Marine Computer for Navigation.

[JDCAVE]

Thanks Nick: As you indicate from your experience, there is no one way to approach this problem or opportunity, depending on your point of view. I'm leaning towards a NUC, as they are small, affordable, have no moving parts, and provide all the requirements for a stripped down vessel computer. Intel indicates "DC Input Voltage Supported 12-19 VDC". It's not entirely clear what they mean by that and I need to clarify that before installation. I checked the power supply for my laptop with a multi meter and it reads 19 VDC exactly. Is that 19 Volts for the battery charging requirements or also elsewhere on the computer? I talked to Paxcom about my current onboard computer and the tech said that he built only a few 12 VDC units (mine being one of them) and he said that the voltages within the computer varied depending on the location on the "circuit" for want of a better term. As I mentioned, Rosepoint indicated to me that quite a few boaters/users of their software have gone towards a NUC as a solution for their computer requirements.

I reached out to a well known "trans oceanic trawler cruiser" for his advice and he indicated he used a small ATX case with spare parts for everything in the box. Given his background, I guess I shouldn't be surprised that he built his own unit! He did say he would probably go with a super small Lenovo System next time.

I would prefer to find a DC solution if possible, as an AC solution would require some new wiring and breakers etc. It's not a deal breaker though, as my Magnum 2812 inverter/charger is up to the task and we run on inverter when travelling. Typically, the inverter is switched off, when on the hook, unless we require it on for the microwave or AC lighting.

Jim

 

[JDCAVE]

Intel has a 12V 36W Power Adapter


https://click.intel.com/12v-power-adapter-and-4-plug-attachments-2323.html


I have submitted a support request to Intel.


Jim

 

[sdowney717]

I use OpenCPN, and a usb GPS. I modified an old desktop case. On it is a standard MB and intel core2duo, sata drive, etc...
About 20 foot cable of HDMI for the video, and USB cable runs to a usb hub next to the monitor where I plug in the keyboard, mouse, gps etc...

So at my NAV station all I have is the 17" monitor, usb hub keyboard mouse gps. ALL the software was free. Hardware was cheap and cheap to upgrade when needed.

I have a remote on off switch with LED indicator lights i made to turn on and off the PC which is stored 20 foot away.

For the OS I run Linux Mint. With OpenCPN i use CMAP charts.

For the power, I have to use an inverter or the generator. I have 2 inverters, either can run the PC.

 

[Chrisjs]

I think it is good practice to keep the nav. laptop as "clean" as possible. It should not be connected to the internet except for specific nav. software downloads/updates and only when not being used for navigation. I would turn off automatic windows updates and any other auto functions. Only turn these on when not navigating. It is inexpensive to have an "on-line" computer and a separate nav. unit. Apart from being able to update to current nav. software, I am not sure there is an advantage of win 10 over previous (XP) versions, assuming you are only running the nav. software. The last thing you need is all the crap we go through every day keeping our on-line computer clean, free of virus, other intrusive PUPs, and automatic windows updates, etc. while using it for navigation.

 

[JDCAVE]

I think it is good practice to keep the nav. laptop as "clean" as possible. It should not be connected to the internet except for specific nav. software downloads/updates and only when not being used for navigation...

Agreed. My current nav computer is offline, unless I’m doing updates, and it does not have any other programs other than CE, the air at weather caster and the aft camera software running.

Jim

 

[Sunset]

Late to the party. Like some others here, I am determined to find a 12-10V charging system for the laptop. I am going to get a Badelf gps box and I note that it comes with a 12-20V plug-in charger. I am wondering whether this will also serve as a charger for the laptop. I'm not really in a position to turn to an inverter on my small boat.

 

[Sunset]

I tried one of those 12VDC to 19VDC from Amazon.

How did you wire it into your computer input jack?

 

[Larry M]

We’ve been using 10-15 vdc input to 19.5 vdc output DC adapters for almost 10 years. This one is at least 5 years old and works on 2 of our Dell’s.

 

[Simi 60]

More than happy with our dated Compaq presario cq41 after giving it a SSD and ram boost.
Got rid of win7 and installed Linux mint and its much faster than before.

Linux doesn't update constantly which was my main reason to leave windows.
No virus issues, pop ups , pups etc either.
Leave it connected to mobile hotspot continually, no issues in 2 years.

Opencpn and USB GPS on this as well.

 

[jungpeter]

Hi JDCAVE.

My $.02: I've used a NUC for electronic charting for two years now. My NUC is hard-wired to ship's DC power (~12.4VDC-13.4VDC). No issues with voltage fluctuations, no need (in my opinion) for a 12V-19V transformer, no need to run from ship's AC. The 22" Dell monitor IS powered from ship's AC via an old modified sine wave Xantrex inverter. I've simply mounted the NUC to the back of the monitor, where the power button is accessible. I run Windows 7 and Coastal Explorer as a nav software.

Scrolling, panning, zooming, etc. of the chart(s) is easy-peasy via the bluetooth mouse, with no discernable latency. For my configuration, it has an adequate number of USB ports. Note I'm not a touchscreen guy, so YMMV should you chose to go that route.

I had my NUC built by my local computer shop, and all-up, including the NUC, the SSD, memory, OS, monitor, bluetooth mouse and keyboard, labor to build and configure, etc. was about $1000. My geeks were very helpful in the specification of the NUC, and subsequent assembly and configuration.

SPIRIT BEAR is a pilothouse trawler, and I have never had a "ruggedization" issue with the NUC, or any other on-board PC for that matter. It doesn't rain much in the pilothouse, and engine vibration is nil. Again in my opinion, "marinization" of an on-board nav system for inside use is simply gross overkill.

FYI, I only use this as a nav computer, with only occasional forays onto the WWW for chart downloads, weather, marina info, telephone numbers, etc. Works good, lasts long time.

Hope this helps.

Pete

 

[High Wire]

What’s a NUC?

 

[Sunset]

A mini computer:

http://https://www.howtogeek.com/231978/htg-explains-what-is-a-nuc-pc-and-should-you-get-one/

 

[twistedtree]

My how things have changed. This is what a "mini computer" used to look like.

 

[sean9c]

Bought an input jack from Amazon and wired it to the converter.

How did you wire it into your computer input jack?

 

[ktdtx]

What about something like this or one of their batteries which can be plugged in and charging?

https://www.anker.com/deals/powerhouse2

 

[danderer]

My how things have changed. This is what a "mini computer" used to look like.

Gawd I miss those.

 

[tpbrady]

Consider a USB 3.0 monitor as an alternative to an AC monitor. They are generally limited in size 16/17” but I use one as a remote monitor and it works well. I also use a combination USB 3.0 hub/Ethernet adapter to expand the USB 3.0 capacity of my notebook.

Tom

 

[JDCAVE]

Thanks Peter. This is useful to know. I will get onto this project after the Xmas madness is over. Do you happen to know if all NUC units are shipped with HDD, with the option of a 2nd drive that is SSD? Or can you have a single drive unit that is SSD?

 

[FlyWright]

You can use a small inverter powered through a 12V plug to power a laptop and charge small devices. Mine runs 24/7 and works great. I prefer the smaller ones without cooling fans for quiet power.

https://www.amazon.com/BESTEK-300W-...coding=UTF8&psc=1&refRID=7VY43DMKJB00AJ4M70XE

 

[JDCAVE]

My how things have changed. This is what a "mini computer" used to look like.

Chuckle! I remember the DEC Unix systems with an FMT text editor.

 

[Donsan]

Do you happen to know if all NUC units are shipped with HDD, with the option of a 2nd drive that is SSD? Or can you have a single drive unit that is SSD?

Intel ships the NUCs barebones except for the CPU chip. They come in 2 heights. The taller accepts a SATA drive and also has a slot for a M.2 SATA card. The shorter unit only accepts a M.2 SATA card. I believe the i7 and i5 CPUs only come with the taller NUC due to cooling issues.

There are 3rd parties that add data storage and RAM for additional cost. You can find fully configured NUCs on Amazon from various third parties.

 

[jungpeter]

Hi JDCAVE,

I'm far from a 'puter expert, and it's been over two years since I had my NUC built, so I'm a bit fuzzy on details. But, I believe the NUCs are shipped without ANY drive, HDD or otherwise. I believe the NUC can support two drives, and I believe many go this route, with one drive hosting only the OS and the various applications, and the 2nd drive hosting only data. Given the fairly modest storage size required to host the OS (Win 7), and NOAA and CHS vector and raster charts, I chose to use only a single SDD (100Gb or so), which runs and stores everything. Boots in a heartbeat and has been flawless for me. I also understand that data stored on a SDD is unrecoverable in case of a failure, but that's a risk I'm willing to take. Probably not a good choice if you chose to store photos (for instance) on your nav PC.

Suggest you find a local independant computer shop, present them with your needs (and your nav software "required specs" from the vendor) and let them research the NUC (and other small form factor PCs) for you, and see what THEY come up with. In the 15 years or so I've been fussing with PC-based electronic charting, the NUC was a bit of a leap of faith for me, as I'd never talked to anyone using it, never seen one, nor ever used one myself. And the thing is TINY! But I decided to listen to my local 'puter geeks, particularly the part about hard-wiring to ship's DC power and lack of cooling issues, operating environment, data storage, memory, assembly, configuration, etc. and have been 100% satisfied so far.

As with almost everything discussed on this forum, your mileage may vary! Your boat's not my boat, and your needs aren't' my needs. But for what it's worth, I feel the NUC is a pretty darn good solution for what I do on the water. And given line one of this message, I'm REAL glad I didn't try to buy this thing on-line, or assemble it myself.

Regards,

Pete

 

[Sunset]

You can use a small inverter powered through a 12V plug to power a laptop and charge small devices. Mine runs 24/7 and works great. I prefer the smaller ones without cooling fans for quiet power.

I have been re-thinking my position. Looking at going Big Time (relative) with this unit:

https://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B0131L8NLM/ref=ox_sc_act_title_3?smid=A3DWYIK6Y9EEQB&psc=1

But I don't know if a larger unit would raise other issues, or would the draw be entirely dependent on what it's powering.

 

[Heron]

Since I did a google search on NUC I've been getting lots of push feeds on various Mini Computers....some from as little as $200

 

[JDCAVE]

Since this thread, I have talked to a number of forum members about my situation as well as Rosepoint (Coastal Explorer) and the manufacturer of my monitor. I have taken the plunge and have purchased a NUC: NUC7i5BNKP with 8 gb ram and a 256 GB SSD (Solid State Drive) and Windows 10 preloaded.

https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/products/boards-kits/nuc/mini-pcs/nuc7i5bnkp.html

I have also purchased a Nemo Gateway from Rosepoint. As I use a laptop and don't have a stand-alone monitor at home, I purchased an inexpensive monitor with DVI capability and an external DVD/CD drive. I can then do any updating and installation at home without having to worry about issues with connecting to the internet.

I have confirmed the shipboard monitor can be connected to the NUC via HDMI to DVI converter plug or similar cable. Same with the home monitor of course. No need to worry about drivers. All of the communications (Talkers) with other electronics such as GPS units, echosounders and the Airmar PB 200 will be routed through the Nemo Gateway. I found a detailed schematic of the current network that was provided to the PO and I have a combination of NMEA 0183 and N2K. Still working out the details with the Autopilot. The current computer has several ports with RS-232 pin connections. I have the schematics for the wires in the cables for the Raymarine echosounder unit and the Furuno GPS. The connection for the Airmar PB 200 is via the N2K network cable.

I'm sure there will be some hiccups but I've conceptualized most of the installation. In doing all of this myself, I should have a pretty good idea of most aspects to my network and the labyrinth of wiring and cabling under the helm.

Jim

 

[boathealer]

Since this thread, I have talked to a number of forum members about my situation as well as Rosepoint (Coastal Explorer) and the manufacturer of my monitor. I have taken the plunge and have purchased a NUC: NUC7i5BNKP with 8 gb ram and a 256 GB SSD (Solid State Drive) and Windows 10 preloaded.

https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/products/boards-kits/nuc/mini-pcs/nuc7i5bnkp.html

I have also purchased a Nemo Gateway from Rosepoint. As I use a laptop and don't have a stand-alone monitor at home, I purchased an inexpensive monitor with DVI capability and an external DVD/CD drive. I can then do any updating and installation at home without having to worry about issues with connecting to the internet.

I have confirmed the shipboard monitor can be connected to the NUC via HDMI to DVI converter plug or similar cable. Same with the home monitor of course. No need to worry about drivers. All of the communications (Talkers) with other electronics such as GPS units, echosounders and the Airmar PB 200 will be routed through the Nemo Gateway. I found a detailed schematic of the current network that was provided to the PO and I have a combination of NMEA 0183 and N2K. Still working out the details with the Autopilot. The current computer has several ports with RS-232 pin connections. I have the schematics for the wires in the cables for the Raymarine echosounder unit and the Furuno GPS. The connection for the Airmar PB 200 is via the N2K network cable.

I'm sure there will be some hiccups but I've conceptualized most of the installation. In doing all of this myself, I should have a pretty good idea of most aspects to my network and the labyrinth of wiring and cabling under the helm.

Jim

I like the NUCs. I have been using one as my home computer for 3 years with no issues whatsoever.

 

[JDCAVE]

I want to have the NUC "boot" when I switch on the breaker on the helm. I talked to Intel Support on "Chat" and got the following answer:

"Thank you for waiting. In this case you will need to access the BIOS (using th F2 key during boot), then go to Advanced > Power > Secondary power settings > After power failure > there you swith to Power ON
In this way once the NUC feels power it will turn on automatically"

Jim

 

[jungpeter]

Hi Jim,

BOOYAH! Thanks, I'll give it a try. Might still leave mine on 24/7 instead, but nice to know there's an option.

Regards,

Pete

 

[JDCAVE]

My how things have changed. This is what a "mini computer" used to look like.

Peter: I know you're a "Hard Drive" guy. My organization got their first IBM PCs in 1983. One of the units had a 5 megabyte hard drive. The IT guy told me just to save my Lotus 1-2-3 spreadsheets on the hard drive. I expressed concern that it might take up too much storage. His reply:

"You will never ever, ever, ever, EVER, fill up that hard drive!

LOL. I saw 10 GB USB sticks at Walmart the other day for $6.95. I think that IBM PCXT was close to $5,000, with half of that cost being the hard drive.

Jim

 

[boathealer]

I used to work with some rack-mount systems back in the late '70s. They had 12 inch "platters" for disks.

When the heads on those things were moving, the whole 19" rack would shake!

The heads inside the platter had "sweepers" in front of them to make sure the head, which was a good 1/4 inch off the surface wouldn't get damaged by foreign objects - LOL! The sweepers looked like friggin' broom heads!