Purchasing used electronics (Victron System)

What is your feeling regarding used electronics?

I have been in the planning, purchasing and collection phase of the electrical side of the Senator restoration for a year or so. Maybe A bit longer. Thanks to in depth discussions here and elsewhere along with browsing the Victron University the needs and wants were just coming into focus recently. Not crystal clear focus but at least a general direction with various knowledge gaps to fill.

I just stumbled on an ad in the local facebook titled "Inverter for sale". In the picture was a slew of blue components that I recognized as Victron components. After a closer look and being able to identify most of the components I messaged the guy and he stated that everything would come with the purchase as well as all cabling. His poorly informed ad with no details was just a lazy post via his phone that he intended to clean up later on his home computer. So My timing was good. We met and I looked at the components and ill be darned if he didnt have nearly everything I would have purchased if I had the budget. He was asking $1300 and we finally agreed on $1200 with all the wires, connectors and cables. He stated he works for an RV mod center and this stuff came out of a customers fancy camper that was being upsized. He stated it was installed for approximately 8 months and barely used.

In addition I found that this person and I had several of the same friends. So I bit the bullet and bought the entire lot. All this stuff now sits on my work bench. I am about to head out and hook it up on the bench and see what works.

I am fully aware about all the warnings regarding the purchase of used electronics. Especially "fancy" electronics. I will occasionally take risks like this if various parameters align to my liking. In this case they lined up nearly perfectly with the list and brand of components and price.

So ill know in a day or two if it was a "disaster" or "one of the best $1200 I have ever spent". To break even the Multiplus II just needs to work.

Anyone spot any issues of deficiencies component wise? Add ons that are a must? Ill catalog the components and list them in a bit.

Sounds like it might turn out to be a great deal. Unless improperly installed or abused I would expect that any "infant mortality" risk is eliminated and they should serve you very well. Definitely if most of it works you got more than $1200 worth of quality electronics.

From recent experience, my only concern is you will have zero access to support if needed. Victron's warranty model depends on customer working with the company that sold the components. Other than that, sounds like a decent deal.

Good luck -

Peter

Not really much different than buying a used boat full of electronics, you have no assurance of support or past operation but it is much less expensive.

You may have scored the deal of the year. You could always bench test it with a battery.

READY said:

Sounds like it might turn out to be a great deal. Unless improperly installed or abused I would expect that any "infant mortality" risk is eliminated and they should serve you very well. Definitely if most of it works you got more than $1200 worth of quality electronics.

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Yes. Fingers crossed.

mvweebles said:

From recent experience, my only concern is you will have zero access to support if needed. Victron's warranty model depends on customer working with the company that sold the components. Other than that, sounds like a decent deal.

Good luck -

Peter

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That was one of the considerations for sure. I dont know how good Victrons warranty is even if I was the original buyer. I have heard mixed feedback.
How often I use warranty in general is determined many times by the difficulty of the process and cost of a replacement. Even when warranty is available sometimes I find myself tossing the failed unit in the trash and starting over. Half the time it was my own damn fault anyways..lol.
Other companies make warranty seamless. But overall I dont mind going it alone.

Gdavid said:

Not really much different than buying a used boat full of electronics, you have no assurance of support or past operation but it is much less expensive.

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That's a great point I had not even though of, and most of us have willingly taken that risk.

Airstream345 said:

You may have scored the deal of the year. You could always bench test it with a battery.

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Working on that now. Just returned from the work shop. The only initial issues I saw was a few missing washers and they dyked all the wires going into the Multiplus AC connector. Im sure because they are a PITA to remove. I got all the ends out, cleaned the components up and will start laying them out. It came with a bunch of already terminated 4/0 cable. Most of which I will probably be able to use.

I think ill pull the Dakota lithiums from the golf cart and wire up the multiplus to a 20amp AC outlet (have to change settings to limit AC to 20 amp) and fire it up on the bench. May as well do a complete set up on the bench before installing on the boat. That should help inform me on location. I am running out of room.

I am waiting on my single 36 volt 105 AH Lifepo4 battery for the cart. The three 12 volt 100AH Dakotas may go in the boat until I can get the battery I am waiting on.

So far it looks like:

* Victron Energy MultiPlus-II 2X 120V, 3000VA 12-Volt Pure Sine Wave Inverter and 120 amp Battery Charger
* Victron Energy Cerbo GX, System Monitoring
* Victron Energy GX Touch 50, Remote Display Screen (Waterproof)
* Victron Energy Lynx Distributor
* Victron Energy Lynx Power in Battery Connector
* Victron Energy SmartShunt 500 amp Battery Monitor (Bluetooth)
* Victron Energy Orion-Tr IP43 12/12-Volt 30 amp 360-Watt DC-DC Converter, Isolated
* Victron VE.Bus Smart Dongle for Multiplus/Inverter
* Class T fuse and holder
* Battery shut off switch
* About 25 cables 4/0 of various lengths already terminated
* Various comm cables and extensions.

I am not real keen on the Class T fuse holder. Its the kind bare wire goes into and an allen head crushes down on the bare strands. Never really cared for those or had good long term luck.

I think you got a deal...

You got a good deal. I just paid $750 for Cerbo, GX Touch 50 display, Shunt, and a handful of DE cables. $1200 probably would have been a decent deal for the inverter alone. If you can re-use the 4/0 cables, pretty pricey stuff right there.

The reason I went with the Cerbo/Touch was I having problems with bluetooth on the MPPT controllers which I had bought at different times from different vendors not knowing the Victron support model was a PITA. I purchased the Cerbo/TOuch/Shunt from PKYS and explained my issue, that I had MPPTs from who-knows-where. Peter Kennedy graciously said he'd provide tech support to the entire system including the orphan components, but if I needed warranty RMA support, he could not help. I thought that was fair so I purchased.

Good luck -

Peter

Peter - your MPPT issues were raised a little while ago. Curious as to whether you got the bluetooth comms working>

Apologies for a bit of thread drift folks.....

If you are having second thoughts I will take it off your hands for $600. Limited time offer.

Insequent said:

Peter - your MPPT issues were raised a little while ago. Curious as to whether you got the bluetooth comms working>

Apologies for a bit of thread drift folks.....

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I'll know in a few days. With painting and such, boat has been off limits to interior work.

Coincidentally, the cerbo is being installed as I write. Attached is from an hour or so ago. Cerbo is rhe smaller Victron box next to the lower Victron box (two MPPTs). I'm also having circuit breakers installed on either side of the MPPTs so I can more easily power cycle them which I think would have solved the Bluetooth issues.

By all accounts, Victron is good kit. Their customer support sucks which will make them vulnerable to competitors in the market. Lucky for them they suck less than anyone else sucks (Renogy for example).

Peter

Peter

I've said for a long time that you don't have to be good, you just have to suck less then the other guys.

In general, Victron is happy to target professionally installed systems as their primary customer. It just happens that they make enough information available that a competent diy-er like many of us on here can also make use of the stuff.

mvweebles said:

I'll know in a few days. With painting and such, boat has been off limits to interior work.

Coincidentally, the cerbo is being installed as I write. Attached is from an hour or so ago. Cerbo is rhe smaller Victron box next to the lower Victron box (two MPPTs). I'm also having circuit breakers installed on either side of the MPPTs so I can more easily power cycle them which I think would have solved the Bluetooth issues.

By all accounts, Victron is good kit. Their customer support sucks which will make them vulnerable to competitors in the market. Lucky for them they suck less than anyone else sucks (Renogy for example).

Peter

Peter View attachment 135413

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Looking good Peter. Let us know how it all turns out.

SteveK said:

If you are having second thoughts I will take it off your hands for $600. Limited time offer.

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Give me 2 to 3 days and I may take you up on that...lol.

Barking Sands said:

Give me 2 to 3 days and I may take you up on that...lol.

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Don't forget Victron has a 5 year warranty....and changing ownership does NOT stop the warranty.

I have bought a used inverter ( in the EU) before w/o worrying if it would be DOA. Based on the serial number I was given the age, which was well inside the 5 years, so safe.

And unlike MvWeebles I have had stellar support, even one time when the inverter was failing, Victron USA shipped me a replacement unit, before I could sent the 'faulty' unit to the repair shop.. Funny thing....neither unit was faulty, it was a software update of the Venus which caused the Inverter act as if it was failing.

dutch-barge said:

Don't forget Victron has a 5 year warranty....and changing ownership does NOT stop the warranty.

I have bought a used inverter ( in the EU) before w/o worrying if it would be DOA. Based on the serial number I was given the age, which was well inside the 5 years, so safe.

And unlike MvWeebles I have had stellar support, even one time when the inverter was failing, Victron USA shipped me a replacement unit, before I could sent the 'faulty' unit to the repair shop.. Funny thing....neither unit was faulty, it was a software update of the Venus which caused the Inverter act as if it was failing.

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At the risk of beating a dead horse, you and Slowgoesit managed to evade the Victron fortress. I'm glad for you both. But to be clear, I did not experience poor support - I experienced the exact support Victron designed which is no direct support for end-users; only through the reseller. IIf something fails when you're out and about, could be tough. f the reseller is strong, you're in luck. If not, well, you know.....

My over-riding advice to anyone is to find a reputable dealer with knowledgeable tech support in your application (marine vs off-grid or #vanlife) and buy everything through them. For me, that was PKYS.

BTW - your last words hint at an interesting dilemma for equipment like Victron's - many failures are firmware issues. However the firmware cannot be updated because the unit is in-operable due to faulty firmware........

Peter

Risky, very risky.

Walmart, Ace Hardware and Menards all have very liberal exchange policies but I NEVER will buy a box or blister pack from anywhere if it has been opened and resealed. I guess I don't mind paying full retail but I want brand new.

pete

For Victron Equipment:
Check the Serial numbers of the equipment. They should start with two letters, followed by 4 numbers, then the rest of the SN. Example: HQ1927XXXXX. The "1927" part of the SN means manufactured in the 27th week of 2019.

If you want to file a warranty claim, you don't have to know who sold the item originally. Use the following link:
https://www.victronenergy.com/support/warranty-and-repairs

Scroll down, click on "Submit a Support Request". Fill out the form. When I did, I received an immediate electronic reply which stated who, where, and when the item was originally sold. The Support Request is then routed to that company. If they do not resolve the issue, it is escalated higher. Worked for me. I just picked up a brand new replacement Isolation Transformer yesterday!

From speaking to Victron Netherlands recently, I gathered their business expanded much faster than they had anticipated, and their business model failed to adequately provide for warranty support. They are attempting to correct that to make it easier to address warranty issues.

Best of luck going forward, and it sounds like you got a great deal. . . You sure it's not stolen?

Super deal" Look at it this way, if it doesn't work, it still looks pretty mounted in the boat LOL! Being a retired Electronic Engineer, I fear not any used electronics if price is right. Saved thousands by buying a used Raymarine AP to just fix a bad CPU.

mvweebles said:

At the risk of beating a dead horse, you and Slowgoesit managed to evade the Victron fortress. I'm glad for you both. But to be clear, I did not experience poor support - I experienced the exact support Victron designed which is no direct support for end-users; only through the reseller. IIf something fails when you're out and about, could be tough. f the reseller is strong, you're in luck. If not, well, you know.....

My over-riding advice to anyone is to find a reputable dealer with knowledgeable tech support in your application (marine vs off-grid or #vanlife) and buy everything through them. For me, that was PKYS.

BTW - your last words hint at an interesting dilemma for equipment like Victron's - many failures are firmware issues. However the firmware cannot be updated because the unit is in-operable due to faulty firmware........

Peter

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There is NO fortress Victron....You experienced a seller who did not supported you enough. Perhaps you had a great deal. I have bought through Peter Kennedy, PKYS, perhaps not aways the cheapest, BUT I got all the support I wanted.

The software issue, would NOT have happened if I had set my, then Venus, to latest release, instead of latest release candidate. In other words BETA or testing version, and I was warned about this.

Firmware can be easily update with an MK cable. Calling somebody at Victron was never an issue. In the manual of the inverter. the dip switches are explained. For more programming the are programs available, BUT again they should ONLY be used by trained people. You can always call the main number. I did it once because the reseller could not tell me when MMPT's were going to be available...A call to the main number...."they have 3 of these units in stock at the distributor"

Have a great day

Barking Sands said:

Give me 2 to 3 days and I may take you up on that...lol.

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Have you bench tested yet? I am sure it will work fine, but I don't want to overpay.

I would think the best way to Qualify the purchase , I Why the sale of the components? Selling due to an upgrade ? Good. Selling for a weird reason be whare.

Victron is good suff. Used dosent bother me. Just Why selling?

SteveK said:

Have you bench tested yet? I am sure it will work fine, but I don't want to overpay.

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No deal!
Everything is working great:

AC in/out- pass through
Inverter AC out
DC out loads
DC in/charging
All Bluetooth and Wifi working
Did all the updates without issue
Changed all the previous owners pass codes to my own.

After going through the history the previous owner had 800AH and the system had 11 cycles. It also had the name of an RV place named in all the Bluetooth ID's. Very happy. All the infoI could gather from previous data history matched the sellers description. I just think he wanted this stuff out of his hair.



Workshop is a wreck of course. I just had to cobble some things together this afternoon, rob a single 100AH lithium battery from the golf carts, get a fire extinguisher handy and throw the switches. Worked great right out of the gate. It was immediately hammering the single 100AH Dakota Lithium with a 100amp BMS with 65 amps of charging. Took about 15 minutes to top it off from some unknown state of charge. Then it floated for a few minutes and stopped charging completely. Hooked up a heat lamp that was pulling abut 265 watts of AC out and all that registered on the touch pad. Pulled the AC plug and it immediately switched to inverter to continue providing the 265 watts to heat lamp. I cant think of any other ways it needs to be tested. There is some set up for charging the batts that I think may need some fine tuning. But overall I am super impressed with the Victron system and its apps and bluetooth. I am especially impressed with the touch screen. I have never had anything so dang fancy.

There are still a few install requirements I am fuzzy about that I will have to read up in the ABYC. The Lynx design and complying with ABYC may be at odds in a few areas. Like Battery shut offs and fusing batts within a certain distance. But I will have to look into that.

slowgoesit said:

For Victron Equipment:
Check the Serial numbers of the equipment. They should start with two letters, followed by 4 numbers, then the rest of the SN. Example: HQ1927XXXXX. The "1927" part of the SN means manufactured in the 27th week of 2019.

If you want to file a warranty claim, you don't have to know who sold the item originally. Use the following link:
https://www.victronenergy.com/support/warranty-and-repairs

Scroll down, click on "Submit a Support Request". Fill out the form. When I did, I received an immediate electronic reply which stated who, where, and when the item was originally sold. The Support Request is then routed to that company. If they do not resolve the issue, it is escalated higher. Worked for me. I just picked up a brand new replacement Isolation Transformer yesterday!

From speaking to Victron Netherlands recently, I gathered their business expanded much faster than they had anticipated, and their business model failed to adequately provide for warranty support. They are attempting to correct that to make it easier to address warranty issues.

Best of luck going forward, and it sounds like you got a great deal. . . You sure it's not stolen?

Click to expand...

Excellent info. Very much appreciated.

Assuming that the history is true you scored a good deal. Frankly an inverter isn't a complex thing so if it worked in the RV it should be just fine. I've purchased one piece of used electronics to replace my Raymarine chartplotter/radar interface. It was a good way to avoid having to replace a perfectly good integrated system. !