Noflex versus OxyClean...Paging Peggie Hall

[Baker]

I recently read the Noflex and OxyClean are the exact same thing....with OxyClean being SIGNIFICANTLY cheaper. Is this true????

 

[DavidM]

OxyClean is the trademark for a specific non chlorine bleaching chemical. Noflex's literature says it has an oxygen producing chemical which may or may not be the same thing. It could be hydrogen peroxide based. Also Oxclean is formulated as a cleaner, not a toilet sludge destroyer like Noflex.

So they may or may not be based on the same chemical but may not necessarily work the same in your head.

David

 

[Waterford]

While we have Peggy's attention, I have a related question. Someone on another thread said that Noflex is just Sodium Percarbonate. Is that true? Is sodium percarbonate a useful option?

 

[Bacchus]

John,
I have compared the MSDS for both... available online with a little searching... and the are roughly 80% the same with differences in minor % ingredients.
I have used both but NoFlex worked so well I have stuck with it. We will hit our tank periodically with a higher dose of OxiClean to help clean things and keep them cleaner.
I forget what the major ingredient is but guessing it is as the sodium percarbonate as I think it was Ted (OC Diver) has recommended using.
Getting adequate air to the tank is key to best performance. I added a DIY bubbler before I found a way to improve my venting by abandoning the old vent hose & fitting and just running a new one to a better / different location.

 

[Dwk]

I recently read the Noflex and OxyClean are the exact same thing....with OxyClean being SIGNIFICANTLY cheaper. Is this true????

I have wondered the same. From my experience Noflex works well digesting the contents of the holding tank making it our additive thru out the season. When we layup for the winter the holding tank gets a large dose of sodium per carbonate (oxyclean) ,filled with water and treated to a boat ride then pumped out and flushed. So far the routine keeps everything clean with no odor.

 

[HeadMistress]

Y'all haven't left much for me to add except...There have been and will always will be boat owners who'll try everything from RidX to bleach to save a couple of $$ on tank products. And no, No-Flex and Oxyclean are NOT the same thing.

Just because one of the active ingredients in one thing is the active ingredient in a cheaper product, that doesn't mean it will work just as well...and combining your own mix of household products can even produce one that's more lethal than a mix of bleach with ammonia.

Oxyclean was all the rage for a while about 15 years ago till people realized it really didn't working all that well, nor did it dissolve sludge either...in fact is somewhat corrosive. Now it's sodium percarbonate...and I won't be surprised if Borax turns out to be next.


And btw...why izzit that Don is the ONLY one of you who's bothered find and read the MSDS for No-Flex or any other product??


--Peggie

 

[Waterford]

Peggy, thanks for the info. I asked because I don't even know what an MSDS is, but I will learn. Sorry for the bother.

 

[FlyWright]

We had a thread on this in the past that included the MSDS for NoFlex. After reading that and comparing the price of NoFlex (~$25-35/lb) to Sodium Percarbonate ($17/ 5 Lbs), I decided to give it a try in consecutive holding tank loads. After 65 days on the hook with pumpouts about every 10 days, I could tell no difference in performance between the two. I will continue to use my existing NoFlex supply in the coming weeks and convert to 100% SPC this summer.

I've very pleased with the performance of both products. Being a cheapskate, the $17/5 Lbs is much better to me than the ~$150/5 Lbs of NoFlex.

Sodium Percarbonate

 

[HeadMistress]

You didn't "bother" me. Apparently some of what's going on around me have put me in a pissier mood than I realized till I read my previous post.

MSDS stands for "Material Safety Data Sheet." Recently the name has been shortened to just SDS (a typical example of a bureaucrat with too little to do deciding to make a change just for the sake of making a change). It lists the active ingredients and other useful information. Here's a link to the NO-Flex SDS
SDS NOFLEX DIGESTOR

In it you'll see that sodium percarbonate is not listed as one of the ingredients.

They're usually easy to find online...just google SDS (product name). I just did that to get the Oxyclean SDS
https://www.bism.org/Documents/State/Old%20SDS/OXYCLEAN.pdf

--Peggie

 

[FlyWright]

I'm no chemist but this is the first ingredient listed on NoFlex.

Disodium carbonate, compound with hydrogen peroxide

Does anyone know the differences/similarities of this with Sodium Percarbonate?

 

[O C Diver]

I have been using a tablespoon of Sodium Percarbonate and a tablespoon (squeeze bottle) of Tide laundry detergent in a bowl full of water. Let it sit for an hour to fiz. A quick turn with the toilet brush and then let it sit in the plumbing overnight. Bowl is squeaky clean and everything else is operating flawlessly.

My tank cleaning thread:

https://www.trawlerforum.com/forums/s31/holding-tank-cleaning-easy-way-46357.html

Ted

 

[HeadMistress]

Does anyone know the differences/similarities of this with Sodium Percarbonate?

"Sodium percarbonate is a powder that releases hydrogen peroxide, and it is very concentrated.To be complete, sodium percarbonate releases hydrogen peroxide and soda ash. Hydrogen peroxide breaks down into oxygen and water. As you may expect, then, sodium percarbonate breaks down into oxygen, water, and soda ash."
You'll find a lot more about it here:
https://www.using-hydrogen-peroxide.com/sodium-percarbonate.html


Disodium carbonate is a compound of Carbonic acid and disodium salt.



--Peggie

 

[DDW]

You didn't "bother" me. Apparently some of what's going on around me have put me in a pissier mood than I realized till I read my previous post.

MSDS stands for "Material Safety Data Sheet." Recently the name has been shortened to just SDS (a typical example of a bureaucrat with too little to do deciding to make a change just for the sake of making a change). It lists the active ingredients and other useful information. Here's a link to the NO-Flex SDS
SDS NOFLEX DIGESTOR

In it you'll see that sodium percarbonate is not listed as one of the ingredients.

They're usually easy to find online...just google SDS (product name). I just did that to get the Oxyclean SDS
https://www.bism.org/Documents/State/Old%20SDS/OXYCLEAN.pdf

--Peggie

It's gonna take a chemist to explain the difference. Both are mainly sodium percarbonate (or disodium carbonate compounded with hydrogen peroxide, which is the same thing). The carbonic acid sodium salt is baking soda. Not a chemist, but all web sources agree on those things.

 

[Sea Q]

I have been using a tablespoon of Sodium Percarbonate and a tablespoon (squeeze bottle) of Tide laundry detergent in a bowl full of water. Let it sit for an hour to fiz. A quick turn with the toilet brush and then let it sit in the plumbing overnight. Bowl is squeaky clean and everything else is operating flawlessly.

My tank cleaning thread:

https://www.trawlerforum.com/forums/s31/holding-tank-cleaning-easy-way-46357.html

Ted

Not a good idea
Don't be a backyard chemist because i assume you have loved one's on board and why take chances .You have a boat you worked hard for it why be cheap and take the chance.
Like how much Noflex do you use every year.If it is going to break your bank maybe you shouldn't have a boat .Noflex and oxy are not the same .I will post more later on this Noflex Oxyclean thing.

 

[Sea Q]

It's gonna take a chemist to explain the difference. Both are mainly sodium percarbonate (or disodium carbonate compounded with hydrogen peroxide, which is the same thing). The carbonic acid sodium salt is baking soda. Not a chemist, but all web sources agree on those things.

We are the largest soap manufacturer in North America.
Sorry the shelfs are empty at the stores now but we have increased production by 3 X and are getting back up there with filling orders .

Noflex and the Zaal marine line is just a side line that i brought to the company when i was asked by the family to come back into the fold.
Ten years ago .

Noflex-- Oxy clean ---Chemistry sort of-- close but no cigar
Our chemist doesn't under stand why it works.
he is just a chemist .

i know because i have worked in the marine business for years.
Physic's and mechanical engineering come into effect on top of the Chemistry.
It is not same as oxyclean .

As a user of Noflex you ever have question or need help
Please contact me . --Dave

I'm going to write a long fact sheet on what the Noflex will do and post it.
People will be surprised on how it can help them with different things.

But please never mix with other chemicals.

 

[Lou_tribal]

We are the largest soap manufacturer in North America.
Sorry the shelfs are empty at the stores now but we have increased production by 3 X and are getting back up there with filling orders .

Noflex and the Zaal marine line is just a side line that i brought to the company when i was asked by the family to come back into the fold.
Ten years ago .

Noflex-- Oxy clean ---Chemistry sort of-- close but no cigar
Our chemist doesn't under stand why it works.
he is just a chemist .

i know because i have worked in the marine business for years.
Physic's and mechanical engineering come into effect on top of the Chemistry.
It is not same as oxyclean .

As a user of Noflex you ever have question or need help
Please contact me . --Dave

I'm going to write a long fact sheet on what the Noflex will do and post it.
People will be surprised on how it can help them with different things.

But please never mix with other chemicals.

I do not want to look bad but statements like "Our chemist doesn't under stand why it works.he is just a chemist ." does not bring much credibility nor sound very serious. Just to say.

L

 

[Stabi]

if it is going to break your bank maybe you shouldn't have a boat :

ouch

 

[Beaverlake]

Re cost - I had the same reflections. No flex is “expensive”. How much do I use in a year (we cruise year around). $100 worth? $200 worth? Vs $$? Of all the places to save a few bucks on board I hardly think skimping on anything related to a system as critical as waste water is worth taking chances. To save maybe $50? $100? Not a chance on Knot Home.

 

[O C Diver]

Not a good idea
Don't be a backyard chemist because i assume you have loved one's on board and why take chances .You have a boat you worked hard for it why be cheap and take the chance.
Like how much Noflex do you use every year.If it is going to break your bank maybe you shouldn't have a boat .Noflex and oxy are not the same .I will post more later on this Noflex Oxyclean thing.

I have used Noflex and I have used Sodium Percarbonate with Tide as described earlier. The one tablespoon dose daily with Tide and Sodium Percarbonate appears to work better. Until I do annual preventative maintenance on my Vacuflush systems, I can only go by appearance.

Price isn't an issue if you have a better product. I've seen no proof that NoFlex works better, only some anecdotal stories on forums. One only has to look at the pictures in my "Tank Cleaning" thread to realize that Tide and Sodium Percarbonate does work very well.

I will continue to use what works for me and you keep trying to sell your product.

Ted

 

[Bacchus]

Noflex-- Oxy clean ---Chemistry sort of-- close but no cigar
Our chemist doesn't under stand why it works.
he is just a chemist .

i know because i have worked in the marine business for years.
Physic's and mechanical engineering come into effect on top of the Chemistry.
It is not same as oxyclean .

As a user of Noflex you ever have question or need help
Please contact me . --Dave

I'm going to write a long fact sheet on what the Noflex will do and post it.
People will be surprised on how it can help them with different things.

But please never mix with other chemicals.

OK Dave... here goes...
If the chemist can't tell us how it works can he/she at least elaborate on what the bad chemistry results in if mixed with 1) OxyClean 2)Tide or Dawn soaps? 3) Calgon water softener.
I'd like to know if this is a lethal combo or just doesn't work any better in your or the chemists opinion?
Is there any real world test results you can share or just saying "trust me" use only NoFlex and nothing else?
Can you explain how the physics and mechanical engineering enters into its performance.?
BTW I'm a believer and have been using it for several years now with great results.
Thanks
Don

 

[Giggitoni]

We need to learn how Noflex and other products handle sludge build up in our holding tanks and lines. Does anyone have any experience?

 

[Alaskan Sea-Duction]

So I ordered some Noflex last night. I would like to get my holding tank clearner than it is now.

Best way to use this product? (If different than product instructions).

 

[Sea Q]

Yes lets get back to being helpful to other members.
lets get serious and enjoy boating .

Had a customer contact me last week, that had a family of otters move in his back carpeted deck over the winter .
Boy was he upset .
The Noflex cleaned up the glass and got rid of 90 % of the smell in the carpet
he is happyer now but it will take time and a few more washes to get it back .
i suggested an electric fence on his float .
We had a problem with otters and the fence fixed it quick.
they have not been back in over a year

 

[wpc691]

I use Noflex regularly, heaping teaspoon in each head every day, and once a week to clean the bowls. I bought 6 bottles awhile ago to get a discount price and avoid shipping charges. It works great, no odors and easy pumpouts. That being said, Noflex is just sodium percarbonate and baking soda. There are half a dozen ways to correctly (if obscurely) name chemical compounds, and the MSDS uses an obscure one. Pure sodium percarbonate is popular for cleaning brewing barrels since any kind of soap would be undesireable. As such, it’s widely available from brewing supply houses in 5# bags. OxiClean is sodium percarbonate and low sudsing surfactants. It is 50% sodium percarbonate (as I recall), Noflex is 80%, and pure sodium percarbonate is obviously 100%. I make a concerted effort to buy “free world” stuff, and as far as I know, most sodium percarbonate in the US is manufactured here by Solvay. I buy OEM filters, belts and hoses, the best quality all-stainless non-perforated clamps I can find, and top quality lubricants and fluids, so I don’t consider myself cheap or reckless. I don’t consider Noflex in exactly the same criticality class as those maintenance items, and I’ll probably give sodium percarbonate a try next time around. Full disclosure, I made my living as a chemist for much of my life, and have no relationship, good or bad, with any products or suppliers involved in this discussion.

 

[catalinajack]

Take a look around and Google the active ingredients in No Flex. Pretty much the active ingredients combine to produce, wait for it, sodium percarbonate. No chemist here but I think I am in the ballpark. I bought some and did a toilet bowl test. Not pleasant but I left some No. 2 behind and added some percarbonate to the water. Came back an hour later and the result was the same as that with NoFlex, solids broken up completely. I'll be using percarbonate going forward.

Another use for both is shower sumps. I have an open sump. I occasionally sprinkle some in the water and come back in an hour or so to a sump with clear water that was before an opaque mess.

 

[DDW]

One problem is, testimonials area dime a dozen. I've yet to see a single vendor of any holding tank product that doesn't have several dozen of them. It would be nice to see actual test data, but I'd guess we are never going to see that.

A large percentage (perhaps a majority?) of members here are driving Chinese built trawlers - like the 'cheap' Nordhavns and KKs . I'm not sure putting N.A. sourced holding tank additives in them proves anything.

 

[Sea Q]

We need to learn how Noflex and other products handle sludge build up in our holding tanks and lines. Does anyone have any experience?

PM me if no one gets back to you
I'm always here to help

 

[Sea Q]

I use Noflex regularly, heaping teaspoon in each head every day, and once a week to clean the bowls. I bought 6 bottles awhile ago to get a discount price and avoid shipping charges. It works great, no odors and easy pumpouts. That being said, Noflex is just sodium percarbonate and baking soda. There are half a dozen ways to correctly (if obscurely) name chemical compounds, and the MSDS uses an obscure one. Pure sodium percarbonate is popular for cleaning brewing barrels since any kind of soap would be undesireable. As such, it’s widely available from brewing supply houses in 5# bags. OxiClean is sodium percarbonate and low sudsing surfactants. It is 50% sodium percarbonate (as I recall), Noflex is 80%, and pure sodium percarbonate is obviously 100%. I make a concerted effort to buy “free world” stuff, and as far as I know, most sodium percarbonate in the US is manufactured here by Solvay. I buy OEM filters, belts and hoses, the best quality all-stainless non-perforated clamps I can find, and top quality lubricants and fluids, so I don’t consider myself cheap or reckless. I don’t consider Noflex in exactly the same criticality class as those maintenance items, and I’ll probably give sodium percarbonate a try next time around. Full disclosure, I made my living as a chemist for much of my life, and have no relationship, good or bad, with any products or suppliers involved in this discussion.

Noflex is pure Sodium P plus more and a special coating

 

[wpc691]

Noflex is pure Sodium P plus more and a special coating

MSDS says 80%, unless I’m misreading it. Most sodium percarbonate comes from Solvay already coated.

 

[Baker]

Holy sh*t!!!...literally. I was on thee boat all weekend and I come back to this. Anyway, thanks to all that provided good information. I am a little shocked at how this thread got so far off the rails when all I was seeking was some helpful information. Thanks again to those that helped. And for the rest of yas....get out there and use your boats!!!!...