Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 10-25-2022, 01:44 PM   #1021
Senior Member
 
Nocanvas's Avatar
 
City: Semiahmoo
Vessel Name: Navigator
Vessel Model: Mariner/Helmsman 38
Join Date: May 2018
Posts: 159
Quote:
Originally Posted by Helmsman View Post
Just an update. It looks like our 38E will be offloaded in Miami around the 10th of December. We tried for a Gulf delivery, but just weren't able to get that worked out for our boat at this time. Now, if we can just lock down what we need to have ready for the trip....
Congratulations
Nocanvas is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-2022, 03:19 PM   #1022
Senior Member
 
Doug_Snider's Avatar
 
City: La Conner
Vessel Name: Alba Bella
Vessel Model: Helmsman 38E (In transit)
Join Date: Jul 2021
Posts: 179
Quote:
Originally Posted by Helmsman View Post
Just an update. It looks like our 38E will be offloaded in Miami around the 10th of December. We tried for a Gulf delivery, but just weren't able to get that worked out for our boat at this time. Now, if we can just lock down what we need to have ready for the trip....
Good to hear you have confirmation, even if it's not your preferred destination. The positive side is a little more time to get ready. We'll be following your progress with great interest.

The container ship carrying our 38E just left the port of Busan, South Korea, the last stop before Seattle. Our current ETA is now November 10, but it's been kind of fluid. We'll probably fill that time with last minute preparations and agonizingly watching the ship's progress across the Pacific.
Doug_Snider is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-2022, 04:00 PM   #1023
FWT
Guru
 
City: Centreville MD
Vessel Name: Resilient
Vessel Model: Helmsman Trawlers 38E
Join Date: Dec 2020
Posts: 1,136
Good news for you both!
FWT is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-26-2022, 12:56 AM   #1024
Senior Member
 
Nancy n Larry's Avatar
 
City: Sequim
Vessel Name: M/V Waterhorse
Vessel Model: Awaiting a Helmsman 38E, Hull#52
Join Date: Jul 2021
Posts: 108
Yay! Congrats to you both! Doug, I Have been watching the container ship with your boat on it daily! I’m certain the wait is agonizing! Hopefully our boat won’t be far behind you! Keep updating us as to the progress of your boat!
Nancy n Larry is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-26-2022, 11:14 AM   #1025
Senior Member
 
Doug_Snider's Avatar
 
City: La Conner
Vessel Name: Alba Bella
Vessel Model: Helmsman 38E (In transit)
Join Date: Jul 2021
Posts: 179
For most of the voyage, the ship is out of range of terrestrial AIS and won’t show its current position on vessel tracking apps. I discovered that opening MarineTraffic.com in a browser and selecting “Past Track” for the vessel allows you to see both the last VHF AIS position and the current satellite position without having to pay for the satellite data. You may have too zoom out and look where the ship’s track should put it.
Doug_Snider is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-26-2022, 11:52 AM   #1026
Guru
 
City: Chattanooga
Vessel Model: Helmsman Trawler 38E
Join Date: Oct 2020
Posts: 851
Quote:
Originally Posted by Doug_Snider View Post
For most of the voyage, the ship is out of range of terrestrial AIS and won’t show its current position on vessel tracking apps. I discovered that opening MarineTraffic.com in a browser and selecting “Past Track” for the vessel allows you to see both the last VHF AIS position and the current satellite position without having to pay for the satellite data. You may have too zoom out and look where the ship’s track should put it.

Good tip!
Helmsman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-26-2022, 02:16 PM   #1027
Guru
 
City: Chattanooga
Vessel Model: Helmsman Trawler 38E
Join Date: Oct 2020
Posts: 851
I happened to get a good deal on a Vulcan Rocna 20 (45 lb) anchor the other day, so I bought it. (There is one for sale on EBay for a good price right now). I will use the Bruce type anchor as a back up to the Rocna.


FWT had mentioned that the Bail would need to be replaced if one decided to go with the Vulcan Rocna. Does anyone know the correct size Bail to be used with the Rocna?
Helmsman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-26-2022, 03:11 PM   #1028
Guru
 
backinblue's Avatar
 
City: Stratford, CT
Vessel Name: Blue Moon
Vessel Model: Mainship Pilot 355
Join Date: Jan 2019
Posts: 3,593
Quote:
Originally Posted by Helmsman View Post
I happened to get a good deal on a Vulcan Rocna 20 (45 lb) anchor the other day, so I bought it. (There is one for sale on EBay for a good price right now). I will use the Bruce type anchor as a back up to the Rocna.


FWT had mentioned that the Bail would need to be replaced if one decided to go with the Vulcan Rocna. Does anyone know the correct size Bail to be used with the Rocna?
It's a shame that you bought the wrong anchor for such a fine boat! Just kidding. The Vulcan is a great choice in my opinion. I bought an Ultra a couple years ago and love it. I saw West Marine recently posting a sale on all Rocna anchors at 40% off. That doesn't necessarilly mean a great deal, but occasionally West marine can be competitive when they run some good sales. Good luck regardless!
__________________
“In my walks, every man I meet is my superior in some way, and in that I learn from him.” ― Ralph Waldo Emerson
backinblue is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-26-2022, 07:58 PM   #1029
FWT
Guru
 
City: Centreville MD
Vessel Name: Resilient
Vessel Model: Helmsman Trawlers 38E
Join Date: Dec 2020
Posts: 1,136
Quote:
Originally Posted by Helmsman View Post
I happened to get a good deal on a Vulcan Rocna 20 (45 lb) anchor the other day, so I bought it. (There is one for sale on EBay for a good price right now). I will use the Bruce type anchor as a back up to the Rocna.


FWT had mentioned that the Bail would need to be replaced if one decided to go with the Vulcan Rocna. Does anyone know the correct size Bail to be used with the Rocna?

FWIW:

I believe there is a bail bar / rod standard on the forward top corners, across the top. But going from pictures of a Vulcan on a Helmsman roller, the top edge of the anchor shank runs higher. IE it won't fit under the bail when snugged up tight. It appears to be truly no big deal to remove the bail. The pictures I have of a Vulcan on a Helmsman clearly do not have a bail of any kind. There are clearly holes to install one, or replace one that might come standard.

As for what might fit to replace it, I think pretty much anything that is hoop shaped, and fits the side to side dimension should work. Some hoops I've seen are made of flat stock, and others round stock. Whatever you fancy.

I don't know the side to side dimension. Its one of those things I figure I'll just measure and order when I have my boat. But perhaps one of the other owners can provide it.

One of the reasons I'm going slow on ordering a hoop bail, even if I had the dimension, is I want to observe the Vulcan action when being deployed. From the pictures its pretty evident it doesn't take much vertical dimension in the hoop when its snugged up tight. But what I want to see is how the top tip of the shank behaves when being deployed. Does the tip swing up high as the anchor is lowered? By how much?

As I picture the final installation, I see the hoop bail leaning forward on a 45 degree angle, which SHOULD allow for any kind of motion the Vulcan might have.

But all just a theory and guess until I can see the reality.

I don't see it being useful as something the Vulcan will wedge up against. Merely something to prevent the rare instance of the anchor jumping out of the roller and clang around if pounding into serious waves. Until the straight bail is replaced with a hoop, one can just use a short length of light line to lash it down in some fashion, if you feel there is any chance of this happening before the next time you anchor.

My two cents.
FWT is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-26-2022, 08:04 PM   #1030
FWT
Guru
 
City: Centreville MD
Vessel Name: Resilient
Vessel Model: Helmsman Trawlers 38E
Join Date: Dec 2020
Posts: 1,136
Quote:
Originally Posted by backinblue View Post
It's a shame that you bought the wrong anchor for such a fine boat! Just kidding. The Vulcan is a great choice in my opinion. I bought an Ultra a couple years ago and love it. I saw West Marine recently posting a sale on all Rocna anchors at 40% off. That doesn't necessarilly mean a great deal, but occasionally West marine can be competitive when they run some good sales. Good luck regardless!
I am impressed with what I see about the Ultra. I had pretty much settled on getting one. But the Vulcan had two advantages. 1) from memory its 25% of the cost of the Vulcan, and 2) one can massage the test stats to say the Vulcan has a slight edge in performance. I would not hang my hat on the performance advantage since they both seem to do very well in the kinds of bottom I expect to mostly see. The Ultra, being stainless, is darned pretty. It has that going for it. At the price, though, I could not quite swallow it. For a while I was concerned the Vulcan would not fit the Helmsman roller, but I was shown an example on a Helmsman where it can and does. Problem solved, and money saved.
FWT is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-26-2022, 08:18 PM   #1031
Guru
 
City: Rochester, NY
Vessel Name: Hour Glass
Vessel Model: Chris Craft 381 Catalina
Join Date: Aug 2019
Posts: 6,043
The Vulcan is definitely a good pick. Although I'd be concerned that a 45 lb one is too small. It's a size smaller than Rocna recommends for an H38. FWIW, I went a size above their recommendation and have a 73 lb one on my boat (very close in size to an H38, but about 8000 lbs lighter).
rslifkin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-26-2022, 08:43 PM   #1032
FWT
Guru
 
City: Centreville MD
Vessel Name: Resilient
Vessel Model: Helmsman Trawlers 38E
Join Date: Dec 2020
Posts: 1,136
Quote:
Originally Posted by rslifkin View Post
The Vulcan is definitely a good pick. Although I'd be concerned that a 45 lb one is too small. It's a size smaller than Rocna recommends for an H38. FWIW, I went a size above their recommendation and have a 73 lb one on my boat (very close in size to an H38, but about 8000 lbs lighter).
Actually, the Vulcan website has two selection aids. In one you input boat length and weight. The V25 is their recommendation there for a 39 ft. boat weighing 39k pounds. The H38 has a dry weight of 30k pounds.

Then there is a table. The V25 is in the middle of the range. Going down to a V20 puts you into a recommendation for a 22k pound boat or less. Going up to a V33 puts you into recommended boat weight of 66k pounds or less. A V33 seems excessive, in spite of the standard advice to go up a size.

Further, my concerns up front were whether a V25 would fit the boat. It will. But going up to a V33 might well be pushing it too far. And the V25 selection seems to have more than enough extra heft built into the selection.

https://rocna.com/fitment-guide/

Then you get into chain. H38 comes with 200ft of 5/16 HT chain.

If I read the fitment chart correctly, go up to a V33 and 3/8 chain is recommended. And then you get into windlass, and so forth.

Taken altogether, it seems to me the V25 is plenty, and going further creates a series of issues.
FWT is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-26-2022, 08:54 PM   #1033
Guru
 
City: Rochester, NY
Vessel Name: Hour Glass
Vessel Model: Chris Craft 381 Catalina
Join Date: Aug 2019
Posts: 6,043
Quote:
Originally Posted by FWT View Post
Actually, the Vulcan website has two selection aids. In one you input boat length and weight. The V25 is their recommendation there for a 39 ft. boat weighing 39k pounds. The H38 has a dry weight of 30k pounds.

Then there is a table. The V25 is in the middle of the range. Going down to a V20 puts you into a recommendation for a 22k pound boat or less. Going up to a V33 puts you into recommended boat weight of 66k pounds or less. A V33 seems excessive, in spite of the standard advice to go up a size.

Further, my concerns up front were whether a V25 would fit the boat. It will. But going up to a V33 might well be pushing it too far. And the V25 selection seems to have more than enough extra heft built into the selection.

https://rocna.com/fitment-guide/

Then you get into chain. H38 comes with 200ft of 5/16 HT chain.

If I read the fitment chart correctly, go up to a V33 and 3/8 chain is recommended. And then you get into windlass, and so forth.

Taken altogether, it seems to me the V25 is plenty, and going further creates a series of issues.

I agree that the 25kg should be fine, my choice of the 33kg on a similar size boat was a case of "it'll take the same effort to make either one fit and I like overkill". As far as weight, I'd use loaded weight, not dry weight. My own boat is a little over 27k loaded (plus people), I'd figure an H38 is around 35k loaded (based on the 8k difference in dry weight, but similar capacity for fuel, water, etc.).


As far as chain size, I'd just ignore their recommendation. Sizing chain to the anchor is pointless, it should be sized to the load the boat in question will apply in the worst weather you want to design for. That led me to sticking with 5/16" G43 chain. Yes, the anchor can hold well enough to hurt the chain in a good bottom, but realistically, it'll never get pulled on that hard. The bigger anchor is for better holding when the bottom is crap.
rslifkin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-26-2022, 10:32 PM   #1034
Senior Member
 
City: Davis, California
Vessel Name: Off Leash
Vessel Model: Helmsman 38e
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 100
Hey all, while we are on anchors…we will upgrade to the Vulcan with a Mantus swivel sometime this spring. But I have a concern that may or may not be valid. The stock boat has 200’ of chain. We would like more total rode for anchoring in deeper water, especially in deeper anchorages in Desolation Sound and the Inside Passage (this concept will be foreign to our southeast and Gulf coast friends). We are toying with adding a stock-purchased 25’ chain—using a connecting link—that is then spliced to 100’ of braid. This allows for substantial scope in a big blow. And in the worst case of a fouled and irretrievable anchor, you can use bolt cutters and still have substantial rode left over to attach your spare anchor to. Like groundings, we are just between fouled anchors.

Am I over-thinking this? Do not ask my spouse that rhetorical question.

On the boat this evening in Seattle where it is windy, cold, wet and to a drought-plagued Californian, lovely.

Jeff
__________________
A rising tide floats all boats, which is a pretty good reason to get a boat.
Hydraulicjump is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-2022, 06:17 AM   #1035
Guru
 
backinblue's Avatar
 
City: Stratford, CT
Vessel Name: Blue Moon
Vessel Model: Mainship Pilot 355
Join Date: Jan 2019
Posts: 3,593
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hydraulicjump View Post
Hey all, while we are on anchors…we will upgrade to the Vulcan with a Mantus swivel sometime this spring. But I have a concern that may or may not be valid. The stock boat has 200’ of chain. We would like more total rode for anchoring in deeper water, especially in deeper anchorages in Desolation Sound and the Inside Passage (this concept will be foreign to our southeast and Gulf coast friends). We are toying with adding a stock-purchased 25’ chain—using a connecting link—that is then spliced to 100’ of braid. This allows for substantial scope in a big blow. And in the worst case of a fouled and irretrievable anchor, you can use bolt cutters and still have substantial rode left over to attach your spare anchor to. Like groundings, we are just between fouled anchors.

Am I over-thinking this? Do not ask my spouse that rhetorical question.

On the boat this evening in Seattle where it is windy, cold, wet and to a drought-plagued Californian, lovely.

Jeff
Couldn't you accomplish the same thing by just splicing some nylon line to the 200' of chain? In fact, I would probably go with more than 100' if that was the case. You'd save a little weight by not adding another 25' of chain. Also, if this is your solution for a blow, I might lose a little sleep worrying about the connecting link.
__________________
“In my walks, every man I meet is my superior in some way, and in that I learn from him.” ― Ralph Waldo Emerson
backinblue is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-2022, 06:22 AM   #1036
Guru
 
backinblue's Avatar
 
City: Stratford, CT
Vessel Name: Blue Moon
Vessel Model: Mainship Pilot 355
Join Date: Jan 2019
Posts: 3,593
Quote:
Originally Posted by FWT View Post
I am impressed with what I see about the Ultra. I had pretty much settled on getting one. But the Vulcan had two advantages. 1) from memory its 25% of the cost of the Vulcan, and 2) one can massage the test stats to say the Vulcan has a slight edge in performance. I would not hang my hat on the performance advantage since they both seem to do very well in the kinds of bottom I expect to mostly see. The Ultra, being stainless, is darned pretty. It has that going for it. At the price, though, I could not quite swallow it. For a while I was concerned the Vulcan would not fit the Helmsman roller, but I was shown an example on a Helmsman where it can and does. Problem solved, and money saved.
I can't disagree with those points. For my boat, it wasn't an extraordinary expense. Yes it was more expensive than others, but not enough to blow the boat budget. Besides appearance, stainless has the advantage of coming up much cleaner with usually nothing clinging to it. Their swivel is also worth a look. The way it flips the anchor into position works every time. It appears to be robust and well-made.
__________________
“In my walks, every man I meet is my superior in some way, and in that I learn from him.” ― Ralph Waldo Emerson
backinblue is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-2022, 06:28 AM   #1037
FWT
Guru
 
City: Centreville MD
Vessel Name: Resilient
Vessel Model: Helmsman Trawlers 38E
Join Date: Dec 2020
Posts: 1,136
It appears you kinda have to use the Ultra swivel with the Ultra anchor. Due to the design of the attachment hole at the end of the shank. I didn't go far looking at the swivel because of my change in direction, but there are reports out there of the swivel failing in a strong side load. I had a mental note to track down how real / serious that was.

I'm going with a Mantus swivel. Which may well be overkill, but at some point you stop studying and pull triggers.
FWT is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-2022, 07:29 AM   #1038
Guru
 
City: Rochester, NY
Vessel Name: Hour Glass
Vessel Model: Chris Craft 381 Catalina
Join Date: Aug 2019
Posts: 6,043
Quote:
Originally Posted by backinblue View Post
Couldn't you accomplish the same thing by just splicing some nylon line to the 200' of chain? In fact, I would probably go with more than 100' if that was the case. You'd save a little weight by not adding another 25' of chain. Also, if this is your solution for a blow, I might lose a little sleep worrying about the connecting link.

Agreed, I'd rather just splice line right onto the chain. And I wouldn't necessarily limit it to just 100 feet. I'd take a look at what will fit in the chain locker and decide from there.
rslifkin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-2022, 09:43 AM   #1039
Veteran Member
 
City: Port Ludlow
Vessel Name: Kiskadee
Vessel Model: Helmsman 46 Hull#1
Join Date: Nov 2018
Posts: 73
backinblue has a great suggestion in splicing line on to the 200' chain. The extra rode is useful up north in many of the deep inlets. The Bruce anchor which came with the 38E worked really well in mud and sand, but not as well in rocky bottoms (as expected). Many of the pubs on cruising the PNW also describe what types of bottom exist in the anchorages, so you can plan ahead. The 46 comes with a 66# stainless Bruce with 300 feet of 3/8" chain. I'm very happy about that. I'll stay with the Bruce. I'm still undecided about a spare, and that could be a Rocna.
chanprr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-2022, 10:44 AM   #1040
Guru
 
City: Chattanooga
Vessel Model: Helmsman Trawler 38E
Join Date: Oct 2020
Posts: 851
The 55 lb Rocna is what Two Truths replaced the oversized Mantus 65 lb with. I might return the 45 lb, or I may keep it. He had reported good results on this forum.
Helmsman is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


» Trawler Port Captains
Port Captains are TF volunteers who can serve as local guides or assist with local arrangements and information. Search below to locate Port Captains near your destination. To learn more about this program read here: TF Port Captain Program





All times are GMT -5. The time now is 02:01 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2023, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2006 - 2012