Waste tank Sealand discharge pump question

[Derek]

Working through the list of items on new to us boat and neither discharge pump (somethimes referred to as macerated pump) is pumping. I figured duck bills need replacement but to my surprise there were none. So either someone took them out or It’s just built that way. This is my first boat with electric heads so forgive the newbie question. BTW, it’s a sealand assembly with a Leeson pump.

 

[HeadMistress]

I'm pretty sure your toilet is a VacuFlush..."Leeson"--was the vendor. It's a bit different from other electric toilets.



I've written a piece I call "VacuFlush 101" that explains how it works ...I'll be glad to send it to you if you'll send me a PM that includes your email address (no way to attach anything to a PM).


--Peggie

 

[Derek]

Hi Peggy. Love your book. Had a vacuflush on my last boat and sorta miss the simplicity of it. This is a jabsco quiet flush setup. First time with electric heads. The 1 1/2” joker valve fits like a glove on the one side I took off. I’m feeling like the PO (on the Chesapeake) never got over 3 miles out and may have taken them out and didn’t have replacements on hand maybe? Surely seems like they should be there. The leeson looks to be a diaphragm pump.

 

[HeadMistress]

VacuFlush is an electric toilet system...so I THINK you mean that this is your first experience with a macerating electric toilet. What's its model name/#/approx age? Is it designed to use sea water or onboard pressurized fresh water.

This totally confuses me: The 1 1/2” joker valve fits like a glove on the one side I took off...I’m feeling like the PO...may have taken them out ...

There's only one joker valve in any macerating electric toilet, and it's in the same location in all of them: the discharge fitting.

Also confusing: BTW, it’s a sealand assembly with a Leeson pump

WHAT is a SeaLand assembly? Can you post a photo of the pump?
And a photo of your toilet too....

Do you have the owners manual for it? If not, I can send you the link to it once I know which model Jabsco Quiet Flush you have.

--Peggie

 

[Derek]

You are right about the macerating head. It is the jabsco 37075 quiet flush with fresh water buttons for flushing circa 2005. We are on a Mainship 430 aft cabin. We have the toilet manual but the waste tanks are from a different company. Attaching pics of the discharge pump assembly (T-series?) as well as the Leeson pump driving the discharge plumbing. Also snapped the place where I think the duckbill valves should go. Really appreciate your help.

 

[Derek]

One more pic.

 

[Comodave]

Hi Peggy. Love your book. Had a vacuflush on my last boat and sorta miss the simplicity of it. This is a jabsco quiet flush setup. First time with electric heads. The 1 1/2” joker valve fits like a glove on the one side I took off. I’m feeling like the PO (on the Chesapeake) never got over 3 miles out and may have taken them out and didn’t have replacements on hand maybe? Surely seems like they should be there. The leeson looks to be a diaphragm pump.

I believe you are the first person to accuse a Vacuflush head of being simple…

 

[porman]

Our 430 also has Jabsco macerator toilets. The holding tanks (there are two) are Dometic HTS-T 28 gallon tanks with a T series discharge pump on the top. Yes, there are supposed to be two joker valves, one on each side of the pump. Also, the screw on fittings holding the valves are left hand thread. Easy to break if you try to turn them the wrong way. Yes, I did.

 

[HeadMistress]

The holding tanks (there are two) are Dometic HTS-T 28 gallon tanks...

OMG, NOW I know what he has. We're not talking about his toilet, we're talking about his holding tank and overboard discharge pump.

Although the one-way valves in the S-Pump (VacuFlush vacuum pump) and the T-Pump (overboard discharged pump) perform one of the functions of joker valves, Mansfield Plumbing named them "duckbill" valves when they introduced the VacuFlush systems in 1978 and that's what they've been known as ever since. "Joker valves" are also one way valves and are found in the discharge fitting of every manual and electric macerating toilet. See photo.


There's a reason why the valve nipples on the the T-Pump are reverse threaded: it is identical to the S-Pump (vacuum pump) in every way except the S-Pump needs 4 duckbill valves--2 on each end...the T-Pump needs only 2--one in each end--and the price: the list price of the S-Pump is just about double the price of the T-Pump. To prevent people from buying T-pump and adding a valve nipple at each end, they reverse threaded the T-Pump.


I'll get back to the original question Monday morning.



--Peggie

 

[tiltrider1]

I see what’s happening. The PO removed the duckbill valves so that the pump could not be used to discharge. Either to be legal in a NDZ or because he is environmentally friendly.

It’s also possible he was afraid the pump would get turned on while the valve was closed and blow out a hose.

Putting the dUckbills back in should make the pump operational.

 

[Derek]

Dave, I had to laugh. I might have got Lucky on our MS400. All we ever had to do was slather a little lithium grease on the bowl flap. Worked flawlessly for the year on the loop.

This Jabsco setup uses a lot more water as well. I bought a boat full of deferred maintenance and will be rebuilding the forward head and may as well do the aft one as well.

 

[Derek]

I see what’s happening. The PO removed the duckbill valves so that the pump could not be used to discharge. Either to be legal in a NDZ or because he is environmentally friendly.

It’s also possible he was afraid the pump would get turned on while the valve was closed and blow out a hose.

Putting the dUckbills back in should make the pump operational.

Thanks Rider!

 

[Derek]

The holding tanks (there are two) are Dometic HTS-T 28 gallon tanks...

OMG, NOW I know what he has. We're not talking about his toilet, we're talking about his holding tank and overboard discharge pump.

Although the one-way valves in the S-Pump (VacuFlush vacuum pump) and the T-Pump (overboard discharged pump) perform one of the functions of joker valves, Mansfield Plumbing named them "duckbill" valves when they introduced the VacuFlush systems in 1978 and that's what they've been known as ever since. "Joker valves" are also one way valves and are found in the discharge fitting of every manual and electric macerating toilet. See photo.


There's a reason why the valve nipples on the the T-Pump are reverse threaded: it is identical to the S-Pump (vacuum pump) in every way except the S-Pump needs 4 duckbill valves--2 on each end...the T-Pump needs only 2--one in each end--and the price: the list price of the S-Pump is just about double the price of the T-Pump. To prevent people from buying T-pump and adding a valve nipple at each end, they reverse threaded the T-Pump.


I'll get back to the original question Monday morning.



--Peggie

Peggy you are a fount of knowledge on this topic. I always learn something new from your posts.

 

[HeadMistress]

VacuFlush was the toilet on my last two boats and I was a dealer for about 10 years, so I'm intimately acquainted with 'em.

The pump will run whether the duckbills are in place or not. It just won't pull anything out of the tank unless the duckbills are there to create the vacuum needed to create the suction required to pull waste out of the tank while it pushes the waste overboard.

After a bit of research I've come to the conclusion that your "Leeson" pump is an aftermarket replacement for the original SeaLand T-pump MOTOR. I found the company...Leeson only makes motors https://www.leeson-direct.com The actual pump is still original, although the bellows may have been replaced. So a good cleaning and two new duckbills and it should be good to go. Whether you can legally use it depends on where you plan to cruise. If on inland waters or the Chesapeake Bay, won't be able to use it. In all coastal waters that allow immediate access to open sea, you only need to go offshore at least 3 miles from the nearest point of land to dump a tank legally.

--Peggie

 

[Derek]

Agree on all points. Putting some raritan CH in Today as we are doing a final systems check cruise up and down the River a few times and then will pump out and put in the valves. Thanks to all for the great insights

 

[willd]

I also have a septic tank discharge problem.

I have a new-to-me houseboat that kindly came with a 1/3 full septic tank, with contents that have been there for about four years (unbeknown to the previous owners). I'm trying to discharge it without luck.

It has a Dometic TW discharge pump that turns on and sounds like it is operating just fine. When I put my hand around the hose to the open seacock I can actually feel content moving around in there with the rythm of the pump. It really seems to be working just fine. Unfortunately, after I leave the pump running for a while (as long as an hour), the waste water level in the tank is unchanged. I'm confused. Any ideas?

One thought I had is that the intake valve within the tank is clogged. I filled the tank full of water. My hope was it would dilute things enough to get it moving. No luck. I've got Odorlos in the mail (another Peggie rec) and hope that will help break things down, but not sure it's going to help. Another idea I've had is to reach a stick in there and try to loosen things up around the intake. Happy to do that (well, willing to do that) if someone thinks it would help.

In case it is relevant, the pump is above sea level, and the seacock is of course below sea level. The tank is pretty close to sea level; if it matters I can try to sort out whether it is above or below (it may be partially above and partially below). I assume this system worked in the past, but I don't have any way to confirm that.

Any suggestions?
Will

Photos attached. And Peggie, if you're reading, those white hoses will be replaced by saniflex hoses as soon as they cross the pacific. Already ordered.

 

[HeadMistress]

I'm guessing that the pump motor is running, but the pump isn't pumping...not surprising after sitting unused for 4 years. At the very least it needs new duckbill valves--2 of 'em--and, I strongly suspect, a new bellows....rubber and plastics dry out over time. It wouldn't surprise me if your tank vent is also blocked...insects love to set up housekeeping in 'em.


There has to be a Dometic/VacuFlush dealer in Hong Kong...I suggest you give them a call....they'll have the parts you need and also some good advice.



--Peggie

 

[willd]

I'm guessing that the pump motor is running, but the pump isn't pumping...not surprising after sitting unused for 4 years. At the very least it needs new duckbill valves--2 of 'em--and, I strongly suspect, a new bellows....rubber and plastics dry out over time. It wouldn't surprise me if your tank vent is also blocked...insects love to set up housekeeping in 'em.


There has to be a Dometic/VacuFlush dealer in Hong Kong...I suggest you give them a call....they'll have the parts you need and also some good advice.



--Peggie

Thanks Peggie. A couple of duckbill valves are in the mail. I’ll try that first.

 

[willd]

Thanks Peggie. A couple of duckbill valves are in the mail. I’ll try that first.

Thanks Peggie. Replacing the duckbills did the trick. I now have an empty tank. Well, mostly empty. Still have a lot of sludge to get out. Going to take a power washer to it when I get a chance (with a towel over the point of entry so it doesn't spray back out!).