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Old 04-09-2020, 12:23 AM   #41
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A friend of mine did basically the same thing. He said they almost missed Hawaii. Then what would have happened?
In those long ago pre-GPS days, there were methods to make sure we didn't miss HI.
First, I swung my compass before we left L.A.
Second, we were able to take a noon sight almost every day using WWV for time.
Third, I sailed for Hilo on the Big Island that has a convenient 13,000 ft volcano on it.
Fourth and most useful, I had a second-hand RDF to locate the radio towers in Hawaii.
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Old 04-09-2020, 02:23 PM   #42
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Zero. Speed stabilizers are pretty efficient at anchor being fins or Gyro. I have ABT STAR stabilizers on my boat and I can confirm that my wife really enjoys them...
To circle back on this, are you saying that hydraulic stabilizer fins work at rest as well as underway?
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Old 04-09-2020, 07:07 PM   #43
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To circle back on this, are you saying that hydraulic stabilizer fins work at rest as well as underway?
It depends on the option, for instance ABT track proposes the STAR ( Stab At Rest) upgrade, I am sure other brands are doing the same.
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Old 04-09-2020, 07:54 PM   #44
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That's pretty much the progression I expect from us. BTW, if we ever do make Hawaii (unlikely given the time to get there), we'd go down to San Diego and over, shortening the shore-to-shore trip length. Personally I don't care for the idea. It's not the time at sea, but the distance from solid ground in the event something goes awry.

Actually, if you wanted to cut the distance, San Francisco is a couple hundred miles closer than San Diego and about 300 miles closer than Seattle.

Then of course you have the extra 800 or so miles between SEA and SFO to make first. So....enjoy your shopping and selecting the perfect vessel for you!
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Old 04-09-2020, 08:22 PM   #45
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Hey. Let's all go comfortably on a ship to Hawaii, as on January 20 this year.
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Old 04-09-2020, 08:31 PM   #46
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Thanks, I'll definitely check out those resources. [*]I'm of the opinion that short coastal cruises will be all we ever do. My wife wants to be able to get as far as Hawaii. It's a reasonable ask. We love Hawaii, and airfare for two plus a couple weeks' worth of hotel can pay for a lot of fuel.
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I had a friend who wanted to buy a 40' sailboat and sail to Hawaii...he'd never owned a boat or sailed before. I'll give you the same advice that I gave him re. taking your own boat to Hawaii. Go to the windward side of one of the islands, look at the waves rolling in, multiply by 2500 miles, then decide if you really want to do it. My friend decided against it. The few hundred dollars in airfare, and 5 hour transit time start to look like a great deal.

So be realistic about how you'd use the boat and buy something that fits that requirement. I've known people who bought ocean capable sailboats dreaming of crossing the ocean and never left San Francisco Bay (well, not by much).
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Old 04-10-2020, 09:45 AM   #47
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Go to the windward side of one of the islands, look at the waves rolling in, multiply by 2500 miles, then decide if you really want to do it.
Now there's a fine bit of advice.
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Old 04-13-2020, 01:09 PM   #48
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I think one of the reasons you are getting some mildly snide remarks is that you present yourself as a bit of a jerk frankly. A little humility goes a long way in the boating community...



Almost no cruisers start off by buying a transoceanic yacht, or one that might be professionally crewed. They start off smaller & simpler.

We can almost guarantee you that if you go out and buy a boat of the size and capability you want, you'll be selling it before too long, after you get some experience and figure out what you really want. And the buy & sell process is long and expensive...



I suggest you buy a boat no larger than 45' or so to begin with. Join a yacht club that does a lot of cruises. Take your time learning the seamanship needed to cruise, and then head to Alaska in the summer. After that trip, you'll have a better feel for what your needs & wants are in reality.


Being the guy that prefers to pay to have the upkeep done, you may find that a big ocean cruiser is vastly more expensive than you can reasonably afford.

Or maybe not. In that case just go ahead and buy the Fleming 55, hire a captain and enjoy the ride...
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Old 04-13-2020, 02:47 PM   #49
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... And the buy & sell process is long and expensive...
What I'm trying to avoid is having to switch boats two or three times over the next few years.

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I suggest you buy a boat no larger than 45' or so to begin with. Join a yacht club that does a lot of cruises. Take your time learning the seamanship needed to cruise, and then head to Alaska in the summer. After that trip, you'll have a better feel for what your needs & wants are in reality.
That's my plan, actually. I've been reviewing floor plans for boats in the 35-50 foot range, and finding plenty I like in the 38-43 foot range. As I said, I expect to spend somewhere between two and five years cruising exclusively in the PNW before attempting to go anywhere else.
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Being the guy that prefers to pay to have the upkeep done, you may find that a big ocean cruiser is vastly more expensive than you can reasonably afford.
You appear to be reading a lot into my posts. I'm asking questions, presumably of experienced people. I know what my limits are, both physical and financial. I expect to take the information I get, put it in the mix with the limits I have, and decide on a boat. That's all.
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Or maybe not. In that case just go ahead and buy the Fleming 55, hire a captain and enjoy the ride...
I don't know what the Fleming 55 is, but I get your drift. And, no, I don't have that kind of money. And if I did, I would use it some other way. But I'm also not limited to $25,000 hurricane-tossed pocket cruisers from the early eighties. My preference is to buy a boat that's going to not only do what I want now, but what I want for the extent of the next eight years or so. I don't want to buy something, feel it out, find out that I didn't do enough research, should have bought something else, should have listened to the people offering me solid advice... I don't have time for that crap.

I also want to buy a boat that isn't going to need a ton of fixing for problems related to previous neglect. And they appear to be out there. I'd rather buy a boat that has fewer features than might be available, but has been well maintained, than I would something that fits the description of "all fur coat and no knickers". I want to spend my time boating, not in dry dock fixing through-hull issues.

I'm sorry if my frankness comes across as being an ass. In a somewhat-related note, my favorite line from any movie is from Who Framed Roger Rabbit? where Jessica Rabbit says, "I'm not bad, I'm just drawn that way."

Cheers.

JD
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Old 04-13-2020, 05:04 PM   #50
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Talking history

investigated my dream 31 years ago. had heart set on catalina 30 sloop. friend advised me to charter because he thought i wasn't "sailboat material". Chartered a Mariner 37sloop with friend/captain and others. Got frustrated in watching Nantucket grow larger at 1/8" per hour and begged for engine.....
Great ! now 3/16" per hour ! had fun but came home and bought a 33' - 20kt cruiser and enjoyed that for 3 years and slowed down to a 10kt trawler and LOVED IT
for 26 years ! Charter, charter, charter !





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Yeah, all that.

Boats are almost entirely about dreams, right? Some of us are drawn to the water like moths to a flame, to re-use a well-worn adage. For those so drawn, countless subcategories blend together in one of the most complex Venn diagrams known; swimmers, surfers, kayakers, fishers, boaters. Boaters are separated in a myriad of dimensions; fast and slow, power and sail, recreational and liveaboard... All of us dream about being on the water, even when we're on it already. And for most of us, boats are the vehicle to get us there.

I've been around small boats most of my life. In the seventies, someone in our family always had something to use for lake fishing, water skiing, or simply puttering around on the water for the pleasure of it. In later years, my wife and I took up kayaking until back injuries stopped me from being able to tote all the gear hither and yon to get us to the point of being able to enjoy ourselves. I have friends who sail, and while I enjoy spending time on their boats, I have no proficiency at that and don't much care to learn.

Speed is not my thing. I've spent too much time sitting in the open bow of a boat zipping across the waves at 30 mph, busting my kidneys with every slap of the waves and watching the guy at the helm (and it's always a guy, isn't it?) scream "Yee haw!" while looking for the next swell to jump. The older I get, the more I'm looking for a slow, comfortable ride.

In the last couple of years, we have spent a lot of time talking about how we want to live in retirement, which is looming closer all the time. We eagerly consume YouTube channels like Sailing Yacht Ruby Rose and Gone With The Wynns. We love the places they go and the things they do, but watching them has solidified the idea that sailing is not for us. So we took up watching MV Freedom and MV Cassidy (which, due to their purchase of a motorsailer is now Cassidy's Sailing Trawler). We are inveterate vicarious yachters.

However much we watch and try to learn, there are things we can't know just yet. We are hatching a plan (five years in length) to figure them out. Among them is knowing how well my wife will tolerate being at sea. We once went out fishing in a friend's 26' walk around, and she chummed the water the entire time in light swells. I blame it as much on the size of the boat as anything, but that's supposition on my part. Later this year, after everyone can leave their houses again, we intend to charter a (crewed) trawler in the Puget Sound for a couple days to see how it goes.

Elsewhere in this forum, someone pointed out that choosing a boat isn't so much about the brand or features, but about the people who are going to use it. My career as an analyst means that it's natural for me to ask a ton of questions before even thinking I'm in a position to make statements about what we want. That said, we've toured boats at shows, and have some ideas. But I have more questions, and since this post is already getting long, I'll post something else more targeted.

Thank you all for creating this community. It appears to be a good one, and I look forward to being a member.

Cheers.

J.D. Ray
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Old 04-13-2020, 05:44 PM   #51
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Hello JD Ray,
We have crossed the pacific ocean (San Diego to Hawaii, to the Line Islands, to French Polynesia, to New Zealand, to New Caledonia, to Vanuatu, to Australia - in our Nordhavn.

I have spent years learning about Ocean Crossing / ocean capable boats. I would be quite happy to answer any questions you have, (one question at a time ). I always a few minutes to spare for a fellow boater.
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Old 04-13-2020, 05:57 PM   #52
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JD,


I don't mean to presume, sorry if I misinterpreted you post...

In my experience of owning boats for the past 48 years, I've come up with a few hard rules, and a whole lot of preferences. I would encourage you to really look at how you will be using it, who will be using it with you, and what boat is the best fit.

For PNW cruising, I want a nice open salon to relax in with our guests. Too many boats comfortably only seat a couple people, as in lounging around, playing cards, having drinks, etc. I prefer a big airy salon that can easily accommodate six people.

I also vastly prefer twin engines. As a transoceanic jet pilot, I just don't feel as comfortable with a single, in a larger boat. (30'+) Now, my pal is a retired container ship captain. He's crossed the Pacific countless times on his 985' single-engine freighter.

And, I vastly prefer indoor stairs to the flybridge rather than an outdoor ladder. So much easier carrying food & drinks up the stairs...

Finally, and probably our most important rule: NO FULL BEAM AFT CABINS. No "sundeck" models. We only like boats with a cockpit, or low aft deck. So much easier to get on and off, to use the swim step, to fish, and mostly; to carry food & supplies aboard. I know there are plenty of sundeck style owners who apparently don't mind carrying their groceries up the back ladder in the rain. Not us...

An excellent example of a boat that fills all these requirements is the Bayliner 4788. Plus it's reasonably priced, designed to cruise the PNW waters, and easy to operate.

I believe we're about to see some very good deals on boats. Not quite yet, but within a couple months. Great time to buy...
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Old 04-16-2020, 02:09 PM   #53
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Sounds like you need a Seakeeper installed boat or need to install one.
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Old 04-16-2020, 02:16 PM   #54
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Sounds like you need a Seakeeper installed boat or need to install one.
Aren't those things somewhere around $100,000 installed? That's the price I remember when they first came out, anyway.
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Old 04-16-2020, 02:30 PM   #55
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And, I vastly prefer indoor stairs to the flybridge rather than an outdoor ladder. So much easier carrying food & drinks up the stairs...
I'll have to wait until I've spent more time on this class of boat, but I'm beginning to feel like I could do without a flybridge.
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Finally, and probably our most important rule: NO FULL BEAM AFT CABINS. No "sundeck" models. We only like boats with a cockpit, or low aft deck. So much easier to get on and off, to use the swim step, to fish, and mostly; to carry food & supplies aboard. I know there are plenty of sundeck style owners who apparently don't mind carrying their groceries up the back ladder in the rain. Not us...
We watched a video tour of an aft-cabin boat the other day, and the only way in from the swimdeck was through the master cabin, and a narrow passageway past the end of the athwartship bed. I'm a much bigger fan of the master cabin amidship, but that appears to be most common in contemporary boats, which are out of my price range.
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An excellent example of a boat that fills all these requirements is the Bayliner 4788. Plus it's reasonably priced, designed to cruise the PNW waters, and easy to operate.
I was apparently misinformed about Bayliner construction, applying their smaller-boat methods to the entire line. A such, I was skipping looking at them. Now that I've had my opinion corrected, I'm looking again, and yes, their layout is about perfect for what we want.
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I believe we're about to see some very good deals on boats. Not quite yet, but within a couple months. Great time to buy...
Unfortunately, yes, an excellent time. Same goes for vacation property.
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Old 04-16-2020, 03:17 PM   #56
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Seakeeper 3 is about $28K, right under $40K installed.
There's no perfect boat... every boat is a compromise, every boat will have its flaws and tradeoffs.
You just need to find the one that suits you the best.
Please don't think I'm Bayliner bashing, just posting this as an example.

https://youtu.be/n4gXycEWwsY
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