Helmsman 38E V 43

[newt]

This was a great thread. I've got a contract on a Helmsman 37 Sedan for delivery around May 2023. I know most(all?) of you are on Pilothouses, but I really wanted a 2 stateroom boat with 4 foot draft or less. The tradeoffs you all mentioned were a lot of my thinking as well. I really appreciate all the conversations around options too. Helping me fill in my own list as time approaches.

Two key ones for me: I'm having a custom box up top for an extra fridge and electric grill. And I'm having the flybridge rail moved forward a little so that everything aft of the bridge deck hatch is railed off, and Scott & Co are putting a solar panel setup aft of that.

[newt]

Oh yeah, for dinghy, I've decided to do a hurley 3.0 system on the swim platform and have side doors on both sides of the boat to make boarding for us and dogs easier.

Newt

[FWT]

Originally Posted by newt

Two key ones for me: I'm having a custom box up top for an extra fridge and electric grill. And I'm having the flybridge rail moved forward a little so that everything aft of the bridge deck hatch is railed off, and Scott & Co are putting a solar panel setup aft of that.

In particular that rail and solar panel idea sounds like a really good idea on that design. Kudos

[BellevueMatt]

We are working on the 38E with a planned delivery in Feb 2024 (our delay not Helmsmans) and will be interested to hear how that Davit system works out. Did you need an extended swim platform?

Matt

[newt]

You’d have to check to make sure the platform and transom are the same height as on the 37 Sedan. If so the Hurley would work. I’d also check with Scott on weight though. The sedan has the hull structural to part of the platform while the 38 isn’t.

[bowball]

Has anyone done the loop in the 38E? I’m trying to look up the air draft as well. I have a bigger trawler on the west coast but was thinking of one of these for the east coast - and letting my relatives use it. I want to spend some time there.

I like the layout of the 38E and my only concerns have been outdoor space as well as carrying a larger tender.

[Helmsman]

People are doing and have done the loop on a 38, or a Mariner 37 which is the older version. There is a guy that moved his 37 to the Illinois river and is in Florida right now On his way around. The air draft is currently about 17 feet to the top of the anchor light and approximately 14’10” to the top of the arch. Not sure if that is the same for the mast.

The arch and mast are hinged and the lowest bridge on the loop is in the western Erie Canal at about 15 feet. You can go around that by going through Canada. Most people really enjoy the CAnadian portion of the loop. I think there is one or two bridges in downtown Chicago where you would drop the mast also. The absolute lowest bridge you have to clear is in the 19 foot range south of Chicago. The 4 foot water draft would not be an issue.

The AGLCA is the group to join to start learning more about the loop. I can get you in touch with Kim Russo (owner of the site) if you want to talk with her before joining. Once you are a member, you can search for the boat type and contact members who have done, are doing, or planning to in a 38e. Just let me know.

[FWT]

Originally Posted by bowball

Has anyone done the loop in the 38E? I’m trying to look up the air draft as well. I have a bigger trawler on the west coast but was thinking of one of these for the east coast - and letting my relatives use it. I want to spend some time there.

I like the layout of the 38E and my only concerns have been outdoor space as well as carrying a larger tender.

Done the Loop: I think so but can't swear to it. It is very Loop-capable. The Loop isn't the top of my list to do but I might and thus made sure the boat can do it. It has plenty of fuel range, way past the limit need along the Mississippi / TennTom area where there is a long run without fuel availability. As far as air draft goes, its 17.6 feet with mast up (maybe more with electronics and antennas) but under 13 feet with mast folded down for those few short bridges in Chicago. Per Scott, quite some time back by email.

As far as tender space goes, I don't know the exact dimensions of the dink space from railing to railing, but I am sure you saw the boat has a beam of 13'11". The top deck will measure most of that but not all. Knock off a few more inches to account for the rails inside of the edges. I'd guess 12 feet or better in room. Scott could give it you in a quick email, and I wouldn't hesitate to ask. Others have chosen to carry it off the swim platform, and you can bite off as much of that 13'11" as you dare.

[HeadedToTexas]

Not yet! Should not be a problem though, even for the western Erie Canal.

The laser level point I shot from the top of the bridge windshield was 12’ 3” above the water with both fuel tanks at ½ and the fresh water tank at ¼. The top of the bimini rises another 33” bringing the air draft total up to exactly 15’. The radar mast rises 9’ 11” from the bridge deck and the laser level shows bridge deck at 99” above the water with the tanks as listed above. That adds up to 218”, or 18’ 2”.

[AdmiralS]

We have done a good chunk of the loop on our 43 on the East side. Including Lake Champlain which was 16' due to flooding and we passed with no issue. Had to lower the mast down, but didn't have to touch the bimini.

Both the 43 and 38 will easily clear the 19' Chicago bridge

[Nocanvas]

We were asked to make a comment in this thread so here it go’s.
Sitting here in Vero Beach, FL on our Mariner 37 Pilothouse 2008 480HP after our Great Loop start 9/2021 after trucking from Blaine WA. We all know the difference between this boat and the Helmsman 38E.
Our air draft is 17’8” to anchor light and antennas down. 14’ 10 air draft with Bimini. We clear most bridges. Draft 3’10” but we say 4’. It’s just the wife and I with the occasional visiting Inlaw who loves the lowering table in the galley and the day head wet bath (comfortable) and very private with the curtain installed at the steps to the Pilothouse.
Our experience going down and up the Illinois, Mississippi, Ohio, Tennessee, Tombigbee, Mobile rivers & AICW was very good partly because our draft was never a problem getting into places we wanted. The boats have imho just the right draft if your paying attention ( a good compromise).The air draft from Seneca, Illinois to Fort Myers to Okeechobee onto Miami and so far up here to Vero Beach has been pleasant with only a few bridges we waited on and had We chose to lower the mast we’d waited even less. I guess I’m saying air draft can be managed with the Helmsman giving a pleasant traveling experience.

We cruise between 3 gph and 9gph depending on current or mood. The 7.8 hull speed says the rest. The admiral loves stretching out in the Pilothouse while the skipper sits attentively driving with remote autopilot inside at the helm. One of the most asked questions has where do we steer from the most and that would be inside. Especially docking the low railing is easier to help one hand the boat docking. Long cruising in the open waters we tend to drive Chariot. The second most common question we get is. Who builds that boat what is it.
It’s been a great looper boat for us the way we use it and we’re still happy we chose it.
We have a custom hub on the prop and have re pitched , 450ah bank 450w PV standard frig and a portable dometic deep freezer, 6.5kw genset two heat pumps ,diesel heat,
Seawise Davit on stern AB 10VSX with 20hp Tohotsu can deploy or stow in 4 1/2 min one person. Boat isn’t too heavy and it cost less as a package ( that worked for us) and lots of usable upper deck space all the time.

I’ll add that Scott has always been readily available and quick to help if we had any issues.
Hope this sheds light on the question.
Remember life is full of trade offs pick what’s best for you.
We like the percentage rule ��

[Helmsman]

Originally Posted by Nocanvas

We were asked to make a comment in this thread so here it go’s.
Sitting here in Vero Beach, FL on our Mariner 37 Pilothouse 2008 480HP after our Great Loop start 9/2021 after trucking from Blaine WA. We all know the difference between this boat and the Helmsman 38E.
Our air draft is 17’8” to anchor light and antennas down. 14’ air draft with Bimini. We clear most bridges. Draft 3’10” but we say 4’. It’s just the wife and I with the occasional visiting Inlaw who loves the lowering table in the galley and the day head wet bath (comfortable) and very private with the curtain installed at the steps to the Pilothouse.
Our experience going down and up the Illinois, Mississippi, Ohio, Tennessee, Tombigbee, Mobile rivers & AICW was very good partly because our draft was never a problem getting into places we wanted. The boats have imho just the right draft if your paying attention ( a good compromise).The air draft from Seneca, Illinois to Fort Myers to Okeechobee onto Miami and so far up here to Vero Beach has been pleasant with only a few bridges we waited on and had We chose to lower the mast we’d waited even less. I guess I’m saying air draft can be managed with the Helmsman giving a pleasant traveling experience.

We cruise between 3 gph and 9gph depending on current or mood. The 7.8 hull speed says the rest. The admiral loves stretching out in the Pilothouse while the skipper sits attentively driving with remote autopilot inside at the helm. One of the most asked questions has where do we steer from the most and that would be inside. Especially docking the low railing is easier to help one hand the boat docking. Long cruising in the open waters we tend to drive Chariot. The second most common question we get is. Who builds that boat what is it.
It’s been a great looper boat for us the way we use it and we’re still happy we chose it.
We have a custom hub on the prop and have re pitched , 450ah bank 450w PV standard frig and a portable dometic deep freezer.
Seawise Davit on stern AB 10VSX with 20hp Tohotsu can deploy or stow in 4 1/2 min one person. Boat isn’t too heavy and it cost less as a package ( that worked for us) and lots of usable upper deck space all the time.

I’ll add that Scott has always been readily available and quick to help if we had any issues.
Hope this sheds light on the question.
Remember life is full of trade offs pick what’s best for you.
We like the percentage rule ��

And there is the “guy on the loop”!
Thanks for bringing the perspective.

[Two Truths]

Originally Posted by FWT

As far as tender space goes, I don't know the exact dimensions of the dink space from railing to railing, but I am sure you saw the boat has a beam of 13'11". The top deck will measure most of that but not all. Knock off a few more inches to account for the rails inside of the edges. I'd guess 12 feet or better in room. Scott could give it you in a quick email, and I wouldn't hesitate to ask. Others have chosen to carry it off the swim platform, and you can bite off as much of that 13'11" as you dare.

My H38E came with an AB10VSX RIB with a 20hp Tohatsu outboard; the AB10VSX is actually 10'6" and sitting crosswise on chocks with the engine raised on the upper deck, it just barely fits between the rails--maybe an inch or so to spare on each size. This is absolutely the largest size dinghy I would suggest it you plan to carry it topside on a H38.

[FWT]

Originally Posted by Two Truths

My H38E came with an AB10VSX RIB with a 20hp Tohatsu outboard; the AB10VSX is actually 10'6" and sitting crosswise on chocks with the engine raised on the upper deck, it just barely fits between the rails--maybe an inch or so to spare on each size. This is absolutely the largest size dinghy I would suggest it you plan to carry it topside on a H38.

Thanks for that. To be really clear, that is 10'6" from the bow to the tip of the raised outboard, right?

[Two Truths]

No, 10"6' is the measurement of the length of the RIB itself without outboard (according to the AB brochure). The outboard extends beyond that. (I am not on my boat so can't take the measurement.) Together they just fit between the rails.
BTW, I estimate the AB 10VSX (which has a steering console, electric start, etc.), together with 20hp engine, loaded fuel tank, spare fuel tank, battery, dinghy anchor, etc. to weigh in the neighborhood of 450 lbs. That is the very upper end of what I would want to hoist to the top deck, especially given how tight a fit it is. (Were I to buy a new RIB, I would opt for something the same size but lighter, perhaps an aluminum bottom.)

[FWT]

Great. Many thanks.

I'm going with an ePropulsion I won't leave on the dink. Plenty of room to go with anything I choose to get.

[cardude01]

Originally Posted by FWT

Great. Many thanks.



I'm going with an ePropulsion I won't leave on the dink. Plenty of room to go with anything I choose to get.

I have an Epropulsion unit and use it when I don’t need the big 15hp Suzuki. Have been very satisfied with it.

[FWT]

Originally Posted by cardude01

I have an Epropulsion unit and use it when I don’t need the big 15hp Suzuki. Have been very satisfied with it.

Thanks for the observation. Unless something better comes along before its time to pull the trigger, that's the plan.

[HeadedToTexas]

Originally Posted by newt

Two key ones for me: I'm having a custom box up top for an extra fridge and electric grill. And I'm having the flybridge rail moved forward a little so that everything aft of the bridge deck hatch is railed off, and Scott & Co are putting a solar panel setup aft of that.

Interesting mods, Newt. That's on a Sedan 37, right?

[khomaizad]

I’m new to trawlers and this thread has been amazing, thank you. I’ve been a decent sailor and have been looking for my first trawler. This will be my first boat. I’ve looked at the N41 but I really like the H38E and the H43E, I have yet to board either and hope to be in contact with Scott soon. I need to get my wife to fall in love with one or the other. Do you guys have any concerns about 2nd engine or a wing engine. I hope to be on extended cruises, I am in Los Angeles and have some lofty dreams of heading Deep South and very far north. Thanks again!