200 perkins Diesel , which battery is best

[Cigatoo]

I have a T6.354 in my lobster boat cruiser which lives on a mooring, is never plugged in dockside, and in the water till December in New England. I also have a small refrig.
I get along nicely with 2 group 29 deep cycle (slightly smaller than 31's)
I have an ACR which automatically parallels batteries while running. I have had great luck with WalMart deep cycles and would never go back to paying for marine, premium, or 8D batteries.
LED lights, especially anchor light, are a big help in reducing load as is replacement of old Norcold with smaller modern unit with extra 6" of foam all around.

I took 2 Walmart deep cycles out of my boat last spring. Nothing wrong with them but were 10 years old and piece of mind dictated replacement. Started my Yanmar just fine in cold and warm New England weather using either battery. Just keep em charged and wet.

 

[ranger58sb]

Good evening , starting battery question . I have a 34 main ship 200 perkins . I'm not new to Diesels or batteries , just this engine . Have always used big 8 d's . But seen discussions here about 31 's and also two 6 's to make the 12 because easier to move than the 8 d's . This will be a cranking battery only , any recommendations ?

As I recall... which, of course may be faulty...

We had a single 8D in our Mk III with DD 8.2T, acting as dual-purpose starting and house battery, and it was located to starboard, underneath the saloon sole, not all that easy to reach and service.

If we still had that boat today, I believe I'd consider a couple options, somewhat combinable, and in no particular priority order (yet):

a) Change to AGMs, to alleviate that whole service thing.

b) Separate start and house functions. A single Odyssey PC-2150 (huge cranking amps) would make a fine starter. A group of 4x or 6x Lifeline 6V AGMs should make a fine house bank. (I can't remember how much space was available.)

c) Leave the bank as dual-purpose, and create a single bank of 4x or 6x 6V AGMs (~440 or ~660 Ah); the combined cranking amps would be way more than sufficient to start the engine.

d) Leave the bank as dual-purpose, but create a single bank of 3x or 4x G31 12V batteries, whatever will fit (3x = ~ 300Ah, 4x = ~400 Ah). In this case, Odyssey could be good (our experience in our current boat has been very positive) or maybe Firefly Oasis Carbon Foam AGMs could be worth a look... especially if anchoring out a lot and for longer periods. (The taller Odyssey batteries could be great too, but one reason I'd home in on G31s is about the weight of each individual battery... and what it takes to get it into the installation.)

In terms of effort -- both for installation and for follow-on service -- I suspect a combination of a and c or a and d would be easiest.

-Chris

 

[Edelweiss]

My boat came with two LA 8D's and I switched to two LA 4D's in the battery box and one 4D for the generator, only because they're quite a bit lighter and not that much different. Three 4D's are more amperage than two 8D's.

Keep in mind the size of the battery case may be an important consideration too. So before you purchase batteries measure the space you will be putting them in. If it's built in, that may be the deciding factor for you.

I would have gone to 4 group 31's, but I have a built in F'glass battery box and no matter how I organized them only two 31's would fit in the space. So I stayed with the 4D's.

 

[john61ct]

As above

Odyssey PC-2150M is actually great for both use cases, a rare example, could also use for a small House bank and then all your batts are interchangeable!

No need to go to a different model batt like Lifeline.

Note I am not in this post advocating for or against keeping the traditional dedicated Starter system.

In either case, having all banks comprised of the same excellent batts would give great flexibility and redundancy.

 

[john61ct]

Firefly Oasis can't be justified for Starter.

As a House bank, their unique ability to handle chronic PSOC conditions

would IMO be the only reason to pay well over $500 per 100AH.

Some would say that cost's even close enough to justify jumping right up to LFP.

 

[psneeld]

Anyone here need great flexibility and redundancy they already dont have?

I set mine up for those traits and it isnt even close to exotics yet.

You can get an automotive style group 31 lead acid battery in every nook and cranny place tbey have cars. Keep it isolated and when cruising, it will stay charged, crank, and last like your car battery.

For backup, a device that lets you connect it to a house bank of nearly any type batteties on s cruising boat will crank most smaller diesels.

For true emergency starting, there are many options....but the subject for a different thread as it goes all over the place including wiring 3 6V batteties in series fir 18V to startthe engine (that ought to get the skeptics and theorists wringing their hands).

 

[cmgreeniv]

I was waiting for someone to say 3X6V or 2X8V GC batteries! Anyway, back to basics. Real world, with different engines. I had 8Ds for my 3208 375s, one each. Plus dual 4Ds in par for the house. I have replaced the starting 8ds, with 2 Sets of dual 31AGMs from Sams. (basically Deka 31AGMs). So 4 31s now sit where two 8Ds sit. I replaced them in 2015. I have cranked both motors on one set many times and never seen a problem. I even had one-two minutes of cranking over a 20 minute period on a pair while working a fuel issue when i had a priming pump go bad on the engine. No problems. For my house, i removed dual 4Ds, and replaced with 4 * GPL12750s which were two years old when i installed them in 2014. I got them from a turned down site where they were used in a large UPS. They finally failed a month ago and i replaced with three AGM 31s from Sams. They were 154 each plus tax. They are rated at 1000 CCA plus 105AH. Cannot comment on their long term ability in house bank use, but for the starting bank, i would think they should last 7-10 years. I am almost 4 years in now, with no issues at all. I should also note, my generator battery failed a few months ago. It was an Optima 31D with a manufacture date of October of 2010. I think it got toasted pretty hard last year when we had an onboard fire caused by a shorted battery cable to generator enclosure. The battery stud melting out of the battery is what finally killed the power to the generator, which caused it to turn off, which caused me to get up, about the same time our neighbor boat moored to us was banging on the window concerned the boat was on fire. Which is was. nothing like diesel dripping on a red hot power wire to start a diesel fire in the ER at 2AM, on the hook! So bottom line, i am happy i ditched my 4Ds, and my 8Ds, and think i get better, safer performance out of my 8 31s now. Never checked a water level since i put them in!

 

[FF]

The big hassle in designing a DC system is how to cover a batt failure.

If a bat is in a string to increase voltage 2 + 6 =12,,, 4+6=24 or other parallel combinations to increase amperage , the hassle is every battery in the combination can go dead when one dies and drags the set down.

How the problem is overcome can be solved a bunch of ways .

For boats with bow thrusters or noisemakers the the use of that isolated batt hauled into position might be simplest .

Of course YRWV , but the daisy chain failure of the system should be kept in mind .

 

[john61ct]

This is a benefit of

if you want dedicated Starters, isolated from House except when charging

having the paralleled House bank composed of the same 12V units

as those used for Starters

whether pairs of 6-volt or actual 12V units doesn't matter.

Very convenient and easy to swap batts around, make do with a reduced sized House

Until you get back to civilization to buy replacements.

 

[FF]

"having the paralleled House bank composed of the same 12V units
as those used for Starters"

If by this you mean the same case size (24 - 27 - 31 ) it will work well.

If you mean to use start batteries for the house bank , it is not advised.

 

[john61ct]

No, other way around

http://www.trawlerforum.com/forums/showthread.php?p=618948

 

[FoxtrotCharlie]

Wow, this is as much fun as an anchor thread Seriously, sounds like there are endless possibilities for battery selections that will work.

 

[psneeld]

Wow, this is as much fun as an anchor thread Seriously, sounds like there are endless possibilities for battery selections that will work.

some in practicality, some in theory....

 

[jleonard]

some in practicality, some in theory....

Exactly!

MY backup to several backup scenarios is a set of 25 ft heavy duty jumper cables.

 

[C lectric]

Exactly!

MY backup to several backup scenarios is a set of 25 ft heavy duty jumper cables.

Yup, carry those too. Needed them once and had to borrow a set so, "not again". Carry my own.

 

[john61ct]

It is true, Starter functionality presents no real challenge, thousands of satisfictory solutions.

The more interesting complications did go beyond the OP request.

 

[psneeld]

well, when ideas like this get thrown out there....

"Dedicated Starter batts becomes an obsolete wasteful idea. "

no telling where things go.......

 

[john61ct]

As long as risks of getting stranded are eliminated, there are lots of benefits to consolidating to a smallest number of banks, especially where 100 lbs here or there makes a real difference.

But I can see the desire for a standard setup too, and I guess a bit of extra dead lead is no worriesi on a big trawler.

 

[geoleo]

Here is my battery story!! FWIW!

In 2004 after the big Florida hurricane season I purchased a Iland Packet 44 from Boat US Insurance . It had been sunk and dismasted by Hurricane Charley at its owners house in Punta Gorda. It has been completely under water for 10 days before being salvaged. In my process of fixing it I became aware of the house bank of batteries which were 3 8D AGM "West Marine and 1 8D starting AGM West Marine." Most of the cable ends were burnt off by the salt water shorting while being sunk. I replaced the cable terminals and charged the batteries using a temp Walmart chrager. They held up fine for the next 2 years while I used the boat and I sold the boat (which I had by then in perfect condition ) with those batteries intact . Those West Marine AGM 8 D s are fine batteries!!!!!