Trying To Sort Out Navionics On My Simrad Evo3 Plotter

[Squidward]

I sorta have two trains of thought related to this. Basically the Evo3 came with the boat when I bought it. Its mounted on the flybridge, so I don't always use it for longer trips, but I'd like to better utilize the functionality when I do find myself up there. So since January I've taken the steps of wiping the old owner's config from the unit, tinkering with wireless networks, etc.

Yesterday I spent almost 2 hours in front of it, trying to sort out why the navigation app never seems to be able to auto-route from one location to another. If my two-hundred dollar tablet with the Navionics app loaded can do it, then I kinda expect the thousand dollar plotting system to do it too. A few days ago I discovered the owner left a Navionics card installed, so I was trying to set that up properly.

The outcome is that I managed to get my phone's Navionics app talking to it, which then prompted me to shell out $200 to renew the card's subscription banghead, and then it completed an update of the card. Sounds promising, right? I then tried to plot a course using a process from a YouTube video. Basically creating a new route on the chart, selecting a start and end point, and then selecting "Dock-to-dock autorouting" and "Entire Route". In the video, that guy's unit started computing a course automatically. Mine gives an "Unknown Error"

Oi. Like I said, I have two trains of thought.

1) Why am I paying $200 to Navionics when my app subscription, which works on phones and tablets, costs about $27? Why should I pay that kind of cash do a crappier version of something my tablet already does?

2) Why isn't it working? The Evo 3 is fully updated, and I confirmed that the newly updated card shows up in my Navionics account when I visit the website. The display appears to have all the data that my phone app has.

 

[FWT]

Are the boat settings for draft etc. correct?

 

[wkearney99]

Garmin has auto-routing, I wasn't aware that any others implemented it.

It's a bad idea anyway, as it doesn't take nearly enough caution into account when creating those routes.

The manual is online and on page 39 mentions some key requirements, mainly the 'safe location' and 'compatible cartography' points. Chart version have been a clusterf*k for a lot of vendors. It'd certainly depend on what charts you've got, and I have no idea how to check that on a Simrad.

https://softwaredownloads.navico.co...ments/NSO-evo3S-MPU_OM_EN_988-12489-002_w.pdf

I'd venture the difference in subscription rate has to do with a) because they can and b) there's added info in the chartplotter versions that are downloaded for offline use.

That and if you're balking at $200 for a boat expense... are you sure you're not a ragbagger?

 

[catalinajack]

I sorta have two trains of thought related to this. Basically the Evo3 came with the boat when I bought it. Its mounted on the flybridge, so I don't always use it for longer trips, but I'd like to better utilize the functionality when I do find myself up there. So since January I've taken the steps of wiping the old owner's config from the unit, tinkering with wireless networks, etc.



Yesterday I spent almost 2 hours in front of it, trying to sort out why the navigation app never seems to be able to auto-route from one location to another. If my two-hundred dollar tablet with the Navionics app loaded can do it, then I kinda expect the thousand dollar plotting system to do it too. A few days ago I discovered the owner left a Navionics card installed, so I was trying to set that up properly.



The outcome is that I managed to get my phone's Navionics app talking to it, which then prompted me to shell out $200 to renew the card's subscription banghead, and then it completed an update of the card. Sounds promising, right? I then tried to plot a course using a process from a YouTube video. Basically creating a new route on the chart, selecting a start and end point, and then selecting "Dock-to-dock autorouting" and "Entire Route". In the video, that guy's unit started computing a course automatically. Mine gives an "Unknown Error"



Oi. Like I said, I have two trains of thought.



1) Why am I paying $200 to Navionics when my app subscription, which works on phones and tablets, costs about $27? Why should I pay that kind of cash do a crappier version of something my tablet already does?



2) Why isn't it working? The Evo 3 is fully updated, and I confirmed that the newly updated card shows up in my Navionics account when I visit the website. The display appears to have all the data that my phone app has.

I have the same system and I still haven't mastered the autorouting. I gave up. But, there are ways of creating the route on a tablet and transferring the route to the MFD. Except for this one issue, I am happy with the evo3. In any case, I am not a fan of autorouting except for its telling me about how long a passage will take and a suggested route that, of course, must be verified. If I want to use an autopilot course I simply enter a few waypoints that gets me down the road a ways, then add more as needed. The tablet helps me do that.

As for the cost of the MFD card, they charge more because they can. The cost, to me, and I am a cheapskate, is inconsequential. I keep mine up to date and have two tablets running at the same time, one with Navionics, the other with Aquamaps Master Edition. Why when I also have Navionics on the MFD? Answer: because there are times when I want something else displayed on the MFD such as radar. Flexibilty. Redundancy. Some folks run with just a tablet but I like having the big screen right there to look at at a glance - heading, depth, SOG, autopilot state, and more, all at a glance. Each to his own.

 

[Bacchus]

I have had limited autorouting experience using Navionics but what I ran into sometimes was the need to put in a few intermediate point to get autorouting to activate.

 

[koliver]

My dinghy and FB share a new Lowrance FS5. It has Auto Routing, a feature I have seen only on other people's boats, and always envied. I am not comfortable using it, because the first Auto Route that I successfully created, would take me through familiar waters, but at every turn, far too close inshore for safety, and to get to the very first turn, far too close to a rock that dries 3' and would be so easy to hit if following that route with even a minimal cross track error. Once I have a few seasons usage with the new (to me) technology I might relent, but for now, I will stick with the old ways of putting in a route.
I guess what I am saying is that you may be expecting too much of your new (to you) tech, so give it time to gel.

 

[SteveK]

Keith, just a wag, as a test did you change the draft of the boat deeper than it is? I suspect the course will take you in deeper waters.

 

[Squidward]

Sensing a lot of reluctance to trust the Navionics auto-routing, but frankly I don't. Even if I were set up to just plug a course into the autopilot and go take a siesta, I wouldn't. I mind the chart every step of the way, sometimes zooming in on potential areas of concern, and of course I keep a watchful eye.

That said, I've never really had a problem with my auto-routed courses in Navionics. If anything, it tends to plot a safer course in deeper water than I would otherwise do. The only exception was the time it tried to take me through a river-like passage between two islands. Maybe it would've worked out and maybe it wouldn't, but I opted to turn around and go the long way.

Overall I find Navionics a terrific tool, because it not only plots courses and estimates travel time, fuel usage, etc, but it also gives me a real time ETA while travelling. The Evo 3 can probably do the latter as well, but I'd end up plotting a less efficient course than Navionics is capable of.

In the end, I guess the MFD crowd are less eager to offer auto-routing because if people point and click their way into a reef then then they'll be hip deep in lawsuits.

 

[Shrew]

My experience with auto-routing is much different. In fact, I was talking with neighbor on the dock who was asking about a particular destination I'm very familiar with and had, in fact, just spent a few weeks in that area.

After he told me he did used the auto-route setting I asked him to show me the route. The auto-route brought him directly across a long shoal. While the shoal had mostly 4-5 feet at low tide, there were a few 3's and the water stands-up terribly there.

There is no reason to cross that shoal. Plus once inside of the shoal, there is a narrow and confusing set of markers that has you splitting two greens to get out. There is no reason to not stay west of that shoal in deep water, where the main channel is.

 

[SteveK]

There is no reason to cross that shoal.

You are dealing with a computer. Tell Navionics the draft of the boat is 15 feet and if it still takes you over reef then you have a point.

 

[FWT]

Obviously one needs to review a route and modify as needed or wanted.

My Garmin GPS device in my car gives me screwy routes at times, and I just ignore the suggestion and start a path I prefer and it adjusts. An option on those things to "avoid ghetto" would be value added but unlikely to be offered.

In other forums the angst is about folks blindly following "Bob tracks" and unwilling to deviate.

The OP question was how to get it working. Absent more info my bet is some setting, or some software piece needs an update.

 

[wkearney99]

... would take me through familiar waters, but at every turn, far too close inshore for safety, and to get to the very first turn, far too close to a rock that dries 3' and would be so easy to hit if following that route with even a minimal cross track error.

My Garmin GPS device in my car gives me screwy routes at times...

The difference is the street navigation need only take into account that you can travel on a road in a given direction. The auto routing I've seen in most boating situations seems to default on the bare-minimum of draft clearance (depth) and shortest-path-first course lines. No accounting for local sea conditions, tides, currents or even much heed paid to commercial shipping transit area restrictions.

I've used the routing on the Navionics app on my phone, purely as a rough guesstimate for travel time. That's about all I trust it for.

Would it be convenient to have back/forth passing of routes and tracks? Absolutely, but until such time that auto-routing gets less brain-dead, I can see why it's not as widely offered.

 

[FWT]

"The auto routing I've seen in most boating situations seems to default on the bare-minimum of draft clearance (depth) and shortest-path-first course lines."

If you draw 4 and want to use 6 as your bare minimum, input 6 for your draft. Solved.

Tides, currents, etc? Yeah, obviously. Its an assist, not a substitute brain. Critical thinking skills still required. Including when its a reasonable tool to use and when it isn't.

 

[wkearney99]

"The auto routing I've seen in most boating situations seems to default on the bare-minimum of draft clearance (depth) and shortest-path-first course lines."

If you draw 4 and want to use 6 as your bare minimum, input 6 for your draft. Solved.

Tides, currents, etc? Yeah, obviously. Its an assist, not a substitute brain. Critical thinking skills still required. Including when its a reasonable tool to use and when it isn't.

The point about draft was it doing something stupid like routing you through a surf line as it routed a long stretch along a coast. Sure, there's depth, but there's also quite a lot of waves stacking up to break. And it's not like these areas wouldn't already be known as problematic, yet the auto-routing seems to have no provision for them.

Seems like it'd be a much smarter compromise to require a point-by-point review of an auto-route BEFORE allowing it to be activated for guidance. But then again, someone dumb enough to not review said points would likely just plod through ok, ok, ok on all the warnings anyway.

 

[SteveK]

Imagine if the app creates a route based on your input using calm seas and current tide along your path.


If you do not want to go over a reef 4 feet under water during 5 foot seas then input at least 10 feet so it takes you around that part.

 

[kchace]

I sorta have two trains of thought related to this. Basically the Evo3 came with the boat when I bought it. Its mounted on the flybridge, so I don't always use it for longer trips, but I'd like to better utilize the functionality when I do find myself up there. So since January I've taken the steps of wiping the old owner's config from the unit, tinkering with wireless networks, etc.

Yesterday I spent almost 2 hours in front of it, trying to sort out why the navigation app never seems to be able to auto-route from one location to another. If my two-hundred dollar tablet with the Navionics app loaded can do it, then I kinda expect the thousand dollar plotting system to do it too. A few days ago I discovered the owner left a Navionics card installed, so I was trying to set that up properly.

The outcome is that I managed to get my phone's Navionics app talking to it, which then prompted me to shell out $200 to renew the card's subscription banghead, and then it completed an update of the card. Sounds promising, right? I then tried to plot a course using a process from a YouTube video. Basically creating a new route on the chart, selecting a start and end point, and then selecting "Dock-to-dock autorouting" and "Entire Route". In the video, that guy's unit started computing a course automatically. Mine gives an "Unknown Error"

Oi. Like I said, I have two trains of thought.

1) Why am I paying $200 to Navionics when my app subscription, which works on phones and tablets, costs about $27? Why should I pay that kind of cash do a crappier version of something my tablet already does?

2) Why isn't it working? The Evo 3 is fully updated, and I confirmed that the newly updated card shows up in my Navionics account when I visit the website. The display appears to have all the data that my phone app has.

Autoroute is disabled on this device. This is a cut and paste quote from the EVO3 manual.


"Note: Units designed for sale in the U.S. region do not have Autorouting capabilities.
Autorouting features are disabled on all non-U.S. units when they are used in U.S. territorial waters."


Ken

 

[FWT]

Ken:

Where are you seeing that notice? I just opened the manual online from Simrad and it gives no such indication. The discussion of how to use auto route is on page 39.

https://softwaredownloads.navico.com/Simrad/SimradYachting_Software%20-%20Copy/Downloads/documents/NSO-evo3S-MPU_OM_EN_988-12489-002_w.pdf

 

[kchace]

The quote comes from the NSS EVO3 manual and it had been in other Simrad/Lowrance manuals in the past. I see you're looking at the manual for an NSO EVO3S which is much newer model (Came out about 2 years ago). I probably wrongly assumed that since you said "it came with the boat" it was not the latest model. If it is a EVO3S, then the capability is there. I believe it is a part of the plotter and not particularly chart brand specific. However, it does require certain compatible charts which are also listed in the manual in the Autorouting section.


Ken

 

[FWT]

Now you have me guessing and wondering.

The manual for NSS EVO 3 has your language. The NSO EVO 3 manual does not. The NSS has the hard side buttons but NSO is touch screen only. I have assumed buttons / no buttons was the difference but maybe there is more? Or one manual posted is not up to date.

Of some importance to someone about to make a buy.

edited to add:

The manuals posted are NSS Evo 3, and NSO Evo 3s. Not apples to apples. The S version is later and more powerful while the non-S is older.

 

[FWT]

FWIW, I now have NSS Evo 3s manual. It clearly provides for dock to dock auto routing.

I can't speak to earlier models.

 

[FWT]

A detail. Apparently if you have more than one MFD you need to create the auto route on the plotter that has the chart chip card in it. Otherwise, it won't work.

 

[Squidward]

Interesting distinction among the models. I think mine is only a few years old, but it is nonetheless the older NSS version. And although I'm Canadian, the boat came from Washington. I've dredged up the correct manual and the part about it being disabled is there.

The strange thing is that the feature is included in the unit at all. You'd expect it to be removed completely, or give a specific error message if it's not intended to work.

I believe my boat's dimensions are all set in the system. I'll take another look when I'm there, and maybe send Simrad a message to see if it can be enabled.

In any case, this sort of confirms that there's no point in shelling out another $200 to update the Simrad's charts every single year. Not if I'll be plotting my courses via Navionics tablet anyway.

When the plotter gives up the ghost, probably years from now, I expect I'll look for a way to just interface my radar and sonar to a tablet. It's more practical in this day and age.

 

[Avalon36]

I had the same problem. The solution is to get the CMap chart card. CMap is owned by Lowrance/Simrad. Dock to Dock routing works seamlessly and CMap has no annual renewal fee. Navionics is owned by Garmin. Not only does it not work as well with Simrad, it costs more every year to renew.

 

[MBythewood]

I have used Navionics charts with a Raymarine eS127 for over 6000 miles of cruising the Gulf and East coasts. Following are a few of my observations:

1) Auto routing is a good start to create any route.

2) DO NOT FOLLOW an auto route before inspecting every waypoint position. Auto routing will sometimes create multiple waypoints on top of each other. If you are following a route and select “go to next waypoint”, without verifying where the next waypoint is, you could end up making a 180° turn to return to a “covered up” way point. At the least this could be embarrassing. At the worst, it would be life-threatening.

3) Auto routing creates WAY too many waypoints on all of the ICW routes that I create. My Raymarine firmware (Lighthouse 2) does not allow for more than 200 waypoints in a single route. My most recent auto routing experience created a route from Kilkenny marina to Jekyll Island, GA and produced almost 500 waypoints for the 62 km trip. I was able to edit the waypoints down to 145 with no hazard to navigating and was within my Raymarine limitations.

4) A great annoyance to me is that Navionics only displays a “path” when creating an auto route on my iPad. I must then export the auto route to my AquaMap program, which does display the individual waypoints, and then export them back to Navionics in order to view and edit the waypoints. I could edit the waypoints in Aquamaps but find it easier to do so using the Navionics program. I have discussed how silly this process is on numerous occasions with the Navionics tech-support people.

That said, I rely on my Raymarine plotter using Navionics charts as my primary navigation device while displaying Aquamaps on a dash mounted iPad.
Aquamaps allows me to VERIFY missing or misplaced navigation aids and notations, two of which were missing on this last trip.

Fair winds and following seas,
Mike Bythewood
Mainship 400 “Scout”