Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 08-30-2020, 01:27 PM   #1
Guru
 
ScottC's Avatar
 
City: Malmö
Vessel Name: ABsolutely FABulous
Vessel Model: Greenline 33 Hybrid (2010)
Join Date: Nov 2019
Posts: 1,255
Greenline Hybrid: Solar Panel, Solar Charging & Propulsion Battery Discussions

Now that we have a new, dedicated area for Greenline/Solar/Hybrid discussion, I thought I would start this thread with an eye toward aggregating Solar Panel, Solar Charging & Propulsion Battery Discussions (for all models) - in order to make it easier for those that might be doing research in the future. Not sure if this type of "organization" will work or not, but will try and see what happens.


Prior to the creation of this dedicated Greenline area, there have been some relevant solar panel/charging discussions elsewhere in the forum. They can be found here:


https://www.trawlerforum.com/forums/...tml#post872340

https://www.trawlerforum.com/forums/...lar-51605.html
__________________
Scott
2010 Greenline 33' Hybrid
Home port: Malmö, SWEDEN
Currently in: Valletta, MALTA
ScottC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-30-2020, 02:07 PM   #2
Valued Technical Contributor
 
DavidM's Avatar
 
City: Litchfield, Ct
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 6,378
Well ok, now that we have a half dozen threads to kibitz here goes my technical analysis of operating on batteries and solar:

A general rule of thumb is that it takes 1.5 hp per thousand pounds of displacement to move a displacement hull at its hull speed or half of that at a knot slower. So that is about 8 hp at 6.5kts. The battery has about 10 KWhr usable. The motor is probably more efficient than most so lets figure 80%. So the battery should be able to run it for a bit more than an hour.

If all you do is cocktail cruises around your harbor for an hour or so then the Greenline will work for you. But a Duffy 22 will be much cheaper and arguably better suited for cocktail cruises.

So how about solar to keep you going. That 8 hp takes about 8 Kw to drive it. That would require about 16,000 watts of solar panels to keep up considering solar angles during the day. You might fit a couple of thousand watts at best on the roof. You can't even begin to keep up at mid day.

So the hybrid Greenline is best to use the motor to get out of the marina a few miles and then switch to diesel when in open water. Or cruse for an hour on battery, drop the hook for a day or so to recharge and then cruise back home on battery power.

Why bother? Modern common rail diesels are reasonably eco friendly and don't smoke any more. I can't see much advantage to the battery/motor/solar panels.

David
DavidM is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 08-30-2020, 02:24 PM   #3
Guru
 
ScottC's Avatar
 
City: Malmö
Vessel Name: ABsolutely FABulous
Vessel Model: Greenline 33 Hybrid (2010)
Join Date: Nov 2019
Posts: 1,255
HI David,


Your general technical assessment isn't far off the mark from my experience. Being the technical guy that you are, then you also understand that speed (i.e. rate of power consumption from the battery) can dramatically affect cruising time on electric. If I want to go "max" at 5.5-6.0 knots, then I'm out of battery power in 75 minutes. If I go 3.5-4.0 knots, as is the speed limit in many canals, then I'm good for 3-4 hours. If it's a sunny day, I can go ~2.2 knots on solar alone. Admittedly, not so exciting, but it is a form of get-home option that's nice to have. I actually had to rely on that once, when my diesel failed.

People buy Greenline Hybrids for various reasons. For me, I like the silence of using electric when I can. I like the low-speed/low-torque precision electric provides for maneuvering in marinas and locks. I also like having household AC current available 24/7 without having to run a generator.

I'm not trying to sell Greenlines or Solar/Hybrid options. I've created this thread simply for Greenline owners to discuss their hybrid experiences and issues, as the complexities are a step-up from traditional diesel-only boats.
__________________
Scott
2010 Greenline 33' Hybrid
Home port: Malmö, SWEDEN
Currently in: Valletta, MALTA
ScottC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-30-2020, 02:48 PM   #4
TF Site Team
 
Bacchus's Avatar
 
City: Seneca Lake NY
Vessel Name: Bacchus
Vessel Model: MS 34 HT Trawler
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 6,664
Quote:
Originally Posted by ScottC View Post
Now that we have a new, dedicated area for Greenline/Solar/Hybrid discussion, I thought I would start this thread with an eye toward aggregating Solar Panel, Solar Charging & Propulsion Battery Discussions (for all models) - in order to make it easier for those that might be doing research in the future. Not sure if this type of "organization" will work or not, but will try and see what happens.


Prior to the creation of this dedicated Greenline area, there have been some relevant solar panel/charging discussions elsewhere in the forum. They can be found here:


https://www.trawlerforum.com/forums/...tml#post872340

https://www.trawlerforum.com/forums/...lar-51605.html
Scott
That sort of organization certainly works and makes finding items of interest much easier - it does take some time & effort to keep things up.
Here is an example of what one of the RV forum members has done / keeps doing for owners of Newmar MHs so we can find items of interest.

https://www.irv2.com/forums/f103/ori...ods-18509.html
__________________
Don
2008 MS 34 HT Trawler
"Bacchus"
Bacchus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-30-2020, 09:16 PM   #5
Member
 
City: FL
Vessel Name: Solaris
Vessel Model: Greenline 39
Join Date: Aug 2020
Posts: 9
12 volt solar system addition

Here's some info on our one major modification to our Greenline 39:


We spend a lot of time at anchor and we felt the 12v charging system could be improved a little. The factory system takes the 48v lithium battery, converts to 120v, then through a charger to the six 12v batteries. Of course there is some loss (maybe 10% or so) for each conversion. (Not super efficient) We added 200 watts of solar to the forward top, forward of the sliding hatches along with a dedicated victron mppt solar charger. This is all completely separate from the factory systems. Now the factory solar and lithium battery is used only for 120volt power and boat propulsion. We can last a lot longer on the hook without recharging using the diesel. The 120v powered battery charger has not been changed and is used to charge the 12v batteries when we have shore power.



An added benefit is when the boat is not used for a few months the new 12v solar system keeps the 12v batteries topped off and the lithium can be disconnected completely. (Lithium batteries last longer if not kept at 100%. 40-50% is best for long term storage.)



Hope this might be useful for others.



J.
Solaris is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-31-2020, 09:52 AM   #6
Guru
 
Ken E.'s Avatar
 
City: Bellingham WA
Vessel Name: Hatt Trick
Vessel Model: 45' Hatteras Convertible
Join Date: Nov 2016
Posts: 1,797
Scott, many of us know nothing about this type of boat, me included, so I find this educational.

Diesel-electric drives have been around a long time, as in submarines and modern-day locomotives
How do they differ from your boat and others like it?
__________________
Ken on Hatt Trick
Ken E. is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 08-31-2020, 10:05 AM   #7
Guru
 
ScottC's Avatar
 
City: Malmö
Vessel Name: ABsolutely FABulous
Vessel Model: Greenline 33 Hybrid (2010)
Join Date: Nov 2019
Posts: 1,255
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken E. View Post
Scott, many of us know nothing about this type of boat, me included, so I find this educational.

Diesel-electric drives have been around a long time, as in submarines and modern-day locomotives
How do they differ from your boat and others like it?

Hi Ken,
I have read, over the years, about various alternatives for "marrying" diesel and electric. I really don't have the knowledge or experience with these different methods to make an intelligent recommendation on which strategy might be best.


As for the GL33, it's a normal turbo diesel engine connected, in line, via a special clutch to an electric motor (which is also a generator). With this setup, one can cruise on either diesel or electric, but not both. Hope that illuminates a bit.


This little promotional video gives a pretty good overview of what I'm trying to explain -- starting at about 1:18.





Best regards,


Scott
__________________
Scott
2010 Greenline 33' Hybrid
Home port: Malmö, SWEDEN
Currently in: Valletta, MALTA
ScottC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-27-2020, 03:54 PM   #8
Member
 
City: Mars
Vessel Name: TBD
Vessel Model: TBD
Join Date: Sep 2020
Posts: 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by ScottC View Post

[...]
I like the silence of using electric when I can. I like the low-speed/low-torque precision electric provides for maneuvering in marinas and locks. I also like having household AC current available 24/7 without having to run a generator.

I'm not trying to sell Greenlines or Solar/Hybrid options. I've created this thread simply for Greenline owners to discuss their hybrid experiences and issues, as the complexities are a step-up from traditional diesel-only boats.
[...]

I have to enthusiastically second Scott's note about silence, and about operating off-grid without a generator. Looked at from dollars alone, with current technologies, your ROI on fuel savings will never recoup the investment. The value is in the experience of being in and experiencing nature, which is what draws me to boating in the first place. And there is value to me in knowing that if I want to take a short jaunt I am not stressing cold engines or contributing CO2 for my enjoyment.

For me, once I learned how to maximize the benefits of a hybrid auto on my old commute, I understood the trade-offs much better, and feel like I 'get' how to use a hybrid boat in a way that delivers that quality of life, even if it costs more to buy and costs no less to get from A to B when it's over 20 miles.

Okay, enough for now. Like Scott, I'm not repping the brand. I am an enthusiast, though. Apologies in advance. ;-)
rallison is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-02-2021, 01:56 PM   #9
Member
 
City: Punta Gorda
Join Date: Feb 2021
Posts: 8
Victron MPPT 150/35

My Greenline 33 2014 had two relays for solar charging that did not work.

Replaced them with a VictronConnect Smart Solar MPPT 150/35 .It has the feature to transform solar cell voltages in the 60+ range to lipo battery voltage at the time . This increase in the amperage is of course as wattage is the same minus the less than 1% loss.

In sunny southwest Florida daily 3.5 to 4.5 kw go into the LIPO to replace refrigeration and cooking power consumption
Rich J is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-02-2021, 02:07 PM   #10
Member
 
City: FL
Vessel Name: Solaris
Vessel Model: Greenline 39
Join Date: Aug 2020
Posts: 9
Hi Rich,


We are here just south of you in Ft Myers. Our 2018 Greenline 39 came from the factory with that same Victron solar charger for our 4 panels. I added the bluetooth module that just plugs in and adds bluetooth connectivity. (most of the newer victron solar controllers have it built in) From the cell phone victron app I can monitor charging, view 30 day history, and change settings. It's great and I can even turn off charging entirely. I do that after getting back to our slip to keep the lipo at less than 80% in order to extend their life.


Solaris







Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich J View Post
My Greenline 33 2014 had two relays for solar charging that did not work.

Replaced them with a VictronConnect Smart Solar MPPT 150/35 .It has the feature to transform solar cell voltages in the 60+ range to lipo battery voltage at the time . This increase in the amperage is of course as wattage is the same minus the less than 1% loss.

In sunny southwest Florida daily 3.5 to 4.5 kw go into the LIPO to replace refrigeration and cooking power consumption
Solaris is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-02-2021, 04:26 PM   #11
FWT
Guru
 
City: Centreville MD
Vessel Model: Helmsman Trawlers 38E
Join Date: Dec 2020
Posts: 1,026
The worst nightmare of electric vehicles.

Electrical systems in general for that matter.

FWT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2021, 11:33 AM   #12
Guru
 
ScottC's Avatar
 
City: Malmö
Vessel Name: ABsolutely FABulous
Vessel Model: Greenline 33 Hybrid (2010)
Join Date: Nov 2019
Posts: 1,255
Quote:
Originally Posted by FWT View Post
The worst nightmare of electric vehicles.

Electrical systems in general for that matter.




This is why you want to make sure you can easily monitor the status (voltage and resistance) of each of the (probably many) cells that make up your battery. If one cell starts to fail/short out, then that's where overheating and risk can begin to escalate.
__________________
Scott
2010 Greenline 33' Hybrid
Home port: Malmö, SWEDEN
Currently in: Valletta, MALTA
ScottC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2021, 11:49 AM   #13
Guru
 
ScottC's Avatar
 
City: Malmö
Vessel Name: ABsolutely FABulous
Vessel Model: Greenline 33 Hybrid (2010)
Join Date: Nov 2019
Posts: 1,255
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich J View Post
My Greenline 33 2014 had two relays for solar charging that did not work.

Replaced them with a VictronConnect Smart Solar MPPT 150/35 .It has the feature to transform solar cell voltages in the 60+ range to lipo battery voltage at the time . This increase in the amperage is of course as wattage is the same minus the less than 1% loss.

In sunny southwest Florida daily 3.5 to 4.5 kw go into the LIPO to replace refrigeration and cooking power consumption



My 2010 GL33 came originally with an Outback solar MPPT controller/charger. While it did the job, I was never very happy with it. It was especially annoying that it would frequently lose all custom settings and go back to the Outback factory defaults fairly often. Never figured out why. But, I would be alerted to the fact that this had happened when the BMS alarm went off after shutting everything down to prevent overcharging (as the default Outback voltage limit was too high).


At SVP's (GL Manufacturer) recommendation, I ended up replacing the Outback with a Victron Solar 150/45 MPPT for my 6 panels and have been VERY pleased with it. I added the Blue Tooth dongle as well so I could monitor the data from my smartphone.
__________________
Scott
2010 Greenline 33' Hybrid
Home port: Malmö, SWEDEN
Currently in: Valletta, MALTA
ScottC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-04-2021, 01:05 AM   #14
Member
 
City: Los Angeles
Join Date: Feb 2021
Posts: 11
True, but diesel fuel is far more flammable than batteries.

https://abc7news.com/boat-fire-alame...tuary/5723120/
DDevlinJr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-04-2021, 11:28 PM   #15
Veteran Member
 
City: Monterey Bay
Vessel Name: Swan Song
Vessel Model: Greenline 33 Hybrid '14
Join Date: Mar 2021
Posts: 37
Quote:
Originally Posted by ScottC View Post
Now that we have a new, dedicated area for Greenline/Solar/Hybrid discussion, I thought I would start this thread with an eye toward aggregating Solar Panel, Solar Charging & Propulsion Battery Discussions (for all models) - in order to make it easier for those that might be doing research in the future. Not sure if this type of "organization" will work or not, but will try and see what happens.


Prior to the creation of this dedicated Greenline area, there have been some relevant solar panel/charging discussions elsewhere in the forum. They can be found here:


https://www.trawlerforum.com/forums/...tml#post872340

https://www.trawlerforum.com/forums/...lar-51605.html
Help needed from ScottC, and/or other GL Hybrid owners! I've just joined the forum, and have owned a '14 GL Hybrid for nearly two years - bought in cherry condition from Paul Kaplan, owner of KKMI yacht yard on San Fran Bay as his personal craft, only 231 EH on the VW 165TDi - and now a couple hundred more, including a 750mi round-trip down from Monterey to S. CA, Channel Is., turning around at Catalina Is.'s fabled Avalon.

Normal in every respect operationally and maintained by the book, I've just had a failure 2 days ago of the electric propulsion system using it to come back the last 5mi. or so to the marina: It started up normally with after the 5sec. or so delay as the electro-hydraulic clutch engaged to separate the 7kW in-line motor from the diesel's clutch disk. But I noticed erratic operation, with decreasing but varying amperage draw from the 48V lithium bank at about 2/3 throttle. I shut it down and went back in under diesel. There was little 48V amperage being generated, but that's normal when the batt. is fully charged, near it's 54.4V max.

The autopsy today: I'm a hands-on guy, and very familiar w/ diesels and electrics and have digested the complex manual pretty well, I think, and suspected that the clutch actuator may have leaked out it's dot-4 brake fluid. I check it every several months, always OK, as it was today, a quarter inch over the min. mark. But went ahead and purged several cycles, with a few initial bubbles in the drain tube, then several ounces clear - but no change operationally. And on first putting it into gear dockside advancing to about half throttle, a brief red light and error message I couldn't read on the hybrid control monitor, then back green. No blown fuses in the hybrid box, and relays seemed to function normally.

I checked the motor/gen (7/5kW) generator output by turning off dock power, and turning on AC, boiler kettle, and microwave to draw batt. down below 52.8V which triggers the gen. and started the diesel, grad. increasing to 2000RPM where it's capable of 100A @ nom. 48V, and it acted normally, putting out 60A which rapidly brought up the voltage, and tapering down the output. So good news, at least we can go to sea without the elect. motor, as planned next month for another S. Cal. cruise, unless this is a portent of worse news to come...

So Dr. and magician ScottC, where do we go from here to diagnose the motor problem? One more thing I tried - with hybrid motor on and in gear with throttle advanced, I was able to turn the prop shaft freely, so it doesn't seem that the clutch plates have fused together, but I only turned it 90 deg. or so before my elderly body said "Enough, you idiot!"
Thanks for any and all suggestions.
PeterB40 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-05-2021, 03:36 PM   #16
Guru
 
ScottC's Avatar
 
City: Malmö
Vessel Name: ABsolutely FABulous
Vessel Model: Greenline 33 Hybrid (2010)
Join Date: Nov 2019
Posts: 1,255
Hi PeterB40,

You're diagnostic capabilities are excellent, Peter! You are on the right track. What you describe is something I've been through -- twice. I know others who have been through this as well. I think the newer Greenlines are using a different (and hopefully improved) clutch actuator mechanism.

There is a master cylinder (which is what I think you were observing in your description above, as that's where the fluid reservoir is). The cylinder is known to corrode and leak. There is also a "slave" cylinder inside the clutch housing that can also leak. Rebuilding the master cylinder is not so difficult, but rebuilding the slave is a pain. I had my local boat yard do this (they know diesels, but are not a GL dealer). The clutch housing needs to be removed from the engine to access and replace the slave. Invariably, the clutch plates will be covered with fluid from the leak and, thus, somewhat slippery. Both times, my yard recommended replacing the clutch plates rather than trying to clean them. So cleaning might work...but if it doesn't, one has to take apart the clutch housing again.

As for obtaining these cylinders and pistons, my yard obtained them from Brunswick Marine, which I believe is a global operation. You might best start asking your closest Greenline dealer about getting these parts. I worry that they may soon become in short supply, if that’s not already the case. I am kicking myself for not buying some extras the last time around. When you get your hands on the pistons, look for any “shelf life” date on the box. One of these my yard received had just “expired”. I don’t know how critical this is, really, but my yard sent it back to get a newer one. I suppose there is a possibility that the rubber gets a bit too stiff when old. Why take chances using an old one, unless it’s the only part you can get your hands on!

I have a couple of related documents I got directly from the Factory in Slovenia many years ago. I think you might find them useful. I have uploaded one here. The other, at 7mb is too large for TF upload. If you send me a PM (Private Message) with your e-mail address, I will send it to you.

Regarding bleeding – I’m not sure how you went about it. The documents above will explain how to do it properly. You might be able to buy a little more time before getting into the big work by doing a full and proper bleeding. Just be aware of the “tip” I’ve provided below.
I have also learned a bit of a short cut for bleeding. Rather than manually fussing with the master cylinder piston, you can use the hybrid switch at the helm to do this work for you (you will need an assistant at the helm while you’re working the bleed valve).

One tip – something you should be aware of. It is possible for the slave cylinder to leak – just a bit, but not to the extent that you notice it by not being able to disengage the clutch. I painfully became aware of this once when I was in heavy seas running on diesel. The conditions and the current demanded more power. I kept applying more throttle, but the results were very limited. I assumed it was just because of the heavy seas and current. Wrong. Not long after, I had no forward motion at all and the cabin smelled of burning something (I did not know that it was the clutch I was smelling at the time). I shut the diesel down and contemplated calling the coast guard for a tow. Before that, however, on a whim, I decided see what would happen in electric mode. That worked a charm. Electric is not normally what one would use in 2-3 foot seas on a GL33, but it was enough to get me ~5nm to my boat yard.

I wish you good luck as you work through this.
Attached Files
File Type: pdf GL33 bleeding clutch hyd_sys.pdf (611.3 KB, 22 views)
__________________
Scott
2010 Greenline 33' Hybrid
Home port: Malmö, SWEDEN
Currently in: Valletta, MALTA
ScottC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-05-2021, 06:24 PM   #17
Veteran Member
 
City: Monterey Bay
Vessel Name: Swan Song
Vessel Model: Greenline 33 Hybrid '14
Join Date: Mar 2021
Posts: 37
Quote:
Originally Posted by ScottC View Post
Hi PeterB40,

You're diagnostic capabilities are excellent, Peter! You are on the right track. What you describe is something I've been through -- twice. I know others who have been through this as well. I think the newer Greenlines are using a different (and hopefully improved) clutch actuator mechanism.

There is a master cylinder (which is what I think you were observing in your description above, as that's where the fluid reservoir is). The cylinder is known to corrode and leak. There is also a "slave" cylinder inside the clutch housing that can also leak. Rebuilding the master cylinder is not so difficult, but rebuilding the slave is a pain. I had my local boat yard do this (they know diesels, but are not a GL dealer). The clutch housing needs to be removed from the engine to access and replace the slave. Invariably, the clutch plates will be covered with fluid from the leak and, thus, somewhat slippery. Both times, my yard recommended replacing the clutch plates rather than trying to clean them. So cleaning might work...but if it doesn't, one has to take apart the clutch housing again.

As for obtaining these cylinders and pistons, my yard obtained them from Brunswick Marine, which I believe is a global operation. You might best start asking your closest Greenline dealer about getting these parts. I worry that they may soon become in short supply, if that’s not already the case. I am kicking myself for not buying some extras the last time around. When you get your hands on the pistons, look for any “shelf life” date on the box. One of these my yard received had just “expired”. I don’t know how critical this is, really, but my yard sent it back to get a newer one. I suppose there is a possibility that the rubber gets a bit too stiff when old. Why take chances using an old one, unless it’s the only part you can get your hands on!

I have a couple of related documents I got directly from the Factory in Slovenia many years ago. I think you might find them useful. I have uploaded one here. The other, at 7mb is too large for TF upload. If you send me a PM (Private Message) with your e-mail address, I will send it to you.

Regarding bleeding – I’m not sure how you went about it. The documents above will explain how to do it properly. You might be able to buy a little more time before getting into the big work by doing a full and proper bleeding. Just be aware of the “tip” I’ve provided below.
I have also learned a bit of a short cut for bleeding. Rather than manually fussing with the master cylinder piston, you can use the hybrid switch at the helm to do this work for you (you will need an assistant at the helm while you’re working the bleed valve).

One tip – something you should be aware of. It is possible for the slave cylinder to leak – just a bit, but not to the extent that you notice it by not being able to disengage the clutch. I painfully became aware of this once when I was in heavy seas running on diesel. The conditions and the current demanded more power. I kept applying more throttle, but the results were very limited. I assumed it was just because of the heavy seas and current. Wrong. Not long after, I had no forward motion at all and the cabin smelled of burning something (I did not know that it was the clutch I was smelling at the time). I shut the diesel down and contemplated calling the coast guard for a tow. Before that, however, on a whim, I decided see what would happen in electric mode. That worked a charm. Electric is not normally what one would use in 2-3 foot seas on a GL33, but it was enough to get me ~5nm to my boat yard.

I wish you good luck as you work through this.
Thanks for your prompt reply, Scott! Since I didn't seem to have lost signifcant fluid from the master cyl. resevoir, I'm wondering (and hoping!) that it's its piston's O-rings, or whatever other piston seal is used, has failed and the fluid just passes the piston rather than compressing. I did use the simple method of actuating the hybrid mode repeatedly rather than un-pinning the actuator arm as described in the hybrid system manual. I see that the manual lists the master cylinder part as VW: 701 721 401 B.

What did you end up replacing?

Oh, tried to PM you my e-mail address, but the forum refused to send it. Ill try again with a little modification.
PeterB40 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-06-2021, 08:23 AM   #18
Guru
 
ScottC's Avatar
 
City: Malmö
Vessel Name: ABsolutely FABulous
Vessel Model: Greenline 33 Hybrid (2010)
Join Date: Nov 2019
Posts: 1,255
Quote:
Originally Posted by PeterB40 View Post
Thanks for your prompt reply, Scott! Since I didn't seem to have lost signifcant fluid from the master cyl. resevoir, I'm wondering (and hoping!) that it's its piston's O-rings, or whatever other piston seal is used, has failed and the fluid just passes the piston rather than compressing. I did use the simple method of actuating the hybrid mode repeatedly rather than un-pinning the actuator arm as described in the hybrid system manual. I see that the manual lists the master cylinder part as VW: 701 721 401 B.

What did you end up replacing?

Oh, tried to PM you my e-mail address, but the forum refused to send it. Ill try again with a little modification.
Hi Peter,

Trawler Forum (TF), for some reason, does not let new users include mail or web addresses in posts and personal messages from the very start. Just wait a week or so (or maybe a few dozen posts) and you will be able to include these things in your posts and messages.

You are lucky that you were furnished with some type of manual with this kind of detail. All I received with my boat was the basic operation manual. It didn't mention anything about bleeding or VW part numbers. I would be very interested in having a copy of that manual, if you have it in electronic format!

I replaced the master cylinder/piston assembly (one time) and the slave assembly twice. There is a little more to this story. It was the end of the summer after the first slave unit replacement that I had the "burning clutch" event I described earlier. Why was the clutch slipping? I thought it unlikely that it was due to the relatively new slave cylinder. Could there have been some adjustment that was not optimal after the last time the clutch was apart?? I will never know the real cause -- but I do know that I sure didn't help it any by continuing to run hard while the clutch, was slipping and burning. Now I know the warning signs and will never let the situation get this bad again. So, my clutch had to be replaced and I was advised to replace the fairly new slave cylinder assembly again, since it had been exposed to such high temperatures. Was this replacement really necessary? This too, I will never know. I wanted to play it safe, so I had it replaced.
__________________
Scott
2010 Greenline 33' Hybrid
Home port: Malmö, SWEDEN
Currently in: Valletta, MALTA
ScottC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-06-2021, 08:48 AM   #19
Guru
 
ScottC's Avatar
 
City: Malmö
Vessel Name: ABsolutely FABulous
Vessel Model: Greenline 33 Hybrid (2010)
Join Date: Nov 2019
Posts: 1,255
I ended up relocating my reservoir to a more accessible location where I can easily keep an eye on it. See pix. (Click on pictures to enlarge).
Attached Thumbnails
R1.jpg   R2.jpg  
__________________
Scott
2010 Greenline 33' Hybrid
Home port: Malmö, SWEDEN
Currently in: Valletta, MALTA
ScottC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-06-2021, 01:46 PM   #20
Veteran Member
 
City: Monterey Bay
Vessel Name: Swan Song
Vessel Model: Greenline 33 Hybrid '14
Join Date: Mar 2021
Posts: 37
Quote:
Originally Posted by ScottC View Post
Hi Peter,

Trawler Forum (TF), for some reason, does not let new users include mail or web addresses in posts and personal messages from the very start. Just wait a week or so (or maybe a few dozen posts) and you will be able to include these things in your posts and messages.

You are lucky that you were furnished with some type of manual with this kind of detail. All I received with my boat was the basic operation manual. It didn't mention anything about bleeding or VW part numbers. I would be very interested in having a copy of that manual, if you have it in electronic format!

I replaced the master cylinder/piston assembly (one time) and the slave assembly twice. There is a little more to this story. It was the end of the summer after the first slave unit replacement that I had the "burning clutch" event I described earlier. Why was the clutch slipping? I thought it unlikely that it was due to the relatively new slave cylinder. Could there have been some adjustment that was not optimal after the last time the clutch was apart?? I will never know the real cause -- but I do know that I sure didn't help it any by continuing to run hard while the clutch, was slipping and burning. Now I know the warning signs and will never let the situation get this bad again. So, my clutch had to be replaced and I was advised to replace the fairly new slave cylinder assembly again, since it had been exposed to such high temperatures. Was this replacement really necessary? This too, I will never know. I wanted to play it safe, so I had it replaced.
Man, what an ordeal! The one thing that confounds me on the exploded pic below of the whole motor/gen unit is why there's a clutch at the tranny end in addition to the engine clutch? The engine clutch is the one that must be open for the elect. motor to function, as well as the other one closed. And in diesel power, the the tranny clutch must be closed also for pass-through power to prop. So which clutch burned up in your case? I figure it must have been the engine side that the slave cyl. disengages, as in an automotive application. Turns out the master cyl. unit is a VW manual trans. van part that I've just ordered - $100. Removal/re-installation of the whole motor/gen. unit is a real hassle. Did you do this yourself? Thanks for the detailed, well-illustrated .pdf!

The "Letrika" manual is a highly detailed, well illustrated 42 pg. booklet that I couldn't find a link for. Turns out Letrika has been sold to Mahle, of Germany. I'll PM you scans of of specs, error codes, etc. by PM if you wish.
Thanks again!
Attached Thumbnails
img822.jpg   img823.jpg  
PeterB40 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
battery, charging, greenline, hybrid, solar

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


» Trawler Port Captains
Port Captains are TF volunteers who can serve as local guides or assist with local arrangements and information. Search below to locate Port Captains near your destination. To learn more about this program read here: TF Port Captain Program





All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:25 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2022, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2006 - 2012