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Old 04-19-2020, 12:22 PM   #1
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Stinky source solved

My semi sometimes stinking head has been self diagnosed when I read the installation manual. (Go figure!)

Seems PO installation or new hoses put in by BYard X in 2017 had a straight shot down to holding tank.

No loop to create a trap to exclude gases coming back up in current installation.

I want to fix this ASAP but need a recommendation on the correct 1” hose. Must be vapor proof but flexible enough to make some bends in a tight space.

John
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Old 04-19-2020, 12:27 PM   #2
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Try and use schedule 40 plastic pipe for any and all poop hoses. It will never permeate.

Is the toilet bowl always empty? If it’s still got water in it, your odour problem lies elsewhere.
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Old 04-19-2020, 12:27 PM   #3
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Raritan Sani Flex hose comes in 1” and 1 1/2”. It is very flexible and does not let smells out. Defender has the best price on it that I have seen.
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Old 04-19-2020, 12:33 PM   #4
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The bowl has no water in it. That’s what tipped me off to the cause.

I went to the Defender site to look at the Raritan hose. I noticed they described the Trident Sanishield as the best. Not a lot of price difference.
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Old 04-19-2020, 12:38 PM   #5
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I used the Raritan on Peggie Halls recommendation. And she it the guru of gurus on heads and associated equipment.
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Old 04-19-2020, 01:58 PM   #6
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Both the Trident and Raritan hoses mentioned above are excellent. The Raritan is much more flexible.

Are you flushing with raw or fresh water? If raw, a commonly overlooked source of odor is the rim of the bowl. The flush water brings in bits of weed and small critters. They get trapped in the rim of the bowl and rot.
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Old 04-19-2020, 02:23 PM   #7
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I don’t think want to ask how you learned that, Parks.
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Old 04-19-2020, 02:41 PM   #8
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Wait....I too do not normally have any water in the bowl as I thought i should have...does this mean I dont have a loop trap in my hose either?
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Old 04-19-2020, 05:01 PM   #9
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Depends on the head type. Vacuflush...no standing water. I believe some newer heads have a built in trap. Older heads like our Raritan Crowns had a joker valve at the discharge from the pump that helped a (very) little. I tore out all the original hose and used vented loops mounted above the level of the top of the holding tank. Very little hose...mostly hard schedule 40 PVC and street elbows where necessary. Hose was used for a few joint connections, but that's about all. I used Dairy grade flexible hose from a farm supply store. Fifteen years and counting with no odor, although the runs for both heads are downhill after the vented loop. I think this can be accomplished on most boats with some careful redesign of pipe/hose runs. It's all hidden behind cabinetry on our OA.
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Old 04-19-2020, 05:05 PM   #10
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My semi sometimes stinking head has been self diagnosed when I read the installation manual. (Go figure!) Seems PO installation or new hoses put in by BYard X in 2017 had a straight shot down to holding tank. No loop to create a trap to exclude gases coming back up in current installation.

Nor is one needed in a system that flushes only into the tank. Aerobic tank maintenance (a vent that provides enough air exchange and a tank product that actually prevents odor from forming), no filter in the vent line, and new joker valve at least annually is all that needed to eliminate odor from the tank in the bowl.


As Parks noted...the other common source of "head" odor in a sea water toilet is micro-and not so micro-animal and/or vegetable sea life left to sit and stagnate in the toilet intake line, toilet pump and the channel in the rim of the bowl. A strainer in the toilet intake line will keep the weeds and small critters from getting into the toilet.


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Old 04-20-2020, 06:54 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PMF1984 View Post
I want to fix this ASAP but need a recommendation on the correct 1” hose. Must be vapor proof but flexible enough to make some bends in a tight space.

SaniFlex.

-Chris
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Old 04-20-2020, 10:15 AM   #12
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Not that Peggie needs more praise but I had a 2 yr problem with a smelly elec toilet.
The prior owner had changed all hoses, I had changed a hose, still smelly. Peggie said clean the intake hose with a bucket of water/vinegar. Put end of disconnected hose in bucket and run mixture thru system. This is a 5 min job and lasts about 2 mo. and 5 min later another 2 mo. etc!
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Old 04-20-2020, 11:39 AM   #13
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SaniFlex. -Chris
You may need a slightly more detailed description:

Raritan's promo sheet is here:
https://www.raritaneng.com/en/shop/products/saniflex
Note that it now has a 10 yr warranty.

Defender has it for the best price I've seen in both 1" and 1.5"
https://www.defender.com/product.jsp?id=3057989


--Peggie
(on my laptop which doesn't have my bookmark file on it due to a hard drive crash on my office desktop)
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Old 04-20-2020, 03:51 PM   #14
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Good news and bad news.

I got the loop installed and there was standing water in the head. For just a couple of minutes. Drained out but not on the deck. New hose does not leak.

Where is the water going?

Peggy, thanks for your book and the advice. I do need a larger vent hose, but need a haul-out to install the thru hull, so that will have to wait.

Right now, other issues.

John
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Old 04-20-2020, 04:17 PM   #15
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How much water was in the bowl? How high above the toilet did you put the loop? When was the last time you changed the joker valve in the toilet?



You said the water didn't drain out "on the deck"...is it still installed? Or do you really mean the head "sole" (correct name for floorings INside a boat...decks are exterior surfaces)?



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Old 04-20-2020, 04:34 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xsbank View Post
Try and use schedule 40 plastic pipe for any and all poop hoses. It will never permeate.

Is the toilet bowl always empty? If it’s still got water in it, your odour problem lies elsewhere.
That is exactly what I did to my old sailboat and my current Silverton. No stink ever with PVC and it is far less expensive than hoses. But watch, there remains general support for hoses regardless of both cost and eventual stench.
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Old 04-20-2020, 05:16 PM   #17
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How much water was in the bowl? How high above the toilet did you put the loop? When was the last time you changed the joker valve in the toilet?



You said the water didn't drain out "on the deck"...is it still installed? Or do you really mean the head "sole" (correct name for floorings INside a boat...decks are exterior surfaces)?



--Peggie
Peggie,

Thanks for the interest. The installation directions say to put the loop about 8 inches above the level of the base of the head. So that's what I did.

I just checked with a ruler and the bottom of the loop is 7.5 inches above the base. The water level in the head is about as low as it can get and still have some water in it. (It's a Jabsco 37010)

I changed the joker valve three days ago.

The water did not drain out of the unit onto the sole. Whatever is going on is an internal situation.

Also, just to be honest..... When I run the pump the first flush is clean water, as the water filters through the waste, the water turns dirty like there was some kind of recirculating system to reuse the water water for flushing. It does go away after a few pulses of water.

Is there someway to figure how the waste is mixing with my intake water within the pump?

John
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Old 04-20-2020, 08:21 PM   #18
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First...the Jabscp 37010 isn't designed to keep water in the bowl. In fact, except for the high end all-china thrones, no marine toilet is. That's because water in a bowl will end up all over the head any time the boat is bounced around by wake or heavy seas.


By installing the loop, you've created a "workaround"...the only problem is, it needs to be several inches above the BOWL--which, if it's the same height as standard household toilets, has a "lip" 15 inches above the surface on which the toilet sits (sole or any raised platform). If the top of the loop is below the bowl, water in the bowl will just run through it.


When I run the pump the first flush is clean water, as the water filters through the waste, the water turns dirty like there was some kind of recirculating system to reuse the water water for flushing. It does go away after a few pulses of water.

Is there someway to figure how the waste is mixing with my intake water within the pump?


Figuring out what causes that to happen requires more detailed questions and answers than is practical in open forum. If you'd like to send me a PM that includes your email address, I'll use it to send you my phone number.


--Peggie
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Old 04-21-2020, 06:20 AM   #19
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Old 04-23-2020, 09:22 AM   #20
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Yesterday I replaced the motor/pump assembly. Did a “test run” and everything seems to work. I’ll take the old motor assembly apart and report findings.
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