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06-25-2017, 10:12 PM
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#21
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Senior Member
City: Patterson, LA
Vessel Name: Last Tango
Vessel Model: Ocean 40 + 2 Trawler Yacht
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 112
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Capt. Well done.
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06-25-2017, 10:32 PM
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#22
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Guru
City: Gig Harbor
Vessel Name: Kinship
Vessel Model: North Pacific 43
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 9,046
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Last Tango
Capt. Well done.
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Thanks, but not really. I just managed to not completely screw up and was fortunate.
In retrospect, I think I should have dropped the anchor sooner. I should have dropped the anchor at 50-60'. I knew the shore was very steep. I waited until I had about 26' of water which put me too close to shore.
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06-25-2017, 10:34 PM
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#23
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Guru
City: Boston
Vessel Name: Adelante
Vessel Model: IG 30
Join Date: Nov 2016
Posts: 1,608
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Instead of a rum & coke I would have filled my glass with engine oil to see if I could get any fuel to separate out. My first instinct would have been a failed oil pump. But smelling fuel would indicate injectors either out of time or orifices too large and washing fuel past the rings. Curious about the cause of unplanned afternoon of leisure.
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06-25-2017, 10:43 PM
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#24
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Senior Member
City: Patterson, LA
Vessel Name: Last Tango
Vessel Model: Ocean 40 + 2 Trawler Yacht
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 112
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I anchored north of the Panama Canal, Pacific side. Single handling and tired. Dropped the hook in 21 fsw
Slept and woke up with Mai Tai in breaking waters. I was Blessed to get my ground tackle back.
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06-25-2017, 11:01 PM
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#25
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Guru
City: LaConner
Vessel Model: 34' CHB
Join Date: Apr 2016
Posts: 1,257
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That sounds like a not too fun day Dave, sorry that happened, it sucks. But as you say, could have been worse. You done allright, got the boat home, no injury or damage. Now to have a chat with the mechanic fella!
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06-25-2017, 11:16 PM
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#26
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TF Site Team
City: Ex-Brisbane, (Australia), now Bribie Island, Qld
Vessel Name: Now boatless - sold 6/2018
Vessel Model: Had a Clipper (CHB) 34
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 10,100
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Yes, Dave, kudos for your calmness. And yes, it might have paid to drop anchor a bit sooner, but hindsight is great. Now we are all agog as to what the issue turns out to be. The thing against your diagnosis re the low oil pressure is such a low pressure. Even if contaminated with diesel oil, one would still not expect such a huge drop - ie, enough to set off the low pressure alarm. What was the dipstick level..?
__________________
Pete
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06-26-2017, 06:55 AM
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#27
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Technical Guru
City: Wilmington, NC
Vessel Name: Louisa
Vessel Model: Custom Built 38
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 6,194
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Diluted oil absolutely can cause low oil pressure. It also can wreck crankshaft and rod bearings. If injectors were replaced, could have been an error in the supply or return lines under rocker cover.
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06-26-2017, 07:33 AM
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#28
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Guru
City: Carefree, Arizona
Vessel Name: sunchaser V
Vessel Model: DeFever 48 (sold)
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 10,179
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ski in NC
Diluted oil absolutely can cause low oil pressure. It also can wreck crankshaft and rod bearings. If injectors were replaced, could have been an error in the supply or return lines under rocker cover.
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+1
Who was the last guy who worked on injectors and/or fuel system?
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06-26-2017, 07:39 AM
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#29
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Guru
City: Newark, DE
Vessel Name: Infinity
Vessel Model: Kadey Krogen 48
Join Date: Jan 2015
Posts: 708
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Well handled Dave.
..though IIRC that boat seems very comfortable on the rocks. You missed another photo-op.
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06-26-2017, 09:56 AM
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#30
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Guru
City: Gig Harbor
Vessel Name: Kinship
Vessel Model: North Pacific 43
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 9,046
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SoWhat
Instead of a rum & coke I would have filled my glass with engine oil to see if I could get any fuel to separate out. My first instinct would have been a failed oil pump. But smelling fuel would indicate injectors either out of time or orifices too large and washing fuel past the rings. Curious about the cause of unplanned afternoon of leisure.
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I am curious as well. I have had a 6 months of engine trouble, all starting with a problem of my own making. A short recap;
In January I changed the charger on my engine battery and then forgot about that. A couple weeks later when we next ran the boat the engine was running very rough.
Got a mechanic out to check it out. Three visits, a new lift pump, and 6+ weeks later I gave up on that shop (their Cummins Tech was out on an L&I claim).
Called Cummins Northwest, they replaced the fuel pump actuator, all six injectors, and still the problem persisted (the engine simply ran poorly better than it had before). When the mechanic disconnected the alternator and the problem got a bit better, I finally remembered the charger. When it was disconnected the problem disappeared.
Next time we used the boat it ran better than it has ever run, but after a while it would smoke. Still ran well (not as efficient) and no issues with oil pressure or temps.
Mechanic came back Friday and we took it out for a sea trial and he found that one injector was returning a lot more fuel than it should. He corrected that (he thought the tube that feed the fuel into the side of the injector hadn't seated fully) and being as it was late at this point, we called it good. BTW, he along with every other mechanic on the boat checked the oil each time they were on the boat.
Sunday, no smoke, no problems, until the oil pressure dropped.
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06-26-2017, 09:59 AM
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#31
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Guru
City: Gig Harbor
Vessel Name: Kinship
Vessel Model: North Pacific 43
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 9,046
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter B
Yes, Dave, kudos for your calmness. And yes, it might have paid to drop anchor a bit sooner, but hindsight is great. Now we are all agog as to what the issue turns out to be. The thing against your diagnosis re the low oil pressure is such a low pressure. Even if contaminated with diesel oil, one would still not expect such a huge drop - ie, enough to set off the low pressure alarm. What was the dipstick level..?
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Dipstick was about twice as high as it should have been. So their was a whole lot more volume in the pan. I am completely ignorant about anything mechanical but to me it seems there are only two possibilities, water or fuel. It didn't seem like water so I was guessing fuel. Hard for me to tell but it seemed to me that it smelled like diesel a bit.
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06-26-2017, 10:00 AM
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#32
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Guru
City: Gig Harbor
Vessel Name: Kinship
Vessel Model: North Pacific 43
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 9,046
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Quote:
Originally Posted by danderer
Well handled Dave.
..though IIRC that boat seems very comfortable on the rocks. You missed another photo-op.
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At one point I could almost have jumped from the swim step to shore and taken another photo.
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06-26-2017, 10:13 AM
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#33
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Guru
City: Northport
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 2,046
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dhays
I am curious as well. I have had a 6 months of engine trouble, all starting with a problem of my own making. A short recap;
In January I changed the charger on my engine battery and then forgot about that. A couple weeks later when we next ran the boat the engine was running very rough.
Got a mechanic out to check it out. Three visits, a new lift pump, and 6+ weeks later I gave up on that shop (their Cummins Tech was out on an L&I claim).
Called Cummins Northwest, they replaced the fuel pump actuator, all six injectors, and still the problem persisted (the engine simply ran poorly better than it had before). When the mechanic disconnected the alternator and the problem got a bit better, I finally remembered the charger. When it was disconnected the problem disappeared.
Next time we used the boat it ran better than it has ever run, but after a while it would smoke. Still ran well (not as efficient) and no issues with oil pressure or temps.
Mechanic came back Friday and we took it out for a sea trial and he found that one injector was returning a lot more fuel than it should. He corrected that (he thought the tube that feed the fuel into the side of the injector hadn't seated fully) and being as it was late at this point, we called it good. BTW, he along with every other mechanic on the boat checked the oil each time they were on the boat.
Sunday, no smoke, no problems, until the oil pressure dropped.
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Excuse my bluntness but you may have incorrectly hooked up the batt charger but I do not see anything you did permanently to the engine "problem".
From your description it appears that a Cummins mechanic replaced parts while guessing at a causal problem and installed one or more parts incorrectly and did not pick it up on a test run.
IMHO - let the problem lay with whomever caused it since this is not a situation that is near resolution and the results may be more than you might imagine - hopefully not - but there is not a complete picture here so far.
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06-26-2017, 10:38 AM
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#34
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Guru
City: Gig Harbor
Vessel Name: Kinship
Vessel Model: North Pacific 43
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 9,046
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smitty477
Excuse my bluntness but you may have incorrectly hooked up the batt charger but I do not see anything you did permanently to the engine "problem".
From your description it appears that a Cummins mechanic replaced parts while guessing at a causal problem and installed one or more parts incorrectly and did not pick it up on a test run.
IMHO - let the problem lay with whomever caused it since this is not a situation that is near resolution and the results may be more than you might imagine - hopefully not - but there is not a complete picture here so far.
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I think you have characterized it very well. One small difference is that I hooked the charger correctly. There seems to be an issue however with the Balmar Duo Charger with the Cummins electronic engines. Once that charger was removed from the picture, things were fine.
So, all my current problems were created by the mechanic's attempts to find and fix the prior problem. In their defense, I will say that this was a very difficult problem to track down. I also had simply forgotten that I had reconnected that Balmar prior to the engine initially running rough. If I had recalled that, I would have solved the problem myself (which I did anyway) before I had ever called a mechanic.
In general I try to maintain a positive attitude about most things. I will admit though that this is starting to get me down a bit. Thursday the mechanic will be out at the boat again and then hopefully a sea trial on Friday.
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06-26-2017, 10:41 AM
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#35
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Guru
City: SF Bay Area
Vessel Model: Tollycraft 34' Tri Cabin
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 12,569
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GEEE WIZZZ Dave - Almost a BIG, BIG Ouch!! But, now you are in position to correct the situation. Hope repair goes smoothly and quickly... inexpensively too!
You did well!! Sorry I'm so late to the "party".
Regarding how coolly you handled things. I felt confident that that coolness is in your nature... from looking closely into the first avatar photo at captain's wheel you had on TF. Pictures really do tell a thousand words.
Best Luck! - Art
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06-26-2017, 11:34 AM
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#36
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TF Site Team
City: Jacksonville
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 11,670
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[QUOTE=Ski in NC;567011.... If injectors were replaced, could have been an error in the supply or return lines under rocker cover.[/QUOTE]
This happened to us after the rebuild last fall. The bleed off pipe wasn't torqued properly at an injector so instead of returning fuel to the tank it was leaking under the rocker arm cover and diluting the oil. Found and fixed the problem then changed the oil. That was 150 plus hours ago and everything seems good.
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06-26-2017, 10:20 PM
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#37
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Guru
City: LaConner
Vessel Model: 34' CHB
Join Date: Apr 2016
Posts: 1,257
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Afraid I don't grasp how a remote charger would make the engine run rough. Once its started it doesn't need anything but fuel and air.
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06-26-2017, 10:32 PM
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#38
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Guru
City: Gig Harbor
Vessel Name: Kinship
Vessel Model: North Pacific 43
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 9,046
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 78puget-trawler
Afraid I don't grasp how a remote charger would make the engine run rough. Once its started it doesn't need anything but fuel and air.
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Electronic engines seem to be picky about their batteries and voltage. I recall Tony Athens being very vocal about never letting an engine start battery "talk" to anything else but the engine. In essence, the Balmar Duo Charge was "talking" to the engine and the engine didn't like what it heard.
The mechanic had been told by a more senior tech for truck based Cummins that they had seen a faulty alternator create the same type of problem we were having. We disconnected the alternator while the engine was running and the engine ran better, but still not great. When i disconnected the Balmar Duo Charge the engine ran smooth.
The Duo Charge would charge the engine start battery (which is what is connected to the engine) whenever a charge current was applied to the house bank. The alternator was connected to the house bank and the Duo Charge then charged the start battery. We kept connecting and disconnecting the Duo Charge and it was like magic. Ran like crap with it connected and purred like a kitten with it disconnected.
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06-26-2017, 10:52 PM
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#39
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Guru
City: LaConner
Vessel Model: 34' CHB
Join Date: Apr 2016
Posts: 1,257
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Thanks Dave, I guess with my more primitive Lehman such is unlikely to be a problem. I hope your situation is easily resolved.
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06-26-2017, 10:54 PM
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#40
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Guru
City: Gig Harbor
Vessel Name: Kinship
Vessel Model: North Pacific 43
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 9,046
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 78puget-trawler
Thanks Dave, I guess with my more primitive Lehman such is unlikely to be a problem. I hope your situation is easily resolved.
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Thanks. I get just a little sick every time I think about it. <sigh>
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