UPDATE - Lemon-aid R 27 Ranger Tug

I am sorry that you have had to go through all of this. On the surface, this info does not look good for the manufacturer. I have seen other owners who have been very 'unhappy" with Cutwater (same manufacturer I think but different reasons) as well.

I am not saying that means anything conclusive, or that these are "bad boats", only that it gives "food for thought" and further investigation would be warranted for anyone considering one of these boats.
I hope you get to some level of satisfaction with all of this.

bucketlist1 said:

I have a 2018 R27 Ranger Tug with 2 large cracks . there is no sign of the hull hitting or scrapping anything . In my personal opinion it was done when blocked

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So you bought a used boat, that has a crack in it, and you're putting the manufacturer on blast?

Based on your previous responses, it sounds like you rushed into a deal without doing your homework and now you're throwing anything you can grab at the wall to see what sticks.

Toocoys,
That could be, but maybe not??
If this damage was only caused by the boat being "properly" (assumption there) blocked, or if not built to high enough structural strength, then I understand his concerns.
Admittedly there is alot more to this and info we don't have. Maybe after the testing he is having done there will be more definitive info on structural strength?
I can understand his unhappiness. In my case, I had a boat from new, well and properly maintained and used, and the small diesel engine suffered a complete failure just after the warranty (time period not hours) expired. I hired a metallugical engineer who stated with 100% certainty that the cause of failure was due to one of the connecting rod nuts not being properly torqued (from the factory, as it had never seen any need for service). The engine manufacturer "doubted" this finding?????
It does happen. Not all manufacturers do a good job 100% of the time or even stand behind their products.

I'm sorry to see your predicament. It is a beautiful boat, looks like new and I can imagine you paid quite a bit for it, I would be upset as well.

That said, I would suggest having it surveyed and then repaired by a reputable boat yard. There are several very high caliber yards in your area, document the process and get the boat usable and then chase after the compensation that you feel you deserve once you are enjoying the boat and the final cost of repairs are known.

toocoys said:

So you bought a used boat, that has a crack in it, and you're putting the manufacturer on blast?

Based on your previous responses, it sounds like you rushed into a deal without doing your homework and now you're throwing anything you can grab at the wall to see what sticks.

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Yes it was a rush deal ( person wanted my trade , What could be wrong with a 25 hour boat ...... ) Don't accuse until you read the FULL story on the website . Dealer was witnessed mopping up the V birth the morning it was shipped to me . Said it was an '' air conditioning leak '' see sworn letter by freight company . Boat was never blocked by me . NOTHING is thrown to see if it STICKS .

I had it surveyed directly after the crack was seen . I have talked to every shop to repair , the good ones say to fix from inside and out . They can't fit me in or maybe don't want to be involved in a high profile case . It is possible other spots could crack also .

After reading your website and watching your videos it looks to me like you may have been taken for a ride by an unscrupulous used boat salesman and you are trying to blame the manufacturer as you think your constant negativity reflects badly upon them.

I just don't think that reflects well on your integrity imo.

I might feel differently if there were more than one complaint about hull failures, but I haven't seen one, and I read anything and everything I can find, going back to 2009.

Wouldn't your time might be better spent taking legal action against the person that sold you the boat?

I viewed the youtube video, but frankly, the shots of the plug, and the borescope pics were so blurry it was difficult to see what you were trying to show. The 1/4 (minus) hull thickness would definitely be a concern to me, but then again, the whole point of a towable trawler is light weight, which can only be obtained by omitting weight somewhere. I am interested in seeing the factual laboratory tests of the samples, without interpretation, unless by a trained forensic specialist. Sorry that you are going through the problem you are dealing with, but a survey prior to purchase might have found the problems prior to purchase. Also, I'm not convinced the problems (possible incorrect blocking) you are mapping out are attributable to the manufacturer as much as to the first owner and/or selling broker.
Best of luck moving forward. I hope you get resolution on your issues, and can soon get to using your boat!

I am involved with the dealership situation also . Are you familiar with the Youtube channel ''Parley Revival '' ? Two guys , find bulkhead problems in a Lagoon Cat , they put the word out to other owners , 66 broken bulkheads and counting . Lagoon has now agreed to Pay for repairs . ---- About other cracks - Why was I ''deactivated '' ( kicked off ) the TUGNUTS forum for asking about JFRANO ranger that had a crack that didn't hit anything ? I asked about cause and repair procedure . The post was removed and i was kicked off by the moderator , on order from head of sales of RANGER. Sounds like I hit a nerve ???? Search JFRANO posts on Tugnuts tonight before they remove his original post about his 4 inch crack , and asking what to do .

It seems to be gone on Tugnuts ( big surprise ) but I saved it ! It is on my website under '' sources '' This is why I was Kicked off , Asking about another crack ......

here it is !

I can't blame a boatyard for steering clear of you, the hull does appear thin me but I don't know the layup schedule. The boat may have been dropped onto a block or trailer's cross beam for all we know but you are blasting the manufacturer for something that happened after it was sold to the first owner, perhaps there is a latent deficiency but I don't you are going to get the resolution you want in the manner you are pursuing.

If you have not done so already, try Smith's marina in Crownsville, Bert Jabin in Annapolis or Osprey Marine in Deale. There are other competent yards in the area but these are among the best IMO. A one sided repair maybe more difficult but totally possible. With hull repaired and a coat of barrier coat applied the boat can be better than new.

.
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The factory will not share the laminate schedule or the ''outside '' repair that they say their engineers ''say '' will work . Most experts say an outside repair could be dangerous do to the thin hull .

I stand corrected ... I found the JFRANO original post ( not my deleted question post ) on DuckDuckgo , any combo of words and it came up , then I using the exact title words on Tugnuts ''crack in hull '' the JFRANO hull crack post came up . Once an owner PM's or calls the factory , they ask ( tell ? ) the owner to deal with them by phone or email , keeping the Tugnuts people out of the loop . Other Tugnuts people have asked JFRANO by PM about it , but no response . Maybe factory has them sign a disclosure on repair ? I don't know that , but wonder if that is how it works ?

According to info from your prior posts it appears that either the PO or the hauler was more than likely the source of the problem. You were an informed buyer and chose to forego surveys and inspections. You now own the problem. I suspect the factory would have been more than willing to share their layup schedule with you until you publicly slammed them thus closing the door to all communication.

It seems as though you are more interested in blaming the manufacturer than fixing the problem. Move on and enjoy the repaired boat.

bucketlist1 said:

I ---- About other cracks - Why was I ''deactivated '' ( kicked off ) the TUGNUTS forum for asking about JFRANO ranger that had a crack that didn't hit anything ? I asked about cause and repair procedure . The post was removed and i was kicked off by the moderator , on order from head of sales of RANGER. Sounds like I hit a nerve ????

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I'm fairly sure that 'tugnuts.com" is owned by Ranger Tugs. I don't know of any vendor hosted forum that will allow you to criticize the vendor.

Previously, many folks were suggesting a Ranger27 for a good trailerable boat.
It that a different thread or have folks changed their minds?

Dan,
"I am not saying that means anything conclusive, or that these are "bad boats", only that it gives "food for thought" and further investigation would be warranted for anyone considering one of these boats."
As stated earlier in this thread, I feel the above statement holds true. These boats are built to be trailerable, and therefore weight is important. It therefore stands to reason that the hull will be made as thin (and therefore light) as possible. Any errors in layup may lead to problems???
However, to be fair, you don't see or hear of these kinds of issues often! Ranger Tugs seem to have a large and loyal following, but they are not for everyone (me among the latter group).

You KNOW this damage occurred either with the PO, the transporter, or the dealer, and you know the dealer knew about the damage and was dishonest about it, right? You also know that Ranger Tugs are designed to be light weight and trailerable, so you understand the thinner hull material right? Why are you so hell bent on going after the manufacturer on this? I'm going to guess you've hit dead ends in going after the dealer, transporter and PO, so you're just going up the chain to deeper pockets? Is that it?

The only "damning" comments I have heard of the Ranger/cutwater boats is from my refit guy who's main expertise is electrical/electronics in boating. He said he worked on one of the two makes, don't remember which one, and he found something strange in electrical.

He said if you looked at the electrical box/control board, it was a model of how to wire. But he found the boat had an almost hidden separate box which brought the wires together and he said it was a spaghetti horror show. I haven't heard this from anyone else. This is the only critical negative critique I have heard against the brand.

and do not forget improper placement on the trailer too.

Now, to find fault in the design or building, one would need to expand the sample size significantly, looking for a common cracking.

Toki said:

You KNOW this damage occurred either with the PO, the transporter, or the dealer, and you know the dealer knew about the damage and was dishonest about it, right? You also know that Ranger Tugs are designed to be light weight and trailerable, so you understand the thinner hull material right? Why are you so hell bent on going after the manufacturer on this? I'm going to guess you've hit dead ends in going after the dealer, transporter and PO, so you're just going up the chain to deeper pockets? Is that it?

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Toki , I had a 2013 R 27 Ranger witch i loved (but not working on the Volvo Diesel , I made a removable fiberglass step for better access to front of engine ) It is unbelievable how most Ranger owners have turned on me ( even some I met at many Rendezvous ) Ranger Tug owners are loyal till the end for the brand , even when bad stuff happens .

Look at Tugnuts post , Oct 2020 ''Tugnut #1 '' this happened right after I was kicked off the forum for asking about another boat with a similar crack . Censorship at it's best ! All Tugnuts members where then told " if you can't be nice - go somewhere eise '' '' if you don't have anything good too say - go somewhere else ''
If you read my website , facebook etc I have not given the dealership ( Bayshore Yacht Sales/ Lefroy Harbour ) a pass . They sold a boat that they have admitted having water in the V birth , They said it was an " air conditioning leak '' and then told the shippers with the hydraulic trailer to ship it . I was told by the salesman they would pay for the ''air conditioning to be repaired '' Wish it was just ''air conditioning ''
The original owner never had a trailer , the dealership delivered the boat by water . the only place the boat was blocked could be 1- dealership 2- freight from Washington to Ontario ( remember they won't tell me who the freight company is ) or at the factory in Washington .

Normal Hull building overlaps the port and starboard fiberglass mat/cloth . This is to build up strength and thickness for the keel area , where it is needed in case of grounding etc ( this is what other builders/repair yards tell me ) . I don't think 6.23 mm thickness is overlapping !

Oh , Did i mention ABYC electrical infractions that could cause fire ? the dealership and factory never offered to repair . I will post survey . I am into this over a year now . Lab results in less than 2 weeks .

survey page attached

I feel bad for you, the OP. However, this reminds me of daytime court shows. Girl buys car from guy she trusts who says it's a good car. She drives it and starts having trouble, takes it to a mechanic, who points out all sorts of things. She loses because the didn't use a mechanic before buying and protect herself.

You likely lose for the same reasons. Was there any warranty given to you? If not, then you have no recourse unless there was fraud. I know you pointed out the water issue was known by the salesman, but doubt he knew the cause and if you can't prove he did, there's no fraud there. You accepted the boat delivery in that condition.

You took shortcuts. No survey. Not even a personal inspection. While the issue and the video and the subsequent survey may reflect poorly on the builder and on the dealer, that really doesn't help you.

Now, you need to find someone to tell you what needs to be done and repair the boat. If they know what an issue you're making of this and how you're badmouthing the dealer and the builder, no way most are going to want to do work for you. You best get off your high horse and go to one on your knees begging for help.

Three wrongs don't make a right. Perhaps the builder did something wrong, perhaps the dealer did, but definitely you took short cuts. There is no way to know what happened. Something might have happened with the first owner. Perhaps even before they bought it. Just takes one yard incident. As to the thickness of the fiberglass and things like that, you weren't buying a Hatteras. Ranger is built light and that includes thin. Nothing inherently wrong with that. The boat we're on right now is built lighter than any others we own. Hopefully materials that will sustain but built for speed. I quote from their website, "Advanced construction technologies associated with the use of lightweight materials everywhere."

Reality is you're fighting a losing battle and continuing to wage the fight will only cost you, in time, energy, money and reputation. You can't win. You bought a used boat and have problems. You cannot possibly know when the damage occurred. The boat traveled a great distance on a trailer after you bought it. Maybe a speed bump. Who knows. Perhaps the previous owner had it hauled and blocked. Perhaps when new at the dealer. Is it faulty construction? Doesn't really matter and by what standards? You have no recourse and likely it's their normal standards.

I can understand your pain and your anger. I would be furious at some of the treatment. However, it's time for you to direct all your energies to a solution. If you had insurance at the time of transit, I frankly would have filed and let them determine whether to deny as a manufacturing defect. I wouldn't have said anything untrue, just that I bought it and it arrived and has this damage. At least they would have paid to have it analyzed. You though only have three choices. You can sue, but you have no case that I see. Second choice is to sell as is. Third choice is to get it fixed and then decide further. Deep down, you know you screwed up. Forgive yourself and move on. We make mistakes and they're painful. Sometimes they even involve being taken advantage of. Still we learn and move on.

This is not a new story. This story has been on Trawler Forum before. The victim wants the manufacture to pay. The manufacture is not responsible for the damage. The victim was informed by members on this forum to turn the claim over to his insurance company. He either did not have insurance or he is afraid the insurance will go after the real culprit and that is not what he wants. The story we get here is so biased and one sided that it is miss leading. I have seen no naval architecture reports showing how much structural glass should have been laid up. Just non architecture opinions. At least some one was smart enough to recognize that there is a balance between weight and structure needed to keep the boat trailerable and to achieve the operating speed that the customer base is looking for. We have learned nothing here at all.

I am not even a fan of Ranger Tugs.

tiltrider1 said:

This is not a new story. This story has been on Trawler Forum before. The victim wants the manufacture to pay. The manufacture is not responsible for the damage. The victim was informed by members on this forum to turn the claim over to his insurance company. He either did not have insurance or he is afraid the insurance will go after the real culprit and that is not what he wants. The story we get here is so biased and one sided that it is miss leading. I have seen no naval architecture reports showing how much structural glass should have been laid up. Just non architecture opinions. At least some one was smart enough to recognize that there is a balance between weight and structure needed to keep the boat trailerable and to achieve the operating speed that the customer base is looking for. We have learned nothing here at all.

I am not even a fan of Ranger Tugs.

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I agree 100% and the so-called victim would rather rage at everyone than solve the problem.

Hey, this is America. It's always someone else's fault.

Of course, the real question here is ... why on earth did you carve two huge holes through your hull?