Another new start for Helmsman

The friendliest place on the web for anyone who enjoys boating.
If you have answers, please help by responding to the unanswered posts.
...I pretty much grew up on Garmin and all of my boats/devices have been that platform, but I see advantages regarding other systems...

Tom, like you I have been reading everything I can and talking to people about what they use and recommend. I still haven't made a decision but may be leaning toward Garmin. When we lived in the Caribbean we had a catamaran with Autohelm auto pilot and instruments and one of the first Garmin GPS units (1992).

On our sailboat that we had from 2000-2015 had Raymarine Radar with a Garmin handheld GPS...then we bought the Ranger Tug and had a full Garmin suite and really liked it. So...I am leaning toward Garmin but I have a lot of time to decide and the Seattle Boat Show (I hope!).

Garmin GPS vintage 1991-92:
 

Attachments

  • Garmin GPS 50.jpg
    Garmin GPS 50.jpg
    28.9 KB · Views: 25
We saw on Instagram a few days ago photos of a 38E being delivered to Lough Ree in Ireland. It’s the first European delivery. That’s exciting. Scott’s blog on the Helmsman website has more pictures. Zoom in on one of the photos and you will see Scott standing on the dock. That’s amazing product support. I’d love to know how it got to this inland lake and what hull number it is.
 
We saw on Instagram a few days ago photos of a 38E being delivered to Lough Ree in Ireland. It’s the first European delivery. That’s exciting. Scott’s blog on the Helmsman website has more pictures. Zoom in on one of the photos and you will see Scott standing on the dock. That’s amazing product support. I’d love to know how it got to this inland lake and what hull number it is.

Thanks for posting this Doug. The Ireland boat is the same color scheme as ours with the Kingston Gray hull and the white deck that we decided on.

Tom and Jill, is this the same color scheme as yours?

https://www.helmsmantrawlers.com/news/blog/
 
Merry Christmas to all Helmsmans and to all Happy New Year

Merry Christmas!

Jill wanted me to post her one and only present she got under the Christmas tree.

She was really excited, and said that a great one for the next 20 Christmases!!

29387-albums1192-picture7334.jpg
 
Tom, like you I have been reading everything I can and talking to people about what they use and recommend. I still haven't made a decision but may be leaning toward Garmin. When we lived in the Caribbean we had a catamaran with Autohelm auto pilot and instruments and one of the first Garmin GPS units (1992).

On our sailboat that we had from 2000-2015 had Raymarine Radar with a Garmin handheld GPS...then we bought the Ranger Tug and had a full Garmin suite and really liked it. So...I am leaning toward Garmin but I have a lot of time to decide and the Seattle Boat Show (I hope!).

Garmin GPS vintage 1991-92:

I'm just getting into the electronics. One of my best buds was an installer on expensive yachts, and he said do nothing but Garmin. I've concluded it's down to Simrad and Garmin. Gary and Scott assisted in selling my 2018 7.1 Sealegs (amphibious boat) last month and it had Simrad. I like my 2008 Garmin system on our 2004 27' Seasport better - they are selling that vessel for us as well..

In 14 years, the only issue with my Garmin system was a flicker on one of chart plotters and was simply replaced under warranty.

Aside from what I read, Scott's preferred outsource C&L (eddie) mentioned they had issues twice or so with the Garmin Autopilot. I'll find out more.
Whatever it was, was fixed. You might want to ask him if he is your installer.

Were on this trip in back country and I will state I we will always have the Garmin InReach Explorer Plus as part of my electronics suite for the 38E. It has saved us three times in 5 years, one of those deep in Alaska days from any civilization on the Seasport. If anyone is going to cruise the PNW up to the broughtons, inside passage, a satellite communicator is a must aside from your cell phone and any fancy VHFs - which neither will work in most of Alaska. Never leave home without it or in this week's case, chains in backcountry winters. I couldnt get weather forecast for days and sat texted my niece who basically said we have a few hours left to get out as it was dumping snow.. Without it, we'd be snowbound. But one the other hand, we'll have no problems to troubleshoot on the 38 :ermm:

- Tom
 
Thanks for posting this Doug. The Ireland boat is the same color scheme as ours with the Kingston Gray hull and the white deck that we decided on.

Tom and Jill, is this the same color scheme as yours?

https://www.helmsmantrawlers.com/news/blog/

Hi Mr. Helmsman,
Our is:
Colored gelcoat hull -- LIGHT GRAY from Awlgrip Color Chart
Hull accent stripe -- ARISTO BLUE from Awlgrip Color Chart

- Jill
 
The awl grip light gray looks pretty close to Kingston gray. The blue stripe will be a nice contrast to the gray.
 
These are our hull and accent stripe colors. The hull looks great out of the mold. I’ve played around photoshopping Margaux graphic on the transom. Spring can’t get here soon enough.

28403-albums1128-picture7335.jpeg
 
Steve and Margaret

We saw on Instagram a few days ago photos of a 38E being delivered to Lough Ree in Ireland. It’s the first European delivery. That’s exciting. Scott’s blog on the Helmsman website has more pictures. Zoom in on one of the photos and you will see Scott standing on the dock. That’s amazing product support. I’d love to know how it got to this inland lake and what hull number it is.

Hi. Been a member here for many months (first post!) followed all the Helmsman discussions with great interest.
We are held 45 by the way. Getting to lreland was not easy. Brexit was a real pain, as shipping was to Southampton UK & road transport from there was the only option due to customs. Anyhow all went well, apart from a few days delay (due to storm Barra) which held up the road haulier.
We had the pleasure of Scott and Lisa for the few days commissiong. Salt of the earth people. A real pleasure to meet & spend time with. "My Obsession" is now safely down on Lough Derg where she will be based. It was all well worth the wait. An amazingly well put together boat.
 
These are our hull and accent stripe colors. The hull looks great out of the mold. I’ve played around photoshopping Margaux graphic on the transom. Spring can’t get here soon enough.

28403-albums1128-picture7335.jpeg

Doug, Wow that is going to look very nice. Can't wait to see it. Thanks so much for sharing. It makes it so much more real.

- Jill
 
Welcome aboard. We love Ireland. We were pursuing my getting Irish citizenship but decided to stay put. My grandmother was born in County Kildare while her father was stationed there in the army. Most of my relatives were from Connemara. I was amazed to learn what a great system of Inland waterways you have. Seeing Ireland on a Helmsman 38E would be a dream. We’d love to hear about your travels.
 
Hi Doug,
Where did you get your colors from?
It'd be great to see those colors we picked out on a chart..

Is there a site which has a color chart, and if so I wonder how close that would be looking at the computer screen?

Thanks Tom
 
Hi. Been a member here for many months (first post!) followed all the Helmsman discussions with great interest.
We are held 45 by the way. Getting to lreland was not easy. Brexit was a real pain, as shipping was to Southampton UK & road transport from there was the only option due to customs. Anyhow all went well, apart from a few days delay (due to storm Barra) which held up the road haulier.
We had the pleasure of Scott and Lisa for the few days commissiong. Salt of the earth people. A real pleasure to meet & spend time with. "My Obsession" is now safely down on Lough Derg where she will be based. It was all well worth the wait. An amazingly well put together boat.

Great to hear from you! You have a beautiful boat. Ireland is a wonderful place, as is England. Please keep us up to date as you get to know your boat. We can all learn together!
 
Doug, I like that light blue color. It seems like it has a bit of gray tint in it.
 
Hi Doug,
Where did you get your colors from?
It'd be great to see those colors we picked out on a chart..

Is there a site which has a color chart, and if so I wonder how close that would be looking at the computer screen?

Thanks Tom

I got the colors from this website. https://www.fibreglast.com/category/colorgelcoat

The numbers match up with the color card we selected our colors from. They are a little off on the computer screen which always seems to be a problem.
 
Hi. Been a member here for many months (first post!) followed all the Helmsman discussions with great interest.
We are held 45 by the way. Getting to lreland was not easy. Brexit was a real pain, as shipping was to Southampton UK & road transport from there was the only option due to customs. Anyhow all went well, apart from a few days delay (due to storm Barra) which held up the road haulier.
We had the pleasure of Scott and Lisa for the few days commissiong. Salt of the earth people. A real pleasure to meet & spend time with. "My Obsession" is now safely down on Lough Derg where she will be based. It was all well worth the wait. An amazingly well put together boat.

Obsession,

Would it be safe to assume you are on the River Shannon? Donegal seems like a very remote area to boat not to mention getting there!

Rob
 
I love the look of the GPSMAP® 8617 MFD but I understand it needs several other components in order to match the functionality of the 8616.

I guess I need to look it up and read about it.

Rick

Hi Rick,
Working on electronics and saw you mentioned 8617 needs stuff to match the 8616 back a while ago. Isnt these MDFs the same, 17 is just 1 inch bigger? I cant find anything regarding your comment. Did you ever look back into it?
I also need to figure out if a 17 will fit. As I saw max 16 and someone else said 17.
Thanks, Tom
 
Hi. Been a member here for many months (first post!) followed all the Helmsman discussions with great interest.
We are held 45 by the way. Getting to lreland was not easy. Brexit was a real pain, as shipping was to Southampton UK & road transport from there was the only option due to customs. Anyhow all went well, apart from a few days delay (due to storm Barra) which held up the road haulier.
We had the pleasure of Scott and Lisa for the few days commissiong. Salt of the earth people. A real pleasure to meet & spend time with. "My Obsession" is now safely down on Lough Derg where she will be based. It was all well worth the wait. An amazingly well put together boat.

Welcome to the growing merry band of brothers (and sisters), we Helmsman owners and prospective owners.

And congratulations on your successful delivery.

As you begin to gather experience with it, I for one would welcome hearing about it, and any observations you care to share.

Ireland: I spent a delightful week there long ago, perhaps 25 years ago or more. My vow to return has yet to be acted upon, and today such travel is impractical. One day.
 
Obsession,

Would it be safe to assume you are on the River Shannon? Donegal seems like a very remote area to boat not to mention getting there!

Rob

That one confused me until I discovered that there is more than one Lough Derg. The one south of Lough Ree is on the Shannon River waterway the extends from Lough Allen in the north to Limerick in the south. The Google Earth team has done street views, water views actually, all along the waterway. Following the route on Google Earth is fascinating. There are some beautiful marinas and residential areas with water access. The route includes several lakes and canals with locks. Stuff to dream about.
 
Hi Rick,
Working on electronics and saw you mentioned 8617 needs stuff to match the 8616 back a while ago. Isnt these MDFs the same, 17 is just 1 inch bigger? I cant find anything regarding your comment. Did you ever look back into it?
I also need to figure out if a 17 will fit. As I saw max 16 and someone else said 17.
Thanks, Tom


I believe I was the one who mentioned seeing the 8617 on a H38E. You might check with Eddie Legard, who does most of the installations on new Helmsmans. I don't think the 8617 comes with sonar capacity built in--you have to add it. Also, one issue that has not been mentioned is touch-screen-only versus hybrid (touch-screen PLUS keypad controls) chartplotter. I inherited Simrad electronics (NSO EvoS) with my H38E, and now wouldn't get anything that didn't include a keypad. The keypad is much easier to use in chop, but even in calm waters there are many operations that I find easier to execute, or execute quickly and precisely, via the keypad rather than the touch-screen. I don't know if Garmin has a keypad option or not, but given that Garmin, Simrad, Raymarine, Furuno, etc. all offer much the same funtionality, I would look seriously at a unit that has hybrid controls.
 
That one confused me until I discovered that there is more than one Lough Derg. The one south of Lough Ree is on the Shannon River waterway the extends from Lough Allen in the north to Limerick in the south. The Google Earth team has done street views, water views actually, all along the waterway. Following the route on Google Earth is fascinating. There are some beautiful marinas and residential areas with water access. The route includes several lakes and canals with locks. Stuff to dream about.

The Shannon is an amazing river/waterway. My mother grew up on Lough Key in Corrigeenroe, Roscommon part of the waterway. Nearest town of any size is Boyle. We still have a lot of family there including the the house mom grew up in. As often as I have been there I've yet to do any boating in Ireland. We do have canal boat type rental on our bucket list.

Rob
 
Bareboat chartering in Ireland looks relatively inexpensive compared to other destinations. Anyone have any experience? Maybe not the best way to see the country?
 
Bareboat chartering in Ireland looks relatively inexpensive compared to other destinations. Anyone have any experience? Maybe not the best way to see the country?

Probably should not answer this as I have never chartered there though my cousins have. It would surely give you a tour (Shannon River) that the vast majority of tourists never see on their mad dash to visit Dublin or the Ring of Kerry. Be sure to check what qualifications would be necessary. It is not the same as here where you simply write a check and go boating. Inland is probably easier than coastal.

You would possibly see (on the Shannon) the Ireland that existed before the arrival of the "Celtic Tiger". Many of the smaller towns while still affected by the rise in land values and influx of mainland Europeans still retain their "irishness".

This is coming from someone who grew up on mom's stories of a childhood on a farm with no electricity or running water. Cooking was done on a open turf fire. The turf was "saved" from the family section of the local bog.

I did see the end of that life when I first visited in the 70's. It was a harder life than we grew up with and I am thankful to see the progress over the years. However even my cousins who carried water from the well are somewhat nostalgic for the sense of community that has been lost. Not pining for what is gone as it was a hard way of life just noting the changes. Of course if you lived in a city or town it was similar to here.

Sorry for the hijack,

Rob
 
A question for the group. Is anyone planning to install or have installed a stereo in your boat? If so, what kind did you install, and where did you place the speakers?

If we end up going with Garmin (leaning that way) we will go with their Fusion® Apollo™ RA670 Marine Entertainment System. We had a Fusion system on our 2015 boat and it worked well. We will probably put speakers in the pilothouse, salon and on the flybridge (2 each location) so 3 'zones' that can be adjusted independently.
Unlike some have mentioned we enjoy listening to radio stations when we are in the San Juans and Southern Inside Passage. The Canadian stations are a fun change from the ones we listen to in the US. Then we can also attach our USB drive to it with all of our music on it. Of course it does Bluetooth and WiFi too.

Rick
 
I'm just getting into the electronics. One of my best buds was an installer on expensive yachts, and he said do nothing but Garmin. I've concluded it's down to Simrad and Garmin...

Here our tentative Garmin list:

GPSMAP® 8616xsv
GPSMAP® 8610xsv for flybridge
Reactor™ 40 Hydraulic Corepack with SmartPump v2 With GHC™ 20
Reactor™ Autopilot Remote Control
GHC™ 20 Marine Autopilot Control Unit for flybridge
GRF™ 10 - Rudder Feedback Sensor
GMR Fantom™ 18x/24x Dome Radar
VHF 315 Marine Radio (maybe to be replaced with Vesper Cortex)
GHS™ 11 Wired VHF Handset (maybe to be replaced with Vesper Cortex)
AIS™ 800 Blackbox Transceiver (maybe to be replaced with Vesper Cortex)
GC™ 14 Marine Camera (rear view)
GC™ 14 Marine Camera (engine room)
MSC™ 10 Marine Satellite Compass
Garmin GT41-TH | Thu-hull Transducer (don't know anything about transducers)
inReach SE®+ Satellite Communicator (or Mini?)
gWind™ Wired Transducer
Fusion® Apollo™ RA670 Marine Entertainment System with DSP
Fusion® XS Series Marine Speakers 6.5" 200-Watt Classic Marine Speakers

Supposedly the new autopilot has fixed previous problems and is a big improvement...still doing research (and trying to figure out how to afford it all :blush:).

Rick
 
Based on recommendations from my wife’s brother, a marine electrician, we are going with Garmin. Our system will include the Fusion entertainment system. We are looking at speakers in the salon, pilot house and stateroom. Once we verify the size that the drop down TV cabinets can handle, we will buy flat screen TVs with AirPlay capability. We like to download movies from services like Netflix to our iOS devices and AirPlay them to the TVs. An HDMI cable routed from the salon TV to a convenient location would allow playback without relying on AirPlay.

We really like our Sonos sound system and are considering their new Bluetooth capable speakers for viewing and listening in the salon.

Even with that setup, when the weather is nice, the best entertainment will still be the world around us. No more “Alexa, play ocean sounds”.

When we have cellular service, we will listen to music from Apple Music and SiriusXM via USB to the Fusion system and download music when we’re out of cellular coverage.
 
Rick,

Thanks for posting your proposed electronics. It looks like a really good setup to me, and mirrors mine except for the primary equipment vendor.

I am close to completing the “line up” for our boat. Like most of us on here, I am typically pretty “cheap” when it comes to spending money on electronics, preferring to find deals where I can, and enjoy making things work. However, with a new build I want to ensure that the electronics “just work” as much as possible. I landed on Furuno a few months ago, based upon my personal assessment of the big four electronics companies. All four have good products, but in discussions with two of them, I felt Furuno had the more knowledgeable people on their tech help line. I also have yet to be put on hold when I call them. I like the breadth of the charts available from Furuno. The TZ3 MFD line is a major upgrade in ease of use and computing power over the TZ2.

During the NMEA workshops I was able to attend in September in Orlando, I received good feedback on all four. Different techs favored different brands. With the Furuno supporters I didn’t hear negatives, just positive comments. I would say Garmin was also positively supported with the one caveat about them sunsetting products quickly coming up in a couple of conversations, and the lack of support after that. I had run into that same issue with a new install of a Raymarine I completed in 2017 and so was a bit snake bitten. (In fairness to Garmin, I have also heard the exact opposite in terms of after sunset service.)

Again, I don’t think you can go wrong with any of them, so personal preference is the most important criteria in my view.

Here are my selections for the boat.

Furuno

TZ Touch 3 16” MFD
TZ Touch 3 12” MFD
Radome (DRS4D-NXT) Solid State radar
SCX20 Satellite Compass
Auto Pilot
FAP 3011 Control Unit
FAP 3012 Processor Unit
Rudder Reference Kit
AP OctoPump 16-12
Safe Helm 2
DST-810MSF Bronze Thru-Hull, Digital Depth, Speed, Temp Sensor, NMEA2000

Communications/AIS/Monitoring
Vesper Cortex w/ H1 and H1P VHF handsets
Morad HD VHF/AIS 159 Mhz Antenna

Network
Pepwave Max BR1 Pro 5G Router
Peplink Mobility 42G 7 in 1 Antenna
TBD Actisense or Yacht Design NMEA to LAN

Cameras
Axis M7104 Video Encoder
Cameras TBD for Backup and Engine Room

Satellite TV
KVH Tracvision TV1 system

The 16” MFD will go in the PH. I plan to put it, the AP control unit, and the tethered Cortex handset on the helm if there is room, with the Mercruiser engine monitor placed just forward of the wheel on the “flat” area. I have seen that setup in pictures. The untethered handset will be used on the flybridge when driving the boat and in the bedroom at night for the anchor alarm.

We settled on the NXT radar after some consideration. About $500 more than the non solid state radome after some discussion with Furuno (and due to it being a new build).

The SCX20 satellite compass takes the place of a heading compass, is installed on the arch, and informs the plotter, AP, and radar of the boats pitching and yawing
We purchased the Vesper Cortex, the Pepwave BR1 Pro 5G and the Peplink 42G from Doug Miller at Milltech. As others have mentioned here before, he does a really nice job of explaining products, and supporting what he sells. The reason I am going with a modem router is that various friends and family members who are still working will travel some with us, if they can work from the boat. With the change to folks working from “home” for a few days a week, this became an important consideration.

Using a KVH Tracvision to deliver TV, will lower cellular bandwidth usage on the boat. The Pepwave equipment allows prioritization between cellular and WiFi. So, when we are in a marina with a sufficient network, the Pepwave will default to that. Underway, the cellular will take over. I may use an Actisense converter to broadcast the NMEA2000 and 0183 signals to a PC or tablets as a backup to the plotters.

For cameras, I am still trying to settle on a brand . I will have a backup camera, and one or two engine room cameras. Using the Axis video encoder will eliminate the MFD using cpu time for rendering images.
 
Based on recommendations from my wife’s brother, a marine electrician, we are going with Garmin. Our system will include the Fusion entertainment system. We are looking at speakers in the salon, pilot house and stateroom. Once we verify the size that the drop down TV cabinets can handle, we will buy flat screen TVs with AirPlay capability. We like to download movies from services like Netflix to our iOS devices and AirPlay them to the TVs. An HDMI cable routed from the salon TV to a convenient location would allow playback without relying on AirPlay.

We really like our Sonos sound system and are considering their new Bluetooth capable speakers for viewing and listening in the salon.

Even with that setup, when the weather is nice, the best entertainment will still be the world around us. No more “Alexa, play ocean sounds”.

When we have cellular service, we will listen to music from Apple Music and SiriusXM via USB to the Fusion system and download music when we’re out of cellular coverage.

Tempted to go ahead with the fusion, but think I will wait and decide in the fall.
 
In reading the manual for the Vesper Cortex, it appears that the Cortex will broadcast NMEA2000 PGN’s and NMEA0183 wirelessly. If so, tablets and PC’s connected to the network can make use of the information. I will need to look a little more into that, but if so, it would stand to reason that an Actisense NMEA2000 to wireless becomes unnecessary.

For those still looking at electronics, I have heard from two different vendors that prices will go up in 2022. In addition, the Autopilot equipment I ordered two days ago is on back order until late February due to chip shortages. So, I would suggest some lead time on your orders to ensure availability at launch.
 
Last edited:

Latest posts

Back
Top Bottom