This week's mystery electronics challenge

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Kenhuse

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Hello Mates,
I have an elderly non-functioning Cetec Benmar Course Setter 21R auto pilot.
I also have a cool elderly functioning auto pilot drive unit. I'd like to, if possible, use this drive unit with a new auto pilot set up. I hope the attached pictures will provide enough information for some knowledgeable soul to tell me whether or not my hopes are realistic and or possible. Any information would be appreciated very much. Thanks, Ken
 

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Based on the pictures, I see an electric motor with 2 leads, orange and blue. Assuming those are the only power leads, the electronics supply power and or reverse power to turn the helm in one direction or the other. If it's 12 VDC, it shouldn't be difficult to connect a new autopilot controller to that motor. I would want to prove the drive system is still functioning and 12 VDC, before going further.

Ted
 
O C Diver said:
Based on the pictures, I see an electric motor with 2 leads, orange and blue. Assuming those are the only power leads, the electronics supply power and or reverse power to turn the helm in one direction or the other. If it's 12 VDC, it shouldn't be difficult to connect a new autopilot controller to that motor. I would want to prove the drive system is still functioning and 12 VDC, before going further.

Ted
Click to expand...
Thanks Ted! The boat dc system is 12 volt. Can I assume then that the motor is 12 volt also?
I’ll double check to make sure that the motor is still functioning. I’ll look a little closer to be sure there are only 2 power leads. Thanks again!
 
I would look for a voltage label on the motor. Also, it's highly likely that motor has brushes. It's probably worth the effort to determine how much of the brushes are left or if you can find a suitable replacement set.

Ted
 
Even if the brushes are worn down they can be replaced by a good motor shop.

Years ago I had a set of four brushes made for my windlass. I sent the shop one of the brushes as a sample for sizing. The only thing I had to do was give them a length. I asked for a bit longer than was likely as I had no ideal what the original length was so better too long and trim than too short.

I then did have to trim them shorter by about 1/8.

My table saw did a nice clean job.
THe windlass ran like a champ afterwards.
 
C lectric said:
Even if the brushes are worn down they can be replaced by a good motor shop.

Years ago I had a set of four brushes made for my windlass. I sent the shop one of the brushes as a sample for sizing. The only thing I had to do was give them a length. I asked for a bit longer than was likely as I had no ideal what the original length was so better too long and trim than too short.

I then did have to trim them shorter by about 1/8.

My table saw did a nice clean job.
THe windlass ran like a champ afterwards.
Click to expand...

Thanks C Lectric for the information!
 
Robert at Benmar may be of assistance. He has sent me parts and documentation. From their website contact information is:
Benmar Marine
25510 Foster Lake Rd.
PO Box 4007
Idyllwild, CA 92549-4007

Phone: (951) 659-8510
 
Good luck. If I understand your post right, I have the same autopilot, non-functioning since the drive unit is busted. Reverse polarity on the electric motor brings the rudder back the other way. You can jump it and apply power directly to the motor and check out what it does. Or at least that’s what I did….
 
Last edited:
As for the rest of the autopilot- the compass and course control, not sure if yours is working? But there has been a set of three used controls for sale on eBay for several months now. But if you decide to sell your drive unit give me a shout. I’ve been half heartedly looking for one for a year or two now, to try to test and fix my 21R too, from the opposite end to you, I think.

Benmar still does repairs.
 
Last edited:
Doug said:
Robert at Benmar may be of assistance. He has sent me parts and documentation. From their website contact information is:
Benmar Marine
25510 Foster Lake Rd.
PO Box 4007
Idyllwild, CA 92549-4007

Phone: (951) 659-8510
Click to expand...
Ive called and written an email with no luck. I’ll try again. It’d be fantastic to get the thing going. Thanks for inspiring me!
 
I’ve gotten a couple words out of him over the years so he does exist.
 
My plan for next time is to wildly wave a bunch of cash around first thing, and try for a complete sentence or two. :thumb:
 
Kenhuse said:
Ive called and written an email with no luck. I’ll try again. It’d be fantastic to get the thing going. Thanks for inspiring me!
Click to expand...

From my experience the email doesn’t work. Phone and leave a message, he’ll call you back.
Good luck
 
My brother and I both converted Benmar motor and chain driven units to digital SITEX SP 70 dual station APs on our two Grand Banks 42 trawlers. ALL the original electronics was removed leaving ONLY to original motors and chain drive which interfaced with the cable-driven steering systems. I used a local AP dealer to help me connect properly to the motor from the SITEX brain. I performed all physical installation.
You need NOTHING from Benmar.
 
rgano said:
My brother and I both converted Benmar motor and chain driven units to digital SITEX SP 70 dual station APs on our two Grand Banks 42 trawlers. ALL the original electronics was removed leaving ONLY to original motors and chain drive which interfaced with the cable-driven steering systems. I used a local AP dealer to help me connect properly to the motor from the SITEX brain. I performed all physical installation.
You need NOTHING from Benmar.
Click to expand...

Good gawd man, sounds like the ticket! Thanks a bunch rgano! I’ll check out the Sitex sp 70!
 
rgano said:
My brother and I both converted Benmar motor and chain driven units to digital SITEX SP 70 dual station APs on our two Grand Banks 42 trawlers. ALL the original electronics was removed leaving ONLY to original motors and chain drive which interfaced with the cable-driven steering systems. I used a local AP dealer to help me connect properly to the motor from the SITEX brain. I performed all physical installation.
You need NOTHING from Benmar.
Click to expand...

Would you have any detail on how to connect the Sitex controller to the Benmar power unit Rich?
My boat came with a Benmar power unit, no controller. I was able to obtain a Benmar controller through the generosity of John (jagates 10) on this site. I have refurbished both units with parts obtained from Benmar and have the system working on the bench. I am in the process of installing it back on the boat for testing.
If I’m not satisfied with the way it works I may be interested in exploring the Sitex solution.
 
Doug said:
Would you have any detail on how to connect the Sitex controller to the Benmar power unit Rich?
My boat came with a Benmar power unit, no controller. I was able to obtain a Benmar controller through the generosity of John (jagates 10) on this site. I have refurbished both units with parts obtained from Benmar and have the system working on the bench. I am in the process of installing it back on the boat for testing.
If I’m not satisfied with the way it works I may be interested in exploring the
Sitex solution.
Click to expand...

Great question Doug. I'm also interested to find out about this issue.
 
Yup, simple. Use a pilot for solenoid drive (used with constant running hydraulic pump) and relays wired for reversing motor. I used standard 'Bosch' automotive cube relays, and made it work with a Raymarine ST4000/5000, a little wheel drive unit for small sailboats. It's on a 45' trawler and is working great still after 18 years.
 
Been there Done that!

I had same autopilot on our boat and used the motor and pump with a new modern autopilot because something in the old electronics died.

Rip out the electronic boards and leave only the motor. Connect the motor leads to your new autopilot using the “reversing motor” directions. Only caution, some manufacturers have (or had) a couple different models that handle different current drawls when running. The one I used had components that would handle a 30a 12v reversing load. Have been using for @6 years without a problem.
 
I did just what your asking two years ago. The drive unit is a great unit. There two things you need to do. First strip out all the internal electronics. You only need the two motor leads. Second you need a autopilot that has a output that has about 3o amps. I used simrad autopilot system. The output for the autopilot control unit just goes to the motor leads.
If you wants model numbers I can get them tomorrow.
Chuck DeFever 49 RPH.
Vancouver Canada
 
Interesting thread. I have an old Benmar Course Keeper 220 on my sailboat that
I want to do the same thing with......use the drive motor coupled to a more recent AP controller.

My unit also has an electric clutch, and I wonder if anyone knows whether the clutch functions on 12 volt, or uses one of lower voltages available out of the power supply.

Any ideas?

Tks
 
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