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Old 02-03-2021, 08:19 AM   #1
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Understanding the Coronavirus (2)

For those who are still interested in the topic.

Katalin Kariko, the scientist behind the Pfizer Covid-19 vaccine.
When trials found the Pfizer-BioNTech coronavirus vaccine to be safe and 95 percent effective in November, it was the crowning achievement of Katalin Kariko’s 40 years of research on the genetic code RNA (ribonucleic acid) and Drew Weissman, MD, PhD, a professor of Infectious Diseases in Penn’s Perelman School of Medicine.

The Pfizer/BioNTech and Moderna COVID-19 mRNA vaccines both use licensed University of Pennsylvania technology.

https://www.pennmedicine.org/news/ne...ional-research
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Old 02-03-2021, 10:03 AM   #2
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Hopefully these scientists and researchers will receive the recognition they deserve for their work. It sound like the research will be effective in the battle combating future virus strains.
Thanks for this information.
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Old 02-03-2021, 10:23 AM   #3
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Thank you Pilou! That was interesting again. It looks as though this technology has tremendous possibilities for our future, as well as being rapidly adaptable to potential mutations in the Covid-19 virus. Bill
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Old 02-03-2021, 11:16 AM   #4
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Was aware of this. We always stand on the shoulders of giants. Glad you’re back.

Although operation warp speed was all to the good it’s interesting that the applied science involved occurred in the main in the absence of the parties involved accepting US federal funds via warp speed. Big pharma and bench scientists saw a economic opportunity on one hand and a intellectual opportunity on the other so proceeded accordingly. It’s striking Moderna and others opted out. We see the results of decades of research.
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Old 02-03-2021, 12:29 PM   #5
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Katalin Kariko's story is amazing:

https://www.businessinsider.com/mrna...avirus-2020-12
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Old 02-03-2021, 01:21 PM   #6
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Hopefully these scientists and researchers will receive the recognition they deserve for their work. It sound like the research will be effective in the battle combating future virus strains.
Thanks for this information.

You said it. Those workers behind the scenes are doing a tremendous job what few people realize, from 1989 when the Biotechnology company Vical from San Diego CA succeeded in including a mRNA in a lipid nanoparticle then in introducing it into several cell types, to nowadays. We owe them a lot.

Also I hope that others countries would be aware of how much we owe to the USA. The first confirmed U.S. case associated with Sars-CoV-2 WA1 virus strain was isolated in Washington state on January 15, 2020. In Europe, the first diagnosed case occurred in an employee of an automobile supplier who visited the company’s headquarters in Bavaria, Germany, on January 20, 2020. It was only 2 months later, on March 16, 2020 that a clinical trial of investigational vaccine for Covid-19 begun at KPWHRI (Kaiser Permanente Washington Health Research Institute) in Seattle. Just amazing.
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Old 02-03-2021, 01:21 PM   #7
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Thank you Pilou! That was interesting again. It looks as though this technology has tremendous possibilities for our future, as well as being rapidly adaptable to potential mutations in the Covid-19 virus. Bill

Yes Bill. Since the last 10 years mRNA vaccines are already playing a crucial role to combat several types of cancer. Also they represent a promising alternative to conventional vaccine approaches against infectious diseases.
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Old 02-03-2021, 01:23 PM   #8
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Was aware of this. We always stand on the shoulders of giants. Glad you’re back.

Although operation warp speed was all to the good it’s interesting that the applied science involved occurred in the main in the absence of the parties involved accepting US federal funds via warp speed. Big pharma and bench scientists saw a economic opportunity on one hand and a intellectual opportunity on the other so proceeded accordingly. It’s striking Moderna and others opted out. We see the results of decades of research.

Thank you . "We always stand on the shoulders of giants". I like that.
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Old 02-03-2021, 01:27 PM   #9
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Indeed it is. Thanks Murray for posting this link that pays tribute to her professional background also her personal path.
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Old 02-03-2021, 03:12 PM   #10
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Thank you.
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Old 02-03-2021, 03:13 PM   #11
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Thank you . "We always stand on the shoulders of giants". I like that.
Yes, thank you.
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Old 02-03-2021, 06:50 PM   #12
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In Israel data showed today that 3,207,157 people have already had the first dose of the vaccine, including 1,844,206 who have also had the second shot. More detailed figures will be interesting to see. Despite over three weeks of lockdown and a world-leading vaccination program, Israel has seen daily virus caseloads remain high, 40% of cases are in kids.

Prof. Nachman Ash, Israel's National Coronavirus Project Coordinator (formerly Israel Defense Force Chief Medical Officer) said officials estimate some 40-50 percent of new daily cases are caused by the British variant.

Since the Pfizer vaccine being used in Israel expires quickly after being removed from deep freeze, at least one provider - The Clalit health - was forced to throw away around 1,000 expired doses.
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Old 02-03-2021, 07:21 PM   #13
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While I agree that the mRna vaccines are an incredible scientific accomplishment. There are some concerns https://www.americasfrontlinedoctors.com/vaccines/

The video is a little long but brings up some valid points. That said both my wife and I chose to be vaccinated with the Moderna vaccine.
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Old 02-03-2021, 09:27 PM   #14
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Understanding Coronavirus 2 Guidelines

NOTICE:

The “Understanding The Coronavirus” thread has been a valuable resource but has, at times, become contentious and has been closed.

This “Understanding The Coronavirus 2” will continue with an emphasis on understanding and education.
Sharing and discussion of science based information is encouraged.

Posts that are off topic or otherwise distracting may be deleted to maintain a friendly, informative and civil exchange.
Anyone wishing to discuss topics outside of these guidelines are encouraged to start separate Covid discussions they feel appropriate.

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Old 02-03-2021, 10:46 PM   #15
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Since the Pfizer vaccine being used in Israel expires quickly after being removed from deep freeze, at least one provider - The Clalit health - was forced to throw away around 1,000 expired doses.
There have been vaccines wasted and thrown away in the US as well. Now more recently, one major vaccine facility with vaccines about to expire and having vaccinated their appointments for the day, decided they've vaccinate anyone, but were not going to let them go to waste.

There can be an interesting debate of whether you vaccine those most vulnerable or those most likely to spread the virus. As the intent is to focus on saving lives, we're all vaccinating those most vulnerable and the health care workers most in contact with them. We have to work through those groups and then we'll be able to vaccine younger, more active, more likely to spread the virus persons.

In the US, the availability of the vaccines is rapidly increasing both in total number and in locations with it available.

With Pfizer and Moderna around 95% efficacy, how do you see the introduction of other vaccines going, such as Astra Zeneca and Johnson and Johnson. Looks like Johnson and Johnson will be next available in the US with efficacy of 66%. These are more traditional vaccines with more traditional numbers.

Another advantage of Pfizer and Moderna's vaccines is the ease with which they can be modified for variants.
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Old 02-04-2021, 10:33 AM   #16
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When considering vaccines there’s two ways to look at it.

From the personal perspective. How effective is this vaccine in preventing my death, hospitalization, severe illness, any illness, long term sequalae? Think about polio. If you get a mild URI you don’t much care. If you’re left paralyzed you do. If your respiratory muscles are paralyzed so you’re vent dependent you do. If you die or have premature death you do.

Now that perspective is entirely different than the public health perspective. Here you’re concerned about two main issues. What’s the impact of the vaccine on the R. Any vaccine that is 50% or greater in efficacy in preventing transmission will drive the R down over time. The more effective the faster the pandemic becomes a endemic infection. Any vaccine that’s 50% or greater in preventing severe disease will allow the society to continue to function and economic drain on the society will diminish with time. The more effective the quicker.
The other concern is escape. The fewer being infected the less the opportunity for vaccine escape. Here again impact on rate of new infections (incidence not prevalence) and not mortality or morbidity is more important. New infections offer new opportunities for new mutations in new hosts. Caveat is transformation to a indolent non lethal infection does as well. To date we’ve yet to see mutations that follow that clinical course.
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Old 02-04-2021, 12:31 PM   #17
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At the hospital's virologist lab where I work, we have eyes on Israel because the country is the first full-scale test in the real life moreover with perhaps the optimum management approach of Covid-19 vaccination so far. What we can see now is that the vaccine drive is slowing since 3 days which recently leaded to throw away more than 1000 vaccine doses. It's a great concern to us all.

Indeed vaccination providers are now facing increasingly difficulties to get people to come to be vaccinated. It's not the rate of vaccinations for over 60s what is concerning, it has leveled off because many people in that age group have already been vaccinated. Also it's not the people's fear of a possible suffering from common side, or of those who don't know what to expect.

Actually it's about the drop in public enthusiasm, I should say the lack of interest, of approved age groups - currently over 35s and ages 16-18 -. Kalanit Kay, who manages the vaccine campaign for Clalit, told Channel 12 "In recent days, we’ve seen a slowdown in vaccinations, in the number of people who are coming in to get their first dose. We sent out messages on Facebook and text messages, for everyone who lives in the area, everyone who thinks they want a vaccine, to come early and get vaccinated,” she said. The calls prompted many more young people to come in for their first dose". So, in the past they lacked vaccines, now they lack people to vaccinate.

It's very good that the U.S. is well improving Covid-19 vaccination. At the same time European nations are trying to deal with a lack of vaccines, struggling to secure supplies for their populations. It's a huge concern, I fear that this lack of vaccine may last for 2 or 3 months. Last week I attended an European meeting about Covid-19 vaccines (2 days ago one media reported the meeting then I can talk about it now) where concerns had been raised about Pfizer facing difficulties in delivering the quantities promised for the early months of the year, Moderna and AstraZeneca had joined Pfizer in announcing delays.

Why this shortage of doses ? actually it seems to be a top secret information !. Because of supposedly political issue in Europe ? too easy, too comfortable justification. Is it EU failure to order enough Covid vaccine ? The answer is definitely "no". Logistics side ? it could be. Manufacturing issue ? Hmmm, yes, but why ? In my opinion, they work on the design of a new jab, I mean a new version of their Covid-19 vaccine targeted at coronavirus variant, or a wide-spectrum one.

Here is why above I commented the situation in Israel. My main concern is what should happen in European countries when vaccines could be available in April or May ? No doubt that elderly people would already been vaccinated at that time. But I am pretty sure that we may meet the same issues than nowadays in Israel, with also younger approved groups showing less enthusiasm for the reason that with summer approaching and its higher temperatures, they may decide to postpone their vaccination until September or October to be protected for autumn and winter. You will see, now we are lacking vaccines, in May or June we will lack people to vaccinate.

To answer your question about other vaccines, you should ask Hippocampus. (editing my post: Good to see that he has already answered). This was one of the main topics of my last week meeting : the EU expects Johnson & Johnson to submit an application for its coronavirus vaccine (Janssen vaccine) "shortly" after it published "promising" results from a large trial. As well many questions have being asked about Hungary agreeing to buy doses of Chinese firm Sinopharm's vaccine, and some about AstraZeneca working on Covid vaccine combinations with Sputnik V vaccine. But as Hippocampus posted in another thread, "Data is Data", scientific evidence relies data. So far not enough data exist about both Chinese firm Sinopharm and Sputnik V vaccines.

That said, one sure thing is that we must continue to develop multiple vaccines using multiple scientific approaches to be able to control or perhaps stop the Covid-19 pandemic.
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Old 02-04-2021, 01:18 PM   #18
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"Data is data."

Trust is huge in this scenario where there is no time to do another full scale trial to verify if a countries data is accurate.

Would I trust Covid-19 vaccine trial data coming out of countries which have a history of government controlled/accepted violations of Olympic anti-doping rules? No way.

I do hope those vaccines are good though, because it will probably be poorer countries that will be ordering them.
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Old 02-04-2021, 01:36 PM   #19
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"Data is data."

Trust is huge in this scenario where there is no time to do another full scale trial to verify if a countries data is accurate.

Would I trust Covid-19 vaccine trial data coming out of countries which have a history of government controlled/accepted violations of Olympic anti-doping rules? No way.

I do hope those vaccines are good though, because it will probably be poorer countries that will be ordering them.
German Health Minister Jens Spahn yesterday confirmed that talks were ongoing with Moscow to explore production capacities for the Sputnik jab in Germany, a country which can’t be rated as one of the poorer countries.
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Old 02-04-2021, 02:06 PM   #20
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German Health Minister Jens Spahn yesterday confirmed that talks were ongoing with Moscow to explore production capacities for the Sputnik jab in Germany, a country which can’t be rated as one of the poorer countries.
I hope my distrust of Russian 'government' is proven wrong.
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