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Old 12-16-2019, 03:24 AM   #21
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Brian,
have you worked out how these would attach on the MK1. For example, are you planning to install the deck mount on t he cap rail or side. I liked the look / reviews of these but was a little concerned that it didn't seem to need as high a topping lift as most other versions (for example, the Forespar Roll-X Flopper Stopper). This seemed to make for an easier installation but I was under the impression that the topping lift took the most strain and was quite critical.
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Old 12-16-2019, 05:46 AM   #22
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Hi Robert

I have only had a cursory look at installation at this point. I'll get my usual contractor down at Gold Coast City Marina involved when it come times to do it. But I'm thinking of mounting on the side so that they can be stored against the hull, just above the rub-rail, which is at the level of the side deck. Then the topping lift can connect at the level of the pilothouse roof, which will be a strong point, and well above the end of the boom even with the boom angled up.

I'll take advice on it, but I think 2.5m booms and size 4 stabilisers will be enough. I base this on having a drogue hanging off my dinghy crane one night last year, only about a metre outboard and on just one side, and being surprised at the benefit. I will be happy to dampen and attenuate the roll at anchor enough to stop stuff sliding around on bench tops! I don't need it to be as flat as the Naiad's make the boat when underway.
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Old 12-16-2019, 06:18 AM   #23
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Thanks. Will certainly be interested in your eventual design. Hadn't thought of storing them horizontally but that may actually help accessing the pole ends if they align about near the swim platform. Whether the attachment is fwd or aft of the side gate might be a consideration (don't want a trip hazard over the gate) but probably determined by where the strongest point to attach on flybridge is.
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Old 12-16-2019, 06:35 AM   #24
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My current setup has the poles attached to the flybridge and stowed aft a d horizontal into chocks. Forespar site shows one topping lift and two down hauls, one to bow, one to stern of boat. From experience, swinging the pole out with a single topping lift can be unwieldy. I have changed from a mast to a hard top and can now use two topping lifts and a single down haul which I hope will be easier to rig.

Based on another posts challenge, I did find a drag-force calculator. 20"x30" plates generate 20kg resistance at 0.3 m/second of drag and increase exponentially to 55kg at 0.5 m/s. Finding the mechanical advantage is more difficult as the effective fulcrum changes as the boat rotates, but believe it to be 5:1 or so with 12-foot poles mounted 2-feet inboard along the flybridge brow. Forces are in the 100kg - 300kg range as I don't believe there would be much "snatch" load with two FS. Less if spread across two topping lifts as I suggest, and of course if pole length is reduced as I will do, it's reduced further.
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Thanks. Will certainly be interested in your eventual design. Hadn't thought of storing them horizontally but that may actually help accessing the pole ends if they align about near the swim platform. Whether the attachment is fwd or aft of the side gate might be a consideration (don't want a trip hazard over the gate) but probably determined by where the strongest point to attach on flybridge is.
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Old 12-20-2019, 02:45 PM   #25
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I traveled the South Pacific islands on my trawler MV SeaWitch in 2018 and I've been in many rolly anchorages. I tried first the https://www.forespar.com/products/ro...-stopper.shtml type. The results were satisfactory, but not perfect. These were working kind of OK, but the issue with them is that they need about one foot of up/down motion fully engage. by that time with the mass of the boat the roll momentum is significant and it takes little longer to overcome and stop. So the motion was dampened but not stoped. the roll was reduced to some level, but when it gets extremely rolly, they often tangled and I had to get up in the middle of the night to pull one out and untangle. quite often after one is tangled, the other one follows as the motion even becomes more severe with only one of them working.

I was fed up with dealing with the issues and not been comfortable, and I made myself different type. This type of flopper stoppers takes few inches of up/down motion to engage (almost immediately due to the small mass of the venetian blinds type of light aluminum flopping parts. They are light and have more area than the first type, plus they are designed to disassemble and store as a 3 foot bundle when underway. They had area of just under 9 square feet each when assembled 36"X34". See the attached picture.

They were easy to make and even of them performed better than both of the old type. Considering that my boat is 60,000lbs and the beam is 14 feet with poll length of about 12 feet for total of 19 feet of center, I believe that they had the best performance one could wish for. The boat roll was practically brought to minimum and even if very rolly anchorages, we were steady as a rock. Plus there was no more frequent tangling issues.

So if you are looking for something that is tried and true, this is it! you can buy them already made here: http://www.flopstopper.com/FlopStopper/Home.html

Cheers!
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Old 12-20-2019, 07:05 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SeaMaster101 View Post
I traveled the South Pacific islands on my trawler MV SeaWitch in 2018 and I've been in many rolly anchorages. I tried first the https://www.forespar.com/products/ro...-stopper.shtml type. The results were satisfactory, but not perfect. These were working kind of OK, but the issue with them is that they need about one foot of up/down motion fully engage. by that time with the mass of the boat the roll momentum is significant and it takes little longer to overcome and stop. So the motion was dampened but not stoped. the roll was reduced to some level, but when it gets extremely rolly, they often tangled and I had to get up in the middle of the night to pull one out and untangle. quite often after one is tangled, the other one follows as the motion even becomes more severe with only one of them working.

I was fed up with dealing with the issues and not been comfortable, and I made myself different type. This type of flopper stoppers takes few inches of up/down motion to engage (almost immediately due to the small mass of the venetian blinds type of light aluminum flopping parts. They are light and have more area than the first type, plus they are designed to disassemble and store as a 3 foot bundle when underway. They had area of just under 9 square feet each when assembled 36"X34". See the attached picture.

They were easy to make and even of them performed better than both of the old type. Considering that my boat is 60,000lbs and the beam is 14 feet with poll length of about 12 feet for total of 19 feet of center, I believe that they had the best performance one could wish for. The boat roll was practically brought to minimum and even if very rolly anchorages, we were steady as a rock. Plus there was no more frequent tangling issues.

So if you are looking for something that is tried and true, this is it! you can buy them already made here: http://www.flopstopper.com/FlopStopper/Home.html

Cheers!
You make a good point - how long does it take to engage? I wish I had a picture of my plates, but they are about 24x36 rigid frame with a few cross bars.
with a thick plastic diaphragm that has an X from corner to corner so there are four triangular relief pieces. They work well, but not as well as the aluminum shutters in this design. Mind do not allow as free of an opening and take about 6 inches to slam shut. Of course, they were about $65 when I purchased them 20-years ago.
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Old 12-20-2019, 07:44 PM   #27
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Maybe they are just not updating their web site but Ocean Torque's site is from 2910/2011. Has anyone ordered these in the past several years?
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Old 12-22-2019, 08:33 PM   #28
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As Brian mentioned, we have had the OceanTorque ones for a couple of years now and use them pretty much every time we go out. Simple and effective, and the stainless poles dont seem to detract badly from the appearance of the boat..

Hamish.
Thanks for the recommendation Hamish, they look like a good product. Do you remember the cost all up, supplied and fitted? Cheers
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