Fiberglass Repair Opinion

[bucketlist1]

So What , Thanks for that post . I have insurance and you don't need a survey on a current boat . Most of the forum thinks you just pickup the phone and it's fixed . Not so easy .

 

[mvweebles]

I hate these threads where info comes in dribs and drabs. I just watched the video - cracks are hugely obvious with splintering of fiberglass mat outside the hull. Not sure if the OP is really asking for repair advice or wanting to drive-home point of a shady transaction.

Interesting the boat has no bottom paint, so presumably she's stored on a trailer or dry-dock berth?

How was such a large crack missed? As far as repair, not sure I'd trust the dealer given the circumstances. As psneeld said, time to call-in an experienced professional. I will observe it's not unusual for large repairs to be made from outside only - from time to time, saddle tanks are removed by cutting large holes in the side of the hull and can only be repaired from the outside. Though not sure that would work with a cored-hull.

Peter

Peter

 

[SoWhat]

I will observe it's not unusual for large repairs to be made from outside only - from time to time, saddle tanks are removed by cutting large holes in the side of the hull and can only be repaired from the outside. Though not sure that would work with a cored-hull. Peter

I believe all Ranger 27's are solid glass. Upper deck and stingers in liner uses foam core. So yes, it can probably be repaired from the outside.

 

[rochepoint]

I believe all Ranger 27's are solid glass. Upper deck and stingers in liner uses foam core. So yes, it can probably be repaired from the outside.

You are correct according to Ranger Tug's website, they say the hull is hand-laid solid fibreglass below and above the waterline, only the deck and cabin are cored fibreglass.........see attached......

 

[Olebird]

Well BL#1 ... as someone once said - "What a revolting development this is!!" - I'm not a boat building expert - so what follows is pure opinion from a retired engineer with 50 years of practical experience.


First with regards to repair - I would lean heavily on the builder for advice as to how to open her up for a more critical inspection as well as how best to repair what you find. You may have give them a hold harmless letter and offset some cost to get their total cooperation - but likely worth it in the longer run. If they will help write a repair plan that could be put out for bids would be invaluable. Get bids from three or four top repairs shops - per the builder's plan. (any changes to be reviewed and approved by builder) (the idea being you walk away with a repair you can have faith in and can sell down the road with your honor intact.) I recently went thru something similar with an airplane - bad news - the Feds got involved, -good news the guilty party fessed up and had GREAT insurance,


I am concerned that the damage you can see is only the tip of the iceberg - I would contact Andy at youtube's "Boatworks today" - he might be able help you in more ways than one - if he could turn it to a video with the help of Total Boat FG products - might make a good advertisement for the boat builder too --- and lemons!!


Financially - well -- not much hope that anyone's gonna fess up and take some responsibility. Probably a total write off.


Hate it for you - lot'sa take aways in this sad tale!



Larry

 

[sean9c]

The OP says in his post #5 that the hull is cored, but maybe not. It doesn't really matter much in the way that you'd repair it.

 

[bucketlist1]

 

[Pcpete]

Dorchester as in Boston metro or somewhere else? The cost of shipping the boat to the factory in Monroe, WA and back is substantial. I would strongly seek the advice from the factory. Given the effort made in creating a Ranger Tug community, I would expect they would be helpful. It’s good advertising.

 

[SoWhat]

Dorchester as in Boston metro or somewhere else?

Small village in Ontario. Toronto nearest large city. In between Lakes Huron and Erie.

 

[Larry S]

Ranger Tug is a great looking boat. That boat was dropped on something like a keel blocking block - like 12” by 12” or so. What type of core material are you dealing with? Some core materials would absorb the shock, and possibly prevent interior damage. The boat can be safely repaired from the outside, regardless, but my concern is the moisture level of the hull, a substantial distance from the break, requiring the job to be made larger than it would have needed to be, had the work been done immediately after the accident. An experienced Fiberglass man can make the boat like new again. Good luck. Move forward, enjoy!

 

[bucketlist1]

To answer the one question above , PcPete , i have talked and emailed with the plant many times , for 6 weeks before doing any social media . The plant and dealership -- no help . Other questions - foam core ( see above Tugnuts post picture ) . for full story and survey www.rangertugtruth.com Thanks

 

[Miz Trom]

We have a 2018 R 27 Ranger Tug that has 2 - 12 '' long hull cracks , port side , about 1/3 back from the bow . We believe it was from blocking . The closest crack to the keel ,is split open like someone took a can opener to it . Some people think water in the crack froze in the boathouse .

I bought the boat in June , and the dealer thinks the hull can be fixed from the outside only . I said it needs to be fixed from the inside as well , and vacuum bagged .
I would like opinions on repairs . If you google '' R-27 Ranger Tug Lemon Aid '' you can see video of the cracks .

Any advice would be appreciated , Thanks Dave

Hi Dave:

I've read your website and your posts. It is a cautionary tale for all boat buyers.

Your account, unfortunately for you, sadly illustrates the most fundamental prerequisite to buying a boat:

A thorough survey performed prior to any boat purchase.

Because you trusted the dealer, you did not hire a marine surveyor prior to purchase. This was the first mistake.

A rushed sea trial. This was the second mistake.

Paul Cornwall's discovery of the water intrusion in the v-berth happened after you had bought the boat and before it was shipped. The boat legally belonged to you at this point in your sad story.

If Mr. Cornwall had made the executive decision to have the boat pulled the minute he discovered the water intrusion, and then had the source of the water intrusion thoroughly investigated, then you and the boat dealership might have had a claim against the former owner.

But because Mr. Cornwall forged ahead with your arrangement to have the boat shipped, the boat's original damage may have been exacerbated during shipping. This was the third mistake.

I sincerely hope your insurance will cover the repairs, but I doubt that they will, as your account indicates that you were probably sold a badly damaged boat.

As to what needs to be done to fix the cracks, consult with several fiberglass shops. Admit to yourself that you made a huge mistake in not getting a pre-purchase survey, get your wallet out, and get her fixed properly.

Then enjoy your boat. A proper repair should not affect the value of the boat.

As a wise TF member recently stated, "when you find yourself in the swamp, don't spend time worrying about how you got there, but focus on how to get out."

My gosh, your story is a true clusterf***. The original owners may have pulled off a scam and gotten away with it. However, the boat could have also been damaged somewhere between their boathouse and the dealer's dock. You don't have any way to prove where or how the damage occurred. But this is due to a combined lack of due diligence on the part of yourself and the boat dealer.

Thank you for sharing your story. It could happen to anyone.

Caveat emptor always applies to boat buyers. That's why God made marine surveyors.

So sorry,
Mrs. Trombley

 

[Olebird]

You need to talk to the VP of marketing or VP of investor relations - the factory will come around.

 

[sean9c]

You need to talk to the VP of marketing or VP of investor relations - the factory will come around.

I'm thinking that those bridges have already been burned.

 

[bayview]

What would the factory do? The boat was not shipped from the factory in that condition.

While I agree it looks like it was dropped if is strange that the sharp bottom shows no apparent damage.

 

[sean9c]

To me it looks like it might have been blocked incorrectly, maybe on the previous owners railway, something to point load the bottom in that area. That is why you don't see any scrape or scratch in that area. The bottom deflected far enough for the fiberglass to crack, then when the load was removed it went back into its original shape. Of course if the bottom pushed up far enough to crack the fiberglass you have to wonder what it did to the interior structure. The surveyor mentions some cracked putty, so something happened. I don't know how RTs are built, I sort of assume that they have an interior pan that drops in. This is easy for the builder but makes access more difficult for repairs.

 

[bucketlist1]

Update - Hull Core Cut Out - Cut on edge of crack by keel V . I am surprised how thin it is . I thought it would be built up in the Keel V area . Funny thing was , when i stuck my finger in toward the starboard side , and pinched the outside hull with my thumb , it felt a fair bit thicker . I can't see a separate core in the middle . There is a flat fiberglass panel above the cutout . I wonder if it helps support the waste tank above ? The only way to the cracks inside is complete disassembly or cut the floor out . Opinions ? I am working toward a repair this winter . Having problems loading pictures , should be on website by weekend . www.rangertugtruth.com Thanks

 

[sean9c]

If the core is a thinner Coremat , as was suggested somewhere, it might not be obvious. It just looks like a slightly less dense laminate. With a normal core material it's common to not have it down the centerline or around corners like at a chine. Coremat is moldable so they might just put it everywhere.
Are you doing this repair yourself?

 

[bucketlist1]

No , I have a capable shop , but till you get into it , there is not a firm price .

 

[sean9c]

No , I have a capable shop , but till you get into it , there is not a firm price .

I'd be surprised if you could get anyone to do it other than on time & materials.

 

[Solly]

I'd think an engineer somewhere came up with the dimensions for the hull thickness. Cost vs. what's needed for support. Also a Ranger Tug is made to plane. Not built as heavy as a 7 knot trawler.

 

[bucketlist1]

hull core sample - 2018 R-27 Ranger Tug

see pictures

 

[sean9c]

Not sure what the pics are supposed to show, just looks like a low tech cheesy laminate.
Couldn't figure out what scale those calipers are using but then figured out, I think, that you're showing the same piece in inches in one pic and mm in the other.
If you think you're going to try and figure out if the laminate is too thin or there is something wrong with the laminate that'll be a tough road. You'd need an engineer or naval architect to determine if he thinks it's strong enough and then you get to go to court to fight it and have dueling experts argue over it.

 

[Miz Trom]

Hi Dave:

Glad to see you are forging ahead with the repair!

That hollow keel surprised me, too. Thanks for the photos. And I also agree, the keel hull seems a bit thin for a keel, but I am NOT a Naval Architect. However, that keel is definitely thicker than the hulls of two small runabaouts I have done some fiberglass repairs on.

From your photos it appears to me that the hull is not cored, I see five or six layers of cloth layered with epoxy. Good.

Perhaps one of our esteemed TF Naval Architects will chime in here and explain the logic behind that hollow keel. Perhaps it is engineered purposely to only crack the keel when one runs hard aground?

Happy and Safe Thanksgiving,
Mrs. Trombley

 

[sean9c]

Hi Dave:

Glad to see you are forging ahead with the repair!

That hollow keel surprised me, too. Thanks for the photos. And I also agree, the keel hull seems a bit thin for a keel, but I am NOT a Naval Architect. However, that keel is definitely thicker than the hulls of two small runabaouts I have done some fiberglass repairs on.

From your photos it appears to me that the hull is not cored, I see five or six layers of cloth layered with epoxy. Good.

Perhaps one of our esteemed TF Naval Architects will chime in here and explain the logic behind that hollow keel. Perhaps it is engineered purposely to only crack the keel when one runs hard aground?

Happy and Safe Thanksgiving,
Mrs. Trombley

What hollow keel?

 

[SoWhat]

4 pictures with the core held by the vice grips are apparently attempting to show a manufacturing defect? 1) A void would be possible but it's isolated and would not be a cause of the substantial hull damage 2) the hull damage is more than likely the cause of the delaminated void.

It seems like you are still trying to blame the manufacturer. I can't imagine how any manufacturing defect would cause the damage visible in the photographs. I believe the general consensus is the boat was dropped. I would be very surprised if you found an expert witness who would testify the damage was a direct result of a small isolated delamination.

 

[cks]

Forget the manufacturer helping you.
Go to the most reputable yard in the area. DON’T waver and use the local yard. If there’s ever a time not to scrimp, this is it.
I suspect the yard will open that hull until they get to something solid. If cored hull, until something that looks structurally sound. I would think it best to open now and let it dry out for some months. It might be able to effect the repair from the exterior, but that’s for a knowledgeable, reputable yard.
Then, one ONLY then, they will build it back up, probably with epoxy to insure the core is water tight.
Furthermore, make time to visit the yard when the work is being performed.

 

[Sailor of Fortune]

I would call Check Destefano in Dedham. He does all types of F/G repair work ....including cutting workboats and widening them. A Boston FG guru. 617 365 8610

 

[BruceK]

I read the core pics as merely going to whether or not the hull was cored.

 

[bucketlist1]

I know you can't cheap out on a repair like this , has to be accessed from the inside as well . Just worried about the thickness of the rest of the hull