Wood GB 33

Captain DJ · Dec 5, 2022

Cold Duck said:
Anyone who has owned a wood boat for any length of time has replaced a plank. \

I had a 1969 GB 42 Classic for 15 years and never had to replace a plank. I had to replace the worm shoe in Tarpon Springs, Florida after a year in the Keys. But that was not a big deal. Wooding the hull years later, with a blank check from an insurance claim to "replace any and all rotted wood". None could be found. The real 2-inch thick mahogany planking on Yakal ( SE Asian ironwood) frames makes replacement in under 50-80 year timeframe only really likely with abuse, neglect, fresh water ingress as well as warm weather. You can abuse or neglect a "Tupperware", steel, aluminum, wooden or Ferro-cement boat to an extent that drives it to an early demise. These American Marine works of art may outlast many of the post-2000 Mainship type boats, even with a 40+ year headstart.

I did have to replace a plank on a 60-year-old Chris Craft, but that too was a case of multiple years of negligence and warm, fresh water. Simply keeping the engine space dry with an operational bilge pump would have prevented that maintenance. It did NOT happen under my ownership/stewardship of the CC, but the guy that bought it from me and never did any maintenance on it. It was a dock queen/party barge Batchelor pad for a drunk. That mentality will sink any boat given enough time.

Just my opinion. Everybody has one. When it comes to wooden Grand Banks, maybe the ones that have owned one or more for decades has an opinion that carries more weight than someone that has NEVER and would NEVER own a woody. Just my thoughts regarding the value of expressing opinions. Who knows?

MVDarlin · Dec 5, 2022

Dont do it! Even if they offer to give to you. You will soon hate boating, because it will only mean work.

omoore · Dec 5, 2022

Wood GB

Forget the doomsayers. I purchased a 1971 wooden GB 42 in 2002. The boat was in good shape and had been winter stored inside. It was a Lake Superior boat. Brought the boat to NC 10 years ago. I quickly learned that any break in the paint had to be addressed quickly. Heat and high humidity can quickly lead to rot.

The Lehman diesel as was mentioned is virtually indestructible. 380 ci, cast iron block, mechanical fuel injection 109 hp--(120 was a marketing number I was told by the Pres of Lehman) typical running rpm-1650. Compared that with an aluminum block Yanmar running at higher rpm.
Get a detailed survey from a surveyor with wood boat experience. Ditto an engine survey. BTW there are no shortage of parts.
Get a cost estimate of repairs if needed and make your decision.

As an aside a glass boat is not necessarily cheap to maintain. My 58 Hat MY had a lot of brightwork. Polishing and waxing was costly. Re-bedding the windshield in the pilothouse was costly, ditto portholes.

If you are handy you can do much of the work yourself. I, for one enjoy it. The engine is accessible. I have replaced water pumps, alternators, injectors and gapped the valves and more myself. By comparison I did no work on my Detroits or Cats.
Let us know what the survey found and your decision. Good luck!

ronobrien · Dec 6, 2022

Mike GB32 said:
What is a reasonable purchase price for such an adventure given my limited skills

I would say that you would need to be prepared to do a lot of maintenance and repair. I love my fiberglass 32 but I wouldn't own her if I couldn't do 99 percent of the work myself. I enjoy it. A wood boat would likely require more attention.
I'm not saying don't do it. I am saying (in my opinion) you would really need to love the boat and love working on her.

When I was searching for a boat I had a broker on the lookout. I was only specific about 2 things. It had to be diesel and it couldn't be wood. I just didn't want that work.

omoore · Dec 6, 2022

A quick add. Many people mistakenly think a glass boat is all glass. Not so. Bertram used 2x4's and plywood covered with
glass as many learned when they had to replace a transom. Also engine stringers are often lumber yard wood covered with glass. Pacemakers were one of the very worst examples of wood structure under glass. Even my very expensive Magnum 46 had a plywood deck under glass which I learned when the survey for a buyer from Italy found a very large area of foredeck that had to be replaced.
Even worse, that encapsulated wood was covered with polyester of some sort not epoxy!!!

Marinex · Dec 6, 2022

All boats have their maintenance. We have owned our GB 32 1967 for the last 11 years and the key to wooden boat ownership , or any boat for that matter, is buy one that has been cared for and not neglected. That way you are starting at a known commodity and while there are always surprises it will minimize the list.

We love our 32GB and I think the main reason is that we can do absolutely all the work ourselves and we can keep the boat yard bills to the minimum. If you already have the skills in woodwork and mechanical they are very simple boats and built like a brick. We have over 8000 nm on ours since purchase and the Lehman keeps ticking along. Fuel pump, water pump spares are onboard but so far we haven't used them. Do all your annual maintenance as specified and we send an oil sample out each year to keep an eye on the engine. Simple and reliable.

If you are looking for the weak points:

Top of steel fuel tanks can rust, our tanks were replaced with aluminum by a previous owner.

The cabin house plywood needs to have the paint kept up or water will get in there, under the windows and the windows themselves can leak causing damage there. The step down area can get soft underneath the step to the aft deck, check for rot underneath.

We have never had the deck leak through, they did an amazing job originally.

Hawse holes can allow water into the area below the hawse, we ringed ours with fiberglass as the early boats just had a plate on each side of the hole and wood in the middle.

Under the rear door sill area should be inspected as water can damage there over time.

Hope this helps! as per the wood vs glass debate, I would call it a draw. We haul in a self service yard and while we are touching up wood and painting I see glass owners polishing and repairing little bumps from the dock where it has cracked.

I think all boat owners are crazy but isn't that why we are the characters we are?

If you have questions send me a PM

Otrtrucker1960 · Jan 4, 2023

Love old woodies

We just bought a 1967 GB 36 in July. We are having to do a complete refurbish. She sat in a shed, at AYB in Chesapeake, Va unused for over 6 years. Mold on every surface, inside and out. When she was hauled out for survey and bottom paint, the paint fell off in sheets. So it was taken to bare wood and redone. We live in Great Bridge, so the boat stays at AYB. Planning to take her out in the Spring for short excursions. Then head South in the fall of '23. It's a lot more work than a "turn key" boat. But we love it. More pride in doing it ourselves, than just paying someone else to do it.

SteveK · Jan 5, 2023

Good on you for taking on this project.

Welcome to the forum. When the time is right posts work in progress photos

Cigatoo · Jan 5, 2023

Otrtrucker1960 said:
We just bought a 1967 GB 36 in July. We are having to do a complete refurbish. She sat in a shed, at AYB in Chesapeake, Va unused for over 6 years. Mold on every surface, inside and out. When she was hauled out for survey and bottom paint, the paint fell off in sheets. So it was taken to bare wood and redone. We live in Great Bridge, so the boat stays at AYB. Planning to take her out in the Spring for short excursions. Then head South in the fall of '23. It's a lot more work than a "turn key" boat. But we love it. More pride in doing it ourselves, than just paying someone else to do it.

Welcome to the forum!
This will be a beautiful classic boat when done properly. If I had the wherewithal this would be in my top 5. Just love a wooden boat!
Pictures would be greatly appreciated. Maybe best to start a new thread so that we can follow along.

Pete Meisinger · Jan 5, 2023

Wait, What?? 5200 troweled on and then fiberglass applied? Are you serious?

I would really like to see that.

pete

ronobrien · Jan 5, 2023

sunchaser said:
Is a 58 year old diesel a rock solid engine? Doubtful unless it has been stripped down and inspected carefully, rebuilt totally with new marinization parts installed.

Anything less keep it close to safe harbor and SEATOW. The engine has to come out anyway so wood planking, ribs, keel and stem can be rebuilt and replaced as required.

Do the overall engine, mechanicals and wood work rebuilds far inland to avoid storm damage if near hurricane waters. Once done (5years +) the vessel could be a center piece at wooden boat shows with lots of enjoyment amid like minded friends.

Disagree. The 2 primary factors in a diesel's longevity are maintenance and running hours. An old diesel will be just fine if it was maintained and doesn't have 50,000 hours on it. (50,000 is hyperbole, you get the point). I was a truck mechanic for many years and have seen private owner trucks with 1,000,000 miles that were in for rebuild but were still running OK. We had to figure some sort of equivalent for off road vehicles that ran hard at low speed but racked up hours. We figured 30 miles for every hour run. An hour, by the way is not a clock hour but is 1000 revolutions. A comprehensive mechanical survey of the engines is certainly warranted but to dismiss an engine simply because of it's age is not valid.

boomerang · Jan 5, 2023

Pete Meisinger said:
Wait, What?? 5200 troweled on and then fiberglass applied? Are you serious?

I would really like to see that.

pete

I had a wooden boat that was glassed over using the C-flex system which used 5200 troweled onto the bare wood of the hull. I believe the idea is to hold the glass to the wood with 5200 adhesive caulking, which gives the fiberglass coating the ability to move separate from the wooden hull ever so slightly.
My C-flex job was 12-15 years old when I sold the boat and the sides were just as perfect as when it was originally done.
FYI, the pictured (glassed over) wood boat was one of several I've owned over the many years of boat ownership and I'm of the opinion that ,other than nostalgia, there's really no good reason to want to own one. It's kind of like a 2 stroke Evinrude. They were the best thing going... until something better came along.

Xlantic · Jan 5, 2023

boomerang said:
FYI, the pictured (glassed over) wood boat was one of several I've owned over the many years of boat ownership and I'm of the opinion that ,other than nostalgia, there's really no good reason to want to own one.

I agree. A glassed over wood boat is a travesty.

Cigatoo · Jan 5, 2023

Xlantic said:
I agree. A glassed over wood boat is a travesty.

Not to be confused with cold molded

Nomad Willy · Jan 5, 2023

5200 has a great rep for adhesion.
Use it on dry wood (hopefully he roughed it up some) and w a high surface area of FG that should be a VERY good bond. I think.

The marriage of wood to FG frequently falls short of that tho .. especially when bonding to teak.
I wonder if the hull planking on the GB was teak or Pmahog?
I would guess the teak bond would go south because of the wood’s oil.

Bob Cofer · Jan 5, 2023

Almost all of the wooden GB hulls were made of Philippine Mahogany.

ofer · Jan 5, 2023

I now believe what i heard from a mechanic in the Alaskan boat yard who said one of his clients had 10 5 gal buckets of 5200 and applied them over his wooden boat hull.

Otrtrucker1960 · Jan 11, 2023

Here are pics of what we sent to the insurance company for coverage. More to come showing progress. When we bought her, every surface was covered in mold. Inside and out.

Cigatoo · Jan 12, 2023

Otrtrucker1960 said:
Here are pics of what we sent to the insurance company for coverage. More to come showing progress. When we bought her, every surface was covered in mold. Inside and out.

That’s a pretty boat. I like the original lines as compared to the “newer” longer wide body.

Otrtrucker1960 · Jan 12, 2023

I'm not thrilled about the hull colors. But, that can be changed back to "original" scheme in a year or two. Right now, my finances are going toward getting her liveable, and dependable.

Old Sea Dog · Jan 12, 2023

OTR..... remember passing by that very same GB in the shed to view another GB 36 that eventually did not pass our survey. Look forward to seeing you on The Bay. We are moored over in Crisfield MD.

Otrtrucker1960 · Jan 12, 2023

Sorry the one you wanted didn't pass the survey. I had an insurance survey done when I bought her. After I get everything at least 80-90% done, I'll have another survey/appraisal done. I've done a lot to her since July when I bought her. But still have a ways to go. What started out as a "get it running and barely liveable" has turned into a full renovation.
BTW, I spent several months in negotiations with the previous owner. I'm glad that we were able to come to an agreement.

Otrtrucker1960 · Jan 17, 2023

Before and after

Here are some before and after pics of the heat exchangers and oil coolers. I had all 7 of them refurbished (including generator) just as a matter of course. The boat had been sitting idle, sitting tied to the pier, (decommissioned) for 6 years.
I have no idea how long it had been since the heat exchangers and coolers had been cleaned before.
There were a few leaky tubes, and cracked solder. All of which was fixed.

Slowmo · Jan 18, 2023

I'm coming late to this party but from the perspective of someone who cruised a wood boat most of his life and recently move to FG.
A few things to consider.
1) wood boats are far quieter than FG boats. FG is a 'live' material that transmits sound so you hear waves slapping on the hull at anchor. Not so with our old wood boat.
2) Wood boats need painting every few years. FG boats should be buffed and waxed but won't fall apart if you don't. However painting can be done by the owner (if the local environmental laws allow). It isn't hard at all. The opposite of is true of FG, refinishing is expensive and generally requires a professional. I've sanded an painted a 40' wood boat in 1.5 days when I was young.
3) The durability of a wood hull is a function of multiple factors. Maintenance plays a big role but so does quality of original construction.
4) It isn't the cost of maintaining a wood hull as much as finding a well qualified shipwright.
5) The wood boat really needed to live under cover, that was a huge benefit on maintenance costs.
6) A wood boat should not spend a long time out of the water, so dry storage is not recommended. Planks will shrink out of the water.
7) Anti-fouling paint is critical on a wood boat.

Wooden GBs were well constructed for a production boat. The mahogany hulls are relatively rot resistant, the frames are reasonably stout. I have seen one that the chine planks swelled and required repair so you might check for leaks in the chine area. The cabins were a weak point, the plywood was subject to rot. This carried over to the earlier FG models. The teak decks of the wood GB are less problem prone than the FG models (which are very problem prone).

The biggest issue with a wood boat these days is resale. You have many who simply won't consider them. They forget that the move to FG wasn't because FG was so much better, it was because it was so much cheaper. And I have known people who moved from wood to FG then back to wood because they didn't like the FG.

Cigatoo · Jan 18, 2023

Slowmo said:
I'm coming late to this party but from the perspective of someone who cruised a wood boat most of his life and recently move to FG.
A few things to consider.
1) wood boats are far quieter than FG boats. FG is a 'live' material that transmits sound so you hear waves slapping on the hull at anchor. Not so with our old wood boat.
2) Wood boats need painting every few years. FG boats should be buffed and waxed but won't fall apart if you don't. However painting can be done by the owner (if the local environmental laws allow). It isn't hard at all. The opposite of is true of FG, refinishing is expensive and generally requires a professional. I've sanded an painted a 40' wood boat in 1.5 days when I was young.
3) The durability of a wood hull is a function of multiple factors. Maintenance plays a big role but so does quality of original construction.
4) It isn't the cost of maintaining a wood hull as much as finding a well qualified shipwright.
5) The wood boat really needed to live under cover, that was a huge benefit on maintenance costs.
6) A wood boat should not spend a long time out of the water, so dry storage is not recommended. Planks will shrink out of the water.
7) Anti-fouling paint is critical on a wood boat.

Wooden GBs were well constructed for a production boat. The mahogany hulls are relatively rot resistant, the frames are reasonably stout. I have seen one that the chine planks swelled and required repair so you might check for leaks in the chine area. The cabins were a weak point, the plywood was subject to rot. This carried over to the earlier FG models. The teak decks of the wood GB are less problem prone than the FG models (which are very problem prone).

The biggest issue with a wood boat these days is resale. You have many who simply won't consider them. They forget that the move to FG wasn't because FG was so much better, it was because it was so much cheaper. And I have known people who moved from wood to FG then back to wood because they didn't like the FG.

Well said!

ronobrien · Jan 18, 2023

Otrtrucker1960 said:
Here are some before and after pics of the heat exchangers and oil coolers. I had all 7 of them refurbished (including generator) just as a matter of course. The boat had been sitting idle, sitting tied to the pier, (decommissioned) for 6 years.
I have no idea how long it had been since the heat exchangers and coolers had been cleaned before.
There were a few leaky tubes, and cracked solder. All of which was fixed.

A good prophylactic treatment is Rydlime. There are others also. They work to dissolve that growth. Done periodically (annually) it greatly reduces the need for removal and service. It is biodegradable so discharge to a waterway is not generally a problem, although you would want to check local regulation.

Otrtrucker1960 · Jan 18, 2023

Thank you for the wood boat tips. I'll likely incorporate some of the on my 1967 GB 36 that we just bought in July. In the process of refurbishing her now. Doing the work ourselves. Fortunately, I do mechanical and electrical work, and can paint as well. My better half is working on repainting the living spaces.
Fortunately, our boat has spent at least the last 6 years in a shed. If not much longer. As I understand it, she's been at this particular yard for a number years before that.

Otrtrucker1960 · Feb 5, 2023

Progress update

This weekend, I was able to spend a few hours working on the boat. The lazarette is coming along. About 90% complete. I removed the aft sewage tank, and began painting out the stbd side of the lazarette. Before and after pics included. I also had to make a mount for the generator sea strainer. The strainer had been just hanging by the hoses for many years
I made a mount for it, and attached them to one of the engine mount beams. I had to modify the deck board because the mount displaced the strainer about 3/4".

Simi 60 · Feb 5, 2023

Best thing we ever did was ignore the naysayers and buy a big woody.

Been out here cruising full time for 6 plus years not a care in the world vs driving a desk while the plastic boat sits parked in a marina berth while I work to pay for the:

more expensive boat that I rarely use
the marina berth it sits in
somone to polish and maintain the boat because I'm too flogged after working all week to do it myself
the car I need to get to work
and a dirt house to live in.

All of the above just digs a deeper debt hole almost guaranteeing I never get to play boats.

Otrtrucker1960 · Feb 5, 2023

We had naysayers as well. We/I tend to not pay them much attention.
We bought the boat from a friend. No brokers involved. As you can tell, we are doing a complete refurbishment. We plan to have our first underway later this Spring.
I'll retire for the second time, around August.
Then we will take some long weekends on the water. We plan to do the Great Loop within a few years.
We still have a lot of work ahead to get her ready. The brightwork and detailing will be projects for "downtime" on our future cruises. But, she will be in sound mechanical, electrical, and physical shape. Certainly liveable by that time.

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