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Old 10-08-2021, 06:13 PM   #41
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Originally Posted by Davil1 View Post
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Hi Deep Sea
is this your boat?

https://sailboatdata.com/sailboat/cal-21
Sure is. Spent a few years sailing her and looking forward to a few years motoring her.
Deep Sea
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Old 10-08-2021, 07:56 PM   #42
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Here's a sailboat to trawler conversion that I thought came out reasonably well and would certainly be a good Looping boat.

https://www.trawlerforum.com/forums/...kts-14365.html

Ted
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Old 10-08-2021, 08:52 PM   #43
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sail to trawler

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Originally Posted by Deep Sea View Post
Sure is. Spent a few years sailing her and looking forward to a few years motoring her.
Deep Sea
===============================

I specialized in "lost" causes, there is no project that simple I cannot complicate.
Few years ago did the opposite, had a Nimble Vagabond 20,pilot house or mini trawler, since I have always been a sailor (still am, sail a Cape Dory 30 MKII), after the first year asked several forums about converting to sail, everybody agreed could not been done, lots of technical explanations, and the more was told why could not been done the more determined I was.
Eventually had her rigged as a sloop, with roller furling on both head and main sails Bark sails that ordered precut from SailRite and sewn, together, learned to make sails during that time.
Was the prettiest boat ever seen, when stopping at transient places, somebody always had a comment, was truly a sight.
Every comment and opinion expressed here from a technical or practical point of view more likely correct, but we are not logical, nor practical, otherwise we will not be sailing or boating.
Go for it if your heart is on it.
By the way, I am in this forum although still sailing my time is coming up and trawler is there for me, haven't jumped yet but more likely have a season left the most, after that trawler here I come.
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Old 10-08-2021, 10:26 PM   #44
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I hope you will post pictures of this journey. Really curious to see the project as it moves along. Good luck.
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Old 10-09-2021, 10:56 AM   #45
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Another possibility?

At least 75% of the sailboats we see on the water (Pamlico, Pungo, Neuse, Rivers, Pamlico Sound, ICW, etc.) are under power - no sails up. We call those a "Motor Boat on a Stick". Why not just enjoy the nice design of the Cal 21 for what it is, save the money, add whatever additional power makes sense. I had a 21' San Juan - a smaller/lighter sailboat, and we did an 8 day cruise from New Bern, to Oriental, Belhaven, Bath, back to Oriental then New Bern. Tight accomdations, but it beats staying home or day sailing. (Saw a small trawler on the trip, light bulb went off, began Trawler dreams right then.) Power was a 4 1/2 hp British Seagull, but we sailed most of the way, except Hobucken/Bay River ICW canal. Havng a centerboard all the way down on those waters often is a great idea even under power - short, steep chop in moderate wind on those shallow waters with long fetches.

Assuming you have an outboard already, going higher up hp might not get you much additional speed, so check your actual speed against calculated hull speed.

Keeping up your sailboat to maximize potential sale price, and saving the money might lead to your having a nifty trawler later on. I see a razor sharp Atlas 25 on the water often - sort of a lobster boat/trawler variant. Saving up for one of those on the used market and selling the Cal might be the best outcome down the road. Check them out at Atlas's website or Yachtworld.
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Old 10-09-2021, 11:51 AM   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NCheaven View Post
At least 75% of the sailboats we see on the water (Pamlico, Pungo, Neuse, Rivers, Pamlico Sound, ICW, etc.) are under power - no sails up. We call those a "Motor Boat on a Stick". Why not just enjoy the nice design of the Cal 21 for what it is, save the money, add whatever additional power makes sense. I had a 21' San Juan - a smaller/lighter sailboat, and we did an 8 day cruise from New Bern, to Oriental, Belhaven, Bath, back to Oriental then New Bern. Tight accomdations, but it beats staying home or day sailing. (Saw a small trawler on the trip, light bulb went off, began Trawler dreams right then.) Power was a 4 1/2 hp British Seagull, but we sailed most of the way, except Hobucken/Bay River ICW canal. Havng a centerboard all the way down on those waters often is a great idea even under power - short, steep chop in moderate wind on those shallow waters with long fetches.

Assuming you have an outboard already, going higher up hp might not get you much additional speed, so check your actual speed against calculated hull speed.

Keeping up your sailboat to maximize potential sale price, and saving the money might lead to your having a nifty trawler later on. I see a razor sharp Atlas 25 on the water often - sort of a lobster boat/trawler variant. Saving up for one of those on the used market and selling the Cal might be the best outcome down the road. Check them out at Atlas's website or Yachtworld.
^^^That is what I meant by don't do it. The Cal 21 is a fun boat as is. Use your talents to bring an old trawler back to life.
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Old 10-09-2021, 12:12 PM   #47
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Originally Posted by O C Diver View Post
Here's a sailboat to trawler conversion that I thought came out reasonably well and would certainly be a good Looping boat.

https://www.trawlerforum.com/forums/...kts-14365.html

Ted



Thanks for the link OC. I've seen "Winnie the Pooh" on another site. Love that boat. I pulled a lot of great ideas from her - smaller version, but still...
Thanks again


What does OC stand for?


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Old 10-09-2021, 12:22 PM   #48
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[QUOTE=Davil1;1044130]===============================

I specialized in "lost" causes, there is no project that simple I cannot complicate.
Few years ago did the opposite, had a Nimble Vagabond 20,pilot house or mini trawler, since I have always been a sailor (still am, sail a Cape Dory 30 MKII), after the first year asked several forums about converting to sail, everybody agreed could not been done, lots of technical explanations, and the more was told why could not been done the more determined I was.
Eventually had her rigged as a sloop, with roller furling on both head and main sails Bark sails that ordered precut from SailRite and sewn, together, learned to make sails during that time.
Was the prettiest boat ever seen, when stopping at transient places, somebody always had a comment, was truly a sight.
Every comment and opinion expressed here from a technical or practical point of view more likely correct, but we are not logical, nor practical, otherwise we will not be sailing or boating.
Go for it if your heart is on it.
By the way, I am in this forum although still sailing my time is coming up and trawler is there for me, haven't jumped yet but more likely have a season left the most, after that trawler here I come.[/QUOT



I don't really understand any of the negative input that you got converting a small trawler to sail. Motor sailors have been around a long time. Essentially, that is what it sounds like you ended up with. What did you use for a keel and ballast under sail or did you use small sails and light winds?
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Old 10-09-2021, 12:27 PM   #49
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I hope you will post pictures of this journey. Really curious to see the project as it moves along. Good luck.

Most definitely! What jobs are worth doing without the documentation in pictures? Please stay tuned

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Old 10-09-2021, 12:30 PM   #50
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[QUOTE=Deep Sea;1044260]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Davil1 View Post
===============================


I don't really understand any of the negative input that you got converting a small trawler to sail. Motor sailors have been around a long time. Essentially, that is what it sounds like you ended up with. What did you use for a keel and ballast under sail or did you use small sails and light winds?
Deep Sea
--------------------------------
we speak the same language, "small sails and light winds"!!!!
Just wanted to enjoy both the challenge and the "under sail" sensation.
If you have difficulties understanding the negatives, imagine The Wright brothers!! a flying machine? Cannot be done!
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Old 10-09-2021, 12:32 PM   #51
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and the Nimble has a stubby keel with about 600 lbs ballast
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Old 10-09-2021, 01:09 PM   #52
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Originally Posted by NCheaven View Post
At least 75% of the sailboats we see on the water (Pamlico, Pungo, Neuse, Rivers, Pamlico Sound, ICW, etc.) are under power - no sails up. We call those a "Motor Boat on a Stick". Why not just enjoy the nice design of the Cal 21 for what it is, save the money, add whatever additional power makes sense. I had a 21' San Juan - a smaller/lighter sailboat, and we did an 8 day cruise from New Bern, to Oriental, Belhaven, Bath, back to Oriental then New Bern. Tight accomdations, but it beats staying home or day sailing. (Saw a small trawler on the trip, light bulb went off, began Trawler dreams right then.) Power was a 4 1/2 hp British Seagull, but we sailed most of the way, except Hobucken/Bay River ICW canal. Havng a centerboard all the way down on those waters often is a great idea even under power - short, steep chop in moderate wind on those shallow waters with long fetches.

Assuming you have an outboard already, going higher up hp might not get you much additional speed, so check your actual speed against calculated hull speed.

Keeping up your sailboat to maximize potential sale price, and saving the money might lead to your having a nifty trawler later on. I see a razor sharp Atlas 25 on the water often - sort of a lobster boat/trawler variant. Saving up for one of those on the used market and selling the Cal might be the best outcome down the road. Check them out at Atlas's website or Yachtworld.

Thanks for the heads up on the Atlas/Acadia 25. Just about what I have a vision for in my little 21.
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Old 10-09-2021, 02:15 PM   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Deep Sea View Post
Thanks for the link OC. I've seen "Winnie the Pooh" on another site. Love that boat. I pulled a lot of great ideas from her - smaller version, but still...
Thanks again


What does OC stand for?

Deep Sea
OC Diver was the name of my charter boat. Had it for 20 years and use the name on any internet forum I'm on. OC is short for Ocean City, MD.

Ted
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Old 10-09-2021, 04:27 PM   #54
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Ncheaven wrote;
“ Assuming you have an outboard already, going higher up hp might not get you much additional speed, so check your actual speed against calculated hull speed. ”

Yes but not so much.
Because of the very fine ends (bow especially) the sailboat hull will push the water aside late as in when the hull is further fwd. So the effective WLL will be shorter.

Sailboats do this because while under sail they are going considerably slower than hull speed so to optimize what they usually do .. go slow. At these well under hull speed speeds the sailboat maximizes their very low power (sails) most of the time. And at those speeds they will be very efficient.

And w a trawler or similar boat w full ends, it will respond to longer than measured WL lengths … and will be faster than using the traditional (actual) WLL.
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Old 10-09-2021, 07:51 PM   #55
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We towed a small sailboat once at our normal tow speed, nearly capsized it.
Good advice to check if hull speed is reached before adding power.
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