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Old 10-14-2022, 04:01 PM   #41
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We are probably going to replace the existing Norcold DE-0061 in Morning Light with something larger. The Norcold Polar N10DC is out there as well as several possibilities from Isotherm at high prices. We need 24" nominal width and up to 79" height. I'm thinking about a standard residential 110VAC unit.



Does anyone have any thoughts about other 12VDC or 24VDC units in the 10-12 cuft (280-340 liter) range? Any comments on using a standard residential fridge on a boat? -- I know the manual say they have to be level, but we ran a 50Hz under counter residential unit from the UK on 60Hz on Fintry for six years, including the Atlantic crossing with no problems.


Anyone want the Norcold?



Thanks,


Jim
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Old 10-14-2022, 05:02 PM   #42
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OCDiver had a thread about residential refers. We love our Isotherm CR271. I think it is 9.8 cubic feet. Cools excellently with good ventilation.
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Old 10-14-2022, 08:37 PM   #43
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I'm thinking about a standard residential 110VAC unit.
Any comments on using a standard residential fridge on a boat? -- I know the manual say they have to be level, but we ran a 50Hz under counter residential unit from the UK on 60Hz on Fintry for six years, including the Atlantic crossing with no problems.
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OCDiver had a thread about residential refers. We love our Isotherm CR271. I think it is 9.8 cubic feet. Cools excellently with good ventilation.
https://www.trawlerforum.com/forums/...tor-41392.html

I've had mine about 4 years and other than the thermostat, it's been flawless. Most of the thermostats are junk until you get and expensive home model. I had a problem with mine which is rare for those of us who have Summit refrigerators on our boats. Ended up changing mine for a nice digital thermostat, and will add the link below.

In addition to it being Frost Free and super efficient, you can order it with a traditional ice maker if that's important to you. While you loose some space in the freezer, for those that need ice for drinks, it can be the game changer.

https://www.trawlerforum.com/forums/...ead-62905.html

Ted
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Old 10-15-2022, 07:09 AM   #44
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I'm thinking about a standard residential 110VAC unit.

Any comments on using a standard residential fridge on a boat? -- I know the manual say they have to be level, but we ran a 50Hz under counter residential unit from the UK on 60Hz on Fintry for six years, including the Atlantic crossing with no problems.
Our boat model was built with SubZero residential freezer and fridge. Later model year iterations were built with Perlich units. Freezer and fridge are both 24" wide, both brands.

Ours seem fine. The original icemaker in the freezer crapped out a few months ago; I replaced, easy. Shortly afterwards, we discovered some water leakage under the freezer and I chose to have a local fix-it guy come to do the work. Just as well I did, since he found even more leaks: icemaker feed, plus condensation. All good now, and only cost an arm (leg not required).

He noticed and mentioned the freezer compressor had been replaced, previously. He also diagnosed an issue with our fridge control panel (can't change temp from 36°F), but said since it's working well enough at that temp to ignore that 'til it really goes south.

SubZero seems to enjoy a decent reputation for longevity... and can be repaired. SubZero is said to stock parts for almost ever.

OTOH they do cost an arm and a leg... and a decent hunting dog.

The warranty in a boat installation is different from, not as long as, their residential warranty.

Frost free is turning out to be nifty. We always had AC/DC fridges before (Norcold, two boats ago, NovaKool on the last) and had no particular issues with those. In fact, I thought the NovaKool units were both pretty good. But they did need defrosting from time to time.

Our fridge is a 2-drawer unit. That's turning out to be mostly nifty, too. Easier to find stuff, easier to get it in and out. One drawback is that the upper drawer isn't quite tall enough for a typical white wine bottle. (Wine boxes solve that easily enough.)

Next is the part about 110VAC only: our genset came with high hours, I think specifically because previous owners had to run the generator all the time when away from shorepower... even when aircon or other high-draw appliances wouldn't have been necessary. We installed a 3000 kW inverter/charger and re-purposed our thruster battery bank to service AC loads including the fridge and freezer, all better.

Not a recommendation; just observations.

-Chris
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Old 10-15-2022, 07:37 AM   #45
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Following this thread with interest. I need to replace our fridge and it is good to know my available different options. I'm in no rush but will probably be a spring project.

Circumnavigator, if your looking to get rid of the Norcold I may be interested if you're still in New England.
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Old 10-15-2022, 08:09 AM   #46
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O C Diver, in your original thread four years ago you said, "Last issue is locking doors. Apparently apartment refrigerators aren't subject to pitching and rolling."


The Admiral has raised that as a good reason to go with a marine unit. How did you deal with it?


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Old 10-15-2022, 08:59 AM   #47
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O C Diver, in your original thread four years ago you said, "Last issue is locking doors. Apparently apartment refrigerators aren't subject to pitching and rolling."


The Admiral has raised that as a good reason to go with a marine unit. How did you deal with it? Jim
My refrigerator door faces to the stern. The magnetic seal is substantial. To date, it has never opened, even in 6' seas.

I have considered several options for heavy weather. Avoiding heavy weather seemed the best.

If you want to install a heavy weather lock, it would be pretty simple to block both doors with a small piece of Starboard that could be attached to the hinge screw hole. The doors are designed to be reversible to open the other way. So there are a couple of capped hinge screw holes that should work.

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The important thing to understand is that the magnetic seal keeps it closed. So it should require almost nothing to keep the door from starting to move.

Ted
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Old 10-15-2022, 10:21 AM   #48
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Simplest way to lock your fridge door is to use a velcro strap. We use a small piece of velcro with adhesive backs and the longer loop thingies. However, our fridge is not totally enclosed. We attach one piece to the main body side and the other to the side of the door. Only fasten it in rough seas and in 16 years have never had it fail. Boat is 900 miles away or I'd take a photo to show it.

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Old 10-16-2022, 06:46 AM   #49
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Circumnavigator, if your looking to get rid of the Norcold I may be interested if you're still in New England.

Ours have had rotating stainless toggles added to each opening -- at the top of the freezer unit and at the top of each drawer on the fridge unit.

-Chris
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Old 10-19-2022, 10:08 AM   #50
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Well this thread took an appropriate turn. Last weekend's troubleshooting confirmed that my generation of Norcold DE0061 does not automatically switch from DC to AC by sensing what is available. That explains the difference in my results this year. Shame on me.

The old thing ran just fine on DC all weekend, but as if it is driven to be replaced, I saw a huge increase in the temperature swing. While my records are far from comprehensive, I used to see pretty tight control; or at least acceptably tight for our use. Now I am seeing 33-41º swings. Too cold to too warm.

I do not see any physical changes to the temperature sensor or to the thermostat dial. It is certainly possible that what I used to think was okay was just luck. I read Ted's digital thermostat thread and replacing the original Norcold thermostat with a new digital one looks pretty straightforward, but I feel like I am beating a dead horse. How long do you guys chase problems like this before calling it and replacing the whole unit?
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Old 10-19-2022, 10:30 AM   #51
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I put these on 2 of our fridge doors. They work perfectly...

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1
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Old 10-19-2022, 10:38 AM   #52
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Well this thread took an appropriate turn. Last weekend's troubleshooting confirmed that my generation of Norcold DE0061 does not automatically switch from DC to AC by sensing what is available. That explains the difference in my results this year. Shame on me.

The old thing ran just fine on DC all weekend, but as if it is driven to be replaced, I saw a huge increase in the temperature swing. While my records are far from comprehensive, I used to see pretty tight control; or at least acceptably tight for our use. Now I am seeing 33-41º swings. Too cold to too warm.

I do not see any physical changes to the temperature sensor or to the thermostat dial. It is certainly possible that what I used to think was okay was just luck. I read Ted's digital thermostat thread and replacing the original Norcold thermostat with a new digital one looks pretty straightforward, but I feel like I am beating a dead horse. How long do you guys chase problems like this before calling it and replacing the whole unit?
If considering the digital thermostat, verify voltage of the compressor circuit if you plan to supply power to the thermostat with it. Mine was easy because everything was 120 VAC.

Ted
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Old 10-19-2022, 01:22 PM   #53
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Spent some more phone time with Norcold answering my question of "Is it normal for my refrigerator to swing from 33º to 41º?" The rep told me that the normal range is 32º to 39º and that if 41º is too warm, I should turn the thermostat down a little at a time until it tops out at 39º. Yeesh.

So once again, I learn that my Norcold DE0061R is working as designed. If there is good news, it is that the control module and compressor are working just fine.

This season it has frozen and burst cans of seltzer water, allowed hair to grow on mayanaise, and worried my wife when she discovered the half & half "warm." Sounds like I might be a good candidate for a new digital thermometer.
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Old 10-19-2022, 04:26 PM   #54
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Spent some more phone time with Norcold answering my question of "Is it normal for my refrigerator to swing from 33º to 41º?" The rep told me that the normal range is 32º to 39º and that if 41º is too warm, I should turn the thermostat down a little at a time until it tops out at 39º. Yeesh.

So once again, I learn that my Norcold DE0061R is working as designed. If there is good news, it is that the control module and compressor are working just fine.

This season it has frozen and burst cans of seltzer water, allowed hair to grow on mayanaise, and worried my wife when she discovered the half & half "warm." Sounds like I might be a good candidate for a new digital thermometer.
A 7 degree differential BS. It should be pretty simple to run the refrigerator off an inverter and wire the digital thermostat between the refrigerator power cord and outlet. It would require a small hole to run the temperature sensor cord (discount it from inside the thermostat) through and seal with RTV. Only downside I see is the refrigerator light would only come on when the compressor is running (and the door is open).

From a positive standpoint, you have a digital thermometer outside the refrigerator, an adjustable differential, and you you can place the sensor where it best works for you.

Ted
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Old 10-20-2022, 09:39 AM   #55
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Have had water cooled frig/freezers in the past. New to powerboat fri/freezers. Ours are the largest draw on the boat. Have a norcool frig/freezer and a separate ice maker ( U-Line) small freezer. Ice maker runs on AC only. Frig has two breakers on the panel on AC board and one on DC board. We’ve been emptying the AC small freezer first. Then shutting it off. Been running the Norcool with AC switch off and DC on.
Is there anything else I can do to lower draw?
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Old 10-20-2022, 09:57 AM   #56
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Have had water cooled frig/freezers in the past. New to powerboat fri/freezers. Ours are the largest draw on the boat. Have a norcool frig/freezer and a separate ice maker ( U-Line) small freezer. Ice maker runs on AC only. Frig has two breakers on the panel on AC board and one on DC board. We’ve been emptying the AC small freezer first. Then shutting it off. Been running the Norcool with AC switch off and DC on.
Is there anything else I can do to lower draw?
Pretty much all you can do to save power is improve airflow over the condenser and add insulation to the fridge box. Depending on the install, that may be easy, or there may not be a whole lot to do.
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Old 10-20-2022, 10:23 AM   #57
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Have had water cooled frig/freezers in the past. New to powerboat fri/freezers. Ours are the largest draw on the boat. Have a norcool frig/freezer and a separate ice maker ( U-Line) small freezer. Ice maker runs on AC only. Frig has two breakers on the panel on AC board and one on DC board. We’ve been emptying the AC small freezer first. Then shutting it off. Been running the Norcool with AC switch off and DC on.
Is there anything else I can do to lower draw?
Probably not the right thing for your boat, but I'm a rare bird that went old school and had my fridge replaced with a custom build box with lots 4" of insulation and a air cooled Danfoss. About 7cf and consumes around 60ah/day. Had a similar 3cf freezer built with separate compressor. It runs a about 75ah/day.

I recently returned an alipicool 42l fridge/freezer. It would easily churned through 90+ ah as a freezer.

As Rslifkin suggests, I would definitely see if you can install a computer muffin fan (or two) to assist cooling of cabinet. The compressor likely has a terminal for a fan so it's easy to wire-in.

Peter
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Old 10-20-2022, 10:32 AM   #58
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Have had water cooled frig/freezers in the past. New to powerboat fri/freezers. Ours are the largest draw on the boat. Have a norcool frig/freezer and a separate ice maker ( U-Line) small freezer. Ice maker runs on AC only. Frig has two breakers on the panel on AC board and one on DC board. We’ve been emptying the AC small freezer first. Then shutting it off. Been running the Norcool with AC switch off and DC on.
Is there anything else I can do to lower draw?
Adding a vent high and low along with a fan to move the hot air out of the cabinet will help the refer to run less.
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Old 10-20-2022, 11:26 AM   #59
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Adding a vent high and low along with a fan to move the hot air out of the cabinet will help the refer to run less.
That is one place the Norcold excels, though perhaps at the expense of volume for the size. The compressor and fan are on the back and there is abundant grill space on front at both bottom and top.

Nova Kool puts the compressor(s) at the bottom and circulates air both in and out at the bottom. Doesn't look like much space (or need) for air flow at the top of the unit.

Isotherm has no accommodation for air flow and requires the owner to create vents for airflow in and out of the cabinet. That both creates more flexibility and more demand on installation.
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Old 11-05-2022, 08:36 AM   #60
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One of my best days on MVDarlin was when I replaced my AC/DC "Nevercold" Norcold Refer with a Regular Whirlpool, Made in Mexico AC unit and an inverter! $300 vs $1,200 and when you open the door a nice light comes on, the upper freezer works great for making ice cubes fast. The Norcold "DC" refer uses a bridge rectifier to convert AC to DC to make it an AC/DC unit. I do the opposite, running the AC refer off solar with an inverter. I run the refer all day on solar power and turn it off at night with the upper freezer full of ice cubes. Cubes melt but it stays cool enough overnight. I also have a 5 cubic foot chest freezer. I run it the same way. Darlin is located in Mexico on the Sea of Cortez.
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