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01-21-2020, 06:41 AM
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#1
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Guru
City: Cary, NC
Vessel Name: Skinny Dippin'
Vessel Model: Navigator 4200 Classic
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 5,841
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Battery Cable Butt Connectors
I am planning another electrical system upgrade, including moving the battery switches out of the engine room and up to the living space for better access (safer too). I have seven or eight wires to move about two or three feet up to the new location, however, some of these wires and 0/2 gauge and are already kinda long and secured into some tight places. It would be a TON cheaper and a TON easier to use butt connectors to tack a few more feet onto the end to get the to reach their final destination. Assuming I make properly crimped connections, is there any significant line loss that would have me reconsider?
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2000 Navigator 4200 Classic
(NOT a trawler)
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01-21-2020, 07:14 AM
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#2
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Guru
City: Fort Myers, FL... Summers in the Great Lakes
Vessel Name: Slow Hand
Vessel Model: Cherubini Independence 45
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 12,835
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While I'm not a fan of doing that, I suppose if they make the connectors, it might be ok. IMO, if the cables periodically carry near their load limits, I would be more hesitant to do it.
Have you considered measuring all the cables and the new required lengths to see if you could switch cables around and only have to replace a few of them?
Ted
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01-21-2020, 07:54 AM
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#3
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Valued Technical Contributor
City: Litchfield, Ct
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 6,786
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I am sort of with Ted on this one. Even perfect butt connectors have some voltage drop at the high currents that starter cables carry. And they never stay perfect. Also I guess they are no worse than the ring connectors at the battery switch, although one more connector is one more potential failure point.
But I do recognize the safety advantages of moving the switches out of the engine room. Also I recognize the cost and work involved with going with new, longer cable.
I guess all in all I am ok with it. What does ABYC say? Probably continuous wiring is preferable but no outright prohibition.
David
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01-21-2020, 08:02 AM
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#4
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Guru
City: Ft Pierce
Vessel Name: Sold
Vessel Model: Was an Albin/PSN 40
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 28,155
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My concern would be how close to "minimum" sized are the wire runs to begin with.
If wayyy oversized like so many here recommend for every wiring job, might not be an issue at all.
I have had a splice in my windlass run for years with no significant heat or voltage drop issues.....probably because the run is oversized a bit.
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01-21-2020, 08:13 AM
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#5
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Guru
City: Rochester, NY
Vessel Name: Hour Glass
Vessel Model: Chris Craft 381 Catalina
Join Date: Aug 2019
Posts: 7,556
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Heat issues are also duty cycle dependent. If those cables only ever see close to max load for a few seconds of engine cranking, you won't have heat problems. Sustained heavy load is a different story, however. Voltage drop is a concern in either case.
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01-21-2020, 08:51 AM
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#6
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Guru
City: North Carolina for now
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 6,348
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Personally, that project would be so far down The List it would never make it to the top.
If it did, I'd replace some of the existing switches with remote controlled solenoids like those marketed by Blue Seas for this very purpose. That way no need to do anything with the cables, not to mention the time and hassle involved.
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"There's the Right Way, the Wrong Way, and what some guy says he's gotten away with"
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01-21-2020, 09:01 AM
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#7
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Guru
City: Seattle
Vessel Name: AZZURRA
Vessel Model: Ocean Alexander 54
Join Date: Aug 2017
Posts: 4,309
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Instead of a butt connector use a bus bar. Psneeld is correct, make sure the guage is adequate for the extra feet.
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01-21-2020, 09:31 AM
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#8
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Guru
City: Gig Harbor
Vessel Name: Sandpiper
Vessel Model: Bluewater 40 Pilothouse Trawler
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 2,315
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I agree with caltexflanc.
A solenoid with switch is the best way to do your project. No increase in cable length.
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01-21-2020, 09:32 AM
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#9
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Guru
City: Boston
Vessel Name: Adelante
Vessel Model: IG 30
Join Date: Nov 2016
Posts: 1,611
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Welding cable would be a lot cheaper
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01-21-2020, 09:36 AM
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#10
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Guru
City: Palm Coast, FL
Vessel Name: Coquina
Vessel Model: Lagoon 380
Join Date: Jan 2017
Posts: 2,570
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Rather curious how batteries are safer in a living space? Especially when cables would exist in both.
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01-21-2020, 10:27 AM
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#11
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Guru
City: Miami Florida
Vessel Name: Possum
Vessel Model: Ellis 28
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 5,308
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Parks Masterson
Retired from Hopkins-Carter Marine Supply
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01-21-2020, 10:27 AM
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#12
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Enigma
City: Slicker?
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 16,567
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Greetings,
Mr. dd. I think Mr. TB is thinking of relocating the switches NOT the batteries, hence the need to lengthen the cables.
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RTF
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01-21-2020, 10:29 AM
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#13
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Guru
City: Pender Harbour, BC
Vessel Name: Gwaii Haanas
Vessel Model: Custom Aluminum 52
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 3,791
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Welding cable is cheaper but will not resist corrosion like tinned.
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Don't believe everything that you think.
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01-21-2020, 10:43 AM
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#14
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Moderator Emeritus
City: Au Gres, MI
Vessel Name: Black Dog
Vessel Model: Formula 41PC
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 21,191
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I just threw out some welding wire that was in my boat and replaced it with proper marine grade cable. I was redoing my battery cables and by taking the longer cables and using them in place of some of the shorter cables, I only needed 2 new cables. I also don’t care for the butt connector but would use a power post in its place.
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01-21-2020, 10:52 AM
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#15
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TF Site Team
City: California Delta
Vessel Name: FlyWright
Vessel Model: 1977 Marshall Californian 34 LRC
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 13,728
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Quote:
Originally Posted by caltexflanc
Personally, that project would be so far down The List it would never make it to the top.
If it did, I'd replace some of the existing switches with remote controlled solenoids like those marketed by Blue Seas for this very purpose. That way no need to do anything with the cables, not to mention the time and hassle involved.
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This would be my first choice.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tiltrider1
Instead of a butt connector use a bus bar. Psneeld is correct, make sure the guage is adequate for the extra feet.
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If that's not feasible, PSN and TR have the right idea....buss bar, not butt splice.
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01-21-2020, 10:54 AM
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#16
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Valued Technical Contributor
City: Litchfield, Ct
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 6,786
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What is the benefit of the power post? It has two crimps same as the butt splice, plus it has a threaded post. Seems like more connections to worry about than the simple butt splice.
And to the safety question above: Moving the switches outside of the engine room makes it easier to shut off the power in case of a fire.
David
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01-21-2020, 10:56 AM
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#17
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Guru
City: Palm Coast, FL
Vessel Name: Coquina
Vessel Model: Lagoon 380
Join Date: Jan 2017
Posts: 2,570
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Battery Cable Butt Connectors
Quote:
Originally Posted by RT Firefly
Greetings,
Mr. dd. I think Mr. TB is thinking of relocating the switches NOT the batteries, hence the need to lengthen the cables.
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Ah, yes. Missed that one.
Ok, I was in an engine space one time, where the starter motor stuck On. Glad I was close to the batt switch. Of course, the counter argument on batt switch location can be made as well.
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01-21-2020, 11:37 AM
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#18
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Guru
City: Coupeville Wa.
Vessel Name: Pacific Myst
Vessel Model: West Bay 4500
Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 2,415
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Quote:
Originally Posted by diver dave
Ah, yes. Missed that one.
Ok, I was in an engine space one time, where the starter motor stuck On. Glad I was close to the batt switch. Of course, the counter argument on batt switch location can be made as well.
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It looks like the Blue Sea remote switch can be controlled manually at the switch as well.
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01-21-2020, 11:44 AM
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#19
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Guru
City: Ft Pierce
Vessel Name: Sold
Vessel Model: Was an Albin/PSN 40
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 28,155
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solenoids sound good too...
however I would butt splice in most cases if just lengthening the cable.
power post if it was convenient for something else or other reason.
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01-21-2020, 12:16 PM
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#20
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Guru
City: Vermont
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 10,094
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Although pulling new cables would be the best solution, I certainly understand the hassle that can entail.
I also agree that a butt connection is preferable to a bus bar or post for the reasons DaveM raised.
And it looks like heavy duty but crimp connectors are available is big wire sizes.
https://crimpsupply.com/connectors/2...terminals.html
Just be sure to use a proper crimper with dies for each gauge. Not one of the hammer crimpers, or pliers, or a vise. And get the best shrink tubing you can find.
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