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Old 12-09-2016, 05:53 PM   #1
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Air Force One

Where is Marin? We need a Boeing insider's take on the Air Force One brouhaha.
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Old 12-09-2016, 06:33 PM   #2
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Sounds like the typical bloated development procurement process to me.
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Old 12-09-2016, 07:37 PM   #3
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I agree. Boing will build what is asked of them. If the requirements creep up, so will the price tag.
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Old 12-09-2016, 11:38 PM   #4
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The general train of thought on another [ military aviation focussed] forum who's members include boeing engineers and some ex-USAF crew chiefs seems to be that the air frames themselves is not the major costs. The real money is in the ECM And other 'custom' hardware and electronics.
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Old 12-12-2016, 07:31 PM   #5
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I agree. Boing will build what is asked of them. If the requirements creep up, so will the price tag.
Reality is that Boeing will end up building it no matter what Trump say's. Who else is available on US soil to build it.
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Old 12-13-2016, 08:01 AM   #6
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Reality is that Boeing will end up building it no matter what Trump say's.
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I agree. Boing will build what is asked of them. If the requirements creep up, so will the price tag.
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... the air frames themselves is not the major costs. The real money is in the ECM And other 'custom' hardware and electronics.

Sure.

I expect Trump hasn't ever heard of requirements creep. Maybe somebody will eventually inform him.

In the meantime, he probably just needed something to keep his thumbs busy... the current equivalent of flapping his gums when he had nothing better to do... and Boeing became his target du jour.

-Chris
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Old 12-13-2016, 11:17 AM   #7
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Greetings,
I seem to recall, our former resident Boeing expert Mr. Marin reporting that Boeing had their wings made in China. Better check the new AF1 for bugs and structural integrity...
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Old 12-13-2016, 02:18 PM   #8
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Greetings,
I seem to recall, our former resident Boeing expert Mr. Marin reporting that Boeing had their wings made in China. Better check the new AF1 for bugs and structural integrity...
Maybe the 747 is still an all USA build and parts source, maybe. If it is then the CIA will have a better opportunity to bug it. Heaven forbid that POTUS be unmonitored.
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Old 12-13-2016, 05:40 PM   #9
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Just for reference, I believe the typical price for a 747-8 freighter is around $378 million. For two that would be $756 million meaning the add-ons are around $3.2 billion if the program is $4 billion. That's a lot of custom work. I wonder if it all has to meet FAA airworthiness requirements as a "two" of a kind change to the basic 747 configuration or some other DOD/USAF requirement.

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Old 12-13-2016, 08:18 PM   #10
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Interesting details, but the real reason for the tweet that started all this was because Boeing's CEO, Dennis Muilenburg, questioned his comments on trade in the Chicago Tribune. Not trying to be judgemental, or political. That's just the way it is right now. You have to look for the reason behind the story nowadays.
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Old 12-13-2016, 08:56 PM   #11
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Cant wait to see what happens.

I'd agree that Boeing will continue to make AF1, and the 747-400 is a fairly good choice (as are a few other models).

I'm a fan of the Boeings.....

"I ain't going,

If it ain't Boeing"
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Old 12-13-2016, 10:21 PM   #12
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The better decide on it pretty soon. A few analysts are saying the 747 production line may shut down within the next couple of years due to declining orders for even freighters. At that point they may have to consider a twin engine platform.

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Old 12-14-2016, 08:00 AM   #13
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The better decide on it pretty soon. A few analysts are saying the 747 production line may shut down within the next couple of years due to declining orders for even freighters. At that point they may have to consider a twin engine platform.

Yeah... hard to have it both ways. Bash (Company X) on the one hand, but pull-back probably decreases all those pesky jobs on the other hand.

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Old 12-14-2016, 10:17 AM   #14
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Why is a new AF 1 needed now or even 10 years in future. Updating, new engines etc are all commonly done and a very large business. Me thinks Chicago rewards programs are in play. Frequent flyer you know, to vacation spots.
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Old 12-14-2016, 02:03 PM   #15
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Cost and new configuration could be due to systems installed more so than base airframe.

The base airframe may be cheaper to build new than reconfigure old to accomodate.
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