instead of fuel polishing?

[BruceK]

"Clean your fuel tanks, if you've got a drain plug then put a tap/valve on it, hold a clear glass jar/bottle below it and 'crack' the (open the valve slightly) valve until clean fuel runs out. Do this once a month and you'll have no trouble."
....While its true draining some gunk from the bottom of box for fuel would improve fuel quality in the tank , what percentage of folks might bother?...

Brisboy was bothering to replace his fuel tank plugs with valves, to do just that. Wonder how it went?

 

[ben2go]

Here are the ingredients as said by the MSDS. You could probably source the ingredients to make a lifetime batch for not much money.

 

[Delfin]

Hi one and all,

Polishing - a subject i have written about many times, so may I add my twp cents-worth?

Remember that your engines are probably the best polishing systems and are already on board. Excess fuel drawn by the engine fuel pumps will have already been filtered before being returned to the tanks.

Real polishing is where any water, diesel bug and debris that's settled on the bottom of a tank is removed. This takes knowledgeable pipe installation and powerful pumping to stir everything up before being drawn off, filtered and returned, polished. BTW, a centrifuge filter is by far the best but many use Racor filters.

Hence, the method of piping and the power of the pump are absolutely crucial and often overlooked by the sellers and installers of polishing systems.

To be effective, you want the outflow from the polisher to be powerful and aimed at the bottom of the tank to create a real stir. The draw should be about halfway up the tank.

Given time, all the muck your engines and common polishing systems you can buy cannot reach, will have been polished.

From experience, I respectfully disagree. What you describe would be a system that can only polish the fuel if the tanks are at least half full, which doesn't seem terribly effective.

And for big tanks, and I'm thinking of a 750 gallon wing tank I recently inspected, their length, supporting gussets, etc. would prevent stirring up any muck effectively with a single nozzle, where ever it was placed. Far easier is to do a serious polishing when the tanks are near empty and you are bashing around in a bit of a sea. Before that, the occasional polishing of a tank that has more fuel in it removes the asphaltine that is starting to precipitate out. The decade old aforementioned tank that has had a lot of fuel passed through it and has been polished as described had about 2 quarts of murky fuel, zero water, and zero deposits on the sidewalls. The pump moves 3gpm, which with a tank 10' long, isn't going to stir up much muck, but will very effectively clean the fuel of managed as described

 

[Delfin]

Without water in a fuel tank you can have no biological life (usually bacteria). A simple means of extracting water, a well with a drain, or a stripper tube, the latter can be added after the fact, I've installed them on many tanks, will eliminate the need for a biocide. No water no biological life, no biological life means no biocides are needed.

I wouldn't dream if using an additive that attacked aluminum. Among other things, primary and secondary fuel filter housings and injection pump bodies are aluminum.

My advice is to use additives to target specific issues, and choose additives based on what they can do. Those that claim to do everything, including clean a dirty tank, are suspect at best. I've cleaned or supervised the cleaning of scores of diesel tanks, the accumulated crud on tank bottoms almost always has to be scooped or shoveled out, see the photos in the article link below. Additives simply cannot remove this material.

Lubricity additives make sense because these are often added at the fuel distribution rack, and errors occur. Stabilizers and cetane boosters also make sense. However, I remain deeply skeptical of the one stop fixes it all solutions.

Two part article additives: https://stevedmarineconsulting.com/diesel-fuel-additives-part-i/ and https://stevedmarineconsulting.com/diesel-fuel-additives-part-ii/

Tank cleaning: https://stevedmarineconsulting.com/cleaning-diesel-tanks/

A properly designed and installed polishing system with sufficient volume can keep fuel and a tank clean. A polishing system can't clean a tank with years of accumulated debris, nor can dockside fuel cleaning services unless they access all baffled chambers of a tank. Otherwise they are simply filtering the fuel, which has value in its own right, just don't expect it to clean the tank too, again unless the tank is fully accessed.

Given the observation that 40% of fuel sold doesn't meet the lubricity standards specified by the manufacturers, adding one seems like a a highly recommended preventative. The testing of lubricity conducted on all major brands I referenced above helped clear some of the smoke and mirrors around the subject for me. Funny that some additives actually reduced lubricity....

 

[Riverguy]

There are a number of additives that claim to reduce fuel consumption by 5% or more. I found that by using 20 of them, I had to stop every couple of days and pump the excess fuel out of the tank or it would overflow.

This made me laugh...thanks! ;-)

 

[Simi 60]

That's really smart. If your fuel sets for any length of time, you'll be breeding organisms in your tank. Probably gaining water, too.
.

Our boat had near enough 1000 gallons of diesel in it when we got her
The then owner had probably done 100 miles in the ten years he had her and the diesel was discoloured so I guess it was old diesel.

We drained a few litres out of the crud sump and had zero water or crud and used the existing filters for a year with no increase in vacuum.
Two years down the track, still check the crud sump monthly and no water or crud.

I put a lot of our result down to deck fillers not being in the deck to leak but high up in the cabin side.

Also Jay Leno's Garage has a video on Archoil.

Do you reckon he has a vested interest in touting the stuff he sells?

 

[greatpapabear]

From experience, I respectfully disagree. What you describe would be a system that can only polish the fuel if the tanks are at least half full, which doesn't seem terribly effective.

And for big tanks, and I'm thinking of a 750 gallon wing tank I recently inspected, their length, supporting gussets, etc. would prevent stirring up any muck effectively with a single nozzle, where ever it was placed. Far easier is to do a serious polishing when the tanks are near empty and you are bashing around in a bit of a sea. Before that, the occasional polishing of a tank that has more fuel in it removes the asphaltine that is starting to precipitate out. The decade old aforementioned tank that has had a lot of fuel passed through it and has been polished as described had about 2 quarts of murky fuel, zero water, and zero deposits on the sidewalls. The pump moves 3gpm, which with a tank 10' long, isn't going to stir up much muck, but will very effectively clean the fuel of managed as described

Hi Delfin, your comments are well received. Yes, I'm referring to large larger fuel tanks such as those on Play d'eau; yes, tank baffles can be a problem making piping a challenge; and yes, keeping tanks full is crucial not only to allow effective polishing but to reduce the potential of condensation during our winters. On our side of the Atlantic, the main issue faced is from diesel bug. As you know, this grows on the interface between the natural suspension of water in diesel and the fuel itself. Couple this with the increasing amount of bio-fuel being sold with its guaranteed water content, it becomes a nightmare.

So anti-bacterial additives are the absolute norm. I've never found bug in tanks treated properly.

 

[foreverunderway]

In the first place, a fuel polishing system is pretty much a waste of money, if you do not start with clean tanks. It cannot clean the tanks, especially if there are multiple baffles in the tanks. Your Racor filter and the secondary on the engine should be sufficient to protect your engine(s) if you change them regularly.
After reading about this product, I'm thinking it may be nothing more than alcohol. At best it is probably 'snake oil' as mentioned above, and at worst would provide the user with a false sense of security and cause engine damage from thinking it is doing something it is not.
I'd suggest sticking with the tried and true additives like Biobor or what we use, Star Tron Enzyme Fuel Treatment.

 

[Delfin]

In the first place, a fuel polishing system is pretty much a waste of money, if you do not start with clean tanks. It cannot clean the tanks, especially if there are multiple baffles in the tanks.

Blanket statements on just about any subject tend to be wrong, as this one is.

 

[Cigatoo]

“I'd suggest sticking with the tried and true additives like Biobor or what we use, Star Tron Enzyme Fuel Treatment.”

Tried and true according to who? No offense intended. Just wondering.

 

[foreverunderway]

Blanket statements on just about any subject tend to be wrong, as this one is.

[FONT=&quot]
[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]If you've had fuel 'shutdowns' due to contaminated fuel, your prime goal, unfortunately, is to somehow get inside that tank and remove all the built up and adhering crud that is deposited and is GROWING on the tank walls. Inspection ports 'can' (should be) be added to fuel tanks. [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]
That 'crud', if black, is usually massive colonies of fungus (Cladosporium resinae, etc.) that are using the (water wetted) fuel oil (and the metal walls of the tank) as its nutrient source.
The best way to remove such contamination is to chemically 'kill it' and then physically hand scrub the 'colonies' off the tank walls.
[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Further down in efficacy of contamination removal - but the 'next best', is to hire a commercial fuel service with a high capacity 'recirculation polishing' system ... but without opening up the tank and physically SEEING the tank walls, there will be no guarantee that the sludge will be completely removed from the tank walls. Any living organism not removed will continue to produce spores (most all organisms that contaminate fuel oil are 'spore formers') which will continue to reinfect your fuel system. BUT, biocides like Biobor and Star Tron will affect 'some' reduction of the continual re-contamination.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]An onboard r[/FONT][FONT=&quot][FONT=&quot]ecirculation polishing system is a means to KEEP a fuel tank relatively clean; not a means to 'clean' it.[/FONT][/FONT]
[FONT=&quot][FONT=&quot]Better?[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
[/FONT] [/FONT]

 

[foreverunderway]

“I'd suggest sticking with the tried and true additives like Biobor or what we use, Star Tron Enzyme Fuel Treatment.”

Tried and true according to who? No offense intended. Just wondering.

Primarily by commercial operators of small craft like fishing vessels, workboats (mostly on harbors, lakes, and rivers), charter boats, and small harbor tugs. Though they use fuel in quantities that would make pleasure boaters go pale, most I've worked on used Biobor, and more recently the Star Tron products, religiously.

 

[Delfin]

[FONT=&quot]
[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]If you've had fuel 'shutdowns' due to contaminated fuel, your prime goal, unfortunately, is to somehow get inside that tank and remove all the built up and adhering crud that is deposited and is GROWING on the tank walls. Inspection ports 'can' (should be) be added to fuel tanks. [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]
That 'crud', if black, is usually massive colonies of fungus (Cladosporium resinae, etc.) that are using the (water wetted) fuel oil (and the metal walls of the tank) as its nutrient source.
The best way to remove such contamination is to chemically 'kill it' and then physically hand scrub the 'colonies' off the tank walls.
[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Further down in efficacy of contamination removal - but the 'next best', is to hire a commercial fuel service with a high capacity 'recirculation polishing' system ... but without opening up the tank and physically SEEING the tank walls, there will be no guarantee that the sludge will be completely removed from the tank walls. Any living organism not removed will continue to produce spores (most all organisms that contaminate fuel oil are 'spore formers') which will continue to reinfect your fuel system. BUT, biocides like Biobor and Star Tron will affect 'some' reduction of the continual re-contamination.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]An onboard r[/FONT][FONT=&quot][FONT=&quot]ecirculation polishing system is a means to KEEP a fuel tank relatively clean; not a means to 'clean' it.[/FONT][/FONT]
[FONT=&quot][FONT=&quot]Better?[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
[/FONT] [/FONT]

Not really. If the contamination is biologic, appropriately designed polishing will remove water and the biologics die. If inorganic, true the deposits that take a chisel to clean off the tank walls won't be removed by polishing, but the particles that actually matter will be. If "clean" means fuel that won't clog the filters and stop the engine, then polishing can certainly produce that result. But I certainly agree that if you have clean tanks and want to keep them that way, a polishing system will do that. As well.

 

[RT Firefly]

Greetings,
Mr. f. I fully agree and to further clarify your post (#41) for the naysayers, C. resinae is a fungus and one of many contaminants that may dwell in fuel tanks. Some are fungi and some bacteria.
While fuel polishing, properly done, will minimize the overall number of biologics and should eliminate any water there will still be "bugs" in your tank.

Tank treatments will affect 'some' reduction but complete elimination would require total sterilization of the tank that would last as long as your next batch of fuel or passage of bacteria bearing air from your tank vent.
As anyone knows, elimination of mold aboard is quite difficult due to their reproductive mechanism ie: spores. By their very nature, spores can survive extremely harsh conditions.
The best one can hope for is keeping the fuel bug free enough to use.


This paper addresses jet fuel but the problem is very much the same:


https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC546914/


Nasty things those fuel eating bugs when they're in your tank BUT great when used to clean up oil spills...



https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2018/04/180409144725.htm

 

[Delfin]

Greetings,
Mr. f. I fully agree and to further clarify your post (#41) for the naysayers, C. resinae is a fungus and one of many contaminants that may dwell in fuel tanks. Some are fungi and some bacteria.
While fuel polishing, properly done, will minimize the overall number of biologics and should eliminate any water there will still be "bugs" in your tank.

Tank treatments will affect 'some' reduction but complete elimination would require total sterilization of the tank that would last as long as your next batch of fuel or passage of bacteria bearing air from your tank vent.
As anyone knows, elimination of mold aboard is quite difficult due to their reproductive mechanism ie: spores. By their very nature, spores can survive extremely harsh conditions.
The best one can hope for is keeping the fuel bug free enough to use.


This paper addresses jet fuel but the problem is very much the same:


https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC546914/


Nasty things those fuel eating bugs when they're in you tank BUT great when used to clean up oil spills... https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2018/04/180409144725.htm

Since resinae lives in the water/fuel interface of the fuel, when the water/fuel interface is removed, where do the "bugs" remain?

Having bought Delfin with 1,500 gallons of fuel that sat for 4 years before we finished refitting her and I could start burning it, and with thousands of gallons of fuel passed through the tanks in the last decade, with never bothering to keep the tanks full during the winter, and having never added a drop of biocide to my fuel - just lubricity improvers - why do you think I have zero biologic contamination and no water in my tanks, which I can attest to since I just looked the inside of them?

Hint: the fuel has been polished over the last decade.

 

[Steve DAntonio]

From experience, I respectfully disagree. What you describe would be a system that can only polish the fuel if the tanks are at least half full, which doesn't seem terribly effective.

And for big tanks, and I'm thinking of a 750 gallon wing tank I recently inspected, their length, supporting gussets, etc. would prevent stirring up any muck effectively with a single nozzle, where ever it was placed. Far easier is to do a serious polishing when the tanks are near empty and you are bashing around in a bit of a sea. Before that, the occasional polishing of a tank that has more fuel in it removes the asphaltine that is starting to precipitate out. The decade old aforementioned tank that has had a lot of fuel passed through it and has been polished as described had about 2 quarts of murky fuel, zero water, and zero deposits on the sidewalls. The pump moves 3gpm, which with a tank 10' long, isn't going to stir up much muck, but will very effectively clean the fuel of managed as described

Delfin, agreed, polishing system pick up and return plumbing should be located close to, and at opposite ends, of the bottom of the tank. 3 gpm, or 180 gph, is a healthy rate for polishing, while it's enough to stir up light sediment, however, nothing is better for this than getting underway.

Far too many polishing systems I encounter suffer from inadequately sized or located plumbing. There should be no restrictions between polishing system pumps/filters and the plumbing that connects them to tanks, and no plumbing should be shared between polishing systems and consumers, engines, and gensets. You should be able to run a polishing system while dockside or underway.

This article covers fuel polishing systems http://stevedmarineconsulting.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/03/FuelPolishing_PBB112_opt.pdf

This one covers centrifugal filtration http://stevedmarineconsulting.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/03/CentrifugeFilters115_05.pdf

 

[Delfin]

Delfin, agreed, polishing system pick up and return plumbing should be located close to, and at opposite ends, of the bottom of the tank. 3 gpm, or 180 gph, is a healthy rate for polishing, while it's enough to stir up light sediment, however, nothing is better for this than getting underway.

Far too many polishing systems I encounter suffer from inadequately sized or located plumbing. There should be no restrictions between polishing system pumps/filters and the plumbing that connects them to tanks, and no plumbing should be shared between polishing systems and consumers, engines, and gensets. You should be able to run a polishing system while dockside or underway.

This article covers fuel polishing systems http://stevedmarineconsulting.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/03/FuelPolishing_PBB112_opt.pdf

This one covers centrifugal filtration http://stevedmarineconsulting.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/03/CentrifugeFilters115_05.pdf

Steve, check out these pumps: https://www.grainger.com/product/PROCON-1-2-Stainless-Steel-Rotary-6XE90

You can get them in a number of sizes, and they are driven by a 1/3 hp 120 vac motor. The carbonator clamp attachment makes it simple to mount. Quiet, and seemingly indestructible.

On my system, one pump draws through a 30 micron Racor 1000 that I run to maintain refinery spec on bulk fuel storage. The other motor/pump is wired through a pair of Omron programable relays that allow me to set an off time separate from the on time. If I leave the boat for a month and want to refill the boiler day tank, the off time is set to 7 days and on the on time to 3 minutes and this keeps that day tank topped off. Or, if I want to polish for 3 days sitting at the dock, that is easy. The filter on this pump is a 10 micron, and I use it to transfer fuel from one tank to another.

I built this system for around $1,500 in parts, not counting the hoses, my labor, or two Debug units which everyone will say are pointless, but which I had great success with in cleaning up a contaminated tank on a prior boat.

 

[greatpapabear]

Maybe it's time for some personal experience rather than theory.

Play d'eau (Fleming55) has 4 fuel tanks with no polishing system installed. One Racor filter plus a fine filter per engine. Overspill returns to the supply tank. The overspill is the polished fuel. Tanks are kept full to prevent internal condensation

The base of each tank is checked bi-annually. No water, dead diesel bug or debris has ever been found in 15 years.

I treat the fuel with an additive every fill, plus a full treatment at the start and end of the season. Tank filler caps have their O rings changed every 3 years to prevent water ingress.

Result? No trace of any isses.

On the other hand, over 30 years I've known many motor boats and yachts suffer from diesel bug and end up employing a contractor to come along with a 'polishing system' which doesn't in any way stir up the base of the tank to get rid of the slimy dark brown dead bug. Lo and behold, that in almost every case, the clogged filters casued by dead bug, persists.

The moral of the story is to care for your fuel from day 1, realising that if there's going to be prpoblem it will happen in an emotional sea just when you don't need it.

 

[sunchaser]

Who amongst us can provide some first hand experiences with details as to:
-- fouled tanks that stopped your vessel
-- how old was the fuel
-- how old is the boat
-- what % of tankage does the vessel turn over each year
-- where was the bad fuel purchased

I have second hand information on
-- new boats with construction debris blocking the tank pickups
-- old fuel in old boats being problematic
-- bad Ensenada fuel fouling tanks on a two year old vessel equipped with a top flight polishing system
-- contaminated shore trucks and 55 gallon drums
-- deck fills leaking

Stories
-- refineries use no additives so "I" do
-- the reason "I've" never had a problem is due to (pick one or two)
-- ESI or similar fuel polishing system
-- Gulf Coast filter
-- magnets
-- use of additives makes bad fuel good, cleans tanks eliminates water
-- "I" heard on TF yada yada about bad diesel fuel

So as tossed out earlier, who amongst us has the first hand knowledge and details as to bad fuel stopping your boat.

 

[FF]

"So as tossed out earlier, who amongst us has the first hand knowledge and details as to bad fuel stopping your boat"

Never stopped yet BUT the monel tanks do not rust , have a plate with holes mounted near the bottom to keep motion from mixing gunk , and a low point drain. And we use BioBore

The drain has a gate valve and plug , as insurance.

The deck fills have been relocated to under 6 inch deck plates , and capped with a std 2 inch plumbing cap.

Even if the deck plate went overboard the cap the threaded cap could take water washing down.

I know of one marina where a weekend constant boat washer did not replace the O ring on his deck mounted fill , and came to blows with the fuel dock for water in the fuel.

Both the USN and Palmer Johnson have published plans of genuine fuel tanks , filter strainers and bailable sumps
.So even a 50/50 fuel and water fill could be bailed out with no equipment , just time for the water to sink.

As few pleasure boats have fuel tanks , most have boxes for fuel,
I have wondered if a bottom drain could be built in to feed a lower down installed sump to collect the water that causes the bugs.

Sure there might be a danger from a leak , but if the water sump were only used dockside there would be less danger.

We use an emergency bilge pump all summer in case there is an oil leak.
Or the usual pump fails.
It is plumbed into the galley sink which has a pile of oil grabbing pads .

 

[angus99]

Who amongst us can provide some first hand experiences with details as to:
-- fouled tanks that stopped your vessel
-- how old was the fuel
-- how old is the boat
-- what % of tankage does the vessel turn over each year
-- where was the bad fuel purchased

I have second hand information on
-- new boats with construction debris blocking the tank pickups
-- old fuel in old boats being problematic
-- bad Ensenada fuel fouling tanks on a two year old vessel equipped with a top flight polishing system
-- contaminated shore trucks and 55 gallon drums
-- deck fills leaking

Stories
-- refineries use no additives so "I" do
-- the reason "I've" never had a problem is due to (pick one or two)
-- ESI or similar fuel polishing system
-- Gulf Coast filter
-- magnets
-- use of additives makes bad fuel good, cleans tanks eliminates water
-- "I" heard on TF yada yada about bad diesel fuel

So as tossed out earlier, who amongst us has the first hand knowledge and details as to bad fuel stopping your boat.

On a delivery run from Florida to the Chesapeake, one of our 1987 Lehmans shut down during rough conditions on Albermarle Sound due to a clogged Racor. I wasn’t aboard, but my son and the delivery skipper changed the filters and plowed on. The fuel was mostly new—purchased in Daytona and at Hinkley’s in Savannah, IIRC—but I have little doubt there were decades of crud in the tanks when I bought the boat. When the boat was on the Chesapeake, I had the tanks professionally cleaned and they got half a 5-gallon bucket of crap out. The boat was then out of the water for two years while I did some major projects and I’m sure some of the crud has returned.

The “polishing” system I have is home-made and weak—although it does draw from the very bottom of the tanks. It’s being replaced with a Fleetguard mud filter, progressive primary filtration and a stronger pump and will be used both at the dock and underway in sloppy conditions to remove any water and whatever else can be sucked out through the “polishing” system. At some point, I’ll check the tanks again to see how it’s working.

 

[greatpapabear]

This is becoming interesting in as far that in the UK and Europe we almost never come across any boats which have 'inbuilt' polishing systems such as ESI.

Once bug is found (normally in emotional seas when it's least wanted) it's treated with additives such as Grotomar 82, filters are changed and lines blown through. This may well happen two or three times before it's been cleared through.

I'm just thankful that the regime I've adopted, appears to have worked well for all the boats i've owned.

Often, we find bug hits when boats have just refilled. The force of refilling causes muck in the bottom of the tank to be stirred up, blocking the filters, and rest you know.

We also find that boats which fill from a refueller which itself has only very recently been refuelled, suffer problems. The bottom of their tanks have been stirred up, and again, you know the story.

 

[jleonard]

Who amongst us can provide some first hand experiences with details as to:
-- fouled tanks that stopped your vessel
-- how old was the fuel
-- how old is the boat
-- what % of tankage does the vessel turn over each year
-- where was the bad fuel purchased

So as tossed out earlier, who amongst us has the first hand knowledge and details as to bad fuel stopping your boat.

I have first hand knowledge of bad fuel stopping my boat.
1978 Mainship I twin saddle bag tanks, Perkins 160.
I used the boat a lot and it was fine for about 5 seasons. Out and about locally and "sputter, sputter, dead". Anchored and investigated, found blockage in a brass fitting where a copper line came into the manifold assembly that Td the tanks together (I ran on only one side so troubleshooting was easier).

The piece of crud looked like a very large coffee grounds stuck together. It was stuck inside the male flare fitting, look like it had a cutoff burr that was rolled inside when the fitting was manufactured.
Cleaned it out, deburred and back up and running.
A couple months later, I got shut down again. This time I noticed the Racor 900 looked a little low on fuel. So I went to shut the valves off and heard/felt a cruck on one of the valves. Opened that one back up and the fuel "bubbled" back into the filter. I'm sure it was anther "chunk".
I always bought fuel from the same place on the Mystic river where the commercial guys went so the turnover was high.

The next season, one of the guys on my dock had his filters all taken apart on the back of his boat and had a crowd around "helping". The crud he had in the bucket was that same as I had but he had it in spades.
We discovered we both got fuel the same day last season at the same place. Further investigation determined that that marina's filter system imploded that day and they didn't know it for a while.

Ship happens.

After that I started draining the crud out of the bottom of the Racor after each days run. It eventually cleared up.

 

[greatpapabear]

A colleague supplied a superyacht with some specialist FLIR kit, and found that when the superyacht refuells, all fuel goes through the yacht's Alpha Laval centrifugal filters before reaching the tanks. When refuelling is complete, the yacht's engineer hands the refuller the muck from the centrifuge....

 

[sunchaser]

This is great, the last few posts are most relevant. It really is helpful for those of us awaiting the and how to recognize it.

 

[greatpapabear]

This is great, the last few posts are most relevant. It really is helpful for those of us awaiting the and how to recognize it.

Have you ever seen dead diesel bug? It's a nasty dark brown sludge that falls to the bottom of the tank, waiting to be stirred up to clog filters and pipes.

As you know, it breeds on the interface of the water that's naturally in suspension in diesel and the diesel itself. Anti-bacterial additives work wonders to stop it from breedng.

 

[Northern Spy]

Two points. Both disparate.

1. I had a leaky deck fill that allowed several liters of water go into one of my fuel tanks. Fuel pick up is at the bottom of tank (1981 boat). Engine stopped due to fuel starvation as the water couldn't get past the Racor. Aquabloc coating worked! Pumped out as much of the water as I could with a barrel pump through the deck fill. Ballasted the boat so that the fuel pick up was at the low point. Ran the engine until the water level came up in the filter. Stopped engine, drained filter. Repeated ad infinitum. Gave tank a shot of Biobor. Dip tanks with sounding rod with Kolor Kut paste on bottom. No repeats, no growth. Have boroscoped my tank many times and have never seen crud. Filter runs clean on a regular basis. Tank is clean. Change filter annually to ensure Aquabloc coating is still present.

2. Nuclear powered submarines have a tank separating the reactor compartment form the forward compartment. It is called the NFO (normal fuel oil) tank. It provides shielding and stores fuel for the ND 8 1/8 Fairbanks Morse diesel engine. The tank is always full as it is topped off (bottomed-off?) with seawater. It would be a bad thing to have ullage in your shield tank. The tank has an equalization tank vented inboard to accommodate temperature and hull contraction changes. The fuel in the NFO could be there for years. It was a big tank. We pumped fuel from the NFO tank to the DFO (Diesel Fuel Oil) tank through a duplex filter for use in the engine. No centrifuges. No biocide. Go figure. Now maybe the old ND 8 1/8 could burn a combination of horse urine and roofing tar and it just wouldn't matter. Or maybe, having cooties in your fuel tank doesn't really matter, as long as it is filtered.

Shrug.

 

[ben2go]

Delfin, agreed, polishing system pick up and return plumbing should be located close to, and at opposite ends, of the bottom of the tank. 3 gpm, or 180 gph, is a healthy rate for polishing, while it's enough to stir up light sediment, however, nothing is better for this than getting underway.

Far too many polishing systems I encounter suffer from inadequately sized or located plumbing. There should be no restrictions between polishing system pumps/filters and the plumbing that connects them to tanks, and no plumbing should be shared between polishing systems and consumers, engines, and gensets. You should be able to run a polishing system while dockside or underway.

This article covers fuel polishing systems http://stevedmarineconsulting.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/03/FuelPolishing_PBB112_opt.pdf

This one covers centrifugal filtration http://stevedmarineconsulting.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/03/CentrifugeFilters115_05.pdf

Thank you for posting those PDFs.

 

[sunchaser]

Thank you for posting those PDFs.

x2

 

[Simi 60]

Does anyone have an idea how much fuel gets pumped through an 855 cummins "PT" pump?

I can find no actual data online or in manuals but the 3500 litre x 2 fuel tanks warm up pretty quick so I am thinking it must pump it through at a good rate.

This page indicates 400 LPM max
That's 24000 litres/ hour
I find it hard to believe that could be right.
https://wancum.en.made-in-china.com...5-PT-Fuel-Pumps-3655233-Cummins-Oil-Pump.html