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Old 02-25-2023, 01:33 PM   #1
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Lift Strap Vendor?

Time for me to get serious about organizing lift straps for the dingy.

I want to explore something that will work for my needs better than one of the sets sold on the basic marine retailers (Fisheries, Defender, West).

Who is your favorite supplier?
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Old 02-25-2023, 01:45 PM   #2
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I would go with Dyneema. You can have most sailboat rigging places do the splicing for you if you aren't comfortable with it. Its really easy to deal with vs 2" strapping.

What we did the first time was buy some adequately sized rope and worked out the lengths needed to balance the dinghy. Then took that to the rigging shop and had them duplicate in dyneema.

For the second time, i just did the splicing myself.

Its a nice set up and packs down small.
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Old 02-25-2023, 01:55 PM   #3
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Originally Posted by bkcorwin View Post
I would go with Dyneema. You can have most sailboat rigging places do the splicing for you if you aren't comfortable with it. Its really easy to deal with vs 2" strapping.

What we did the first time was buy some adequately sized rope and worked out the lengths needed to balance the dinghy. Then took that to the rigging shop and had them duplicate in dyneema.

For the second time, i just did the splicing myself.

Its a nice set up and packs down small.
Good suggestion, but I can't go there.

I have two very different requirements. 1) something that works well, and 2) something my beloved spouse feels comfortable being around.

Happy wife = happy life.

It has to not only work and carry the load, but LOOK like it is substantial enough that it won't fall while she is near it.
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Old 02-25-2023, 02:33 PM   #4
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Funny


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It has to not only work and carry the load, but LOOK like it is substantial enough that it won't fall while she is near it.
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Old 02-25-2023, 02:58 PM   #5
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Funny
Yeah. But the truth.





I will embrace overkill, and be happy she's happy.

Now I need a vendor to put together the pieces to make something work.
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Old 02-25-2023, 08:13 PM   #6
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Time for me to get serious about organizing lift straps for the dingy.

I want to explore something that will work for my needs better than one of the sets sold on the basic marine retailers (Fisheries, Defender, West).

Who is your favorite supplier?

Is this the type of thing you are referring to when you say "the sets sold on the basic marine retailers"? https://www.wichardamerica.com/produ...-dinghy-sling/ If so, what don't you like about it so folks can offer further input (other than the price... which is around $500 more than you "need" to spend to make something safe).
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Old 02-25-2023, 09:51 PM   #7
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We have and love our dyneema lift harness but understand the challenge. What about having a rigging shop do it with heavier non-dyneema line, and splice the connections. You could use 5/8” line when 1/4” dyneema would do, and it would look sturdy and might even cost less.

I don’t even know who would make one out of lift straps anymore.
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Old 02-25-2023, 10:01 PM   #8
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FWT;

By "lift straps" do you mean a bridle? My bridle is stainless steel cable. The bridles attach to the tackles that are used to raise the dinghy.

Bruce


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Time for me to get serious about organizing lift straps for the dingy.
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Old 02-25-2023, 10:15 PM   #9
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Is this the type of thing you are referring to when you say "the sets sold on the basic marine retailers"? https://www.wichardamerica.com/produ...-dinghy-sling/ If so, what don't you like about it so folks can offer further input (other than the price... which is around $500 more than you "need" to spend to make something safe).
Here's the boat.





There are no lift point eyes. The handles on the rails are used as lift points.

So for example with the lift harness you posted, the snap shackles are too small to attach to the handles. They are a big part of the cost of that harness and would need to be hacksawed off. One could make do by leaving heavier shackles around the handles, to rattle around and such when not involved in a lift.

Hoping to find a vendor selling the individual parts, and I end up with something like that, that just works on this boat. Or a custom shop that will make what I need.

The handles are 1.125 inches in diameter by the way. I need to be able to shorten down the legs to roughly 30 inches at the tightest, and up from there as I adjust the fit.
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Old 02-25-2023, 10:19 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by guy with a boat View Post
We have and love our dyneema lift harness but understand the challenge. What about having a rigging shop do it with heavier non-dyneema line, and splice the connections. You could use 5/8” line when 1/4” dyneema would do, and it would look sturdy and might even cost less.

I don’t even know who would make one out of lift straps anymore.
I have my Plan A solution fashioned along those lines already. But knotted until I have the fit and balance fully worked out. The "boss" desires something that "looks" more secure. Straps seem to fit the bill. Its a small ask on her part, so if I can oblige I certainly will.
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Old 02-25-2023, 10:32 PM   #11
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I tried Defender a few times. I think their rigging shop might be closed. I tried a couple other online riggers - radio silence.

My dinghy is a 4-point lift. I like webbing for a 4-point: front legs are one piece that wraps through the lifting ring and sewn, back legs are a second piece. Even if the thread comes undone it is still looped through the ring. I used 1-inch tubular polyester webbing and built my own. Webbing has 4200 lb breaking strength and a tracer thread to indicate overloading. I used a 1/2" x 3" ring from US Stainless. 3/8" safety harness shackles attach to the lifting eyes on the dinghy.

EDIT - i just saw your post in no lifting eyes. Maybe a thimble or ring at end of each leg and a soft shackle to connect to your handles for lifting.

For a 3-point lift, I might go with polyester double braid instead of webbing instead of pulling out the sewing machine. At 1/2" or 5/8" it's plenty strong and fairly easy to splice. I'd still go with a 1/2" lifting ring to reduce chafe. 3/8" safety shackles still.

Dyneema is incredibly strong. I just don't like the feel of it. Polyester double braid is damn strong and easy to work with.

Peter

PS - cool looking dink. Like it?
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Old 02-25-2023, 10:45 PM   #12
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EDIT - i just saw your post in no lifting eyes. Maybe a thimble or ring at end of each leg and a soft shackle to connect to your handles for lifting.

Good idea, soft shackles could work well as part of a setup. If it were me I might end up over-sizing them vs what is necessary strictly for strength to make them easier to undo and to make them meet the "look sturdy" requirement.


FWT: What you shared about the dinghy makes sense, I have no other specific ideas myself.
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Old 02-26-2023, 08:37 AM   #13
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You could look at McMaster-Carr online and see if they have slings that would work for you.
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Old 02-26-2023, 08:51 AM   #14
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I did a google search for custom rigging straps and found several vendors that could make something up.
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Old 02-26-2023, 09:06 AM   #15
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Why not use some larger than necessary rope with soft shackles and beefy carabiners? My lifting "straps" are 4 x 3/8" double braided nylon - each of which has a 4000lb breaking strength. The dinghy total weight is 350lbs so even one of the lines has a 11.5:1 safety factor. Regardless of what one uses to lift a dinghy, it should never be lifted over a person or with a person in it.

Ken
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Old 02-26-2023, 09:26 AM   #16
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I did a google search for custom rigging straps and found several vendors that could make something up.
I did that too a few months ago. I had zero responses in about 4-5 tries.

Thinking about it, given the way FWT's handles double as lift points, knowing what I know and in his Topsiders, I'd go to a marine canvas maker versus a rigger. Why? Because his handles-as-lift-points would be better served by webbing vs line. I'd use a design such as the attached where the end of each leg forms a loop vs using soft-shackles to adapt to carabiners - soft shackles are a bit expensive and just another piece of kit to lose.
  • Hi-quality 1" tubular webbing (HERE) is UV tolerant and has a breaking strength of 4200 lbs and a tracer to indicate over-stress.
  • 3/8" safety shackles (HERE) have a breaking strength of almost 5000 lbs.
  • 3/8" welded ring (HERE) has a breaking strength of over 18k lbs.
For a few hundred bucks, a custom lifting harness that is easy to stow and adapts well to the unusual lifting points of FWT's dink.

Peter
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Old 02-26-2023, 10:33 AM   #17
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I did that too a few months ago. I had zero responses in about 4-5 tries.

Thinking about it, given the way FWT's handles double as lift points, knowing what I know and in his Topsiders, I'd go to a marine canvas maker versus a rigger. Why? Because his handles-as-lift-points would be better served by webbing vs line. I'd use a design such as the attached where the end of each leg forms a loop vs using soft-shackles to adapt to carabiners - soft shackles are a bit expensive and just another piece of kit to lose.
  • Hi-quality 1" tubular webbing (HERE) is UV tolerant and has a breaking strength of 4200 lbs and a tracer to indicate over-stress.
  • 3/8" safety shackles (HERE) have a breaking strength of almost 5000 lbs.
  • 3/8" welded ring (HERE) has a breaking strength of over 18k lbs.
For a few hundred bucks, a custom lifting harness that is easy to stow and adapts well to the unusual lifting points of FWT's dink.

Peter

Peter: Where did that diagram / pic come from? Its pretty close to what I'm thinking.
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Old 02-26-2023, 10:37 AM   #18
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Peter: Where did that diagram / pic come from? Its pretty close to what I'm thinking.
I did a quick sketch in PowerPoint. A little cut and paste and presto.

I work for beer.

Peter
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Old 02-26-2023, 10:47 AM   #19
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All: You guys are throwing out some good stuff. Rather than respond one by one I'll just do it all at once.

Soft shackles: An elegant solution in a practical sense, in so many ways. I'd go that way in an instant. Get one of the standard strap solutions like the one posted above yesterday, and attach the snap shackle to the soft shackle loop. Easy. Done. And soft shackles can be left on the handles without bang and clang around a hard shackle left on would do. HOWEVER, I judge it won't pass the test of LOOKING beefy and strong, which is the key goal here.

However, overnight it occurred to me the simple solution might well be a merge of a couple of the ideas posted above.

Get the standard strap harness posted above (or similar). Forget about cutting off and replacing the snap shackles. Instead, add some beefy looking carabiner big enough to go around the handles. The connection becomes strap-to-snap shackle-to-carabiner. If not carabiner, some other beefy snap shackle.

It has the benefit of being easily executed.

Thoughts?
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Old 02-26-2023, 12:12 PM   #20
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Get the standard strap harness posted above (or similar). Forget about cutting off and replacing the snap shackles. Instead, add some beefy looking carabiner big enough to go around the handles. The connection becomes strap-to-snap shackle-to-carabiner. If not carabiner, some other beefy snap shackle.
I'm not stoked on having two pieces of metal hardware connecting like that at the dinghy. You would need to be sure they can't get caught at a bad metal to metal angle that puts them in a compromised weak position. Be wary of side loading, etc. Plus pinch points for fingers.

I like Peter's diagram or anything that avoids metal hardware at the handles.

I bought the Wichard SP400 two years ago (only $294.98 at the time!) because I was in a bit of a time crunch and like it. Much better than stainless cable I previously had.

As you said though, most of the value of that strap is the shackles... and the fact it is pre made and you can order it off the shelf.

That said, most options will work fine and you'll probably change your mind after trying your first pick anyway if you are like me. And then proceed to live with it for at least 5 years anyway because it is just fine.

I am curious if the front handles being relatively far aft will pose any balance challenges, as that is the other piece of the puzzle... getting all the pieces the right length. That is the step buying the adjustable Wichard step let me sidestep.

You may well have already seen it, but there are a few comments in https://www.facebook.com/groups/1592...9698543465958/ around reinforcing the handles. I'd have less concern just lifting it to set it on deck vs having it permanently hanging off the stern.
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