shower drain

[jchicola]

Albin 43-our shower drains fast enough to time with a sand dial.* All a matter of gravity, and the angle of the pipes getting to the sump.* Has anyone addressed this issue by routing directly overboard or just draining into the bilge aft?*

John

 

[Steve]

is the shower drain lower than the waterline?
Steve W

 

[Phil Fill]

I would lower the shower sump a few inches.* Rather than drain into th bilge or over board.*Also if you are a*land *person don't expect boat stuff to sound and act like the*land stuff.*

*

 

[JD]

What ever you do don't drain into the bilge.* It will change the smell in your boat over time and not for the better.* The bilge doesn't get pumped out to a dry condition and the water remaining will grow all sorts of stuff that not much*short of bleach cures.

 

[HeadMistress]

jchicola wrote:
Albin 43-our shower drains fast enough to time with a sand dial.* All a matter of gravity, and the angle of the pipes getting to the sump.* Has anyone addressed this issue by routing directly overboard or just draining into the bilge aft?*

John

Water runs downhill at a pretty good rate at any angle steeper than about 15 degrees, so unless there are a bunch of bends and elbows in the drain, I don't think the angle of the drain is the problem.

There should be a sump pump... is there? Does it work? Not all sump pumps have float switches...Are you turning it on?

If the shower pan is below the waterline, it can't drain directly overboard 'cuz the water would have to run uphill to an above-waterline thru-hull (open holes in the boat below the waterline tend to take on water instead of draining it). That would also require a pump, so you wouldn't gain anything.

Unlesss the boat is brand new...when, if ever, was the last time the sump was cleaned?* Your problem could be a simple as plumbing and a sump and sump pump that are clogged with hair, soap scum, body oils etc.

Don't even THINK of rerouting the shower drain to go into the bilge unless you want a boat that smells like a swamp or even a sewer.

My advice: Get some competent local help to come aboard your boat and figure out why your shower drain/sump is under-performing and fix it.

 

[Phil Fill]

Since we are a live aboard ever couple of months I have to take a wet vac and clean/suck out the sump/pan and the hose going to the shower, so it might be as sinple as a wet vac.*

 

[HeadMistress]

There's a MUCH easier way to keep a sump clean and sweet smelling:

Raritan "C.P" is a bio-enzymatic cleaner that Raritan only markets as a toilet bowl cleaner, but it also happens to be the best sump and drain cleaner on the planet 'cuz it not only destroys odor on contact, but the enzymes in it "eat" hair, soap scum, body oils, cooking grease etc that build up in drains and stink. Once a week when the shower won't be used for at least 12 hours, run enough clean water down the shower drain to rinse out the sump....then squirt a couple of ounces of C.P. down the drain fill the sump about 1/3 full with clean water. That's it..all you need to do, once a week. Or last thing before leaving the boat at the end of a weekend or before an extended layup...C.P can stay in the sump indefinitely without any harm to the system. Close your sink drain thru-hulls...put an ounce down 'em and fill the drains with clean water when they won't be used at least overnight to have clean and sweet smelling drains.

And all without having to a single lick of manual labor!

 

[Marin]

Peggie--- Is CP totally benign to rubber parts? Our shower drain pump operates on the same principle as a blood transfusion or kidney dialysis pump--- a roller on a rotating arm compresses a rubber tube around the inside of the pump chamber and pushes fluid thorugh it and out. The advantage is that hair, sand, etc. cannot clog the pump because they never touch the moving compenents of the pump. The disadvantage is that the company that made it doesn't anymore (they make big ink transfer pumps for the printing industry), so if it fails we have to go to a different type of pump which we don't want to do because this one is so good. So we don't want to put anything down the drain that could damage the circular* soft rubber tube in the pump chamber.


-- Edited by Marin on Thursday 16th of February 2012 09:39:28 PM

 

[bobofthenorth]

Thread drift alert but that's called a squeeze pump Marin and they're not uncommon in ag applications.* Check companies like John Brooks or Delavan if you ever need to replace yours.

 

[Marin]

I think the issue is size. The company that made the one in our boat did this as a foray into the marine/RV world. As such it is very small for this type of pump. They eventually decided that the marine/RV market was not what they thought it might be so they discontinued the product although they continue to make their line of big transfer pumps. They did have a spare drive gear and other bits that they sold us cheap so that was nice. So my guess is that this type of pump is generally made in sizes much larger than what we use. For exmple, the portable wheeled pumpout pumps in our marina use this type of pump to pull "product" out of our holding tanks and then they run the other way to pump the "product" into the sewer system. Very reliable, clog-proof, great idea. But compared to our little sump pump these things are monstrous.

 

[HeadMistress]

As I said above, .C.P can stay in the sump indefinitely without any harm to the system...and that includes rubber parts.

 

[Peter B]

bobofthenorth wrote:
Thread drift alert but that's called a squeeze pump Marin and they're not uncommon in ag applications.* Check companies like John Brooks or Delavan if you ever need to replace yours.

Or...when and if it does die, a Whale Gulper pump shares many of its virtues, and would be a good replacement.* Bilge type pumps with their rotating impellors all eventually block up with some foreign material.* Peggy's tip might well lessen the frequency however.

 

[Arctic Traveller]

Phil Fill wrote:
Since we are a live aboard ever couple of months I have to take a wet vac and clean/suck out the sump/pan and the hose going to the shower, so it might be as sinple as a wet vac.*

*That's a great idea, but it has the potential of going horribly wrong, (at least it did for me).* After sucking out a shower drain and testing it, I discovered it was still slow, so I thought "why not try to blow it out?"* I reversed the hose and sealed the drain with a wet washcloth.* When I turned on the vacuum (or blower as it was) the crap that flew out the vents and sink drain was pretty much un-describeable.* It took me 45 minutes to clean it off the overhead, mirror, walls, floor etc.* The guy helping me almost turned blue he was laughing so hard.* At least it cleared the drain.........Arctic Traveller

Trawler training at www.arctictraveller.com

 

[HeadMistress]

Does WHAT have to be rinsed first...the sump? Is it THAT much effort to run a little clean water down the shower drain once a week? To turn on the water in the sinks for 30 seconds before closing the drain seacocks? Seems to me that beats the socks off having to get out a wet vac to clean the sumps, but maybe not.

As for using C.P. in a raw water toilet...it IS after a bowl cleaner, and a very good one too! But nothing that's just poured into any toilet bowl will eliminate INTAKE odor problems because it would have to recirculate bowl contents--ALL bowl contents!--to get into the intake...and I don't THINK that's something you'd want your toilet to do (I've always wondered why that never seems to occur to anyone)!

 

[rwidman]

jchicola wrote:
Albin 43-our shower drains fast enough to time with a sand dial.* All a matter of gravity, and the angle of the pipes getting to the sump.* Has anyone addressed this issue by routing directly overboard or just draining into the bilge aft?*

John

Have you had this problem since the boat was new or is this a new problem or something that keeps getting worse?

You've been given some good advice for maintenance or a problem that just happened or has been happening over time, but on my previous boat, the shower didn't drain properly from day one.* An investigation turned up two problems.* One, during construction of the boat, a screw had been dropped into the shower drain and was partially blocking it, and second, the drain from the shower to the sump actually had an upward loop in it.* As Peggie pointed out above, water likes to flow downhill and in this case, it wouldn't make it past the loop.* Re-routing the hose cured the problem but it would have been much better if the guy who installed it understood about water not flowing uphill.

DO NOT drain the shower into the bilge.* It will stink and the hair and soap scum will eventually plug the bilge pump or hose when you need it the most.* You could relocate the shower sump lower or in the bilge if you wish to.

*


-- Edited by rwidman on Sunday 19th of February 2012 06:09:13 PM

 

[HeadMistress]

If you're using C.P. to clean the bowl, it doesn't matter whether you use fresh water or sea water.

 

[Forkliftt]

Another thread drift alert! Our Rule shower sump rig, the commonly available one, cycles about every 2-3 minutes. I have our AC drains also piped in, but it seems that when the heat/ AC is not on I still hear the pump run about 10 seconds every few minutes. I think it is possible that I keep some water remaining in the overboard hose- and it slowly drifts back into the pan after the pump shuts off. It is a pretty good run to the through hull and it is also a good bit higher than the pan. Any ideas?

 

[Codger2]

I have a bronze check valve in the sump overboard line to prevent back flow.

 

[rwidman]

I would expect a check valve in the discharge line of a shower sump to clog pretty quickly with hair and soap scum. I would look for a different solution or at least have the check valve where it is easy to remove and clean.

 

[HeadMistress]

Forkliftt wrote:
Another thread drift alert! Our Rule shower sump rig, the commonly available one, cycles about every 2-3 minutes. I have our AC drains also piped in, but it seems that when the heat/ AC is not on I still hear the pump run about 10 seconds every few minutes. I think it is possible that I keep some water remaining in the overboard hose- and it slowly drifts back into the pan after the pump shuts off. It is a pretty good run to the through hull and it is also a good bit higher than the pan. Any ideas?

*The shower sump pump should be on a breaker...just turn it off in weather that doesn't require running the heat or AC....turning it on only to use the shower.**

Might also be a good idea to hang a little sign on the shower head to remind you to turn it back on when needed.

If you don't like that idea, move the float switch a little higher in the sump.

 

[rwidman]

My shower has no sump. The drain runs to a filter mounted on a pump. There is a switch in the shower to turn it on when using the shower and turn it off when not.

This seems to work fine and avoids any issues with overflowing sumps and failed float switches.

My AC is mounted high enough that the condensate is discharged directly overboard.

 

[Forkliftt]

All great ideas but Peggy wins. I seem to remember a dedicated switch in the panel that supplied power to the original gray water tank. I also think I remember opting to run a constant battery wire to feed the new rig. This weekend I will locate the wire from the switch and make it the new feed wire. Nice little sign hanging from the shower head. Problem solved. Thanks all.