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Old 08-28-2020, 06:14 AM   #41
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Roll your own noisemaker / charger , you can do better than the current crop of 60 year old designs.

A DN 50,alternator can be had in 12 or 24v up to 450a at 24v.

There expensive new but dirt cheap rebuilt since they have been building them for 30-40 years.

A Kubota or other diesel could be selected to operate the unit at just the speed required to keep up the voltage for rapid DC charge.

A large inverter could power the house goodies while charging .

The variable speed would allow the diesel to be very quiet and more efficient when operated slowly .

50DN™ High Output Heavy Duty Brushless Alternator | Delco ...

www.delcoremy.com › find-by-model-family › 50dn

The 50DN is designed for transit bus and motor coach applications. Providing 270 amps at 24 volts the 50DN provides plenty of power at low engine speeds.
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Old 08-28-2020, 07:26 AM   #42
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Interesting idea, I like it, and frankly it’s not that much more, biggest consideration is mounting location. I do want to ditch my xantrex for a magnum so I could use the xantrex as the backup. Only issue is won’t they be out of sync and affect my 240v stuff (CruisAir)

You're running your ACs on inverted AC? (so to speak)

Water heater too?

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Old 08-28-2020, 09:30 AM   #43
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Lifeline batteries can be charged at bulk/absorb voltage without current limit. Practically they will not take more than about .5C for very long as the chemistry limits it. You might see 1 or 2C for a short period if really discharged. In your case that means 800 amps. Your DC system really cries out to be converted to 24V which would reduce the amp by half and the wire sizes needed. But that is a big change.
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Old 08-28-2020, 12:46 PM   #44
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You're running your ACs on inverted AC? (so to speak)

Water heater too?

-Chris
Right now all outlets plus hydronic heating, dishwasher and all kitchen stuff are inverted. Non-inverted is my hot water heater, washer/dryer, watermaker and the CruisAir units. I don’t care much about hot water as I’ve got engine and hydronic loops plus an instahot system of the boiler is running.
Biggest reason to invert the other side is the washer/dryer and watermaker while underway. I’d leave the CruisAirs, hot water heater and fridge AC on gen/shore only. So far the raritan 20g stays hot easily for 12+ hours so no need assuming I’m doing something to charge daily.
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Old 08-28-2020, 09:29 PM   #45
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I think your solution is a much quieter muffler for your genset.
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Old 08-29-2020, 12:59 AM   #46
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Already there, can’t hear it actually unless I really try, the ice maker in the galley is far more irritating.
I’m more trying to figure out how I don’t run it for so many hours at low load. I have two 30a outlets up top for family who raft up but that’s rare and unless it’s freezing and I’m running the cruisairs full blast (problem solved this year with the hydronic heating) I’ve never come close to fully loading the gen.
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Old 08-29-2020, 07:48 AM   #47
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"I’m more trying to figure out how I don’t run it for so many hours at low load."

If the "low load" is getting the house batts from 85% to 100% , the simplest is to over size the house batts and not bother.

Sure the batts will slowly degrade but you can still pull the needed amps out .
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Old 08-29-2020, 08:45 AM   #48
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Charging

I am running a smaller system, but instead of jumping through all the hoops, I realized my genset has an alternator to charge its starter battery.

As it only takes seconds to recharge the genset battery after start, I hooked an automatic charging relay betwen the house and the genset battery, so for the bulk charging period the genset is putting power from both ends as it were, reduces the bulk charge time, the absorption period is done with solar.

The ACR works both ways, so keeps the genset battery at max when the house is charged, which keeps the time the genset takes to charge its battery to a minimum before it switches to house.

So maybe a larger alternator on your genset and an ACR?
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Old 08-29-2020, 09:34 AM   #49
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That’s a super interesting idea, my Balmar makes quick work of my house bank on the main, will need to see what size if any alternator is on the 12kw NL and what would fit in the enclosure.
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Old 08-29-2020, 10:45 AM   #50
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"I’m more trying to figure out how I don’t run it for so many hours at low load."

If the "low load" is getting the house batts from 85% to 100% , the simplest is to over size the house batts and not bother.

Sure the batts will slowly degrade but you can still pull the needed amps out .
If you never (or infrequently) charge your AGM batteries above 85%, the degradation will be rapid. Change to flooded batteries if you are going to do that.
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Old 08-29-2020, 11:00 AM   #51
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I think your solution is a much quieter muffler for your genset.
Actually his solution is to add a 2nd inverter/charger doubling his charging capacity.

His Xantrex charger is already capable of doing this as the two inverter/chargers can communicate with each other via the System Control Panel.

This is a manufacturer supported solution.
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Old 08-29-2020, 11:08 AM   #52
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A. larger alternator on the main engine
B. larger AC charger in conjunction with generator.
C. tack on solar panels to finish the battery charge and float the batteries.

Per inverters.... unless your boat is designed to be totally supported via an inverter, I think the change over to a total inverter boat would be expensive. You need lots of battery power aka more batteries than you might have now.
I think inverters suck out more battery power than can immediately put back in or float. Use wisely, watch the DC and AC voltage meters. Engine electronics are not designed to run on low battery voltage (shut down about 10.6 volts.) I suspect microwave are not designed to run on low battery voltage via inverter,either.

Yes, I have added a 3rd 4D house battery, a couple of solar panels. I have a standard 40amp battery charger and a standard alternator on the Cummins, I think 180 amp output but would need to locate my spare alternator to make sure.

My goat is to keep this boat as stock as possible, in consideration for the next owner.
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Old 08-31-2020, 12:57 PM   #53
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When we upgraded from Xantrex/whatever to Magnum 2812 we left the Xantrex/whatever in place. When at anchor for more than 2-3 days and need to recharge the batteries we can use both combined to get 225 amp charge when running the genset. Doesn't take long to add about 15% to the 1100 amp battery bank at that rate! At least we don't have to run the genset for 4 hours simply to charge batteries. We have propane stove, so never run the genset except in dire extremes when we need AC or need to charge the batteries. Everything else runs off the Magnum inverter.

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Has anyone figured out a slick solution for faster battery charging while off shore power?

AC
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Old 08-31-2020, 01:13 PM   #54
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Batt charging time

[QUOTE=Arthurc;916502]Has anyone figured out a slick solution for faster battery charging while off shore power?

Someone probably mentions this, but on a Magnum, you can adjust the amount of power your inverter/charger is sending to the batts.
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Old 08-31-2020, 04:47 PM   #55
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Yes but you are upside down downunder.
For you the sun comes right out of the ground.
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Old 08-31-2020, 05:17 PM   #56
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An alternative strategy would be to replace your AGM battery Bank with a lithium bank. A lithium battery bank could be considerably smaller as it can be safely discharged much deeper than 50% SOC and will accept full generator/charger output until 100% SOC rather than wasting time in acceptance or float stage. Obviously this isn’t a cheap solution but Battleborn lithium batteries go for about $1000 per 100 amp/hr and a rough guess would suggest that nine or ten of them would replace your 1600 amp/hr AGM bank.
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Old 08-31-2020, 05:20 PM   #57
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Obviously this isn’t a cheap solution but Battleborn lithium batteries go for about $1000 per 100 amp/hr and a rough guess would suggest that nine or ten of them would replace your 1600 amp/hr AGM bank.
$1000/100amps?
I can buy a lot of AGM batteries for that.
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Old 08-31-2020, 05:22 PM   #58
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$1000/100amps?
I can buy a lot of AGM batteries for that.

Can buy a lot of fuel for a generator as well....
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Old 08-31-2020, 05:26 PM   #59
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$1000/100amps?
I can buy a lot of AGM batteries for that.
Yep you sure can and you can spend lots more time recharging each day too. Point of the OP was to reduce charging time on the hook.
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Old 08-31-2020, 05:51 PM   #60
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Arthur, I'm seriously contemplating upgrading from FLA to Lithium and a large requirement is reducing generator run time to a very minimum. I'd love to hear if you decide to head down this path? Thanks and good luck.
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