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Old 12-25-2017, 01:54 PM   #81
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But that explains why normal boaters and commercial operators, using their fuel on a fairly regular basis, that dont use additives generally dont have issues in my and it seems like plenty of other's experience.
Think the simple answers are fuel turnover and suspended particulate removed by the filter. My charter boat typically consumes 40 to 80% of the fuel in the tank each trip. With 70 to 100 trips per year, that's a lot of fuel turnover. While my pickup is in a small sump keeping the bottom of the tank clean, the agitation from running in seas would mix stuff up in most tanks. The one time I got a fill up of fuel with a load of crud in it, the racor had sucked it all up and was plugged in only 2 trips.

The other factor that seems to have made a difference is that most fuel docks now have filters on their stations just before the fill hose. Think that has eliminated most of the crud risk. Don't known if they also trap water.

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Old 12-25-2017, 05:10 PM   #82
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We use about 50% of our tank each year.
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Old 12-25-2017, 06:30 PM   #83
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Never used anything other than diesel in my 4-200 gallon black steel tanks. Boat is 1976 model and we bought it new.

After seeing tests that showed no appreciable difference between keeping tanks full verses half full, I did change my keep full policy to 1/2 tank at the end of boating season and refill in the Spring. Just to turn over the fuel a little more often. Tanks are still clean and it's been 5 years now.
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Old 12-25-2017, 08:09 PM   #84
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Originally Posted by Nomad Willy View Post
PeterB,
Isn’t that the way most boats are plumbed?
A vertical pick-up tube down to about 3/4” from the bottom.
Sorry, bit late coming back in on this. Eric, you missed my point. My tanks actually have the fuel line coming from the bottom. There is no pick-up tube down from the top. So anything the forms that could build up as crud or water is being continually drained away and dealt with by the primary filter - which last years, by the way. So, no crud has time to build up on the bottom of the tanks. I gather Nordhavn use a similar set-up - backed up again by a day tank with a sump drain as well, I think.
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Old 12-25-2017, 08:21 PM   #85
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PeterB,
Isn’t that the way most boats are plumbed?
A vertical pick-up tube down to about 3/4” from the bottom.
Mine have a pickup tube from the bottom side of the tank, approx 1/4 inch above the bottom edge. Here's a shot from inside the tank in the middle of a recent tank repair. This is the aft port corner of the stbd tank.
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tank5.jpg  
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Old 12-26-2017, 02:00 AM   #86
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I think this thread is done.
Those that use additives never have problems
Those that DON'T use additives never have problems........but they do have extra dollars for more diesel.
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Old 12-26-2017, 06:55 AM   #87
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I do believe, I will over dose my fuel with a additive to remove the condensate. Opinions?
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Old 12-26-2017, 07:12 AM   #88
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If you hava a condensate problem, or any other problem...

Sure, use a problem specific additive.

If you dont have a problem with condensate, then dont.

Do you know you have a condensate problem? A little water in a Racor isnt evidence of just condensate, it could have been water in the fuel delivered, or got in through the vemt or filler line. Is it all year or occasional? Etc...etc....
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Old 12-26-2017, 07:28 AM   #89
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If you hava a condensate problem, or any other problem...

Sure, use a problem specific additive.

If you dont have a problem with condensate, then dont.

Do you know you have a condensate problem? A little water in a Racor isnt evidence of just condensate, it could have been water in the fuel delivered, or got in through the vemt or filler line. Is it all year or occasional? Etc...etc....
It all started when I would get a water in fuel alarm when starting. It would clear in a couple of seconds. When I check the Racor, the bowl was white with the emulsion of fuel and water. I had the filter bowl removed, cleaned and new o'rings installed. New filter too.
The fuel is about 2 years old.
I am going to over dose the fuel will BioBorMD, about twice recommended amount. BioBor MD is the only additive that states it will take care of the water.
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Old 12-26-2017, 08:13 AM   #90
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We use about 50% of our tank each year.
I'm like you Simi. Tanks full when we bought at end of March, now at about 1/2. If I was like the guys using it up every day/week/month I would be less concerned although you aren't concerned either. With my low fuel use it wouldn't be very expensive to throw in some biocide at fill up and I guess I will do so. I haven't read one post about it hurting anything.
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Old 12-26-2017, 09:47 AM   #91
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It all started when I would get a water in fuel alarm when starting. It would clear in a couple of seconds. When I check the Racor, the bowl was white with the emulsion of fuel and water. I had the filter bowl removed, cleaned and new o'rings installed. New filter too.
The fuel is about 2 years old.
I am going to over dose the fuel will BioBorMD, about twice recommended amount. BioBor MD is the only additive that states it will take care of the water.
If I were a betting man I would bet that you have or had an entry point for that water. Pretty rare to purchase fuel with water in it in the states. Until you locate and eliminate the entry point and remove the water you will always have condensation. Water comes before condensation. Just sayin.

Can you stick the tanks with a water locating paste to get an idea of the amount of water? Can the tanks be drained from the bottom? Insert hose down the filler and siphoned from the bottom until clean fuel is reached? (Must be done after boat has been still for a time to let things settle?)
Hire a polishing company / tank cleaning company with experience removing water. Fix the waters entry point and start over with clean fuel and you are good to go.
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Old 12-29-2017, 01:19 PM   #92
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With my low fuel use it wouldn't be very expensive to throw in some biocide at fill up and I guess I will do so. I haven't read one post about it hurting anything.
Throwing free money into my bank account won't hurt anything either.
Please transfer funds to...........
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Old 12-29-2017, 01:44 PM   #93
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Yup, probably a leaky filler cap or another source of entry. Water in fuel is nearly unheard of in the US and Canada since they stiffened the rules on fuel storage tank monitoring and EPA licensing of underground storage tanks.

If you've got detectable levels of water in your tank, then the leak source needs to be found and corrected and the water physically removed by draining or filtering.

If you think there is another way to remove the water, then you're in denial. No amount of additive will make the water go away.
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Old 12-29-2017, 01:45 PM   #94
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Throwing free money into my bank account won't hurt anything either.
Please transfer funds to...........
And as they say on TV, "So you dont forget, send before midnight tonight"

Of course you will have to give him all your personal information. You may discover he takes more out than he puts in. LOL
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Old 12-29-2017, 02:43 PM   #95
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Sorry, bit late coming back in on this. Eric, you missed my point. My tanks actually have the fuel line coming from the bottom. There is no pick-up tube down from the top. So anything the forms that could build up as crud or water is being continually drained away and dealt with by the primary filter - which last years, by the way. So, no crud has time to build up on the bottom of the tanks. I gather Nordhavn use a similar set-up - backed up again by a day tank with a sump drain as well, I think.
PeterB,
Thank you. Gave me an idea. My fuel tanks have fuel port right on the bottom in the ctr and on the inside. The yard attached my Wabasto to it. Worked great but crud in the fuel is a very bad thing for Wabasto. I quickly replumbed that but as a pickup for the engine w a sizable Racor filter could be absolutely fine. And all the crud would eventially go down the pick up in the center as the boat pitched. Water w the vertical pu tube would stay on the tank bottom.
Something for me to think about. Thanks again.

I’d like input from others ......
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Old 12-29-2017, 02:53 PM   #96
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And as they say on TV, "So you dont forget, send before midnight tonight"

Of course you will have to give him all your personal information. You may discover he takes more out than he puts in. LOL
Nah, I would never do that. Simi's point is well taken, why waste money? But...with 600 gallons in two tanks I'm ok with $25.00 for 1200 gallon worth of the biocide. All kidding aside my concern is that, for now, the diesel just sits there for extended periods in the South Florida heat and rain and cold(er) and heat and rain, etc. Probably senseless worry but if $20 helps me sleep at night then I'm good.
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Old 01-09-2018, 08:43 AM   #97
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Yup, probably a leaky filler cap or another source of entry. Water in fuel is nearly unheard of in the US and Canada since they stiffened the rules on fuel storage tank monitoring and EPA licensing of underground storage tanks.



If you've got detectable levels of water in your tank, then the leak source needs to be found and corrected and the water physically removed by draining or filtering.



If you think there is another way to remove the water, then you're in denial. No amount of additive will make the water go away.


Depends on amount of water certainly, but detectable water can be safely removed with additives containing jet fuel de-icer.

Also, there is more entrained moisture in diesel fuel nation wide in recent years.

I will see if I can attach a brief on this later.
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Old 01-09-2018, 09:40 AM   #98
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Depends on amount of water certainly, but detectable water can be safely removed with additives containing jet fuel de-icer.

Also, there is more entrained moisture in diesel fuel nation wide in recent years.

I will see if I can attach a brief on this later.
That is interesting!


BTW... I've been using Soltron for a decade; with what I feel are very good results. You have thoughts regarding Soltron??


Thanks! Art
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Old 01-09-2018, 03:41 PM   #99
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Not too familiar, but if you like results...
I worked with Wester States Oil, and they reoorted that the City of SF tried it for awhile. That was years ago though.
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Old 01-09-2018, 03:48 PM   #100
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Hey Art,
Do you know how I would attach a file —.pdf ?
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