Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 07-09-2020, 10:22 AM   #1
Senior Member
 
City: PNW
Vessel Name: Mighty Fine
Vessel Model: Kingfisher 3125GFX
Join Date: Sep 2019
Posts: 107
Protecting our windlass

We have 30’ of chain and 270’ of triple strand nylon line for rode. Do we need to do something to protect our Lewmar windlass from strain at anchor? If yes, what?

Our boat is a 31’ Kingfisher 3125 GFX. It’s an aluminum offshore fishing boat. However, we use it kind of like a water-going Sprinter camper van. This fact just kills our friend who is an avid fishermen. He thinks we’ve neutered an awesome fishing machine.

We plan on practicing our anchoring technique over the next few weeks in the South Puget Sound. We’ve ordered an anchoring book recommended on another thread, and are devouring all the written and video expertise we can lay our eyes and hands on. I’ve also spend an amazing amount of time on this forum!

I realize that our boat is an outlier on this forum. But you folks are the best resource I’ve found for the kind of boating we want to do.

Thanks!

Hal
Haloo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-09-2020, 10:29 AM   #2
Guru
 
City: Rochester, NY
Vessel Name: Hour Glass
Vessel Model: Chris Craft 381 Catalina
Join Date: Aug 2019
Posts: 7,554
With a mixed rode, you can simply cleat the rode off to keep the pull off the windlass. Most windlasses aren't meant to hold the boat while anchored, so I definitely wouldn't just let the windlass hold things.
rslifkin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-09-2020, 12:19 PM   #3
Guru
 
caltexflanc's Avatar
 
City: North Carolina for now
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 6,348
Quote:
Originally Posted by rslifkin View Post
With a mixed rode, you can simply cleat the rode off to keep the pull off the windlass. Most windlasses aren't meant to hold the boat while anchored, so I definitely wouldn't just let the windlass hold things.
Exactly this. Depending on boat design you might need some chafe protection where the rode goes over the gunwale from the cleat.
__________________
George

"There's the Right Way, the Wrong Way, and what some guy says he's gotten away with"
caltexflanc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-09-2020, 12:42 PM   #4
Moderator Emeritus
 
Comodave's Avatar
 
City: Au Gres, MI
Vessel Name: Black Dog
Vessel Model: Formula 41PC
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 21,191
Yes, just cleat the line off so that it has fairlead and doesn’t chaff. You don’t want that much pull on the windlass.
__________________
Boat Nut:
If you are one there is no explanation necessary.
If you aren’t one, there is no explanation possible.
Comodave is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-09-2020, 01:43 PM   #5
Senior Member
 
City: PNW
Vessel Name: Mighty Fine
Vessel Model: Kingfisher 3125GFX
Join Date: Sep 2019
Posts: 107
Do you guys mean that I should cleat the line to that big hefty cleat right behind the windlass? How did I forget about that cleat? Geez, what a major forehead slap moment this morning when I got to the boat.

Thanks for the reminder to use chafe protection on the line!
Haloo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-09-2020, 01:51 PM   #6
Guru
 
OldDan1943's Avatar
 
City: Aventura FL
Vessel Name: Kinja
Vessel Model: American Tug 34 #116 2008
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 10,595
Use a bridal
__________________
Two days out the hospital after a week in the hospital because of a significant heart attack.
OldDan1943 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-09-2020, 02:27 PM   #7
Guru
 
Giggitoni's Avatar
 
City: Vallejo, California
Vessel Name: Mahalo Moi
Vessel Model: 1986 Grand Banks 42 Classic
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 2,093
Quote:
Originally Posted by Haloo View Post
Do you guys mean that I should cleat the line to that big hefty cleat right behind the windlass? How did I forget about that cleat? Geez, what a major forehead slap moment this morning when I got to the boat.

Thanks for the reminder to use chafe protection on the line!
Cleat the rope off on a cleat on your boat with chafe protection. Not on the windless cleat itself. I only use the cleat on the windless to tie off when the anchor is up and stored.
__________________
Ray
"Mahalo Moi"
1986 GB-42 Classic
ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑβΕ
Giggitoni is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-09-2020, 02:56 PM   #8
Guru
 
caltexflanc's Avatar
 
City: North Carolina for now
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 6,348
Sounds like he is referring to a separate cleat, a picture would help.

I personally don't see a need for a bridle on a rope rode, but I suppose you could fashion one using two lines attached to the rode with rolling hitches if you felt the desire.
__________________
George

"There's the Right Way, the Wrong Way, and what some guy says he's gotten away with"
caltexflanc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-09-2020, 02:59 PM   #9
Guru
 
City: Rochester, NY
Vessel Name: Hour Glass
Vessel Model: Chris Craft 381 Catalina
Join Date: Aug 2019
Posts: 7,554
Quote:
Originally Posted by caltexflanc View Post
I personally don't see a need for a bridle on a rope rode, but I suppose you could fashion one using two lines attached to the rode with rolling hitches if you felt the desire.

Agreed. In really nasty weather I'd probably add a bridle or at least a sacrificial snubber to take the load, just to further reduce chafe concerns on the main rode. But in most conditions, if you have a good way to cleat the line off and lead it off the boat, just cleat it, apply chafe protection and call it good.

I cleat mine and protect as follows (with a 4ft long velcro closure chafe sleeve, much longer than the one shown in the picture).
Attached Thumbnails
IMG_20200523_131220.jpg  
rslifkin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-09-2020, 04:04 PM   #10
Senior Member
 
City: PNW
Vessel Name: Mighty Fine
Vessel Model: Kingfisher 3125GFX
Join Date: Sep 2019
Posts: 107
Quote:
Originally Posted by rslifkin View Post
Agreed. In really nasty weather I'd probably add a bridle or at least a sacrificial snubber to take the load, just to further reduce chafe concerns on the main rode. But in most conditions, if you have a good way to cleat the line off and lead it off the boat, just cleat it, apply chafe protection and call it good.

I cleat mine and protect as follows (with a 4ft long velcro closure chafe sleeve, much longer than the one shown in the picture).
My set up is similar to yours, except that my cleat is welded to the deck about a foot and a half behind and slightly higher than my windlass.

I’ll try to post a picture.
Attached Thumbnails
B9C8EFCB-5A33-43C6-B441-D773E1CB0634.jpeg  
Haloo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-09-2020, 04:30 PM   #11
Guru
 
City: Rochester, NY
Vessel Name: Hour Glass
Vessel Model: Chris Craft 381 Catalina
Join Date: Aug 2019
Posts: 7,554
Quote:
Originally Posted by Haloo View Post
My set up is similar to yours, except that my cleat is welded to the deck about a foot and a half behind and slightly higher than my windlass.

I’ll try to post a picture.

Looks very similar, right down to the anchor, although yours is probably a couple sizes smaller.

That cleat isn't necessarily in quite the ideal spot for an anchor rode tie off, but as long as there's nothing in the way between the cleat and the roller, it'll do the job. Definitely make sure to use chafe protection where the line goes over the roller, as there could be significant movement with that much distance to stretch before the cleat.

Also make sure the line can't hit the windlass. If it can, you may have to use a bridle (with chafe protection) through the hawse holes and only cleat the main line as a backup.
rslifkin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-09-2020, 05:18 PM   #12
Senior Member
 
Southern Boater's Avatar
 
City: Tasmania
Vessel Model: Sea Ranger 46
Join Date: Sep 2019
Posts: 426
Quote:
Originally Posted by Haloo View Post
My set up is similar to yours, except that my cleat is welded to the deck about a foot and a half behind and slightly higher than my windlass.

I’ll try to post a picture.
You could always add an extra cleat around the bowsprit area.

BTW, nothing wrong with using a fishing oriented boat as primarily a floating camper. We did the same thing with a Bertram and fishermen didn't approve, but we wanted good seakeeping and occasional fishing, so built a full length hardtop with side covers over the cockpit.

Enjoy your boat
Southern Boater is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-09-2020, 05:38 PM   #13
Guru
 
OldDan1943's Avatar
 
City: Aventura FL
Vessel Name: Kinja
Vessel Model: American Tug 34 #116 2008
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 10,595
Quote:
Originally Posted by caltexflanc View Post
Sounds like he is referring to a separate cleat, a picture would help.

I personally don't see a need for a bridle on a rope rode, but I suppose you could fashion one using two lines attached to the rode with rolling hitches if you felt the desire.
The windless has a job to do and that is to lower and raise the anchor. The windless is not designed to take the stresses and strains imposed by mother nature, especially if you have an all chain rode (chain does not stretch like rope). The bridle acts as a shock absorber when you have an all chain rode and distributes these forces over 2 cleats. With an all rope rode, the bridle and cleats distributes the forces to the 2 forward cleats. (Note: Make sure the cleats have a backing plate, unless the cleats are welded to a steel deck)

The bridle physically protect the windless from the stress of the of the boat's motion.

I can think of some exceptions but, I shall leave that for others' to share. The one arm or two arm bridle.

I couch the above with my usual disclaimer, "Do I actually look like I know about this?" The correct answer is "nope". A lot of boating involves common sense.
__________________
Two days out the hospital after a week in the hospital because of a significant heart attack.
OldDan1943 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-09-2020, 06:01 PM   #14
Master and Commander
 
markpierce's Avatar
 
City: Vallejo CA
Vessel Name: Carquinez Coot
Vessel Model: penultimate Seahorse Marine Coot hull #6
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 12,559
I tie the bridle to the bollard which is welded to the steel deck. Have no forward cleats except for the useless-to-me atop the windlass. Underway here, picturing windlass and bollard.
Attached Thumbnails
Petaluma entrance.jpg  
__________________
Kar-KEEN-ez Koot
markpierce is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-09-2020, 06:29 PM   #15
Guru
 
OldDan1943's Avatar
 
City: Aventura FL
Vessel Name: Kinja
Vessel Model: American Tug 34 #116 2008
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 10,595
Quote:
Originally Posted by markpierce View Post
I tie the bridle to the bollard which is welded to the steel deck. Have no forward cleats except for the useless-to-me atop the windlass. Underway here, picturing windlass and bollard.
When you pass a line through those two hawseholes, port and starboard, to what do you cleat the two fwd lines, onboard the boat?
__________________
Two days out the hospital after a week in the hospital because of a significant heart attack.
OldDan1943 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-09-2020, 06:46 PM   #16
Master and Commander
 
markpierce's Avatar
 
City: Vallejo CA
Vessel Name: Carquinez Coot
Vessel Model: penultimate Seahorse Marine Coot hull #6
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 12,559
Quote:
Originally Posted by OldDan1943 View Post
When you pass a line through those two hawseholes, port and starboard, to what do you cleat the two fwd lines, onboard the boat?
The bollard.
__________________
Kar-KEEN-ez Koot
markpierce is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-09-2020, 07:07 PM   #17
Guru
 
OldDan1943's Avatar
 
City: Aventura FL
Vessel Name: Kinja
Vessel Model: American Tug 34 #116 2008
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 10,595
Quote:
Originally Posted by markpierce View Post
The bollard.
Get out the welding torch and a couple of cleats. That should give you greater flexibility, if you so desire.
__________________
Two days out the hospital after a week in the hospital because of a significant heart attack.
OldDan1943 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-09-2020, 07:12 PM   #18
Guru
 
rgano's Avatar
 
City: Southport, FL near Panama City
Vessel Name: FROLIC
Vessel Model: Mainship 30 Pilot II since 2015. GB-42 1986-2015. Former Unlimited Tonnage Master
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,984
Quote:
Originally Posted by Haloo View Post
We have 30’ of chain and 270’ of triple strand nylon line for rode. Do we need to do something to protect our Lewmar windlass from strain at anchor? If yes, what?

Our boat is a 31’ Kingfisher 3125 GFX. It’s an aluminum offshore fishing boat. However, we use it kind of like a water-going Sprinter camper van. This fact just kills our friend who is an avid fishermen. He thinks we’ve neutered an awesome fishing machine.

We plan on practicing our anchoring technique over the next few weeks in the South Puget Sound. We’ve ordered an anchoring book recommended on another thread, and are devouring all the written and video expertise we can lay our eyes and hands on. I’ve also spend an amazing amount of time on this forum!

I realize that our boat is an outlier on this forum. But you folks are the best resource I’ve found for the kind of boating we want to do.

Thanks!

Hal
Hal, my personal preference is to not end up with the fiber rode taking the strain of anchoring directly to a cleat for a couple of reasons. Using a braided snubber to take the strain will place any chafing on the more expendable snubber (to which you certainly can add chafe protection)rather than on your expensive long rode which you'd rather not have to splice. Also, in an emergency where you may have a huge amount of tension on the rode secured to a cleat, you may not be able to safely release tension on it to let it go free or to start reeling it in with the windlass. Cutting the snubber is a better option, if cutting is required. To make such a snubber, you simply unlay the last six feet of a triple twist line of equal strength of your fiber rode and braid the three strands as is done when braiding hair. You can use this end with a taut line hitch on both chain and rope rode.
__________________
Rich Gano
FROLIC (2005 MainShip 30 Pilot II)
Panama City area
rgano is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-09-2020, 09:52 PM   #19
Senior Member
 
City: PNW
Vessel Name: Mighty Fine
Vessel Model: Kingfisher 3125GFX
Join Date: Sep 2019
Posts: 107
Quote:
Originally Posted by markpierce View Post
I tie the bridle to the bollard which is welded to the steel deck. Have no forward cleats except for the useless-to-me atop the windlass. Underway here, picturing windlass and bollard.
Yeah, I think mine would work kind of like yours. Just a cleat instead of a bollard.
Haloo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-09-2020, 10:02 PM   #20
Senior Member
 
City: PNW
Vessel Name: Mighty Fine
Vessel Model: Kingfisher 3125GFX
Join Date: Sep 2019
Posts: 107
Quote:
Originally Posted by rgano View Post
Hal, my personal preference is to not end up with the fiber rode taking the strain of anchoring directly to a cleat for a couple of reasons. Using a braided snubber to take the strain will place any chafing on the more expendable snubber (to which you certainly can add chafe protection)rather than on your expensive long rode which you'd rather not have to splice. Also, in an emergency where you may have a huge amount of tension on the rode secured to a cleat, you may not be able to safely release tension on it to let it go free or to start reeling it in with the windlass. Cutting the snubber is a better option, if cutting is required. To make such a snubber, you simply unlay the last six feet of a triple twist line of equal strength of your fiber rode and braid the three strands as is done when braiding hair. You can use this end with a taut line hitch on both chain and rope rode.
This approach makes a lot of sense to me. I’m just trying to visualize how you make the snubber and then use it. I do know how to tie a tautline hitch. I’ll do an online search for making your own snubber.

My wife asked me earlier today if the folks on this thread knew I was a newbie. I told her that by now they do!
Haloo is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


» Trawler Port Captains
Port Captains are TF volunteers who can serve as local guides or assist with local arrangements and information. Search below to locate Port Captains near your destination. To learn more about this program read here: TF Port Captain Program





All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:38 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2006 - 2012