those.

First of all a lady, 5 children, and a grandmother is not the usual prospect that walks in a brokers office. The idea of having your banker write a letter of introduction telling the business relationship and your qualifications to buy could help. Also, be honest and tell where you are in the process. Enlisting a buyers broker is a good idea, but stay faithful to that broker. Let the broker lead the way. Explain that it could take some time to find what you want, but if he or she is willing you are.

You have received good advice and intentions from the group at TF. There are plenty of answers suggested. Sift through those, and find the ones that fit your situation and personality.

Oh yeah, if went to some of the brokerages on 17th Street in Fort Lauderdale looking for a superyacht, I would be laughed out of the office. I don't have that kind of financial statement, and few do. However, they recognize who is a prospect, or they don't sell those superyachts.

To the tune of London Bridges Falling Down...

Bla - Bla - Bla - Bla ...

BLA_BLA_BLA

BLA - BLA - BLA

BLA - BLA - BLA


Bla - Bla - Bla - Bla ...

BLA_BLA_BLA

BLA - BLA – BLAAAAA....... BLAAAAAAAA!

Just sayen... with complete respect of course everyone, and, meant to be related to nothing but my short story on post 53

TedB_BC says it straight-up on post 76. Others have said it straight up in other ways.

As often quoted from movie "Jerry Maquire" - Show Me The Money$$$$

I believe there is probably at least some substance to all these months of many hundred postings... some how anyway... but just how - I'm simply not sure! :lol:

Its an awful lot easier to tell if someone has the means to buy a quarter to half million dollar boat in person, sitting in front of the broker in his office. Little things.

Take for example the couple that wanders in wearing cutoff shorts and sandals, possibly some stubble on the guys face. First glance says that they are not capable of that kind of purchase.

But a smart broker will look closer. Is that an Omega, Bretling, Rolex, or other quality watch on his wrist? The Gal is dressed plainly but that might be a couple carat solitare diamond on her finger, and another couple carat solitars in her ears. without looking gaudy a gal can easily have 50K+ in diamonds on at any given time.

Folks do not need to be dressed to the nines to be prospective buyers, but the little things add up faster than any words out of their mouths. In general gals are easier to judge than guys. Guys often dont care how they look, but very few gals with the wherewithall to make that kind of purchase will be far from some serious diamonds.

Over the phone its gotta be a crap shoot. You get calls from dreamers every day. Its impossible to tell the prospective customers from the "entertainment shoppers" In person is another story altogether.

ksanders said:

. Is that an Omega, Bretling, Rolex, or other quality watch on his wrist? .

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Not always is a rich guy or gal wearing a Rolex. The standard yacht broker question, and a good one, is "Do you own a boat now?"

Most if not all serious potential buyers for +$500K vessels establish their credentials early so both sides know it is not a waste of eithers' time. Creds count more than baubles.

I got a call early one Sunday morning. It was from a very young sounding young lady. She said that they were sitting in front of one of my homes that was a 40 minute drive for me. They wanted to see it now as they had a flight to catch. It was in an upscale neighborhood with pricey homes. I drug out of bed, and drove over. They appeared to be just a couple of kids driving a Pontiac Transam from N. Dakota. I thought Oh boy I got out of bed for this. They looked at the house, said that it was what they wanted, but they had to call the young lady's father. They took the house and paid cash. So, you have to show if you are going to sell.

On the other hand, I had a call one Easter morning for a doctor moving from New York. He said he was leaving town and wanted to see the house now as he had an early flight. I went over. He liked it and said write it up. We went back to the office. He signed and gave me an ernest money deposit. He stopped payment on the check next business day. You win some----you lose some. A brokers life is not all it's cracked up to be.

Chrisjs said:

What does it have to do with it??
Kind of like showing up at the Maserati dealership in a Lada!!
I suspect that very few people with no boating experience just show up and buy a 80ft boat , no matter what you think.

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Those folks usually buy much larger stuff. They are not interested in boating experience, they are interested in having a boating experience.

As one who has an office in one of those brokerage houses at a much more upscale location than 17th St. I can promise that you won't be laughed out until you prove yourself laughable. You will be treated with courtesy and respect. If you can't afford the boat then you won't be shown any but no one in the business will laugh at someone they know nothing about. I can assure you that you can't tell who the players are by just looking at them as they walk in the door.

TedB_BC said:

You signed on to Trawler Forum and Cruisers Forum in September, 2012. That's getting close to a year. You have made close to 500 posts and still don't appear to be any closer to your goal. Step back and take a look. As many have said you will not find your boat on the forums. From memory, your actually haven't actually looked at many boats if any.

Lot's of good advise here, get on the docks and find boats to look at. While I know it can take some time to find the "right" boat, you should have by now narrowed the choices down considerably to the point brokers can help you. If you haven't, that is not the brokers fault.

Given what appears to be your reluctance to actually get on board boats of the type you may be interested in, I am:

<----- that far -----> from calling this whole thing nonsense.

Take that any way you want, but it is meant in the best spirit.

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I'm glad that some of you doubt me. All the more fun when you're proven wrong :lol:

Galaxy, stick to your wheel. You can do this.

GalaxyGirl said:

I'm glad that some of you doubt me. All the more fun when you're proven wrong :lol:

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Good God - One can only hope!
As Always... Best Luck!

RickB said:

I can assure you that you can't tell who the players are by just looking at them as they walk in the door.

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I did some business with the son of the CEO of one of the largest corporations in their industry in the world. Looked like a strung out hippie when I first met him. He turned out to be a sharp businessman like his dad. Did some business with a plain looking lady that was well mannered but not impressive. She turned out to be the wife of a famous movie star. I never did meet him in person.

You can't always judge a book by its cover.

Speaking of Rolex watches, back in the late 70's I bought a boat on a trailer at a marina in San Pedro. After we hooked up the boat to my truck we washed up and left. I'd managed to maneuver the truck and trailer onto a north-bound freeway when my buddy says "hey I left my watch back at the washroom." I say don't worry about it I'll buy you another one as I don't want to turn around. Its a Rolex he says. It won't be there I say. We go back and it wasn't in the washroom, no, someone had turned it in to the office. You also can't judge the patrons by the neighborhood.

I can assure you that you can't tell who the players are by just looking at them as they walk in the door.

Just so!