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Old 07-15-2018, 01:51 AM   #201
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FWIW,the 2 times my S/Sarca dragged were:
1. The day the Admiral, for reasons I cannot fathom,let out 1.5 scope without telling me. It held overnight,with a reversal,and dragged next day when the wind freshened. Yes, we discussed it.

2. In Farm Cove, Sydney, NYE. No boat could get a set in the area, us included. We watched and moved about 25M away, bingo, set! I suspect a sheet of polished granite down there.
In neither case do I blame the anchor. My experience is for the benefit of anyone interested, as foggysail suggested.
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Old 07-15-2018, 10:46 AM   #202
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Things fail,
There’sa reason for everything.
Nothing is perfect.
That wasn’t what I had in mind starting the thread but better and more important stuff has emerged hanks to the wonderful posters we have here on TF.
Thanks to everybody including longtime poster psneeld and the newish guy Tozz.
psneeld pointed out how a bad thing said about a product tends give it an unshakeable and long lasting negative taint. And we mostly tend to adore our own so posting even a one in a thousand failure seems undoable.
But I don’t think Peter is right that most just “drop, rest and let the anchor set itself”. I’ll bet most back down a bit at least but it could be that I think others take anchoring seriously just because I do. But I need to play every card I have as I don’t have a ton of chain and a big anchor.

Again thanks all for your “making a difference” contributions. And I want to repeat the original motivation for this thread. Less weed is very likely deeper than 25’. At least when/where seawater isn’t clear as weed is very dependent on light. So in much of the world 30 to 35’ may be the ideal anchoring depth when reversals are likely.
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Old 07-15-2018, 10:59 AM   #203
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T... And for fishermen the most popular option of a replacement is a Claw.
Local Herring fishermen are upgrading from Northill to Bruce to secure nets.
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Old 07-15-2018, 11:14 AM   #204
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Tozz,

Thanks for responding.

Looks like your bigger is better philosophy (like SE Ak fishermen) works well. Is a 150lb anchor big for a 63 foot boat? The one time I tried to set a Forfjord I probably was operating at less than 7-1. My mistake? I think any anchor should set at 4-1 to 6-1 dependably on a good seabed. And for fishermen the most popular option of a replacement is a Claw.
I do subscribe to bigger is better. We have 400' of chain and an FX-85 on board too as an alternate. I don't think it's considered big for those that anchor frequently up here in the PNW. i've seen 50-55' boats with 100-120lb anchors.

I used to back down and my previous boat with an ultra anchor and brought that approach to the bigger boat. but after a few sets with the forfjord I have moved to let it set itself and that seems to work just fine.


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Old 07-15-2018, 02:45 PM   #205
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Tozz,
HaHa that’s an anchor pic. That Fjord looks visually like a 16” gun on a battleship.
The Fjord fits the bows of many boats. My friend in Alaska modified his bow so the Fjord’s shank laid flat on his foredeck. Slick .. I thought. He took the lead from the fishermen in Craig and bought a Fjord. He had the hydraulic windlass and all but last time I talked to him he talked of changing the anchor. If I had the hydraulics and for a reel windlass I’d make his bow mod and find a 55lb Dreadnought.

You wrote;
“but after a few sets with the forfjord I have moved to let it set itself and that seems to work just fine.”
Does work fine mean it’s held in strong winds after the “let it set itself” technique?
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Old 07-15-2018, 02:57 PM   #206
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Local Herring fishermen are upgrading from Northill to Bruce to secure nets.
Mark,
Yes I remember.
Your last post had pics. But the Northills were rather crude as I recall. Home made by the look of it but mamy fishermen in BC make their own Northill or have them made. I suspect a fab shop makes Northills on the side. I’ll have to look and see if they all look the same.
I may take my aviation Northill out for a spin.
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Old 07-15-2018, 11:32 PM   #207
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But I don’t think Peter is right that most just “drop, rest and let the anchor set itself”.
Eric, please stop quoting me out of context. I never said "most just drop and let it set". I said, that his technique appears to work well with the newer generation type anchors, such as those we were discussing, (Rocnas, Manson Supremes, Sarcas, etc), and may, repeat may, help prevent sticking/jamming mud in the fluke, that might, repeat might, interfere with a reverse current re-set on occasion. The above certainly does not apply to most others.

I know for certain the CQR type need a hard set, or they don't set at all, and the same with a Danforth/Fortress or any others of that double fluked type of arrangement. I also suspect the spade types also need a firm drag to get them to bite in and dig down, as did your XYZ. Just sayin'
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Old 07-16-2018, 09:49 AM   #208
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I know for certain the CQR type need a hard set, or they don't set at all, and the same with a Danforth/Fortress or any others of that double fluked type of arrangement. I also suspect the spade types also need a firm drag to get them to bite in and dig down, as did your XYZ. Just sayin'

I dont think this is true. I have used CQR, Danforth, and Bruce anchors over a 50+ year history in sailboats and now power boats and have only had ONE anchor drag. It was none of the above. AND I never set my anchors.I just drift back on them.....Unless I carry it ashore as I am known to do on occasion..
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Old 07-16-2018, 11:49 AM   #209
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[QUOTE=Peter B;681454]Eric, please stop quoting me out of context. I never said "most just drop and let it set". I said, that his technique appears to work well with the newer generation type anchors, such as those we were discussing, (Rocnas, Manson Supremes, Sarcas, etc), and may, repeat may, help prevent sticking/jamming mud in the fluke, that might, repeat might, interfere with a reverse current re-set on occasion. The above certainly does not apply to most others.

Peter,
What???
But you did say “tend to just drop, rest, and let them set”.
I don’t see enough difference to get rasty over.

I even think there’s a difference but just what is the difference? Jam the mud down the anchor throat or oose it down slowly. I have an idea but what’s yours?
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Old 07-16-2018, 12:01 PM   #210
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Peter yes maybe the slow set helps an anchor not clog or clog less is a point that has merrit .. maybe not too.

The Supreme’s fluke is much flatter in the center than it is on the Rocna. It would seem the Rocna would pack in mud better and the turned up trailing edge should help pack in mud too. But I hear no complaints from Rocna users. ??? Perhaps the throat angle is wider on the Supreme and that’s the primary reason the Supreme has such great short scope performance. And the Mantus is or probably should be the worst of the worst as there’s bolts, nuts and protruding flanges to snag the substrate as it passes over the upper surface of the fluke. The cost of the breakdown feature. If I had one I’d cut all that stuff off and weld the shank on like most others.

But a Supreme set slowly may be the best of both worlds.

I’ve heard forever that a slow soak in set is better. Can’t imagine why though. An anchor is at such and such an altitude below the seabed. What’s the difference if it got there quickly or over more time? What’s different? An old wives tale? Could be. Is there a notion that if it takes more attention, care and time it’s got to be better. I suspect it may be something passed on over long periods of time having no credibility or factual function.

I’ve always set more or less fast but I take considerable time laying out the rode. I’ve had setting problems too. But most of those problems are because of my experimental anchors.

Peter can you actually say why slow setting is better or is it just “seems to work better” things. I’ve heard it from very knowledgable people in the industry. But if there’s something to it ..... what is it?
Peter,
Re the quoting out of context were you refering to this post?
I’ve gone back about 30 posts and don’t see what you’re refering to. Is it that “most” let is soak or most back down? I think most back down. Now I’m out on a limb ... go for it since you’re in a combative mood.
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