China made bilge pump, what do you think?

[Capt.Bill11]

Those are domestic water pumps, not bilge pumps.

Those are bildge pumps. Google it.

 

[Capt.Bill11]

I am having a problem with Rule bilge pump switches. I purchased two packages of a Rule 800 bilge pump and a switch (the cheaper Rule switch) from Amazon. I have the same switch in my trawler which was installed by the PO and has worked for over 10 years.

The first switch failed after one summer of use in my skiff. It just quit turning the pump on. Rule sent me a warranty replacement (2yr warranty). To be safer, I installed both the replacement and the other new switch in parallel. Tested both switches in the boat at home, all good.

I took the skiff to the marina, and had a rain. One of the new switches stuck in the 'on' position, could have drained the battery if I had not caught it in time.

So, two out of three new Rule switches failed. One after three months of use, the other after one day.

I think I will try a Johnson brand switch as I have lost faith in Rule, a long time standard in the bilge pump industry.

TEF-GEL - Ultra safety systems - Home page

 

[BandB]

Interesting, didn't know that Jabsco & Rule were from same parent company. I have two Jabsco pump onboard, a fresh water pump and a head pump/macerator assembly. They are working fine but a bit noisy and I found them quite expensive for what it is. The head pump/macerator assembly is basically an electric motor moving 1 impeller and 1 blade on the same shaft, no high tech there and I was not able to find one under 300$ up here in Canada. A bit pricey in my sense. Anyway when you don't have other choice, better to pay than to use a bucket

Here are all the brands under the Xylem umbrella:

Xylem Brands — Highly Efficient Technologies, Applications, and Solutions

 

[BruceK]

Quality of manufacture is more important than country of origin, and we can`t just dump on a product because it is out of China. I`m not saying that solely because China probably watches TF, as well as it watches elections, our weather bureau, political party records, etc etc. Onan/Cummins proudly branded fuel solenoid switches, are made in China.
I have had failures with flipper type pump switches, Rule included, but not with the Johnson Ultra mentioned above.
You can use Paypal to pay many suppliers, keeping your cc details safe. Assuming of course PayPal is safe, didn`t they have an issue recently...
There was a time when Japanese products were regarded as suspect, these days they set the standard in a number of areas. Hyundai stuff was suss too, but has evolved to near Japanese quality,and that`s quite a compliment. China is more of a concern on "originality", and evolving quality can be patchy, problem is finding a good "patch" to buy from. We`ve had issues here recently in "non flammable" building products that were, asbestos free products that were not, insulated wiring for buildings with the insulation failing after 2 years...but give them time and meanwhile, take care.

 

[Simi 60]

Who here is so certain that their choice of smaller electric bilge pump will work every time it needs to till they replace it?

Are you sure enough to just use one? Or one for every gph quota you need?


I doubt anyone will bet their boat on it.

So which will fail first? Expensive or less so? It's all a bet.....

Exactly and for this very reason I have 4 x 300gph in my bilge set at varying depths.
Mix of rule, Johnson and my favorites, TMC.
The first one has the float switch well out of any water and easily accessable but has PVC tube with a float on the bottom so as that float moves up, the tube moves up activating the switch.

Backup to those 4 are 2 submersable 240v. Plumbed in as permanent, just plug in and flick switch.

 

[BruceK]

A 45% import tariff should remove many of the problematic pumps from the market. Though, I have a vague recall my reliable Johnson Ultra was made in Mexico.

 

[Capt.Bill11]

Exactly and for this very reason I have 4 x 300gph in my bilge set at varying depths.
Mix of rule, Johnson and my favorites, TMC.
The first one has the float switch well out of any water and easily accessable but has PVC tube with a float on the bottom so as that float moves up, the tube moves up activating the switch.

Backup to those 4 are 2 submersable 240v. Plumbed in as permanent, just plug in and flick switch.

300 gph? I hope you meant 3000 GPH.

300 gph pumps are what you'd use in a shower sump.

 

[BruceK]

Those are bildge pumps. Google it.

Did you mean "bilge" pumps?

 

[Capt.Bill11]

Did you mean "bilge" pumps?

Obviously.

And just as obviously I can't spell at times.

 

[Simi 60]

300 gph? I hope you meant 3000 GPH.

300 gph pumps are what you'd use in a shower sump.

Yeah, 3000 and 3500gallon, whatever the hell a gallon is

 

[gaston]

Yeah, 3000 and 3500gallon, whatever the hell a gallon is

Real gallon or US gallon ?

 

[stubones99]

Interesting that no one has mentioned a real bilge pump...

Fast Flow Pumps - Bilge Pump

 

[Capt.Bill11]

Interesting that no one has mentioned a real bilge pump...

Fast Flow Pumps - Bilge Pump

They are great. As long as the engine is running.

And most boats sink at the dock.

 

[stubones99]

At least you have an easy way to find the boat... pull on the dock line.

Most bilge pumps can't keep up with a real leak. Either they burn up, clog, run down the batteries, head pressure reduces flow, or the switch fails. Most people don't realize how much water can come in through a 2 inch hole 3 feet below the surface.

 

[BandB]

The key is a mix of pumps and alarms and having the alarms notify you wherever you are. I recommend at least double the "needed" pumps and alarms. A pump like the fast flow or others off the engine are then helpful once someone there or if running offshore.

Interesting story re: Chinese build. An anti-Chinese boat captain friend of ours ran a Hunt 72 from the Fort Lauderdale show back to Stuart. He was praising that boat. Beautiful detail work, Hunt and Hinckley are known for. Great performance, cruising nicely in 4' seas at 28 knots. Great boat. What he didn't know until later was it was built in Taiwan. They build their smaller boats in Rhode Island and design everything there, but their Ocean line is built in Taiwan. It just proves the point of what can be done. It's not worker capability, but design and oversight.

Now, all bilge pumps are basically cheap materials and electrical subjected to water and it doesn't matter where built, all subject to problems. They are built to what I call "throw away" standards and yet we trust our boats to them.

 

[Lou_tribal]

When I bought my boat the PO showed me something interesting. The builder of the boat (custom build) used a valve on the fresh water intake for the enginebetween the thruhull and the water pump, that allow the engine to pump its water from the bilge instead of from the thruhull. I found that very clever. While it is useful only if engine is running, in the even you have an issueand water makes its way in, this may be very useful.
What you guys think about that? Clever or not clever?

 

[AKDoug]

When I bought my boat the PO showed me something interesting. The builder of the boat (custom build) used a valve on the fresh water intake for the enginebetween the thruhull and the water pump, that allow the engine to pump its water from the bilge instead of from the thruhull. I found that very clever. While it is useful only if engine is running, in the even you have an issueand water makes its way in, this may be very useful.
What you guys think about that? Clever or not clever?

A fine idea as long as the intake is screened to prevent blockage from other things floating around in the bilge. I would think a lockable valve would also be in order to prevent opening, as an air leak would render the pump inoperable for cooling and at the dock it would be another hole to let the ocean in...

 

[Northern Spy]

I like Whale pump products. Quite innovative and decent quality.

 

[Andy G]

I`m not saying that solely because China probably watches TF,

Good God! Why wasn't I told? Where is RT Firefly with one of his Dads Army Photo's.

FWIW, my problems over the years stem from the float switches, not the pumps per se, and a faulty float switch can sink your boat even if it has a good quality pump attached to it.

As has already been said I think Marin would have enjoyed this lively discussion.

 

[fryedaze]

Jabsco anyone?

I have the bilge pump in the middle. I need the diaphragm pump because the boat has a keel bilge that only about 4" wide. Just wide enough for a float switch and a narrow suction strainer pickup. The boat came with a spare and I need it. I have swapped and rebuilt the pumps three times in the last six year due to failed valves. The pumps aren't cheap at around $600. The rebuild kits are also pricey. At 650 GPH they aren't big on moving a lot of water. We have other lager volume pumps that sit above the keel bilge.

 

[C lectric]

Fryedaze,

I use the pump on the L.H. side, the smallest version for the same thing, those almost last few tablespoons full of water.
However, my pump now has to be at least 15 yr without a rebuild. The pulsation dampener lasts because it builds almost no pressure so the dampener is not crushed like in the pressure water version.
The valves are the proper bilge pump version with large holes in the valve support. The pressure water pump version has smaller holes in the rubber valve support so although that will work it clogs very/too easily.
There is no check valve on the final output so no pressure is held in the pump body.
I also keep my stuffing box tight and well adjusted so there is minimal water to pump.
I don't have a deeper, narrow well like yours appears to have. I just want to keep water in the bilge under good control.

I agree that parts are expensive and getting worse but I will keep mine as long as I can because they do a good job of that final dewatering. Next time I need to rebuild my two actual pressure water pumps I will change to the newer ones and keep my old Jabsco diaphram units as bilge pump spares.

I'm just curious if you see anything with the valves to indicate why they must be replaced that often.

 

[BruceK]

FWIW, my problems over the years stem from the float switches, not the pumps per se, and a faulty float switch can sink your boat even if it has a good quality pump attached to it...

Andy,give the flippers the flick. Fit Johnson Ultras or similar. Confidence and happiness will be yours, as surely as a fortune cookie foretells.