It came up out of Nowhere!

[slowgoesit]

We're currently at anchor at in Ocean Falls, British Columbia. Tucked up at the end of the bay in 90' of water with 300' of 1/2" anchor chain out. Fat dumb and happy on the boat, 2:30 in the afternoon. Forecast for the next day or so is max winds of 6 kts, overcast, and rain. Currently 3 to 5 mph winds, light ruffle on the water, raining off and on, about ready to go ashore for walkabout.
Then in the space of about 10 minutes we have two foot seas, and gusts up to 61 mph. . . . That's Force 10 winds on the Beaufort Scale! Needless to say, our pucker factor went up quite a lot. Anchor didn't budge, but it was pretty harrowing. Kept up for about 2 hours, then calmed down to 15 to 20, occasional 30 for two hours, then calmed to less than 10 mph, seas maybe half a foot.

We were ready to start the engine if the ground tackle had a problem, or we started dragging, but except for swinging around a bit, we didn't move at all. I had bearings on shore, and the plotter, and nav pegged for anchor watch, but we didn't move.

We're thinking we're liking our new anchor a LOT!
We checked Windy.com, WX forecasts didn't predict it or show it, although my wife posted on facebook and someone said they had 51 mph winds in Sidney Harbor, BC that weren't forecast as well . . .

I've got video of the Wind Speed Gauge, but can't post it here on TF. The link to it on dropbox is:
Login - Dropbox
It actually was higher than 61, but it couldn't push the peg over any more, so I don't know what the max was.
Really got our attention!

 

[kthoennes]

At the risk of setting off- well, you know - what's the new anchor?

 

[slowgoesit]

105lb Mantus M-1. Total of 350' of 1/2" chain, 600' of nylon 3 strand if needed as well.
We replaced the 75lb CQR. I'm just not a fan of CQR's.

 

[Peter B]

105lb Mantus M-1. Total of 350' of 1/2" chain, 600' of nylon 3 strand if needed as well.
We replaced the 75lb CQR. I'm just not a fan of CQR's.

Great move doing that. Those CQRs are crazy unpredictable. If you get a good set, they aren't too bad, but it's the getting the good set that's the intermittent variable, and convinced me, years ago, to get a Super-Sarca. Never regretted that decision.

 

[Shrew]

Tucked up at the end of the bay in 90' of water with 300' of 1/2" anchor chain out.

3.16:1

That would be too short scoped for the reported winds IMHO. I would have been very nervous and trying like hell to get to a min. of 5:1.

Just my humble opinion.

 

[slowgoesit]

3.16:1

That would be too short scoped for the reported winds IMHO. I would have been very nervous and trying like hell to get to a min. of 5:1.

Just my humble opinion.

Totally agree! But we were anchored in 90' of water, with only 350' of available chain. And the forecasts were 6 kts max for the next three days. We only had 50' left, and we weren't going to go out and try and put out the other 50' and risk the winds overpowering the brake on the windlass at the worst possible moment. Our plan was to motor into it to reduce strain on ground tackle, or pull up if we started dragging and move into the lee of the fjord till it passed.

We tried anchoring in 50' earlier, but the holding is poor shallower, so we settled for 90' and 3:1 based on Wx report. We're considering adding another 200' before we head to Alaska again.

 

[rslifkin]

3.16:1

That would be too short scoped for the reported winds IMHO. I would have been very nervous and trying like hell to get to a min. of 5:1.

Just my humble opinion.

Behavior is different in very deep water and you generally need less scope. In 90 feet I wouldn't have been too concerned, but in shallower water I'd want more scope.

 

[koliver]

Totally agree! But we were anchored in 90' of water, with only 350' of available chain. And the forecasts were 6 kts max for the next three days. We only had 50' left, and we weren't going to go out and try and put out the other 50' and risk the winds overpowering the brake on the windlass at the worst possible moment. Our plan was to motor into it to reduce strain on ground tackle, or pull up if we started dragging and move into the lee of the fjord till it passed.

We tried anchoring in 50' earlier, but the holding is poor shallower, so we settled for 90' and 3:1 based on Wx report. We're considering adding another 200' before we head to Alaska again.

Scot
You just proved that your anchoring protocol works as designed, so no tweaking is likely to make it any better!
And, about our weather, Yogi Berra might have said, "It's tough to make predictions, especially about the future."

Congratulations on making it so far, so fast! Marine Tracker had you stalled out for a few days earlier on, but finally caught up with you. I think they rely on cell signals, and when you are out of range of cells, your position is reported in the last area that had coverage.

 

[firehoser75]

Hi Scot,
That area can be a bit "unpredictable"! We saw the same type of unexpected wind (and weather) come up when we visited there. We chose to tie to the dock. While there, we witnessed a large sailboat (say 60 plus feet) that could not retrieve their anchor, over in the deeper water. Locals told us that it happens often, as there are lots of potential "snags" on the bottom. Hopefully it wasn't (or won't be) a problem for you? Glad to hear that your anchoring system did it's job well.

Ocean Falls is an interesting stop, and we found the docks to be in good shape, inexpensive, with space usually available.
Best,
Tom

 

[Moonfish]

Needless to say, our pucker factor went up quite a lot.

Similar to the Beaufort Scale, we need a Pucker Factor Scale...

 

[slowgoesit]

Tom,

Getting snagged was a concern of ours as well, but when we up anchored, it came right in, with only a little mud on it. We're enroute to Dundivan Inlet right now, will arrive in less than an hour, then up to Swanson Bay tomorrow and Bishop Bay Hot Springs the day after that . . . . What day IS it anyway?

 

[slowgoesit]

Arrived Dundivan Inlet . . . . some Rat Ba****d took our spot. Tried two other places before we set, in 56' of water.
Winds are supposed to be 2 to 5 kts (right now) tonight. . . . Where have I heard THAT before?

 

[Captain DJ]

Scot,

That is great progress. Halfway between the lower 48 and Alaska or there about?
How many days of steaming in Canadian waters to get this far? You know why I am asking. Safe voyaging and less blow.

DJ

 

[slowgoesit]

Scot,
That is great progress. Halfway between the lower 48 and Alaska or there about?
How many days of steaming in Canadian waters to get this far? You know why I am asking. Safe voyaging and less blow.
DJ

Darrin, we left 12 days ago. We will stop in Butedale tonight, maybe another 20 miles. Tomorrow will be short day to Bishop Bay Hot Springs, layover there for a day, then two days to Prince Rupert, then 1 long, or 1 short day to Ketchikan. So, Probably 14 days total, around 800 miles over the bottom to Ketchikan.

As of about 10 minutes ago:

Engine hours: 79.2
Miles traveled: 608
Average speed: 7.68 kts
Generator hours: 35.7
Fuel Burned: 225.7 gallons
Days traveling, miles/day: 10Days, 61 miles/day

Issues so far:
Coupling on main engine hydraulic pump failed, necessitating more generator run time.

Aft Macerator pump failed. Replaced with onboard spare.
Other than that, it's been pretty much smooth sailing!

Scot

 

[Captain DJ]

Scot,

What GREAT detail:
Engine hours: 79.2
Miles traveled: 608
Average speed: 7.68 kts
Generator hours: 35.7
Fuel Burned: 225.7 gallons
Days traveling, miles/day: 10Days, 61 miles/day

Looks like you are running very economically at about 2.7 mpg with a little less than 1/2 of the running time on the generator compared to the main. All told, likely around 3 mpg without taking the generator into account.

That with an average speed close to 8 knots is very, very good my friend.
I would be proud of such numbers. I am still kicking myself for not leaving her full
before I left. I really had no way of knowing that I would :
A: lose my job,
B: see investments decline 25-33% ATB,
and C: experience record-setting devaluation of the USD and all that comes with that.

But on the BRIGHT side, real estate is becoming insanely valued. Just cannot see myself selling any more of it unless someone comes along and offers me what "the Professionals" are saying it is worth. Then maybe...

But we seem to have our 1923 building pretty well sorted. We may get one or two more tenants there before the year is out. The City is begging me to open a restaurant/bar there, but I said "No Way".

The hotel/restaurant in Banamichi is doing great. Big Groups are starting to come back.

Take care. Best wishes to you both.

DJ

 

[Art]

Behavior is different in very deep water and you generally need less scope. In 90 feet I wouldn't have been too concerned, but in shallower water I'd want more scope.

That's something I've not heard of before. Is the reason: "Behavior is different in very deep water and you generally need less scope." due to extra length of heavy chain even at lesser scope? What about line instead of chain... is there still reason that anchor behavior is different in deeper water as compared to shallow.

Think I may have anchored in 50' +/- water decades ago. Never in anywhere near 90' water. 20's and 30's are the usual... sometimes much less. Also, I always have 20' to 25' chain, then appropriate dia nylon line. Usually carry about 300' rode. When in deeper water... I'm cruising. When in shallow water... that's to anchor.

 

[Mac2]

That's something I've not heard of before. Is the reason: "Behavior is different in very deep water and you generally need less scope." due to extra length of heavy chain even at lesser scope? What about line instead of chain... is there still reason that anchor behavior is different in deeper water as compared to shallow.

Think I may have anchored in 50' +/- water decades ago. Never in anywhere near 90' water. 20's and 30's are the usual... sometimes much less. Also, I always have 20' to 25' chain, then appropriate dia nylon line. Usually carry about 300' rode. When in deeper water... I'm cruising. When in shallow water... that's to anchor.

After dragging a few times when I first got into boating, I started scuba diving on my set anchor rode. I was in the San Juans. I was astounded at how many car sized boulders my rode wound through. I would NEVER anchor in the PNW without an all chain rode (unless it was Lake Washington). 300 feet of all chain rode worked on my first boat (11 ton Manatee). I have 500 feet of 1/2 inch now (90 ton boat). I'm trying to figure out how to fit 600 feet. I'm a sound sleeper.

 

[rslifkin]

That's something I've not heard of before. Is the reason: "Behavior is different in very deep water and you generally need less scope." due to extra length of heavy chain even at lesser scope? What about line instead of chain... is there still reason that anchor behavior is different in deeper water as compared to shallow.

Think I may have anchored in 50' +/- water decades ago. Never in anywhere near 90' water. 20's and 30's are the usual... sometimes much less. Also, I always have 20' to 25' chain, then appropriate dia nylon line. Usually carry about 300' rode. When in deeper water... I'm cruising. When in shallow water... that's to anchor.

Someone over on cruisers forum detailed it out, but it's something about how chain catenary works. Because of the height difference it's much harder to pull 200 feet of chain tight in 50 feet of water than in 10 feet. The angle of the rode is also less affected by wave action in deeper water (as the relative height change is smaller).

We often anchor in 30-50+ feet. Plenty of good spots that are often empty because others would prefer shallower water. 90 feet of chain and 300 of line currently, but at some point I may go to 150/250 or 200/200 for better chafe protection as our cruising grounds expand over time.

 

[Art]

Someone over on cruisers forum detailed it out, but it's something about how chain catenary works. Because of the height difference it's much harder to pull 200 feet of chain tight in 50 feet of water than in 10 feet. The angle of the rode is also less affected by wave action in deeper water (as the relative height change is smaller).

We often anchor in 30-50+ feet. Plenty of good spots that are often empty because others would prefer shallower water. 90 feet of chain and 300 of line currently, but at some point I may go to 150/250 or 200/200 for better chafe protection as our cruising grounds expand over time.

Angle of the dangle is directly proportional to the hypotenuse of the square!

 

[hollywood8118]

Its simple, the deeper you are you have more vertical chain hanging which is more weight that has to lift to straighten the rode. At 50' depth we use 3/1 scope. never use rope in the PNW.. too much abrasive crap to rub against.

HOLLYWOOD

 

[T210DRVR]

I keep a tank and gear on board. I realize not everyone is a certified diver, but I made a bunch of money recovering abandoned gear when I was a whole lot younger (college). My record was four anchors in one dive off a very snaggy spot at Catalina Island. If someone was in trouble I would do the recovery for free. I still would, it’s what you do.

You can’t have too much anchor or chain until the day the windlass fails.

 

[JP2]

Slowgoesit: I would say that you were VERY Lucky. All should beware of anchoring in Ocean Falls.

If you have the chance, see the aerial pictures of the log rafting over the many years the plant was operating (shown in the books). The place was stuffed to maximum capacity more often than not. The pics show convincing evidence of why one should not want to anchor there.

About the only acceptable place to anchor is in the middle and up against the pier where most of the crab traps currently are placed. Much of the head inlet from Coolidge Pt., east, is littered on the bottom with dead logs stacked 4 to 6 ft deep. Anchors drop in between them and then wrap the rode around the log ends as the boat swings in the wind. (Dragging is of minimal concern!) Most anchors have been untangled and retrieved for owners after considerable effort by a local diver living nearby. Many have simply been cut loose and abandoned.

Rafting at the dock is required because of this issue, although new docks were added some years ago substantially adding more capacity, so rafting is now rarely necessary.
Otherwise, Ocean Falls is not to be missed. Great people who are proud of all the work they do in keeping it a desirable, historical and interesting destination for boaters. Good potable water for your tanks, too.

 

[Alaskan Sea-Duction]

We're currently at anchor at in Ocean Falls, British Columbia. Tucked up at the end of the bay in 90' of water with 300' of 1/2" anchor chain out. Fat dumb and happy on the boat, 2:30 in the afternoon. Forecast for the next day or so is max winds of 6 kts, overcast, and rain. Currently 3 to 5 mph winds, light ruffle on the water, raining off and on, about ready to go ashore for walkabout.
Then in the space of about 10 minutes we have two foot seas, and gusts up to 61 mph. . . . That's Force 10 winds on the Beaufort Scale! Needless to say, our pucker factor went up quite a lot. Anchor didn't budge, but it was pretty harrowing. Kept up for about 2 hours, then calmed down to 15 to 20, occasional 30 for two hours, then calmed to less than 10 mph, seas maybe half a foot.

We were ready to start the engine if the ground tackle had a problem, or we started dragging, but except for swinging around a bit, we didn't move at all. I had bearings on shore, and the plotter, and nav pegged for anchor watch, but we didn't move.

We're thinking we're liking our new anchor a LOT!
We checked Windy.com, WX forecasts didn't predict it or show it, although my wife posted on facebook and someone said they had 51 mph winds in Sidney Harbor, BC that weren't forecast as well . . .

I've got video of the Wind Speed Gauge, but can't post it here on TF. The link to it on dropbox is:
Login - Dropbox
It actually was higher than 61, but it couldn't push the peg over any more, so I don't know what the max was.
Really got our attention!

We had a similar situation in Portage Bay, AK (right around the corner from Petersburg and across from Stevens Passage). Huge thunder and lightening storm. We actually saw it coming. I ran upstairs and cracked the engines and went ran to the bow to let out more rode. Went from 200ft to 350ft. Lasted about 45 minutes, then dead calm.