Boat Prices: Has the world changed????

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This might interest. Carsales Co in Australia is buying the remaining 51% it doesn`t own of US company Trader Interactive which operates as a truck and RV online sales site.
Why interesting? It also operates the well established major Australian online boat sales site, "Boatsales". A reasonably aggressive growth business,would not be a surprise if it sought to expand fields once it digests the takeover.
 
This might interest. Carsales Co in Australia is buying the remaining 51% it doesn`t own of US company Trader Interactive which operates as a truck and RV online sales site.
Why interesting? It also operates the well established major Australian online boat sales site, "Boatsales". A reasonably aggressive growth business,would not be a surprise if it sought to expand fields once it digests the takeover.

Trader Interactive already owns Boatline.com so in the boat business. I'm amazed that patent and registration suits aren't tossed back and forth between Trader and Auto Trader and Boat Trader. Could be interesting.
 
Trader Interactive already owns Boatline.com so in the boat business. I'm amazed that patent and registration suits aren't tossed back and forth between Trader and Auto Trader and Boat Trader. Could be interesting.
The report here didn`t mention the target was already in the boating site field, which might have been the main attraction. Australian coys buying overseas businesses sometimes buy things the locals won`t, and get burnt in the process. Not this time I hope.
 
There's an interesting article in the New York Times today on the housing market. I think some of the observations may apply to the used boat market as well (for buying, not the rental aspects of housing):

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/07/08/realestate/housing-market.html

Even though I happily have a new boat on order, I still follow the used boat market (just a glutton for punishment). FWIW, over the past several weeks I've seen a steady increase in the number of new daily listings for used boats on yachtworld. For my (previous) search parameters, for most of last year and early this year, new daily listings were in the single digits. Often under 6-8, some days none. Over the past couple of months this has increased to 30-40 per day.

Supply is increasing, but I have no idea of demand. I no longer call about boats being listed and don't know if it's the same "I've got 10 offers, most over asking" within 24 hours that was the case (at least for the boats I called about) last year and early this year.

What appear to be prime examples or popular models still seem to show 'pending' within a week. On the other hand, I've noticed price cuts for some boats I called about months ago that are still on the market. But if supply continues to increase, eventually it will approach demand. Especially if the demand side is being attenuated by economic conditions (the drop in the stock market, rising interest rates, and diesel fuel prices around or north of $6/gal). There's also the overall aspect of consumer confidence, and the pall a 'recession' has on buying in general (though that of course doesn't apply to 'recession-proof' buyers with massive net worths).

As it usually is for most things, the economic future is murky. While some economic indicators are down and many economists are predicting a recession -

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/07/08/business/economic-indicators-showing-slowdown.html

at the same time job growth appears good and may temper that -

https://www.nytimes.com/live/2022/07/08/business/jobs-report-june-2022

Anyone's guess is as good as anyone else's. I'm not making any predictions, except that diesel fuel prices are not likely to come down meaningfully from their current range. I suspect we'll be seeing prices north of $5/gal for quite some time. Maybe forever. The longer fuel prices stay high and the more people become acclimated to them - and show producers that demand is relatively inflexible regardless of price - the less incentive there is to ever reduce prices, if people show they're still buying it.
 
@Nick14, I don't think you need to be so humble in your statements/conclusions. It's rather obvious that the entire economy, the real estate market and the recreational markets (boats, RV, aviation, etc.) have gone over the top of the hill and are ready to head downward. Real estate prices in my area have been flat for over 2 months now.

Real estate may have a correction, but not a crash, but boats are a heck of alot more volatile.

Since we're sorta still near the peak, now would be a great time for anyone considering selling their boat. Don't wait, that's for sure.
 
Hmmm, timing the market are we? Any good stock tips too?
 
@Nick14, I don't think you need to be so humble in your statements/conclusions. It's rather obvious that the entire economy, the real estate market and the recreational markets (boats, RV, aviation, etc.) have gone over the top of the hill and are ready to head downward. Real estate prices in my area have been flat for over 2 months now.

Real estate may have a correction, but not a crash, but boats are a heck of alot more volatile.

Since we're sorta still near the peak, now would be a great time for anyone considering selling their boat. Don't wait, that's for sure.

LOL, thanks, but I have a lot to be humble about! (Then there's the old saying, 'Opinions are like a$$h0les, everybody has one').

I think you're absolutely right about sellers getting the message that if they want to sell, now is the time. A lot of people love to try and time markets. In reality the only way to sell at the top and buy at the bottom is by luck. Because you don't know when the top has occurred until you're looking back at it from some lower point.

But there are enough economic changes happening that it's a safe bet conditions will soften going forward. I think the substantial increase in supply of used boats coming onto the market in recent months is a sign that a number of buyers are feeling the same way.

It's one of the strongest forces motivating many human actions: FOMO. Fear Of Missing Out. It drove the skyrocketing price bubble with buyers being afraid of missing out on getting a boat, and now is percolating with sellers afraid of missing a hot selling opportunity.

It's a lot more fun to watch now that I'm a spectator :popcorn:
 
A couple month’s ago I had to sell my fishing boat because I’ll be moving overseas soon. Had nothing to do with “timing” the market but I’m glad for the coincidental timing anyway. Honestly I could feel the sluggishness in the market compared to the 2020/2021 Covid market.
 
LOL, thanks, but I have a lot to be humble about! (Then there's the old saying, 'Opinions are like a$$h0les, everybody has one').

If you'd allow me to edit.....

'Opinions are like a$$h0les, everybody has one, and they usually stink'
 
What I have noticed about the housing market. Hot markets have leveled off and their is slightly more inventory. Vacation homes are seeing some price reductions and inventory is has increased greatly but inventory was so small that only a few additions become a significant percentage increase.

The low end of the house market (under $600,000) is lest affected while the over $1,000,000 shows most the signs of slowing.

With fuel prices up and borrowing costs going up there should be less demand for boats. However, there is little inventory in the under 15 year old category and I wouldn’t expect any change here. I would expect a softening in the 20 to 30 year old category and especially above 50’.

I don’t follow the RV market but I hear it is in free fall. I hear the issue is less fuel prices and more an issue with to much demand on camping sites and of course rising interest rates.
 
It's one of the strongest forces motivating many human actions: FOMO. Fear Of Missing Out. It drove the skyrocketing price bubble with buyers being afraid of missing out on getting a boat, and now is percolating with sellers afraid of missing a hot selling opportunity.

It's a lot more fun to watch now that I'm a spectator :popcorn:

I have to say that I felt some FOMO. I started looking at vacation homes. Prices were right but I wasn’t seeing the right one for me. Then prices started taking off and choices got fewer. I started to lower my requirements and raised my price limits. Still houses were moving faster than I could react. I almost pulled the trigger due to FOMO but at the last moment l pulled out of the market completely. Not a month after I gave up stocks dropped and now interest rates are increasing. I am not claiming genius on the timing, I am claiming luck that things spun out of control before FOMO got me.
 
I have to say that I felt some FOMO. I started looking at vacation homes. Prices were right but I wasn’t seeing the right one for me. Then prices started taking off and choices got fewer. I started to lower my requirements and raised my price limits. Still houses were moving faster than I could react. I almost pulled the trigger due to FOMO but at the last moment l pulled out of the market completely. Not a month after I gave up stocks dropped and now interest rates are increasing. I am not claiming genius on the timing, I am claiming luck that things spun out of control before FOMO got me.

You and me both.

It's a slippery slope sliding down the seductive path of FOMO. It's a slowly progressive disease. It comes on gradually, builds over time, and before you know it, you've got full-blown FOMO. It's just human nature.

I came perilously close to royally FOMO-ing myself, and had a serious case of it. It's hard not to when you love boats and want one. For the past 2 1/2 years every day I'd watch boats plying the waters of Narragansett Bay out our windows, and I wanted to be out there myself. Every day the want got a little bit stronger. Combined with a market that every day got a little crazier and progressively more of a seller's market, is a deadly combination (at least dangerous to one's wallet).

FOMO starts slowly, with little things. Cutting a corner or two, making compromises and doing things just a little bit differently than you did before. Taking a a little more risk. Telling yourself you have to 'move faster', 'make a few little compromises', 'accept the realities of the market.' Which incrementally builds and becomes taking bigger and bigger risks. It starts a chain of bad decisions, and eventually crosses over from risk taking to simple financial stupidity.

It came to a fever pitch for me a few months ago, in the peak of my own FOMO frenzy, doing blatantly dumb and likely self-destructive (at least to my bank account) things to try and get a boat. The last experience was the proverbial straw that broke the camel's back and finally threw a bucket of ice-cold water in my face (my wife helped with that).

I realized that to buy a used boat in the absolutely b@tsh!t-crazy seller's market (up until recently) was going to take a willingness to 1) buy sight unseen, 2) be the highest bidder in an auction situation, 3) be willing to increase my bid with no upper limit if higher offers came in, 4) pay cash, 5) pay much more than a boat would have sold for a year or two ago, 6) with no contingencies, 7) close within two weeks, and, for me the worst of all and what finally broke my delirium, was
8) realizing I had to be subservient and submissive in the face of rude, arrogant, and disdainful treatment. Basically, bend over, grab my ankles, and say, 'thank you sir may I have another? and also take out my wallet and say 'help yourself.'

It finally hit me how absolutely insane that all was (at least for me). Others have opined that this is what it took to buy a boat in this market. But I realized I had gone too far down the dark, ensnaring path of FOMO. I got out before doing something painful to our bank account, and ordered a new build instead (which has been a complete pleasure and delight).

To each their own. Some are willing to pay the prices and are happy with the outcome. There's no absolute 'right' or 'wrong' in the process, only what's right or wrong for each person (it also depends heavily on the size of one's bank account; if there was another zero on the end of ours, I probably wouldn't have cared as much)(though #8 above was still too much to swallow).

It also helped to have a spouse willing to throw cold water in my face and say, 'what the he!! are you doing and why are you doing it?!'
 
As a side note, has anyone else noticed the recent uptick in RV commercials on TV? Not sure I really remember very many in the past, but now they are on frequently. They are offering RV purchases for $5/day, and equipment sales that were orig $500, now $150. I get the impression that they flooded the supply in the last couple years and all of a sudden, demand is drying up.
 
I realized that to buy a used boat in the absolutely b@tsh!t-crazy seller's market (up until recently) was going to take a willingness to 1) buy sight unseen, 2) be the highest bidder in an auction situation, 3) be willing to increase my bid with no upper limit if higher offers came in, 4) pay cash, 5) pay much more than a boat would have sold for a year or two ago, 6) with no contingencies, 7) close within two weeks, and, for me the worst of all and what finally broke my delirium, was
8) realizing I had to be subservient and submissive in the face of rude, arrogant, and disdainful treatment. Basically, bend over, grab my ankles, and say, 'thank you sir may I have another? and also take out my wallet and say 'help yourself.'

I forgot to add another realization of trying to buy a used boat during pandemic seller's market frenzy: 9) I couldn't ask any questions about the boat, because apparently to some people, asking things like engine hours that aren't listed is taken as a 'red flag.'
 
My neighbor recently bought a 36-foot center console with several BIG outboard motors on it. He was up in the Carolinas poking around for a boat when he was informed of this boat down in Florida. He drove on down that day, saw the boat which was offered in the high 300s and offered 250K cash on the spot, no survey. It ended up at 285K. Now he has installed two 500-gallon gasoline tanks on one of his four waterfront lots on our street a couple of doors down from us in order that he may fuel the boat to its 525-gallon capacity for what he figures will be two fishing trips into the Gulf to catch two legal red snappers per person on the boat before he needs to refuel. He cruises at 35 knots - expensive fish. That's the way he rolls, and I don't suppose the other people who were interested in that boat stood a chance in heck of buying it once his sights were on it. One day I looked out to see three big Hatteras sportfishing boats move in and tie up at his pier, all his and on the way to be leased to charter fishermen in Louisiana. I wonder if he bought them in the same aggressive manner. Never a dull moment here.
 
As a side note, has anyone else noticed the recent uptick in RV commercials on TV? Not sure I really remember very many in the past, but now they are on frequently. They are offering RV purchases for $5/day, and equipment sales that were orig $500, now $150. I get the impression that they flooded the supply in the last couple years and all of a sudden, demand is drying up.


Take a look at what’s going on in Elkhart Indiana.
 
Think about the topic and what’s been discussed. Google “RV” and then Elkhart Indiana. Doesn’t take a lot of detective work
 
Think about the topic and what’s been discussed. Google “RV” and then Elkhart Indiana. Doesn’t take a lot of detective work

Or you could just tell us! Why do we have to solve a puzzle?
 
They all seem to be busy as ever.
 
The down side of owning a RV, when you are not using it, you have to find a place to park it, a boat, slips, buoy, anchor.
 
Yup. I think the RV thing is just as applicable to "live aboard" possible boats. It can be more than a boat, it can be a second home.
 
When I google "RV Market" and then click the "news" I see a ton of very recent articles on how even with inflation, even with high gas prices, even with higher financing rates, even if it costs you $500 to fill the tank, the RV market is still hot. (And a lot of articles about electric RV's, etc.) Still hot around here too, but then I'd take issue with Elkhart being the "RV capitol of the world." Okay, maybe they make, buy and sell a lot in that area, but I live in the O'Hare or Hartsfield/ATL crossroads of RV activity on the way to Mt. Rushmore, so my perspective is skewed. Our marina is still packed. New docks are full. But then I've mentioned my analysis before, lots of inertia in the recreational RV/boat markets, deeper pockets to begin with means it takes a little longer for the pockets to empty in a rough economy.
 
The down side of owning a RV, when you are not using it, you have to find a place to park it, a boat, slips, buoy, anchor.

thats why I bought an RV rather than a boat...I can keep it in my yard...My family thought I lost my mind.... "you have always been a boat guy"..... Life evolves.... Camping next weekend with a moderator of this forum....again, this month... And I'm still Chicken of the sea!
 
But you don't get this view from the backyard.

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